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On October 10 2013 03:23 Ghost-z wrote:
Does anyone ever run 21 points in Utility on anything but supports? For ranked play Offense/Defense seems universally better. 2/3rds of the time I even run 1/13/16 on Supports. I really would like to play around with 21 utility more often. What champions are best suited for 21 utility or is it optimal on any of them?
Ryze/Vlad are likely candidates, although I have very little experience with them.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
On October 10 2013 03:23 Ghost-z wrote:
Does anyone ever run 21 points in Utility on anything but supports? For ranked play Offense/Defense seems universally better. 2/3rds of the time I even run 1/13/16 on Supports. I really would like to play around with 21 utility more often. What champions are best suited for 21 utility or is it optimal on any of them?
I know there's a certain type of vladimir that ran 21 utility that reapered created.
Here's an example of it http://www.probuilds.net/guide/EUW/1092461822/20321774
It pretty much focuses on the speed and spell vamp from it to become king afk split push bitch vlad
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~96 true damage beats most skills early game (save for dumb shit like Riven's Q with her passive helping so much, stackable DoTs like Darius' passive, %skills like Elise's human Q, or Kha'Zix's Q with isolation), it's the fact that he harms himself that makes it weaker.
His E isn't actually all that bad early game—the level 1 is underwhelming, but as long as you aren't zoned from the wave or fighting a jerk like Renekton the move from AD to AS gives it stronger dps (and thus healing) between trades or even when trading. It's also easier to use with the mana cost reduction.
He's definitely weak, but it's not utter shit like you seem to imply. Smash knows about it, and Morello says some interesting stuff in-between very selective post-answering and usual generic gibberish annoucements.
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On October 10 2013 03:10 dae wrote:
So, after trying to make olaf work, I have come to the conclusion that in jungle, aatrox does everything he does but better, and for top, theres jax/renekton that are just better.
The rework seems to hav emade him even less viable if that was possible by nerfing his early game and making it impossible to function on him once your behind (w is useless when behind, so is e, so is R.)
He simply cannot function once hes at a disadvantage, and since his earlygame is so weak its too often hes at that disadvantage.
I really hope that they do stuff like remove the minimum range on axe, rework his w so that its actually useful (LOL AA focused champion that has no gapcloser) rework his e so that it isnt so useless earlygame (it feels like in trades it shouldnt do any damage to myself at all, since its weaker then skills that dont have a downside).
Hes just trash tier right now, and needs alot of help.
Edit: its not even the numbers right now, his kit just doesn't work in league of every1 needs 2 gapclosers or else they suck. And hes not even stronger 1v1 vs those champions that have the gapclosers either..
Edit2: upon thinking on it what he needs is a massive defensive steroid (Like his ult used to be..) that he can pop when he runs in so that he doesnt simply die instantly.
Yeah I think his old ult functioned a ton better.
Previously, other team initiates. You pop ult-ghost instantaneously and go ham because you just tanked all their CC and burst damage with ultimate, Now, other team initiates. Pop ulti-> die because you're now just a fast, squishy viking. Don't pop ulti and you're sitting there being chain CC'd and you still take monstrous amounts of damage.
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On October 10 2013 02:39 ketchup wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2013 21:26 DonKey_ wrote:On October 09 2013 20:30 Kipsate wrote:
If LoL was officially covered by TL and it would turn out that all the stuff Riot has done to Dota in the past somehow that Valve is doing that to LoL then I would daresay that you would get the same response. Its not good that it happens but it is not unusual/unfounded that it does happen. Even if we disregard the lol casual dota elitist attitude there is a lot more then that that gets disregarded. I believe there are a lot of people who don't mind LoL or watch it(like me or Yango) and that there is a certain amount of crossover. The dislike does not stem from the game itself, it stems from Riot(but any dislike for the game is amplified by Riot's practices). What kills me about Dota2 players perspective on league is that the VAST majority of the fan base clings on to extremist views held on to by Dota2's prominent community members. The Riot hate, for example, is at a point where every action or event associated with them is a conspiracy to kill Dota2 and "e-sports". There was just one recently where PAX didn't have DotA2 but had LoL in their PC centers, and people were really quick to call Riot conspiracy on (granted it was due to a volunteer's really bad attitude. Something along the lines of asking to play DotA2 -> "just play LoL instead"). It turned out to be easily resolved, but people really jumped on the Riot-hate bandwagon so quick. See this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=427639
As someone who's been to PAX this is kind of silly. Lots of the enforcers the last time I went there knew very little, if anything, about LoL. So if some rando person went up and asked to play HoN or DotA2 or Reign of Titans I doubt they could tell much of a difference between that and LoL. They had a rule at PAX East that you couldn't play Summoner's Rift but they didn't know what that game mode was called so they just told everyone in line, "If you're going to play LoL you have to play the mode with the control points, the other mode takes too long!"
