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They still keep the 7s cd on each individual spell. Dunno, 2s was usually kinda long in drawn-out-fight where I absolutely wanted that heal after pressing E to arrive near my wounded bruiser after peeling for my AD, so I'm kinda used to mashing the button I need, gonna had to relearn to time it. 
I don't get the "powerchord reset aa", tho: to get a powerchord you first need to cast a spell, so unless powerchord resets all animations so that you can, for example, aa-Q-powerchord in a very short timespan, how is this a change?
On July 19 2012 16:19 thenexusp wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 13:59 cLutZ wrote:
1. I didn't understand the Kass changes so I asked.
I read somewhere that the Kassadin changes are aimed at Dominion (some super MP stacking Kassadin build was too stronk), and they tried to change him in a way that won't impact Summoner's Rift that much.
Well if they truly did do the same to Urgot they dramatically failed at "not impact SR too much"...
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That Kassadin change is probably a pretty nice buff tbh. I mean it changes nothing about his laning (obv still crap) but makes his mid/late game significantly stronger.
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On July 19 2012 14:48 GreenManalishi wrote:
Most people don't want to run a comp that absolutely HAS to crush during laning phase or else fade into irrelevancy. If the jungler camps bot lane from levels 1-6, Teemo isn't going to shut down the other team's AD hard enough to legitimize himself. Once Trist/Graves/Corki have IE and PD, Teemo isn't going to bring anything to a teamfight remotely close to the damage those champions can pump out.
Just run an ad or even jayce top/mid, if the enemy jungler camps bot top/mid should be easily won, you know in arranged 5s.
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oh right, now that you mention the individual song CDs... but still auto reset on power chords woot
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I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds
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On July 19 2012 16:25 DURRHURRDERP wrote:
That Kassadin change is probably a pretty nice buff tbh. I mean it changes nothing about his laning (obv still crap) but makes his mid/late game significantly stronger.
uhh not really. if anything it makes his laning/early-mid game weaker and does absolutely nothing for his mid-late game. The only time you would ever Riftwalk onto someone was in small skirmishes in lane or during ganks. That early in the game you're relying on the base damage of the spell, not the AP ratio. Come mid-late game if you Riftwalk onto someone you're going to get blown up by the entire enemy team. Mid-late game AP Kassadin is all about playing like a vulture. Hanging around the edges, rifting in just in range of your Q+E, bursting people, then rifting out. If you try to use your ult to do damage...lolol good luck living. You might use it to clean up but even then, the change is kinda pointless 'cause when you're cleaning up they're very likely going to die regardless.
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Yes you're right I have no idea what I'm talking about.
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On July 19 2012 16:42 UniversalSnip wrote:
I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds
Her W actually gets more efficient as you level it, I have no idea where you're getting your math from.
level:
1: 60 mana, 40 heal
2: 65 mana, 60 heal
3: 70 mana, 80 heal
4: 75 mana, 100 heal
5: 80 mana, 120 heal
The persistence nerf I think was unnecessary though, it's not as if her cooldowns went down. She can just cast all 3 skills faster, not keep more of them up at the same time.
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On July 19 2012 16:42 UniversalSnip wrote:
I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds
The active bonus isn't changed, it's the "fade-out time" that is now 1s down from 2. You'll just have to stay in E stance longer to make up for it, but since the former time was the same as the global cooldown you'll retain most of the speed if you wait (ie wait 2s, duration 1s while before it was "have to wait 2s, duration 2s"), unless you're in a situation where other stances aren't on cooldown and you want them immediatly it won't change much.
I still don't understand the powerchord aa reset. I'll have to test it because I can't get what it changes from the wording (they say "attack timer" but the animation were already longish enough unless you had some bonus AS). Unless I'm overestimating the casting animation's frame #.
What with Orianna's range too? Can somebody explain "Fixed: Attack Range is now 525 at all times."?
Edit: the base numbers keep the "1.5 heal per mana spent" ratio (which could be toned down I believe), so as long as you've got a sprinklet of AP it becomes less and less mana efficient as you level it. But it's not like you've got a lot on AP on Sona... SCRATCH THAT I SUCK AT READING
I'll have to make test and see if I can get Aegis by level 13 on her to stack defensive auras. That would be pretty strong but with support exp. and gold income I'm not sure if it's feasible. Maybe by rushing it directly after philo and skipping HoG/kindlegem.
