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On November 03 2012 02:43 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 02:31 Numy wrote:
Also yesterday I noticed something really interesting on WoDx stream. At around 3 minutes he got ganked and killed. He was really surprised at this and said something along the lines of "wow that was a fast gankg, he must have ran straight here. However I watched Locos stream the other day where around 3 minutes he said something like "I need to be careful for gank now as juggler would be finished his path by now and looking for gank top". Just found it interesting a non-top seems to know jungle paths more than an actual top. What were the junglers, tho? Depending on where they start, which side they're on, and the clear speed, it's not the same. Maybe WoDx was talking about something like a Maokai doing wraiths->blue->red to get level 3 and immediatly gank that side, as opposed to the "standard" path of wolves->blue->wraiths->wolves->red, which ganks later. He was also towerdove by the enemy mid and jungler in the current game, it's not being camped but it sure is more than a simple gank.  He also said he should have seen it coming and died because of his mistake.
People still do the "standart" path?Ever since 1300 elo when I asked I usually got smiteless blue/red for lvl 3 gank with 2 buffs at 3 min  .
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You're a lucky one, I don't ask often for smiteless pulls (well most of the time I jungle Mundo and almost always steal their red when I'm blue side, so... ) but when I ask I get them maybe half the time. When you start red while being blue side it's even worse since bottom lane loves taking those golems and letting you only get a standard "one aa + spell" pull from the mid. 
Btw since we're talking about jungle, how do you balance your "activities" as Nunu? Iceball seems 0K for ganks, esp. with the good base damage (and cd with blue), counterjungling, esp. stealing any buff even w/o smite is easy and fast thanks to consume, and you can somewhat clear well (hilariously enough, the easiest camp to clear for him is minigols because of consume), but I never know how to balance it out so that I actually do useful stuff. @_@
Should I just ward their paths and make up for it by constantly stealing big monsters, instead of trying to gank often/constantly?
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On November 03 2012 02:50 Alaric wrote:You're a lucky one, I don't ask often for smiteless pulls (well most of the time I jungle Mundo and almost always steal their red when I'm blue side, so... ) but when I ask I get them maybe half the time. When you start red while being blue side it's even worse since bottom lane loves taking those golems and letting you only get a standard "one aa + spell" pull from the mid.
Well yah but if you have something like sona/ez they can help after golems with buff.If I'm support I always go help jungler get smiteless red after golems >.>.
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This thread moves too fast nowadays
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South Africa35471 Posts
Zomg I want to refund Merc Kat skin so I can buy the Vlad skin on sale but I don't see refund options anymore. Anyone still have them?!@
EDIT: Nvm seems like they disabled it. Time to submit a ticket and hope I get it. Just have to actually buy vlad first so dunno if I should buy him and risk it. Dammit.
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8751 Posts
On November 03 2012 02:42 Numy wrote:
It was skarner. I also found it really odd how surprised he was. He was riven and even went aggressive at that point where he was defensive beforehand. Maybe he just wasn't paying attention and said some snap remark. Now he's talking about being camped when he just got ganged twice then left completely alone. Get what Shake was saying :<
some people feign surprise when really they just made a silly mistake. i mean he probably really was surprised and then when he gave it a second thought he realized he should have known better but then he continued to act surprised. i've done it before when im streaming and i've seen a lot of situations where i strongly suspect people are doing the same thing.
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On November 03 2012 02:43 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2012 02:31 Numy wrote:
Also yesterday I noticed something really interesting on WoDx stream. At around 3 minutes he got ganked and killed. He was really surprised at this and said something along the lines of "wow that was a fast gankg, he must have ran straight here. However I watched Locos stream the other day where around 3 minutes he said something like "I need to be careful for gank now as juggler would be finished his path by now and looking for gank top". Just found it interesting a non-top seems to know jungle paths more than an actual top. What were the junglers, tho? Depending on where they start, which side they're on, and the clear speed, it's not the same. Maybe WoDx was talking about something like a Maokai doing wraiths->blue->red to get level 3 and immediatly gank that side, as opposed to the "standard" path of wolves->blue->wraiths->wolves->red, which ganks later. He was also towerdove by the enemy mid and jungler in the current game, it's not being camped but it sure is more than a simple gank. He also said he should have seen it coming and died because of his mistake.
The point is that every jungler can be a threat at ~3:00 game time. At least a half-dozen junglers can pull that off with a token leash, and the rest can if they save their Smite. You shouldn't be surprised if you get double buff ganked at 3:00, it's been a common route for months.
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Wolves-->Blue-->Wraiths-->Red-->First blood top lane has been the standard route for purple side junglers for ages now
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Cris is complaining a lot about how mid Teemo made him lose his lane (read: could only leave mid because WoDx roamed bot, and dove Cris on his inner turret after he lost the outer to Singed all by himself) and is carrying the enemy team right now. Is he always this whiny? I don't remember it from when I saw him on other streams.
Well of course compared to hashinshin it's nothing.
