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On May 01 2012 16:42 TheLink wrote:Get out of my lane and back to your bitch role you damn, dirty support. Why should soraka be a competitive mid, and to add insult to injury we're nerfing your W again. I thought supports were weaker because they got no gold? why does Riot need to make supports actual weaker champions too? I miss the days when my Sona was actually capable of soloing an AD at lvl 1. 
anything that makes soraka worse makes me happy. Remake that ho... again.
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i'm pretty new to LoL, how long are the downtimes for patches usually?
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2-3 Hours.
Was having fun losing an ARAM before servers conked out. I suppose I really should have seen that comming.
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On May 01 2012 16:44 De4ngus wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 15:47 Lmui wrote:
For Ryze early game shouldn't change much. Double catalysts seems like it'd become a thing though since RoA is now so good on Ryze. Looking at items,
Out of the old standard of having
Mercury's treads
Banshees
Frozen heart
Wota
Archangels
Rylais
I think you can now replace the rylais with a RoA since Ryze's ultimate now gives movespeed. Everything else should be pretty similar. The missile speed increase on his skills is nice but where I think it'll help the most is his E. It'll actually hurt and do damage now, if you get it to bounce between two targets, those two targets are taking serious damage at an insane speed..
Other than that, Sivir looks like she'll need a look into since her early game domination with a soraka + Sivir + dorans blade and a +20ish AD rune page will be even scarier.
I like the kog nerf since it'll mean if you get caught in ooze you're less likely to go from 100-20 at levels 9-13.
Annie might come back into popularity and levelling her E might become necessary. I know most people prefer to to go QWQWQRQEQ but having the skill to stack stun up fast might make the difference in a level 6 fight, even more so than the extra point in W.
DFG is going to see far more use now with 750 range. Leblanc/Veigar are going to be beastly in lane since DFG gives even more AP than before. They'll get one chance to full combo you since they have much less mana regen but that one chance is going to succeed far more often than before.
Most people saw the WotA nerf incoming since double WotA was just so strong. It'll still be good but that extra 400 gold means that melee top laners are going to have a much easier time against vlad/kennen since after they get their WotA they're pretty impossible to kill in lane unless you can 100-0 them. rylais not standard on ryze at all. that should be void staff.
The tankiness from having a Rylais outweighs the potential damage from a void staff. Rylais allows you to both chase down an opponent - which will be far easier with the new ulti - or kite your opponents. Ryze is special in that he will not get 100-0'd by any AP mid and will last a long time against an AD carry, both of which he won't need a void staff against. Against the tankiest bruisers (250+MR), you're going to go from dealing ~30% damage to ~40%, a 33% increase. Against squishies, the difference is nowhere near as pronounced since your E is going to take off 24 MR regardless. I'd take the extra 500hp and serious slow over the MR shred any day.
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On May 01 2012 17:20 Lmui wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 16:44 De4ngus wrote:On May 01 2012 15:47 Lmui wrote:
For Ryze early game shouldn't change much. Double catalysts seems like it'd become a thing though since RoA is now so good on Ryze. Looking at items,
Out of the old standard of having
Mercury's treads
Banshees
Frozen heart
Wota
Archangels
Rylais
I think you can now replace the rylais with a RoA since Ryze's ultimate now gives movespeed. Everything else should be pretty similar. The missile speed increase on his skills is nice but where I think it'll help the most is his E. It'll actually hurt and do damage now, if you get it to bounce between two targets, those two targets are taking serious damage at an insane speed..
Other than that, Sivir looks like she'll need a look into since her early game domination with a soraka + Sivir + dorans blade and a +20ish AD rune page will be even scarier.
I like the kog nerf since it'll mean if you get caught in ooze you're less likely to go from 100-20 at levels 9-13.
Annie might come back into popularity and levelling her E might become necessary. I know most people prefer to to go QWQWQRQEQ but having the skill to stack stun up fast might make the difference in a level 6 fight, even more so than the extra point in W.
DFG is going to see far more use now with 750 range. Leblanc/Veigar are going to be beastly in lane since DFG gives even more AP than before. They'll get one chance to full combo you since they have much less mana regen but that one chance is going to succeed far more often than before.
