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[Patch 3.13] Heimer Rework General Discussion - Page 139

Forum Index > LoL General
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Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
November 12 2013 00:00 GMT
#2761
On November 12 2013 08:54 Vlanitak wrote:
I like all the interesting post about Cruzer, but tbh we tried out a bunch of players and no one was as consistent or communicative as him, hell we gave people who we thought had "potential" (in lack of better words) 2nd and 3rd chances to prove themselves. Im a little surprised the announcement went out this early though

As a Dig fanboi, I can't really comment. I haven't seen Cruzer play in so long, so I can't really comment on his play.

It's an upgrade, since Kiwi's best champs were all nerfed and he couldn't transition well. How much is something I'll let S4 changes dictate.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
overt
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States9006 Posts
November 12 2013 00:02 GMT
#2762
I'm surprised by Cruzer as well. On the one hand the last time I saw him at relatively pro level was Azure vs CLG and he did decent but didn't even win lane against Hotshot. On the other hand I don't think he'll be worse than Kiwi. Kind of nervous that Dignitas might struggle to get top 6 in LCS Spring which would suck. They're one of my favorites. And I don't dislike Cruzer or anything it's kinda cool to see someone who was semi-pro for so long finally get picked up but I dunno how well he's going to perform.
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
November 12 2013 00:03 GMT
#2763
Man the Eve flanks on Alex's stream. Scary.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Tula
Profile Joined December 2010
Austria1544 Posts
November 12 2013 00:06 GMT
#2764
The garen who spammed emotes instead of helping Alex finish the game is one of the most idiotic trolls I have ever seen.
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
November 12 2013 00:08 GMT
#2765
On November 12 2013 09:06 Tula wrote:
The garen who spammed emotes instead of helping Alex finish the game is one of the most idiotic trolls I have ever seen.

lol, mad on his behalf.
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
November 12 2013 00:19 GMT
#2766
I think kiwikid is way better than cruzer.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
BlackPaladin
Profile Joined May 2010
United States9316 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-12 00:26:44
November 12 2013 00:25 GMT
#2767
On November 12 2013 09:06 Tula wrote:
The garen who spammed emotes instead of helping Alex finish the game is one of the most idiotic trolls I have ever seen.


He's playing garen. It's almost a requirement to be an asshole.
Who ever even heard of a "nice guy garen?"
"Your full potential does not matter if you do not use all 100% of it."
obesechicken13
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States10467 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-12 01:28:24
November 12 2013 00:30 GMT
#2768
On November 12 2013 06:09 wei2coolman wrote:
NA solo queue is so sad. Watch Korean High Elo solo queue, 7-8 players in the game are all pro-players.
NA, it's a miracle of there's 3 in the same game.

That just means Koreans are more likely to drop players when they find better ones.
Or there's more competition among the top Koreans to get on teams.
Which could by extension mean there's more Koreans that practice a lot than NA.
Or a combination of the above with several other factors.

It doesn't necessarily say anything about skill.

Actually not sure if this is even true.
Just saw Dyrus, Oddone, Bjergson, and two members of Quantic(on opposite teams) in my client.
I think in our modern age technology has evolved to become more addictive. The things that don't give us pleasure aren't used as much. Work was never meant to be fun, but doing it makes us happier in the long run.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
November 12 2013 00:34 GMT
#2769
Well if you believe what Vlanitak says, and I don't know why you wouldn't it appears the problem is cyclical.

-teams recruit from the same pool over and over

-people don't view solo q as an avenue to being pro

-no tryhards

-hard to determine who in solo q is actually good because no tryhards

-repeat
Carrilord has arrived.
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
November 12 2013 00:39 GMT
#2770
Cruzer has a lot of competitive experience which is about as valuable as talent, but I'm really not sure how good he can be. There aren't too many top laners in NA though, just a bunch of ADCs and nothing else. Top is the least impactful role in league so it won't matter too much. I really don't like how he spams malphite though, reminds me of people stuck in S2.
Dusty
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States3359 Posts
November 12 2013 00:45 GMT
#2771
i think dig is in for a horrible year with this lineup imo, scarra hasn't been playing well for a long time (pains me to say this), I don't think cruzer has what it takes, qtpie/patoy are good but IDK if they're good enough to be carrying dig.
-Zoda-
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
France3578 Posts
November 12 2013 00:51 GMT
#2772
On November 12 2013 09:39 zulu_nation8 wrote:
Cruzer has a lot of competitive experience which is about as valuable as talent, but I'm really not sure how good he can be. There aren't too many top laners in NA though, just a bunch of ADCs and nothing else. Top is the least impactful role in league so it won't matter too much. I really don't like how he spams malphite though, reminds me of people stuck in S2.

