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On June 21 2014 16:24 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
I have discovered that playing Thresh is immensely fun op'd. I just pulled off the most ridiculous outplay ever keeping my Vayne alive against Rammus, Twitch, and Tryndamere and peeling her into a triple kill. God, I was smiling for like 5 minutes straight after that.
On June 21 2014 16:40 GolemMadness wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2014 15:56 AsianEcksDragon wrote:
Since Riot keeps nerfing armor item, I've decided that atma's impaler is better on adc than randuin/ga especially when paired with an IE. I've been building it on Jinx and Twitch. What does everyone here thinks? Atma's is shit, especially since you're building no health as an ADC. Let's say you have 1,800 health. Atma's is giving you 27 AD, 15% crit chance and 45 armour. That's terrible for slot efficiency, and offers 0 utility. Even frozen mallet would be better.
Fmallet IS better.
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On June 21 2014 15:56 AsianEcksDragon wrote:
Since Riot keeps nerfing armor item, I've decided that atma's impaler is better on adc than randuin/ga especially when paired with an IE. I've been building it on Jinx and Twitch. What does everyone here thinks?
You often buy the defensive item for its health as well as it's armor/mr; or for its secondary attributes
Atmas doesn't fit for an AD item because you won't ever have enough HP without another defensive item to make it worthwhile. Additionally it's gold and slot inefficient, the two things ADs care about most.
If generally GB doesn't work as a fourth offensive item due to slot efficiency then there is almost no way that atmas can stack up.
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Nah atmas is pretty gold efficient at the 1800 life mark. It's still not a great item imo on adc cuz it offers no cool effect like GA or mallet though.
What would your end game ADC build look like? IE BT PD LW Boots Atmas? It's definitely more dps than another defensive item but I dunno if you need the extra armor that much. Most ADC have decent armor by then. Draven has 88 armor at level 18 with runes and levels. But only 42 mr. If you get atmas you're like 23% more resilient to AD damage (188+45)/188.
When do you get the atmas? Like 5th item? 6th?
Cuz if you get it earlier it slows down your dps growth.
And if you get it as a 6th item it's not that slot efficient and gold doesn't matter as much because ADC are selling their boots and buying elixers and Junglers are getting rid of their jungling items.
Draven has 1900 health at level 18. So mallet makes him (1900+700)/1900 36% tougher against all damage (ignoring healing effects). Even AD champions like Nasus and Renekton and Garen have a lot of magic damage.
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Guys guys guys
Fmallet AND Atmas
at 1800 base health, this would give you the tankiness of a randuins, + ~60 damage + 15% crit + mallet passive for op kiting, for only 2 item slots
Just imagine an ie, botrk, boots, atmas, mallet, pd build (just throw in lw as needed, and sell boots for the last item.)
70% crit, and kiting for days vs botrk and mallet. + 700 bonus hp and 45 bonus armour
Just imagine how sad you'd make every non assassin.
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With red elixir you even get an extra 3.5 AD. O_O
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On June 21 2014 17:52 GolemMadness wrote:
With red elixir you even get an extra 3.5 AD. O_O
See, this man gets it
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If you get HP Quints your laning will be way safer and you will get more stats lategame with all the free AD.
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Tried to refund nidalee, I dont like the new one so much, however riot refused, I didnt even understand their explanation. Anyway, thought you can refund reworked champs
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Bearded Elder29905 Posts
You can get 3 refunds. If you didn't use them, you can get a refund or RP/Runes/Champions etc, etc.
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On June 21 2014 19:25 M2 wrote:
Tried to refund nidalee, I dont like the new one so much, however riot refused, I didnt even understand their explanation. Anyway, thought you can refund reworked champs
Had you only just bought her?
I thought support ticket refunds were for if you bought something (mainly with rp) then it immediately got dramatically changed with no warning, from what you thought you were buying. You're not gonna get ip back for something you bought months ago, just because you don't like a change which they've been publicly talking about for ages.
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I really dislike what Riot goes for with the PBE changes for Maokai:
basically, your protects your allies around you with your ult, instead of dropping it in a location. Suddenly you're required to follow your allies to protect them, you can't dive to lock an enemy down while dropping some protection on your allies in the back anymore. It also means it's harder to get the explosion right since it's way harder to drop the ult in a good spot then force people to fight around it.
They made W deal %maxHP damage, so it's weaker at early levels (basically it starts getting even/better against people building HP between level 8 and 10, so it's a way of saying "Maokai does less damage in pre-6 ganks and less damage to non-tanks until they're level 13+"). They also drastically reduced its range, further weakening Maokai's ganks.
His Q's slow has been nerfed because you get a tiny slow on the saplings' explosion... in exchange for reduced damage. Even less incentive to level up saplings (and weakening lane Maokai in the process for people who like it), and it doesn't make up for the W and Q nerfs because his E casting animation is long as fuck, he has low base MS, and only the explosion gives the slow.
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad that they take a look at him, but I don't think they're addressing it right. The ability to dive and protect at the same time was big for him, and his good base damage at early levels + the way the WQ combo works made him a good ganker... who was vulnerable to being counter-ganked because he's slow in the jungle and bad in 2v2s.
I'd have preferred his mana costs to be addressed (especially W and R), working out some way of making his clear a bit faster/less awkward, and maybe a better cd reduction on higher levels of his ult, so that if he builds CDR he becomes able to actually cast it twice in a fight, to address the way he plays.
The way they're changing him now, regardless of numbers, scream that they want to shoehorn him into a bodyguard role and stop him from diving people. Which was a really fun part of playing him, but now it'd be a bad choice because W deals more damage to tanky guys and R requires you to stick to your allies.