edit:
Granted, that could've changed as I wasn't at PAX Prime 2013 but I've been to quite a few PAXs in the past.
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On October 10 2013 03:23 Ghost-z wrote:
Does anyone ever run 21 points in Utility on anything but supports? For ranked play Offense/Defense seems universally better. 2/3rds of the time I even run 1/13/16 on Supports. I really would like to play around with 21 utility more often. What champions are best suited for 21 utility or is it optimal on any of them?
i go 0/9/21 sometimes, usually when its ranged vs melee and I'm the ranged - that extra movespeed really shines in situations like that.
Oops. You said anything BUT supports..
I did it on Ryze when he was a pickable champion. MS/CDR/SOS/Mana/Vamp were all pretty good value picks for him.
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On October 10 2013 03:26 Alaric wrote:~96 true damage beats most skills early game (save for dumb shit like Riven's Q with her passive helping so much, stackable DoTs like Darius' passive, %skills like Elise's human Q, or Kha'Zix's Q with isolation), it's the fact that he harms himself that makes it weaker. His E isn't actually all that bad early game—the level 1 is underwhelming, but as long as you aren't zoned from the wave or fighting a jerk like Renekton the move from AD to AS gives it stronger dps (and thus healing) between trades or even when trading. It's also easier to use with the mana cost reduction. He's definitely weak, but it's not utter shit like you seem to imply. Smash knows about it, and Morello says some interesting stuff in-between very selective post-answering and usual generic gibberish annoucements.
except the 2 most pick/banned tops right now dont allow you to auto attack trade often.
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Yay, all systems down at work, TL time~
When Olaf pops his ulti, it's just a invitation to the other team that says "Hey guys, hit me, I'm so much squishier now". I feel like he needs another offensive based stat, probably something like gaining spellvamp equal to the % lifesteal on W for the duration of his ulti. He's squishier but if he can deal damage, he takes almost no extra damage.
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On October 10 2013 02:03 KarlKaliente wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 00:43 Sermokala wrote:On October 10 2013 00:12 JonGalt wrote:
Wait. Is it Five on Five Wizard Football as in Soccer or pigskin football?
Edit: Pigskin, as in American football is way better.
QB: Syndra
RB: Poppy
FB: Rammus
Oline: Ali, Maokai, Malphite, Gragas, Nautilus
TE: Garen
WR: Lee Sin, Draven
Come at me. QB: Xerath RB: Garen FB: Ali O line: Mao Rammus Cho Sej Shen TE: Galio Blitz WR: Khaziz Talon Ahri Akali Blind man can't catch football bro Cloaky WR best WR. if poppy goes to someone they'll tackle her because shes small yo Rammus can't pick up blitzers very well and ali will just get pulled out of position by a corner blitz. Throws the rock at range in the pocket much better then syndra ever could. Garen can break tackles move fast and deliver a bone crunching blow to run over the saftey. Your football lol theorycraft is bronze level yo. I came at you. Lee Sin is obviously the place kicker.
Lee Sin is obviously the referee, are you kidding me?
Anybody that doesn't set their QB as "Whatever Zuna plays" is like picking Josh Freeman over Peyton Manning.
On October 10 2013 02:12 Ketara wrote:
I've probably watched this Jinx video 100 times.
If I wasn't already engaged to Lux I'd be fighting Req over her.
And because of Jinx, I get Riven all to myself. 
On October 10 2013 03:44 Lmui wrote:
Yay, all systems down at work, TL time~
When Olaf pops his ulti, it's just a invitation to the other team that says "Hey guys, hit me, I'm so much squishier now". I feel like he needs another offensive based stat, probably something like gaining spellvamp equal to the % lifesteal on W for the duration of his ulti. He's squishier but if he can deal damage, he takes almost no extra damage.
