On March 17 2014 11:46 silencefc wrote:
I can't find anything on this LMQ vs VVV game you guys are talking about.

Can someone provide me a link please?

http://www.twitch.tv/kaostv/popout

phyvo

United States5635 Posts

March 17 2014 02:48 GMT

#2502

Here's the stream link: http://www.twitch.tv/kaostv

looks like it's rerunning the series though? + Show Spoiler +

did vvv seriously forfeit?

the ninjaaa

Nos-

Canada12016 Posts

March 17 2014 02:50 GMT

#2503

Mor is doing something top lane, but I don't know what

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

March 17 2014 03:05 GMT

#2504

http://www.twitch.tv/kaostv/b/511769466

killerdog

Denmark6522 Posts

March 17 2014 03:20 GMT

#2505

Is there actually a patch tonight?

Sufficiency

Canada23833 Posts

March 17 2014 03:23 GMT

#2506

If Riot decides to nerf Kha6's R, the nerfs will come to full circle that every single aspect of his kit gets nerfed once. Maybe after the R nerf people will evolve W again? Hahaha

wei2coolman

United States60033 Posts

March 17 2014 03:28 GMT

#2507

On March 17 2014 12:23 Sufficiency wrote:
If Riot decides to nerf Kha6's R, the nerfs will come to full circle that every single aspect of his kit gets nerfed once. Maybe after the R nerf people will evolve W again? Hahaha

W still good, I swear!

VayneAuthority

United States8983 Posts

March 17 2014 03:29 GMT

#2508

the R is what makes khazix pretty much and they should keep the buffed one as its pretty cool to play as and against.

what is not fun is getting 1 shot just because you are isolated, extremely dumb mechanic. needs a serious damage nerf and maybe give W back a bit of damage to compensate

PrinceXizor

United States17713 Posts

March 17 2014 04:03 GMT

#2509

Khaz would be fine if itemization didn't suck so much in LoL. that with a few items all but tanks fall to you.

Gahlo

United States35173 Posts

March 17 2014 04:31 GMT

#2510

On March 17 2014 13:03 PrinceXizor wrote:
Khaz would be fine if itemization didn't suck so much in LoL. that with a few items all but tanks fall to you.

Yeah, assassins shouldn't be able to do what they are designed to!

PrinceXizor

United States17713 Posts

March 17 2014 04:46 GMT

#2511

On March 17 2014 13:31 Gahlo wrote:

Show nested quote +

Yeah, assassins shouldn't be able to do what they are designed to!

there is certainly a middle ground between making a archetype useless and having itemization be so poor that you need to maximize damage on many roles.

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

March 17 2014 04:49 GMT

#2512

There actually isn't, assassins by their design are either
1. can QWER 100-0 something - OP
2. can't QWER 100-0 something - useless

ComaDose

Canada10357 Posts

March 17 2014 04:56 GMT

#2513

On March 17 2014 13:49 Kupon3ss wrote:
There actually isn't, assassins by their design are either
1. can QWER 100-0 something - OP
2. can't QWER 100-0 something - useless

do you orientate your real life around bashing games you don't like to peoples faces to or is it just something you do on tl

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

March 17 2014 05:08 GMT

#2514

I like LoL enough to play it every day, the same cannot be said of games you choose to post about

Nemireck

Canada1875 Posts

March 17 2014 05:15 GMT

#2515

On March 17 2014 13:46 PrinceXizor wrote:

Show nested quote +

there is certainly a middle ground between making a archetype useless and having itemization be so poor that you need to maximize damage on many roles.

For once I kinda agree with PX here.

Like, why SHOULDN'T I be able to itemize a sustainable-damage "ADC" with enough defensive stats to survive longer than 3 seconds against Renekton, but enough damage that, given the 10-15 seconds I survive, I can actually deal a significant amount of damage?

Right now it's a choice between:

A: All-out damage, deal as much as you can before an assassin deletes you or a tank chases you back to nexus.

B: Survive, but deal 5 damage because "LOL you built defense on the ADC"

C: Run away until team does all the work, return and kill 1/2-health leftovers of the opposite team.

Itemization in this game is actually pathetic, and severely limits what is actually possible on the vast majority of champions in the game. You're either all-in offense, all-in defense. Or you're jungle/support and just buy what you can afford given what's happened in the game.

nafta

Bulgaria18893 Posts

March 17 2014 05:21 GMT

#2516

There are champs that do damage without many items they just aren't ranged who are auto focused.Being ranged is a rather big advantage that you cant really ignore.

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

March 17 2014 05:31 GMT

#2517

A lot of that is due to multiplicative scaling on both offensive and defense ends and a significant lack of utility based items. There have been times that ADs could build a midgame survivability item (League of Warmogs, Blue EZ, etc) but those builds are usually quickly deprecated by Riot's patch cycles and game design.

Right now most ADs survive by not getting hit, so going from surviving 1 second to 2 second with a single defensive item really won't do anything, leading to the situation where there's only really 2 viable lategame defensive items in Banshees (lets you avoid getting hit better) and Guardian Angel (lets you get back up after getting hit once)

PrinceXizor

United States17713 Posts

March 17 2014 05:35 GMT

#2518

It could be as simple as making cost efficient items not be slot efficient. and vice versa. going all out offense would be cost prohibitive so you would rely on some of the cost efficient items to fill in gaps, cost efficient items that provide a mix between offense and defense. If hexdrinker cost only 1100 total and maw cost 22-2300 total and Atmas changes to 25 damage + .75% of max hp instead of just flat 1.5% while dropping the cost by 300-500. while IE cost 4000 and BT cost 3500 people would be more likely to buy the hexdrinkers and carry them over to maw throughout the game. you could still go for the big items to be slot efficient and grow in power by larger chunks, but the cost efficient mixed offense/defense itemization would allow more flexibility. but that'd create situations where champions have less uniform power curves and thats anti riot. obviously the exact suggestions i offered don't matter, but the concepts behind them could help for sure.

Nemireck

Canada1875 Posts

March 17 2014 05:37 GMT

#2519

On March 17 2014 14:21 nafta wrote:
There are champs that do damage without many items they just aren't ranged who are auto focused.Being ranged is a rather big advantage that you cant really ignore.

But when every tank and assassin in the game comes with a built-in gap closer, it kinda makes that "range" a useless advantage to begin with. It severely limits the AD champion pool to those that come with escapes. I mean, to get 2 free hits until Renekton starts chasing you or Leblanc 100-0's your ass kind of makes that range "advantage" a moot point. You're now not only stuck building BT, Greaves, PD, LW, IE, GA... but NOW you can only do it using a handful of AD champs that also happen to have an escape in their kit. Caitlyn, Tristana, Vayne, Lucian, etc. Thereby not only making the itemization terrible, but also limiting the champions that are actually viable in the the competitive scene.

Kupon3ss

時の回廊10066 Posts

March 17 2014 05:41 GMT

#2520

That's actually something Riot's attempted to stem away from by creating ADs like Draven, Jinx, and Varus who in theory have no "escapes" but deal significantly more damage while sacrificing safety. The designs themselves were to various degrees of success and brought back slight shifts in the meta.

It would have be interesting to see what would have happened if they persisted with that line of design instead of nerfing the offending champions and making them more homogeneous in the meta