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On July 19 2012 16:48 Ryuu314 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 16:25 DURRHURRDERP wrote:
That Kassadin change is probably a pretty nice buff tbh. I mean it changes nothing about his laning (obv still crap) but makes his mid/late game significantly stronger. uhh not really. if anything it makes his laning/early-mid game weaker and does absolutely nothing for his mid-late game. The only time you would ever Riftwalk onto someone was in small skirmishes in lane or during ganks. That early in the game you're relying on the base damage of the spell, not the AP ratio. Come mid-late game if you Riftwalk onto someone you're going to get blown up by the entire enemy team. Mid-late game AP Kassadin is all about playing like a vulture. Hanging around the edges, rifting in just in range of your Q+E, bursting people, then rifting out. If you try to use your ult to do damage...lolol good luck living. You might use it to clean up but even then, the change is kinda pointless 'cause when you're cleaning up they're very likely going to die regardless.
omg ur right! might as well make the ult do no damage!
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On July 19 2012 16:59 Alaric wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 16:42 UniversalSnip wrote:
I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds The active bonus isn't changed, it's the "fade-out time" that is now 1s down from 2. You'll just have to stay in E stance longer to make up for it, but since the former time was the same as the global cooldown you'll retain most of the speed if you wait (ie wait 2s, duration 1s while before it was "have to wait 2s, duration 2s"), unless you're in a situation where other stances aren't on cooldown and you want them immediatly it won't change much. I still don't understand the powerchord aa reset. I'll have to test it because I can't get what it changes from the wording (they say "attack timer" but the animation were already longish enough unless you had some bonus AS). Unless I'm overestimating the casting animation's frame #. What with Orianna's range too? Can somebody explain "Fixed: Attack Range is now 525 at all times."?
The powerchord AA reset works as in you autoattack with 2 stacks, cast a third spell (most likely Q) and have your autoattack reset. It allows sona to be a bit more bursty although I'm not sure how useful it might be.
I'm not sure about orianna's bugfix but my guess would be that there would be a niche scenario where the ball was E'd onto someone at max range where orianna's autoattack range would either be longer or shorter since that's the only range change they did last patch.
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I've always felt TOG a worthwhile investment on sona. it's not *that* expensive, only a little more than a philo stone. It doesn't give you the GP5 but it gives you constantly scaling mana throughout the game and once it has, it turns into an item that can give you 100+ AP in the later stages of the game. If you're willing to forgo your shurelias (which given sona's E is not that necessary) and focus on other aura items for your CDR+buffs it's a solid choice.
I'd personally go with stone till you're comfortable playing edgy with her, since the TOG requires you make kills/plays happen for your money without dying yourself with lower sustain, but sona is one of the best supports for making those plays if you have the mana to make it happen, which ToG provides.
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Servers just went down.
WAS A PLEASURE PLAYING WITH 5HITCOMBO AND OTHER GUY IF YOU DOODS READ THIS
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On July 19 2012 16:57 Lmui wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 16:42 UniversalSnip wrote:
I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds Her W actually gets more efficient as you level it, I have no idea where you're getting your math from. level: 1: 60 mana, 40 heal 2: 65 mana, 60 heal 3: 70 mana, 80 heal 4: 75 mana, 100 heal 5: 80 mana, 120 heal The persistence nerf I think was unnecessary though, it's not as if her cooldowns went down. She can just cast all 3 skills faster, not keep more of them up at the same time.
hmm yeah the numbers I was looking at were wrong...
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On July 19 2012 17:03 De4ngus wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 16:48 Ryuu314 wrote:On July 19 2012 16:25 DURRHURRDERP wrote:
That Kassadin change is probably a pretty nice buff tbh. I mean it changes nothing about his laning (obv still crap) but makes his mid/late game significantly stronger. uhh not really. if anything it makes his laning/early-mid game weaker and does absolutely nothing for his mid-late game. The only time you would ever Riftwalk onto someone was in small skirmishes in lane or during ganks. That early in the game you're relying on the base damage of the spell, not the AP ratio. Come mid-late game if you Riftwalk onto someone you're going to get blown up by the entire enemy team. Mid-late game AP Kassadin is all about playing like a vulture. Hanging around the edges, rifting in just in range of your Q+E, bursting people, then rifting out. If you try to use your ult to do damage...lolol good luck living. You might use it to clean up but even then, the change is kinda pointless 'cause when you're cleaning up they're very likely going to die regardless. omg ur right! might as well make the ult do no damage!