He already gets a crapton of AD and AS, what more could you want offensively? Increasing his healing more wouldn't solve the "if I can't hit anything I die" feel I keep hearing about.
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On October 10 2013 03:47 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 02:03 KarlKaliente wrote:On October 10 2013 00:43 Sermokala wrote:On October 10 2013 00:12 JonGalt wrote:
Wait. Is it Five on Five Wizard Football as in Soccer or pigskin football?
Edit: Pigskin, as in American football is way better.
QB: Syndra
RB: Poppy
FB: Rammus
Oline: Ali, Maokai, Malphite, Gragas, Nautilus
TE: Garen
WR: Lee Sin, Draven
Come at me. QB: Xerath RB: Garen FB: Ali O line: Mao Rammus Cho Sej Shen TE: Galio Blitz WR: Khaziz Talon Ahri Akali Blind man can't catch football bro Cloaky WR best WR. if poppy goes to someone they'll tackle her because shes small yo Rammus can't pick up blitzers very well and ali will just get pulled out of position by a corner blitz. Throws the rock at range in the pocket much better then syndra ever could. Garen can break tackles move fast and deliver a bone crunching blow to run over the saftey. Your football lol theorycraft is bronze level yo. I came at you. Lee Sin is obviously the place kicker. Lee Sin is obviously the referee, are you kidding me? Anybody that doesn't set their QB as "Whatever Zuna plays" is like picking Josh Freeman over Peyton Manning. Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 02:12 Ketara wrote:
I've probably watched this Jinx video 100 times.
If I wasn't already engaged to Lux I'd be fighting Req over her. And because of Jinx, I get Riven all to myself. Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 03:44 Lmui wrote:
Yay, all systems down at work, TL time~
When Olaf pops his ulti, it's just a invitation to the other team that says "Hey guys, hit me, I'm so much squishier now". I feel like he needs another offensive based stat, probably something like gaining spellvamp equal to the % lifesteal on W for the duration of his ulti. He's squishier but if he can deal damage, he takes almost no extra damage. He already gets a crapton of AD and AS, what more could you want offensively?
Equal tankiness IF he can use that AD and AS to hurt people, adding spellvamp which affects his Q/E might be enough to buff that up since right now, -30/30 resists hurts a lot.
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On October 10 2013 03:47 Gahlo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 02:03 KarlKaliente wrote:On October 10 2013 00:43 Sermokala wrote:On October 10 2013 00:12 JonGalt wrote:
Wait. Is it Five on Five Wizard Football as in Soccer or pigskin football?
Edit: Pigskin, as in American football is way better.
QB: Syndra
RB: Poppy
FB: Rammus
Oline: Ali, Maokai, Malphite, Gragas, Nautilus
TE: Garen
WR: Lee Sin, Draven
Come at me. QB: Xerath RB: Garen FB: Ali O line: Mao Rammus Cho Sej Shen TE: Galio Blitz WR: Khaziz Talon Ahri Akali Blind man can't catch football bro Cloaky WR best WR. if poppy goes to someone they'll tackle her because shes small yo Rammus can't pick up blitzers very well and ali will just get pulled out of position by a corner blitz. Throws the rock at range in the pocket much better then syndra ever could. Garen can break tackles move fast and deliver a bone crunching blow to run over the saftey. Your football lol theorycraft is bronze level yo. I came at you. Lee Sin is obviously the place kicker. Lee Sin is obviously the referee, are you kidding me? Anybody that doesn't set their QB as "Whatever Zuna plays" is like picking Josh Freeman over Peyton Manning. Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 02:12 Ketara wrote:
I've probably watched this Jinx video 100 times.
If I wasn't already engaged to Lux I'd be fighting Req over her. And because of Jinx, I get Riven all to myself. Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 03:44 Lmui wrote:
Yay, all systems down at work, TL time~
When Olaf pops his ulti, it's just a invitation to the other team that says "Hey guys, hit me, I'm so much squishier now". I feel like he needs another offensive based stat, probably something like gaining spellvamp equal to the % lifesteal on W for the duration of his ulti. He's squishier but if he can deal damage, he takes almost no extra damage. He already gets a crapton of AD and AS, what more could you want offensively?