WoDx 1-0-3 as Darius under enemy inner top, dies to Cris Riven who's fairly behind and their Cho, killing Riven in the process. He then explains that it's worth it because it "relieves pressure"... but his team just took dragon and all outer turrets are down, so there's nothing for his team to do anyway. He should point out instead that it's a mistake because the enemy team gets more gold, especially Riven who's behind enough that even the assist helps him, and that his team can't really use the "4v3" situation since there's no objective to be taken atm. If people listen to this kind of advice then when they get caught they'll say "but it's worth it, you're 4v3 now" whatever state the game is in. :/
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I see more people building Elise with AD bruiser crap (ie, Triforce, Wit's End, etc) than I do AP... which seems pretty horrific because she's not innately tanky and none of her crap scales with AD. It kind of reminds me of when Fizz came out and like every Fizz on my team was building him AD and doing awful, while the one on the enemy team was building him AP and blowing up everyone on our team.
I may be playing too much Twisted Treeline tho (it's still horrible there- AP Elise murders Singed, AD Elise... dies to everything).
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What's the most mechanically demanding role? Personally from what I've experienced it's mid lane, constant back and forth with the opposing mid, while still having to cs as much as the adc, not to mention having to watch the minimap consistantly throughout laning phase to help counter gank/watch for ganks from all directions of the lane.
I hear a lot of people say ADC is the most mechanically demanding role, but I just don't see it. Can anyone elaborate as to why?
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South Africa35471 Posts
Most likely top lane since it's the lane that is the least forgiving solo lane at least I think. Mid it's fairly hard to get zoned even if you behind since it's so short and you have your own jungle you going to take anyway. Bot is 2 people so there's almost communication involved, it might be harder but it's not solo lane at least so you have someone shouting at you if you zone out
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As a caster you don't "do" that much, once you used your spells (unless you're Ryze or Cass), while the AD carry will have to position and reposition well constantly, kite, take potshots, etc.
Sure as a caster you want to stay alive too, but the window in which you have to expose yourself then get back to safety is inherently shorter than a sustained damage-type champ like an AD carry. It's even truer on champs with short range and/or no escape, like Sivir and Ashe (Vayne does it too because Tumble adds a lot to the equation).
Farming, well... you know, I think Poppy's more mechanically demanding than Mordekaiser. And just because you've got a support with you doesn't mean you shouldn't keep an eye on the minimap.
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hi guys C: back after 30 day ban wtf? ok
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United States23745 Posts
On November 03 2012 04:26 zer0das wrote:
I see more people building Elise with AD bruiser crap (ie, Triforce, Wit's End, etc) than I do AP... which seems pretty horrific because she's not innately tanky and none of her crap scales with AD. It kind of reminds me of when Fizz came out and like every Fizz on my team was building him AD and doing awful, while the one on the enemy team was building him AP and blowing up everyone on our team.
I may be playing too much Twisted Treeline tho (it's still horrible there- AP Elise murders Singed, AD Elise... dies to everything).
From what I've read, people seem to think Elise is better as a bruiser than AP because her ratios are bad. The argument why this works despite the lack of AD scaling is she benefits from CDR, has the attack speed buff for her and her spiders, and two moves that deal damage on % of health. I don't know if those arguments are right, but that's what I've seen. It probably just stems from fact people haven't mastered her kit yet.
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On November 03 2012 04:28 smOOthMayDie wrote:
What's the most mechanically demanding role? Personally from what I've experienced it's mid lane, constant back and forth with the opposing mid, while still having to cs as much as the adc, not to mention having to watch the minimap consistantly throughout laning phase to help counter gank/watch for ganks from all directions of the lane.
I hear a lot of people say ADC is the most mechanically demanding role, but I just don't see it. Can anyone elaborate as to why?
Because you hardly need any real mechanics to land AOE spells on minions that are mostly stationary.
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On November 03 2012 04:28 smOOthMayDie wrote:
What's the most mechanically demanding role? Personally from what I've experienced it's mid lane, constant back and forth with the opposing mid, while still having to cs as much as the adc, not to mention having to watch the minimap consistantly throughout laning phase to help counter gank/watch for ganks from all directions of the lane.
I hear a lot of people say ADC is the most mechanically demanding role, but I just don't see it. Can anyone elaborate as to why?
Because fights/skirmishes require a much higher APM from most ADs compared to everything else.
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On November 03 2012 04:28 smOOthMayDie wrote:
I hear a lot of people say ADC is the most mechanically demanding role, but I just don't see it. Can anyone elaborate as to why?
I don't think there are mechanically demanding roles. There are mechanically demanding champions.
Mechanics is things like last hitting, landing skillshots, etc. That differs from champion to champion, not from role to role.
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ADCs probably get that from the fact that they're generally the most vulnerable. Top and Jungles are usually bruisers or tanks, mids usually have high mobility (Ahri/Kass/Fizz) or CC (Annie/Ryze/Zyra). Supports don't have to worry about CS and just harass enemy/babysit ADC. While many mids are as squishy as ADs, they can survive with CC or mobility, Supports aren't getting focused, and tops/jungles are tanky. So ADCs get focused the most, don't have CC, and, outside of GA, don't build anything that can help them survive (Many mids get health, Armor, and/or MR in their AP items).
So ADC becomes very mechanical about how you position, kite, focusing targets, and moving around correctly. An AD that's out of position is generally more screwed than any other role. This varies from Kog (no CC or dash) all the way up to Ez (dat blink).
But that's just from a fighting perspective. They generally also want the highest farm since they scale best with items, but mids and tops need to farm just as well to fill their roles.
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Anyone know when Harrowing skins expire? I'd prefer not forking our RP for Fiora but I don't have enough IP atm.
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EPT