That's the fact he has a lot of competitive experience but has not really good results that seem concerning.
But I realize I'm maybe a bit too harsh considering we've seen players progress a lot over the time of a LCS season. If at least he's consistent, he's on a good track I could hope.
♪ 最初はi つなぐdo それ つまりlife 常に移動 ♪ - IGN: Uhryks
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
November 12 2013 00:51 GMT
#2773
I think the problem a lot of people have with picking up players from solo queue is they view limited champion pool as a deciding factor. In my experience people who are one trick ponies for jungle and ADC can generally expand their pool fairly easily, as the underlying mechanics is the same for every champion in those roles. It becomes more of a problem for mid/top and to a lesser extent, supports, as playstyles vary more dramatically for different champions and matchups. The truth is you won't know how someone will do with different champions he actually learns them. Some learn faster than others, but for pro teams they usually don't have the patience to wait. I've never really thought too much of a limited champion pool unless it's something really weird like panth mid only. Communication, experience, and attitude are important but those things are by far easier to improve on than mechanics or awareness. It's kind of hard to judge those qualities unless you actually play with the person many times and take note of small things.

I can understand the habit of pro teams to pick up "established" players as they generally already have the intangibles like communication, work ethic, etc and so less to improve on, but a player's ceiling is just as important but not considered equally most likely due to the overwhelming pressures facing managers and players to get instant results. So basically, having amateur leagues is important as a stepping stone. I'm sure more solo queue players will get picked up in the next split.
Vlanitak
Profile Joined November 2009
Norway3045 Posts
November 12 2013 00:56 GMT
#2774
I was writting a big response looking at some of the reasons, but honestly its pretty simple.

Teams wont pick up solo Q because they simply arent good enough (when they are they get picked up: Quas, C9 )

People in solo Q doesnt take it seriously enough or the ones who do dont have the talent required (people with 10k games still dont know lane matchups etc)

So who is left to pick? The semipros that has been around forever, sitting in a very niche pool of players. They are 100% safe bets, you know them, you know their skill level. It is very hard to go wrong with them.

(quick add: champion pool had nothing in our desicion making as we understand that knowing a champ 100% means you understand a lot of the basic and advanced lane tactics, and we let people play w/e they wanted and semibuilt comps around that, people simply werent good enough)
washed
sylverfyre
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8298 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-12 00:59:14
November 12 2013 00:56 GMT
#2775
To be fair, when Dig picked up Kiwikid, he was not even remotely established. Everyone was like WHO DIS GUY HE CARRIES SO HARD. Can't really blame Dig for never picking up unknowns.

Then he just.. i dont know... imploded or something. It was sad.

I'm pretty content with the pickup. Cruzer has pretty solid work ethic and I never really felt he was a weak link on the teams he's been on in the past. I'm not saying he's #1 NA top laner, but I think he can carry his weight.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
November 12 2013 01:02 GMT
#2776
if they have a small pool it's all the more likely they don't play something that is good on the current patch, giving you the perfect opportunity to test them on adjusting to a new patch.

Dig themselves had problems with this last season, not to mention the even more notable Ozone flop.
Carrilord has arrived.
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
November 12 2013 01:04 GMT
#2777
Also as a side note, it's difficult for players to reinvent their playstyles unless they work really really hard at it by constantly experimenting and disregarding results. When someone has success with a certain playstyle or champion, there's no incentive to go outside of that comfort zone unless pressured to do so, and by that point, which is usually when they get banned out in scrims, a real match, etc, it's almost always too late. There's also underlying but significant factors like ego, pride, etc, as in if you play bad with a new champion in scrims you won't want to do it again and neither will your team want you to. I think a lot of old pros are stuck with their comfort zone champion pool or style, which are often good enough to dominate solo queue with but not much else.

As a small example, for junglers, most good players can play the xj9/meteos style and get as much CS and be the highest level, but it takes practice and feels uncomfortable because it tips the balance of general consensus between farm and pressure. One has to realize the shortcomings and make up for it which takes analysis and practice, and since most good junglers are already successful with their own styles they will thing trying to play a different way is unnecessary. Junglers usually aim for that right balance which is most effective for the most types of games instead of having to have your team adapt to your playstyle.
MooMooMugi
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States10531 Posts
November 12 2013 01:05 GMT
#2778
Qtpie will pull out the AD heimerdonger and shut us all up, you heard it here first
|LoL & SC2 IGN both my username| Just livin' the baylife| Hearthstone ID: MooMooMugi#1544| Dank Memer since 2011
JonnyLaw
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3482 Posts
November 12 2013 01:06 GMT
#2779
Did Kiwi do well on champs that weren't zac?

I hope Cruzer does well for Dig. Can the team carry Scarra? I doubt it.
sylverfyre
Profile Joined May 2010
United States8298 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-12 01:08:03
November 12 2013 01:07 GMT
#2780
On November 12 2013 10:05 MooMooMugi wrote:
Qtpie will pull out the AD heimerdonger and shut us all up, you heard it here first

Qtpie will pull out the AD heimerdonger and make us all rage while reddit has a field day and worships him, you heard it here first.
On November 12 2013 10:06 JonnyLaw wrote:
Did Kiwi do well on champs that weren't zac?

I hope Cruzer does well for Dig. Can the team carry Scarra? I doubt it.

Spring LCS he was a god on Singed, before Zac was even released.
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