Cait and Jinx are vying for my waifuism.
OR SHOULD I SAY VI-ING i'll go away now
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
So with this waifu debate does that mean no one on TL has dibs on vi? If so I take her.
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On October 10 2013 04:06 JimmiC wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 03:25 Fusilero wrote:On October 10 2013 03:23 Ghost-z wrote:
Does anyone ever run 21 points in Utility on anything but supports? For ranked play Offense/Defense seems universally better. 2/3rds of the time I even run 1/13/16 on Supports. I really would like to play around with 21 utility more often. What champions are best suited for 21 utility or is it optimal on any of them? I know there's a certain type of vladimir that ran 21 utility that reapered created. Here's an example of it http://www.probuilds.net/guide/EUW/1092461822/20321774It pretty much focuses on the speed and spell vamp from it to become king afk split push bitch vlad I accidently use 0-9-21 on cait in ranked game. Lots of rage sent my way but I won. And the pick pocket was hilarious. not to mention extra gold. That being said csing was a bitch with all the less damage, and over all it's awful. But I won so its great! As far as chicks I'll take Miss Fortune, esspecially in that cowboy outfit. Who ever picked lux u better be like 16 or younger cause isn't she 14? if older the creep sirens are going nuts.
The age provided for her was when she was enrolled in the Demacia's Academy, which was well before she joined the league, iirc.
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Looking at the discussion on Ahri/assassin changes, I generally agree with the approach Morello has "vaguely" outlined. If, they're moving numbers onto the Q+Charm for Ahri from her ultimate+Foxfire (as it sounds like), it'd be a pretty good change, in all honesty. Makes dodging her Q more important, and makes hitting doubleprocs of Q more impactful.
I'd also agree that I would like to see more Fizz/Kass/Zed counterplay available, but it depends on what's being proposed there.
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She's prob older than that according to her lore—plus she's supposed to be around Ezreal's age, right?
Everyone picking Ahri should just go play Cassiopeia instead.
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On October 10 2013 03:25 Fusilero wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2013 03:23 Ghost-z wrote:
Does anyone ever run 21 points in Utility on anything but supports? For ranked play Offense/Defense seems universally better. 2/3rds of the time I even run 1/13/16 on Supports. I really would like to play around with 21 utility more often. What champions are best suited for 21 utility or is it optimal on any of them? I know there's a certain type of vladimir that ran 21 utility that reapered created. Here's an example of it http://www.probuilds.net/guide/EUW/1092461822/20321774It pretty much focuses on the speed and spell vamp from it to become king afk split push bitch vlad
I've tried similar builds to this on Kennen since he can take full advantage of pickpocket, cdr, 3%ms, LS/Vamp. But that leaves him so squishy without 9 defense and he can easily take advantage of 21 offense.
21/9/0 vs 9/0/21 with top lane Kennen (9/9/12 feels very lackluster, i've tired)
21/9/0 lets me bully around most melees with ease especially since I like to start 15 AD runes against many melee tops.
9/0/21 would let me kite and poke better against harder lanes that I would take scaling AP runes but also lets me kite and chase opponents i want to bully with 15 AD runes. But i'm also losing out on 9 defense that I would want in a harder lane matchup.
Kennen can utilize both 21 Offense and 21 Utility very well and is flexible on runes depending on lane opponent. I tend to favor 21 Offense but am I just tunneling into cookie-cutter builds? Is 21 Utility just going to get out scaled by 21 Offense?
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Cass has problems, though her damage potential is through the roof (as always).
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On October 10 2013 04:11 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Looking at the discussion on Ahri/assassin changes, I generally agree with the approach Morello has "vaguely" outlined. If, they're moving numbers onto the Q+Charm for Ahri from her ultimate+Foxfire (as it sounds like), it'd be a pretty good change, in all honesty. Makes dodging her Q more important, and makes hitting doubleprocs of Q more impactful.
I'd also agree that I would like to see more Fizz/Kass/Zed counterplay available, but it depends on what's being proposed there.
Agree with the ahri changes. Add's some element of counterplay to the post-dfg timing right now where she'll kill a squishy within the duration hitting zero skillshots.
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EPT