And holy crap do they hate hard on Jax's base stats wtf. Oo That's 9.5 armour and 216 HP that he loses at level 18.
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On June 21 2014 20:10 Alaric wrote:I really dislike what Riot goes for with the PBE changes for Maokai: basically, your protects your allies around you with your ult, instead of dropping it in a location. Suddenly you're required to follow your allies to protect them, you can't dive to lock an enemy down while dropping some protection on your allies in the back anymore. It also means it's harder to get the explosion right since it's way harder to drop the ult in a good spot then force people to fight around it. They made W deal %maxHP damage, so it's weaker at early levels (basically it starts getting even/better against people building HP between level 8 and 10, so it's a way of saying "Maokai does less damage in pre-6 ganks and less damage to non-tanks until they're level 13+"). They also drastically reduced its range, further weakening Maokai's ganks. His Q's slow has been nerfed because you get a tiny slow on the saplings' explosion... in exchange for reduced damage. Even less incentive to level up saplings (and weakening lane Maokai in the process for people who like it), and it doesn't make up for the W and Q nerfs because his E casting animation is long as fuck, he has low base MS, and only the explosion gives the slow. Don't get me wrong, I'm glad that they take a look at him, but I don't think they're addressing it right. The ability to dive and protect at the same time was big for him, and his good base damage at early levels + the way the WQ combo works made him a good ganker... who was vulnerable to being counter-ganked because he's slow in the jungle and bad in 2v2s. I'd have preferred his mana costs to be addressed (especially W and R), working out some way of making his clear a bit faster/less awkward, and maybe a better cd reduction on higher levels of his ult, so that if he builds CDR he becomes able to actually cast it twice in a fight, to address the way he plays. The way they're changing him now, regardless of numbers, scream that they want to shoehorn him into a bodyguard role and stop him from diving people. Which was a really fun part of playing him, but now it'd be a bad choice because W deals more damage to tanky guys and R requires you to stick to your allies. And holy crap do they hate hard on Jax's base stats wtf. Oo That's 9.5 armour and 216 HP that he loses at level 18.
You were always better off peeling with Maokai late game anyway, his damage was always laughable past early game ganks, which is what he really excelled at, playing midlane against Maokai was always one of the most ridiculous things on earth to try and deal wtih, since he could come from any angle and point and click snare you from a million miles away then knock you up too? ok.
Lategame you were better off dishing out snares when you caught someone then spam knock up/snaring anyone who tried to dive your carry anyway.
His main problem now is he can still clear the camps smaller minions fine early, but the later the game goes the big minions will take 20 years to kill and on a jungle who has such good ganks as him you cant really afford to spend that long clearing. Not to mention the meta is in a carry jungle meta not a support/tank type meta.
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On June 21 2014 19:29 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2014 19:25 M2 wrote:
Tried to refund nidalee, I dont like the new one so much, however riot refused, I didnt even understand their explanation. Anyway, thought you can refund reworked champs Had you only just bought her? I thought support ticket refunds were for if you bought something (mainly with rp) then it immediately got dramatically changed with no warning, from what you thought you were buying. You're not gonna get ip back for something you bought months ago, just because you don't like a change which they've been publicly talking about for ages.
Nah you can refund champions and their skins if they get a rework, something like in a month after the rework. I did it before with rengar (although I bought it back later). This has nothing to do with the 3 refunds you originally have.
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Na, I'm talking about using the WQ combo to lock an enemy down as a means of initiation. Sure, you could argue that Vi does that now (the minimal delay before releasing Q and the amount of various glitches she suffers from makes her not as reliable as she should sadly) but I still remember Maokai being used for hard initiation when you wanted to jump on a target.
Also because of his ult's radius you can try to peel off someone by Wing him and your carries are going to be out of range to benefit from the damage reduction anyway.
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You cannot refund your reworked champion and skins anymore. Riot now refuses to do it (after karthus VO) because money.
Can't find that post, but it was officially stated by a red on na forums
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On June 21 2014 20:42 M2 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2014 19:29 killerdog wrote:On June 21 2014 19:25 M2 wrote:
Tried to refund nidalee, I dont like the new one so much, however riot refused, I didnt even understand their explanation. Anyway, thought you can refund reworked champs Had you only just bought her? I thought support ticket refunds were for if you bought something (mainly with rp) then it immediately got dramatically changed with no warning, from what you thought you were buying. You're not gonna get ip back for something you bought months ago, just because you don't like a change which they've been publicly talking about for ages. Nah you can refund champions and their skins if they get a rework, something like in a month after the rework. I did it before with rengar (although I bought it back later). This has nothing to do with the 3 refunds you originally have.
I bet it highly depends on the Riot employee whether you get it back or not. I don't think it's an official thing that they will refund champions after a rework, but most of them would probably refund it for you.
Edit: Oh nvm, seems it was an official thing, but that they pulled it back.
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Yeah so it is officialy big fuck you from Riot. Knowing this company they will never try to balance things around. No, if something is popular let nerf this beyond any viability and buff some other things. Rinse and repeat.
They aren't going to balance game as a whole, they just want constant nerfs and buff cycles - because it is easier and more profitable.
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It is impossible to balance a game "as a whole". It is just too complex to know how even little changes work out beforehand, so you cannot expect that a complete game can be balanced at once. All you can do is constantly adjust and work towards balance.
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Not to mention the decision and explanation to stop giving refunds makes complete sense with the number of people abusing this show of goodwill from Riot and the amount of reworks currently going on and the ones coming up.
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EPT
