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Pulimuli
Sweden2766 Posts
On April 15 2014 23:21 schmutttt wrote: I must be the only person who thinks Renekton is a well balanced champion, but I'm gold 1 so wtf do I know :/ Unless he snowballs the shit outa toplane he's not worth that much in lategame tbh. If he's superfed he will fuck up your team though. At least from my experience | ||
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
On April 16 2014 03:22 Kyrie wrote: am i correct in reading this post as primarily saying that niche/gimmick supports with specific timings are more dependent than meta picks on taking advantage of those timings Sure, if you want to tl:dr it. Each champion, meta or not, has power spikes. If you are knowledgeable and use those timings in a way to turn the matchup in your favor then you're using the timings correctly. If not you're missing out on ways to carry your games. | ||
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Amui
Canada10567 Posts
On April 16 2014 03:41 Pulimuli wrote: Unless he snowballs the shit outa toplane he's not worth that much in lategame tbh. If he's superfed he will fuck up your team though. At least from my experience Even if he's just ahead of his lane(slightly ahead or even with others) he can pretty much 1v2 or 1v3 by the 15 minute mark. He's one of the strongest team fighting bruisers, and wins almost every lane so he's hardly ever a bad pick. | ||
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Kyrie
1594 Posts
i don't think anyone disagrees that he is a very strong laner who has the largest individual impact on the viable champion pool. whether this is problematic is an entirely different matter what were things like before renekton was thought of as the #1 top lane issue? if renekton were not in the game, would the number of viable top laners be appreciably different? would there be a much more even, rock paper scissors sort of interaction between many champions rather than the 'must be this tall to ride' restriction that renekton places, or would somebody else become the new benchmark? if there are many champions who can still compete with renekton, does that make it ok that many others will never see play unless he is banned? what color socks am i wearing right now? | ||
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Zdrastochye
Ivory Coast6262 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
On April 16 2014 03:52 Kyrie wrote: whether or not renekton is well balanced is entirely dependent on the definition of 'balanced', which is far from standardized and is at the heart of most champion balance disagreements i don't think anyone disagrees that he is a very strong laner who has the largest individual impact on the viable champion pool. whether this is problematic is an entirely different matter what were things like before renekton was thought of as the #1 top lane issue? if renekton were not in the game, would the number of viable top laners be appreciably different? would there be a much more even, rock paper scissors sort of interaction between many champions rather than the 'must be this tall to ride' restriction that renekton places, or would somebody else become the new benchmark? if there are many champions who can still compete with renekton, does that make it ok that many others will never see play unless he is banned? what color socks am i wearing right now? End of season 2 top lane was either Jax v. Irelia, or Irelia v. Jax. | ||
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SagaZ
France3460 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
I know I'm probably late to the discussion, but I find the proposed change to blood scent insane. Revealing <50% hp large monsters would be so goddam powerful. It'd basically be season 1 cv on a champ except always up. | ||
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RouaF
France4121 Posts
Don't get me wrong he will probably be stronger the first few weeks (and then will be nerfed and become useless) but what's the point ? If they want to make new champs why not make NEW champs and not destroy the existing ones that many people enjoy playing | ||
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Duvon
Sweden2360 Posts
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gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
i can really see how he'll keep his same core play, but get the necessary updates (%-health damage, gap-closer, cc) to make him more viable i love the wolf as is, but i will accept these changes | ||
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krndandaman
Mozambique16569 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
On April 16 2014 05:05 RouaF wrote: I hate the fact that they're completely changing warwick ... yeah W could be changed but the rest is fine ffs, they changed every single one of his spells and even his passive ! I especially don't like blood scent working only if you walk towards the enemies... and his ult was what made him interesting... Don't get me wrong he will probably be stronger the first few weeks (and then will be nerfed and become useless) but what's the point ? If they want to make new champs why not make NEW champs and not destroy the existing ones that many people enjoy playing I don't understand the hate here? His passive, Q, R, and blood scent are all basically the same. They scrapped W, made his ult a skillshot and gave him two new abilities, there's the rework. | ||
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
I don't really see how his ult is an improvement. A blockable Malphite ult? Even if it does a ton of damage, the support steps up and blocks it and the important people wreck you in the meantime. It's unclear if it procs on-hits beyond the passive, so if it doesn't, its actually probably a damage nerf unless the guy you hit has an obscene amount of health. It also sounds like they're adding 30-40 seconds per ult, which is pretty significant given its going from point and click to a skillshot that can be blocked. That can be cleansed. Or crucibled. Man, this is going to suck compared to Malph or Vi ult. Also, unless they significantly up his base/scaling attack speed, he's going to have problems clearing fast enough to be relevant. A 16 second AOE ability that does not do much damage is not going to help a lot. | ||
onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
I think the rework sounds neat, but I guess I understand why people get a little annoyed when people change champions they like. Still, Riot has shown a trend with reworking older champs so this shouldn't come as too much of a surprise. | ||
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RouaF
France4121 Posts
On April 16 2014 05:15 Ketara wrote: I don't understand the hate here? His passive, Q, R, and blood scent are all basically the same. They scrapped W, made his ult a skillshot and gave him two new abilities, there's the rework. Not sure if trolling or not, did you read the changes ? How can you say passive Q R and E are the same ? They're all completely changed. Do you really believe the ult is the same if it has an ap ratio and can be body blocked ? Do you really think the cooldown will stay the same ? Do you really think the fact that it won't be instant cast and targeted any more is "basically the same" ? | ||
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VayneAuthority
United States8983 Posts
along with fiora and nidalee, sion and yorick already in it | ||
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JALbert
United States484 Posts
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
On April 16 2014 05:28 RouaF wrote: Not sure if trolling or not, did you read the changes ? How can you say passive Q R and E are the same ? They're all completely changed. Do you really believe the ult is the same if it has an ap ratio and can be body blocked ? Do you really think the cooldown will stay the same ? Do you really think the fact that it won't be instant cast and targeted any more is "basically the same" ? His passive turned from something that adds damage and healing on hit, to something that adds damage and healing on hit but also stacks. His Q turned from a single target melee attack that did damage and healed, to a single target melee attack that did damage and healed. His R turned from a ranged single target suppress that did damage and applied on hits, to a ranged single target skillshot stun that did damage and applied on hits. Where are the differences? I mean, by your logic Sion stun and Taric stun aren't the exact same ability because Taric stun also deals more damage if they're closer to you. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On April 16 2014 05:28 RouaF wrote: Not sure if trolling or not, did you read the changes ? How can you say passive Q R and E are the same ? They're all completely changed. Do you really believe the ult is the same if it has an ap ratio and can be body blocked ? Do you really think the cooldown will stay the same ? Do you really think the fact that it won't be instant cast and targeted any more is "basically the same" ? His passive is virtually the same, except it got straight up buffed except in small windows early game where the current flat damage is stronger than % damage. Q is basically the same. It heals slightly less, but does potentially more damage depending on how you build him. E is tweaked, but mostly straight up buffed. His ult just got plain nerfed, although it does do more damage now. On April 16 2014 06:02 Ketara wrote: His R turned from a ranged single target suppress that did damage and applied on hits, to a ranged single target skillshot stun that did damage and applied on hits. The R change is honestly very significant. Changing from a massive range point and click suppression to a short ranged skillshot stun is a huge nerf. Honestly though I think the overall kit looks like a pretty big buff. If Blood Scent retains its current range, the map control of that ability is just insane. While the W change lowers damage, giving an aoe fear/slow on a potentially ~5 second cooldown is pretty strong. | ||
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