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Looks like we're back to status quo. Hope more of you lurkers unburrow and talk with us. :3 If you have any issues or comments about the new design, feel free to PM Neo. |
Switzerland3257 Posts
here are two ways to look at the league system if you are frustrated:
1. its only hard to get promoted if you are either extremely unlucky or if you flat out don't deserve it. I've startet at a lower elo than i normally habe due to my connection being broken at the start of the season. It was very easy to get promoted into the bracket where I am now.
2. the LP/division system is purely cosmetic. It doesn't matter what leauge you are in at all for the MM. The MM only cares about your and other peoples MMR.
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On June 05 2013 01:47 Frolossus wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 01:46 AwayFromLife wrote:On June 05 2013 01:36 Sponkz wrote:On June 05 2013 01:32 AwayFromLife wrote:On June 05 2013 01:22 Sponkz wrote:On June 05 2013 01:14 AwayFromLife wrote:On June 05 2013 01:09 Sponkz wrote:On June 05 2013 01:00 Capped wrote:On June 05 2013 00:42 Sponkz wrote:On June 04 2013 23:19 Capped wrote:
Guys you dont realise how the promotion system works. Its not 2/3 its never been 2/3.
Its been at the very least 3/4 wins. Usually 4/5 Because u have to work your way into promotion series first and then go 2/3, winning your way into promotion series never comes from a loss. You HAVE to win prior to the 2/3 streak. You also almost never get put into a promotion series 1 win after a loss (iunless your MMR is super high in which case fuck you im jelly), which makes it 4/5 because you need 2 in a row THEN 2/3 games.
The most common way of getting into a promotion series is getting to 60/70 points then winning 2 in a row to be thrown into promotions for a 2/3 test. So it makes it 4 out of 5 wins needed to be promoted. In which two of those wins have to be in a row or your "reset" to needing 4/5 with 2 in a row. (Going from 60-70 to 80-90 then back down again)
TL;DR - It aint 2/3 wins needed, and its shoshilly.
(Ofc going something like 9/10 from 0 points to promotion is entirely possible, i just wasnt going to math out anything lower lol.)
This is why the league system is stupid, it requires you to go on massive streaks to get anywhere when your supposed to be at a 50% win/loss by design. Your MMR never stops getting higher / lower so you cant be expected to smash the living shit out of your opponents in a league because you might not even be facing people in it.
This system would work perfectly if it wasnt paired with MMR / hidden Elo. Your better then your league, your still matched vs people in said league, you smash them on a streak and get promoted.
Atm its, Your better then your league, your matched with people higher then your league (and thus relative to your skill), your expected to smash them and go on a massive streak anyway.
I mean who the fuck thought it would be a good idea to make it so you need an 80% w/l ratio when the system by design TRYHARDS to make you go 50%? (80% win/loss on the assumption you need 4/5 wins which is the norm.)
Instead, it does this to you repeatedly for an extended period of time before constantly throwing you in a 3/4 series (1 win to get into a promotion series) which is STILL 75% win needed on a 50/50 system.
TL;DR League system is borked to fuck and means nothing. It is 2 out of 3 wins to win a promotion, regardless of how large a win-streak you're on prior to this. It doesn't matter if you're on a 5 win streak and then get into promotion, you always need to win 2 out of 3 games to get promoted. You can't just blantly change it, because you had to win x amount of games to get into your promotion. So stop saying that. Also the League system is more than fine, if you think the system is broken, then i suggest you write an email to RIOT with your concerns, and see if they want to take actions or not (i can already tell you they won't). You don't need a 80% win/loss ratio to climb the ladder. You just need to get your points, win your promotion, get more points, win your promotions etc. I have a 59,8% win rate and I'm Diamond IV at the moment. You care way too much about how much you have to win in a row, that you fail to see the point. It's not impossible to go on a 5-win streak, and then go 2-0 in your promotion, especially not if you care about waiting, to minimize the terribad games where you go 0-5 in lane or shit like that. The biggest fail i see from my mates, is that they spam solo Q 24/7 trying to climb the ladder. This means that while they will have some games where they massively stomp, they will also have the games i sometimes experience in normal games or ARAM aka. playing like a total noob. If you don't honestly believe that you can't queue to solo queue and carry those 4 immense retards on your team, play another game-type or wait a few hours, then when you're ready, you are 100% mentally prepared to just give it your best shot and not give any fucks regarding the system, the points or the divisions. EDIT: Sorry for the somewhat harsh tone, but it's getting frustrating that more and more people whine in GD about the new system, when almost everyone agrees that it's 100 times better than the old one. So, it doesnt matter that you HAVE to win prior to a promotion series (no matter how many it actually is, just say its one win