Most people saw the WotA nerf incoming since double WotA was just so strong. It'll still be good but that extra 400 gold means that melee top laners are going to have a much easier time against vlad/kennen since after they get their WotA they're pretty impossible to kill in lane unless you can 100-0 them. rylais not standard on ryze at all. that should be void staff. The tankiness from having a Rylais outweighs the potential damage from a void staff. Rylais allows you to both chase down an opponent - which will be far easier with the new ulti - or kite your opponents. Ryze is special in that he will not get 100-0'd by any AP mid and will last a long time against an AD carry, both of which he won't need a void staff against. Against the tankiest bruisers (250+MR), you're going to go from dealing ~30% damage to ~40%, a 33% increase. Against squishies, the difference is nowhere near as pronounced since your E is going to take off 24 MR regardless. I'd take the extra 500hp and serious slow over the MR shred any day.
Void's going to give you more damage than Rylai's though. And Ryze doesn't really need the slow. Paying 3150 for 500 health and a slow is pretty silly. If you just want damage you'd get Void and if you wanted to be tankier you'd go Warmogs (it's like 100 gold cheaper than Rylai's and gives you over twice the amount of health that Rylai's does).
You're essentially just buying the passive if you go Rylai's over Void. Seems kinda silly to me.
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Only 33% damage increase on the guys who are most likely going to be in your face? Why would anyone ever want THAT?
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On May 01 2012 17:20 Lmui wrote:
The tankiness from having a Rylais outweighs the potential damage from a void staff. Rylais allows you to both chase down an opponent - which will be far easier with the new ulti - or kite your opponents. Ryze is special in that he will not get 100-0'd by any AP mid and will last a long time against an AD carry, both of which he won't need a void staff against. Against the tankiest bruisers (250+MR), you're going to go from dealing ~30% damage to ~40%, a 33% increase. Against squishies, the difference is nowhere near as pronounced since your E is going to take off 24 MR regardless. I'd take the extra 500hp and serious slow over the MR shred any day.
No it doesn't. Ryze is already good at chasing because he has movespeed quints and movespeed masteries core on him. Ryze already does not get 100-0'd by any ap mid when he's at six items, short of veigar. If you need health to stop from getting oneshotted you just go full warmogs instead of Wota and still get your voidstaff because you're freaking stupid for not getting void staff. It is absolutely necessary to have to kill tanks and you really need the spell penetration since you don't even run Sorc Shoes most of the time or Abyssal.
Now toss in his ult giving him a movespeed boost and Rylai's seems even more redundant for catching dudes. I would never build Rylais on Ryze unless the enemy team has flat out not built any MR and, somehow, don't do enough damage to force a warmogs.
Also lol at only 33% damage increase. For a champion who shits out as much damage as Ryze that sounds like a pretty fucking core use of 1 slot. Assuming boots don't factor, 33% for 1/5th of your items is ABSURDLY efficient.
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On May 01 2012 17:20 Lmui wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 16:44 De4ngus wrote:On May 01 2012 15:47 Lmui wrote:
For Ryze early game shouldn't change much. Double catalysts seems like it'd become a thing though since RoA is now so good on Ryze. Looking at items,
Out of the old standard of having
Mercury's treads
Banshees
Frozen heart
Wota
Archangels
Rylais
I think you can now replace the rylais with a RoA since Ryze's ultimate now gives movespeed. Everything else should be pretty similar. The missile speed increase on his skills is nice but where I think it'll help the most is his E. It'll actually hurt and do damage now, if you get it to bounce between two targets, those two targets are taking serious damage at an insane speed..
Other than that, Sivir looks like she'll need a look into since her early game domination with a soraka + Sivir + dorans blade and a +20ish AD rune page will be even scarier.
I like the kog nerf since it'll mean if you get caught in ooze you're less likely to go from 100-20 at levels 9-13.
Annie might come back into popularity and levelling her E might become necessary. I know most people prefer to to go QWQWQRQEQ but having the skill to stack stun up fast might make the difference in a level 6 fight, even more so than the extra point in W.
DFG is going to see far more use now with 750 range. Leblanc/Veigar are going to be beastly in lane since DFG gives even more AP than before. They'll get one chance to full combo you since they have much less mana regen but that one chance is going to succeed far more often than before.
Most people saw the WotA nerf incoming since double WotA was just so strong. It'll still be good but that extra 400 gold means that melee top laners are going to have a much easier time against vlad/kennen since after they get their WotA they're pretty impossible to kill in lane unless you can 100-0 them. rylais not standard on ryze at all. that should be void staff. The tankiness from having a Rylais outweighs the potential damage from a void staff. Rylais allows you to both chase down an opponent - which will be far easier with the new ulti - or kite your opponents. Ryze is special in that he will not get 100-0'd by any AP mid and will last a long time against an AD carry, both of which he won't need a void staff against. Against the tankiest bruisers (250+MR), you're going to go from dealing ~30% damage to ~40%, a 33% increase. Against squishies, the difference is nowhere near as pronounced since your E is going to take off 24 MR regardless. I'd take the extra 500hp and serious slow over the MR shred any day.