wat's with the sarcasm? if you think I'm wrong then say why. your 1-liner is a waste of space.
i'm just pointing out that the change was utterly piontless for SR. You do use the ult for damage, but just not nearly often as much for the change to impact Kassadin's play. Especially considering I was responding to someone who said the change would "make his mid/late game significantly stronger." Last time I checked you're not using Kassadin's ult for damage in the majority of cases unless you're playing some kind of tanky, mana-stacking Kassadin, in which case this change was a net nerf.
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On July 19 2012 17:03 Lmui wrote:Show nested quote +On July 19 2012 16:59 Alaric wrote:On July 19 2012 16:42 UniversalSnip wrote:
I picked her up recently after realizing the best skill order now is Q > E > W... W is 1.5 healing per point of mana spent no matter what the level so you're just gaining points on the defense aura when you skill it and ooming yourself. Level 5 E is frankly fucking op, it's actually INCREDIBLY strong... or it was when the active bonus lasted 2 seconds The active bonus isn't changed, it's the "fade-out time" that is now 1s down from 2. You'll just have to stay in E stance longer to make up for it, but since the former time was the same as the global cooldown you'll retain most of the speed if you wait (ie wait 2s, duration 1s while before it was "have to wait 2s, duration 2s"), unless you're in a situation where other stances aren't on cooldown and you want them immediatly it won't change much. I still don't understand the powerchord aa reset. I'll have to test it because I can't get what it changes from the wording (they say "attack timer" but the animation were already longish enough unless you had some bonus AS). Unless I'm overestimating the casting animation's frame #. What with Orianna's range too? Can somebody explain "Fixed: Attack Range is now 525 at all times."? The powerchord AA reset works as in you autoattack with 2 stacks, cast a third spell (most likely Q) and have your autoattack reset. It allows sona to be a bit more bursty although I'm not sure how useful it might be. I'm not sure about orianna's bugfix but my guess would be that there would be a niche scenario where the ball was E'd onto someone at max range where orianna's autoattack range would either be longer or shorter since that's the only range change they did last patch.
Meh, I overestimated the frames in her spell casting animation then. I guess there's way to do quite the burst with Q aura active and 2 spells stored, aa-Q-powerchord.
I like the better projectile speed to. When you need to finish off somebody and you realize they have the time to hit you twice when they get a bit of AS because your projectiles are so slooow... T_T
Also I don't like tear on Sona. Well, it's obviously huge on bruiser Sona if you random her in ARAM, but other than that it's mostly luxury: 1k on an item not useful immediatly and that won't ever increase your tankiness or utility? I'd much rather take chalice for 105 gold less, get some MR, and have to be a bit more conservative with my mana lategame than if I'd bought tear.
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Ryuu314 I would answer you seriously but first can I ask you three questions?
1) What's your elo?
2) What's your Kassadin winrate?
3) Have you actually done the numbers behind the Kassadin change?
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On July 19 2012 17:23 DURRHURRDERP wrote:
Ryuu314 I would answer you seriously but first can I ask you three questions?
1) What's your elo?
2) What's your Kassadin winrate?
3) Have you actually done the numbers behind the Kassadin change?
My elo's decayed 100 points from 1730 ish due to not playing for several months. Then tanked some more trying to play from Asia. Currently floating around 1550-1600. Have 60% winrate with Kass in S2, don't remember S1.
Kassadin's ult is stronger early game (didn't notice they didn't nerf lvl 1). And breakpoint is roughly ~130 AP. I never denied that it does more damage mid/late-game when you get AP. I said the change was pointless because you're rarely going to use Kassadin's ulti for damage outside of laning/small skirmishes.
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On July 19 2012 17:23 DURRHURRDERP wrote:
Ryuu314 I would answer you seriously but first can I ask you three questions?
1) What's your elo?
2) What's your Kassadin winrate?
3) Have you actually done the numbers behind the Kassadin change?
Your turn DURRHURRDERP
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EPT