for the sake of this) that one extra win MAKES it a 3/4. There is no question, it just states 2/3 wins because it puts you into a promotion series after the win that puts you there, you still need 3 wins in 4 games. Period. If thats wrong, let me know when you go into a promotion series after a loss, im yet to see it. Nobody who complains likes the new system. Pretty much everybody hates it in fact. You dont need 80% win/loss all the time, i never stated that, but the usual method for a promotion is a 4/5 (or 4/4) game record. (2 wins, then 2 wins 1 loss however you want to put it.) even removing that to 3/4, its a 75% win/loss. The system REQUIRES you to go on a winstreak, i never said you needed that win % all the time, or that a win streak wasnt possible, its just stupid that its required of you to do so, when it tries to put you at a 50/50 w/l all the time (Hidden elo) You seem to just want to shout at me about things i didnt actually talk about anyway, so carry on. I know im actually 100% right on everything i said so i wont argue. I wasnt even "complaining" so to speak, i was outlining how it works and the flaws in the system. I actually could care less because either way, i was going to get put where i am now but the only useful statistic in determining that is now hidden behind a wall of shite.(even though WoS pointed out i get mad :<, this isnt one of those times.) It's still not 4/5 or 5/6 games you have to win. You play for your points, you get into a promotion series, and u either go 2-0, 2-1 or 1-2. I know it seems silly, because in fact you could be on a 4/5 winning streak and still get promoted, but the system doesn't care about that. You get 100 points, get put into a promotion series against equally or better people, and have to win 2 out 3. Also, you made it really hard for me to NOT bash about the win/loss % in general since you wrote: "I mean who the fuck thought it would be a good idea to make it so you need an 80% w/l ratio when the system by design TRYHARDS to make you go 50%? (80% win/loss on the assumption you need 4/5 wins which is the norm.)" You're not getting it. You need to go 3/4 to get promoted (or 4/6 for levels). If you're at 99 points, you need to win 3 out of the next 4 games, with one of those games being the first. To get into a promotion series, you need to win the game prior to it. There is no ifs, ands, or buts. You can have whatever win ratio prior to that point, but to go from Plat 3 -> Plat 2, you need to go 3/4. I'm gonna try one more time, i can't really express this any different. You will always have to win a game prior to a promotion series, however it's the promotion series that actually counts. Screw the points, they're a matter of progression earned for the series you're about to play. The whole point of this system is to show that you can win 2 out of 3 games or 3 out of 5 games to be able to progress further. If they want to show that I can win 2/3 games, COUNT THE GAME I PLAY TO GET INTO THE PROMOTION SERIES. You can't just ignore it, it took time, luck, and changed your MMR and therefore the people you're playing against. They're saying you only need to have a 2/3 win ratio to proceed, but you really need a 3/4 win ratio to proceed because you can't get to the proceeding ceremony without winning the prior one. That's like doing 200 pushups, and then someone saying "nice job doing pushups, can you do 200 pushups?" Well yes, I just did and now I'm fucking tired. I might not be able to do another 200 in a row right afterwards. No it's like you doing 200 push-ups, then the guy says "can you do another 20?". You're just being argumentative and belittling, which makes you seem less intelligent than I hope you are. Riot has flat out said that they place your MMR temporarily higher during your promo series to be more of a challenge. If you make it to your promo series, not only do you have to win probably 2 games in your division (unlikely to go Loss Win and get into promo unless your MMR is way fucked up), then you have to play and win 2/3 games at an artificially increased MMR, where you'll likely struggle if the opponents are at where they should be. It's created in such a way that it promotes stagnation on the surface, while at the core MMR pretty much works exactly like ELO did in the past. So basically all they did was make it so you play against the people you did before, but make it intentionally more difficult to change your shiny badge one way or another. on the flip side, you can't lose the badge though
Which is also retarded.
If I'm Plat but have a really low MMR cause an abnormal losing streak, I don't want to be playing with silver players while having a platinum league.
If nothing else that's just embaressing.
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if you are frustrated play the damn game and stop worrying about your e-penis
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On June 05 2013 01:36 Capped wrote:
New discussion, Does TL ever do in houses, is there a regular one, maybe we can organise some shit :3
Join the LiquidParty channel. You'll see them pop up in there.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
On June 05 2013 01:56 captharlock wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 01:36 Capped wrote:
New discussion, Does TL ever do in houses, is there a regular one, maybe we can organise some shit :3 Join the LiquidParty channel. You'll see them pop up in there.