So new Ryze Standard(?):
Boots
Tear+Sorcs+Cata+Glacier
WotA
Cata>RoA + Glacier > FH
Then either finish Arch or build a Banshees
?
Feels like a solid build takes more time now than ever, and Ryze was already a lategame AP.
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To be honest, unless you need the banshee bubble or really need the MR, a second RoA is probably going to be better than banshees.
But regardless, the final build is going to look something like
Boots
RoA
Frozen Heart
Archangels
Void
???
Only the last item is realistically flexible and it's probably going to end up being wota even after the nerf
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RoA was always okay on Ryze to an extent, the problem was it wasn't good enough to delay your Tear and Glacial and getting RoA late always feels like a waste when you can just start finishing your more core items with the same money, and by then it's lategame and you need Void to kill their tanks. It's just a case of a good item in theory that's difficult to justify getting in practice.
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zilean can no longer get rewind lvl1 nooooo
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Ryze was high priority on my banned champs list, guess who just got bumped to #1.
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On May 01 2012 17:28 Juicyfruit wrote:
To be honest, unless you need the banshee bubble or really need the MR, a second RoA is probably going to be better than banshees.
But regardless, the final build is going to look something like
Boots
RoA
Frozen Heart
Archangels
Void
???
Only the last item is realistically flexible and it's probably going to end up being wota even after the nerf
His Q will do 16 more damage with a RoA this patch compared to last patch, that's without taking into account the mana nerf and not counting the ap you get from archangels(realistically you like never finish this).
I'd still take banshees over RoA any day, banshees lets me shit on lanes way harder than roa does.
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On May 01 2012 17:50 JackDino wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 17:28 Juicyfruit wrote:
To be honest, unless you need the banshee bubble or really need the MR, a second RoA is probably going to be better than banshees.
But regardless, the final build is going to look something like
Boots
RoA
Frozen Heart
Archangels
Void
???
Only the last item is realistically flexible and it's probably going to end up being wota even after the nerf His Q will do 16 more damage with a RoA this patch compared to last patch, that's without taking into account the mana nerf and not counting the ap you get from archangels(realistically you like never finish this). I'd still take banshees over RoA any day, banshees lets me shit on lanes way harder than roa does.
You get
+ 80 AP
+ 350 mana
+ 255 HP
- 50 MR
-300g
-bubble
80AP adds 32damage to Q. 350 mana adds 22.75 damage to Q. Overall, RoA gives ~54 more damage. I'd say it's worth it over veil.
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in an average 30 min game you shoould have tear maxxed by then
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On May 01 2012 18:01 Juicyfruit wrote:Show nested quote +On May 01 2012 17:50 JackDino wrote:On May 01 2012 17:28 Juicyfruit wrote:
To be honest, unless you need the banshee bubble or really need the MR, a second RoA is probably going to be better than banshees.
But regardless, the final build is going to look something like
Boots
RoA
Frozen Heart
Archangels
Void
???
Only the last item is realistically flexible and it's probably going to end up being wota even after the nerf His Q will do 16 more damage with a RoA this patch compared to last patch, that's without taking into account the mana nerf and not counting the ap you get from archangels(realistically you like never finish this). I'd still take banshees over RoA any day, banshees lets me shit on lanes way harder than roa does. You get + 80 AP + 350 mana + 255 HP - 50 MR -300g -bubble 80AP adds 32damage to Q. 350 mana adds 22.75 damage to Q. Overall, RoA gives ~54 more damage. I'd say it's worth it over veil.
I said compared to last patch, I know you get more stats than just AP, I'd still rather have the MR and the bubble which is usefull against a lot of things over some ap and hp/mana.
On May 01 2012 18:01 eagle wrote:
in an average 30 min game you shoould have tear maxxed by then
It's not about having tear maxxed, it's about other more important/usefull items, I doubt you'd have 5 items at the 30minute mark.
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man that is a pretty big nerf to warwick's Q. i don't recall ww being a problem in competitive play, did i miss something?
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Wait so Zilean can't level W first, but katarina still can?
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Katarina's W still gives bonus autoattack damage if you level it up at 1.
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No Varus, don't care about playing this week.
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EPT