No he won't, for the reasons I mentioned above :3
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The fact I constantly stole the kills with Nunu iceballs and fed afterwards amking HD rage probably played in the equation.
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I'm starting to not see how bitching about the league system is in any way constructive.
We've listed the problems with it over and over and over at this point, and nobody defends it. The only thing people ever do is clarify how it works, which is not helpful because everybody knows how it works. Or some people tell other people to ignore it, which we've all heard a hundred times already.
I haven't seen anybody ever try to argue that it's a good system.
Talking about it any more unless it gets changed somehow seems dumb.
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Just be a damn scrub, this way even when the others troll it's still challenging for you even if you tryhard. :>
^ Pokemon hasn't changed in awhile, doesn't stop us from talking about it.
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This is a while old, but when I was active ~6months ago LiquidParty frequently had inhouse games. (US server)
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They only put the league system on the chinese server like last week (they tried 2 times before, but it had bugged out within days the last two tries). After not being able to hit 2000 elo, ever, to get into diamond range for the past two months, I get from plat 2 to diamond 5 in ~20 games. Clearly it is superior because I'm able to get higher with it.
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On June 05 2013 02:05 Ketara wrote:
I'm starting to not see how bitching about the league system is in any way constructive.
We've listed the problems with it over and over and over at this point, and nobody defends it. The only thing people ever do is clarify how it works, which is not helpful because everybody knows how it works. Or some people tell other people to ignore it, which we've all heard a hundred times already.
I haven't seen anybody ever try to argue that it's a good system.
Talking about it any more unless it gets changed somehow seems dumb.
I just assumed the whole discussion fell under "Elo Hell", which is one of the taboo topics.
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Czech Republic11293 Posts
all set-up sweepers own Blissey in this metagame imho. And then there are the still troubling problems with WObbufett who just totally owns her
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On June 05 2013 02:14 Scip wrote:
all set-up sweepers own Blissey in this metagame imho. And then there are the still troubling problems with WObbufett who just totally owns her
Really wish I knew anything about Poke-gametheory
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On June 04 2013 17:56 napo wrote:
How the f* u play zed? Im always out of energy and cant achieve shit with him.
I think there's a guide you should read 
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euw so buggy that it's even showing "ranked q's disabled" although they aren't haha
can confirm btw that MR Tolkien seems to have Internet problems, I always feel bad when I get 5v4 freewins x(
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On June 05 2013 02:15 jcarlsoniv wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 02:14 Scip wrote:
all set-up sweepers own Blissey in this metagame imho. And then there are the still troubling problems with WObbufett who just totally owns her Really wish I knew anything about Poke-gametheory
pokemon metagame is, IMO, perpetually fucked because once they give a whole bunch of pokemon stealth rock, there's no way to take it away from them (unless they make a gen that doesn't have the ability to import pokemon from previous gens, and they don't care enough about competitive to do that)
it would be like if MTG wasn't able to make tournaments that only allowed recently printed cards.
That said, the pokemon metagame isn't completely broken currently, just that the pokemon company has quite little control of how they can make the metagame evolve.
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Oh man. Qtpie throwing down the gauntlet. He's just mounting piles of shit about team siren. lol.
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On June 05 2013 02:13 Vanka wrote:
They only put the league system on the chinese server like last week (they tried 2 times before, but it had bugged out within days the last two tries). After not being able to hit 2000 elo, ever, to get into diamond range for the past two months, I get from plat 2 to diamond 5 in ~20 games. Clearly it is superior because I'm able to get higher with it.
That's the whole point, milestones. MMOs now have it down to a science when it comes to how to get people hooked. The League system isn't about improving the ranking system (Elo rating was doing just fine), it's about giving people clear goals and a gradual sense of accomplishment, it's an extension of the level-up.
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On June 05 2013 02:13 Seuss wrote:Show nested quote +On June 05 2013 02:05 Ketara wrote:
I'm starting to not see how bitching about the league system is in any way constructive.
We've listed the problems with it over and over and over at this point, and nobody defends it. The only thing people ever do is clarify how it works, which is not helpful because everybody knows how it works. Or some people tell other people to ignore it, which we've all heard a hundred times already.
I haven't seen anybody ever try to argue that it's a good system.
Talking about it any more unless it gets changed somehow seems dumb. I just assumed the whole discussion fell under "Elo Hell", which is one of the taboo topics.
if it's not then it should be
this discussion sucks lol
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EPT
