On January 15 2012 11:03 turdburgler wrote: but its a relative scale, i dont think anyone can counter jungle lee sin, assuming equal or 0 team help because he just wrecks at low levels, does that mean that noone can counter jungle except lee sin? nope. amumu may or may not be at the bottom of the ladder but hes not the only hero you will play who suffers from being counter jungled.
While this is true, most champions have a back up plan they can execute with little or no competent team help. For example, you counter Jungle Shaco he is probably already laughing because he is off ganking anyway. Udyr/Shy/Skarner likely have every important camp dead anyway etc.
Who knows, maybe I have never seen a good Amumu in the last little bit, I dunno.
I personally think the reason is the low elo responds to new meta game trends very slowly. I say that because I follow the competitive scene and the most recent trends of which champs are popular, but I am not very good at the game myself.
Generally the most recent OP trends pick up steam very slowly for the worse players and by the time the meta changes or patches change, they are still in full swing for a while. Also you rarely get competently counter jungled in low elo so that isn't really a problem for amumu.
On January 15 2012 11:46 petered wrote: I personally think the reason is the low elo responds to new meta game trends very slowly. I say that because I follow the competitive scene and the most recent trends of which champs are popular, but I am not very good at the game myself.
Generally the most recent OP trends pick up steam very slowly for the worse players and by the time the meta changes or patches change, they are still in full swing for a while. Also you rarely get competently counter jungled in low elo so that isn't really a problem for amumu.
For like, 1400 or so, yeah this is true.
But at 1200 or lower people still ban amumu and other tanks just because they can't deal with them. It's like Two_Down said, when a tank is farmed, all the morons who can't cs can't kill them because they have no farm/damage. Then because they're squishy, they die to the tanks like amumu who are well farmed from ganks (that will surely be successful) and jungle farm. So in the end, they can't die and do enough damage to kill the entire enemy team.
Also, low levels are so terrible that most of them go straight to lane. They don't even understand how to invade, so amumu can jungle unhindered. So obviously he's going to be able to do whatever he wants, and come lategame will be extremely powerful and gamechanging with his ult, which is what amumu is about. >_>
On January 15 2012 11:46 petered wrote: I personally think the reason is the low elo responds to new meta game trends very slowly. I say that because I follow the competitive scene and the most recent trends of which champs are popular, but I am not very good at the game myself.
Generally the most recent OP trends pick up steam very slowly for the worse players and by the time the meta changes or patches change, they are still in full swing for a while. Also you rarely get competently counter jungled in low elo so that isn't really a problem for amumu.
For like, 1400 or so, yeah this is true.
But at 1200 or lower people still ban amumu and other tanks just because they can't deal with them. It's like Two_Down said, when a tank is farmed, all the morons who can't cs can't kill them because they have no farm/damage. Then because they're squishy, they die to the tanks like amumu who are well farmed from ganks (that will surely be successful) and jungle farm. So in the end, they can't die and do enough damage to kill the entire enemy team.
Makes perfect sense to me, I always wondered why everyone hated tanks at low elo, especially amumu who is frankly fucking awful. Now I am educated.
Erhm... yes, it looks cool and all but I don't understand his flash. At all. He finished Brand with R+Q+auto if I'm seeing that right. Ulti at that position would have knocked brand into the wall as well. So basicly Q+auto+R would have done EXACTLY the same damage without wasting flash.
Why the fk did he flash and why was it a good play?
Ive been playing the game for 2 days now unranked just as a way to relax after a hard SC2 ladder session or an especially tiring day at work.
So far LoL seems much more relaxed to me than SC2. Probably because my understanding and drive to really get a lot better at it is pretty low.
Ive been playing pantheon and am really enjoying the aggressive playstyle and assassination focus of the character.
He's pretty expensive in IP though for someone just just starting and idk when I'll be able to afford him after this set of free champs is up.
Anything I should really know, or any resource I should look to to try and learn a bit more? I would like to try ranked play at some point or another.
I really just want to be equivalent of like, gold in SC2 and get a simple grasp of the mechanics and ideas as to playstyles and simple strategies. I don't ever plan on having a set team or playing with vent or skype on.
Anywhere I should look? (I've found a couple builds on mobafire or w/e that is and am having a lot of success on unranked). I've been at the top of the list with most gold and highest k/d/a ratios but I've only played about 10 games so far. All I know is to be aggressive early, and pantheon is really good at killing slow units who can't get away. I've also learned a decent combo for killing champions (ganking?). Often I try to clean up after some champs use up their initial attacks and have their stuff on cooldown. Also, using the jumping attack to land in the lane behind them if they push far towards a turret and im at full health, I then combo with aegis shield small jump thing, then the cone AoE thing (my "e"?) and then as they run I throw a Q at them to finish them off then ghost away if there is a chance I might be close to dying. Is this ok? I read pantheon isn't good for jungling but catching enemies alone or punishing them for being too far from their turrets alone (basically out of position).
On January 15 2012 09:19 Brees wrote: you guys should watch more good morgs play like loci. those are the shit morgs that just durp around and get cs. If I have a matchup that isnt bad im going to zone the shit out of you and continually try to hit qs before i heal up with W. She is a gank proof character and you should treat her like one, if you hit 1 Q its a kill. shes not the down syndrome non killing character you make her out to be, i frequently get kills in lane.
she can get ganked but only vs specific heros who can break her shield while still having a disable up
Erhm... yes, it looks cool and all but I don't understand his flash. At all. He finished Brand with R+Q+auto if I'm seeing that right. Ulti at that position would have knocked brand into the wall as well. So basicly Q+auto+R would have done EXACTLY the same damage without wasting flash.
Why the fk did he flash and why was it a good play?
Brand e'd him and then sent a q at him. If lee sin just pressed q (he was too close to dodge the brand q by moving from the looks of it) he would have been hit by brand q and stunned. Since flash is instant, he was able to dodge the q stun by flashing behind brand, kick him away, and then q at brand to get out of brand's w and kill him.
Mobafire is pretty hit and miss. I think SoloMid.net is probably going to be your best resource for guides as you can find "Featured" guides that are usually written by pros or high ELO players. Once you've played for like a month or two you probably won't need to look up guides at all.
For new players, just practice a lot. Like with any game the more you play it the better you'll get. Wards are really fucking important so while you might not need them at low levels because no one jungles and hardly anyone ganks get in the habit of buying them. Try to get good at CSing because if you can CS well you will win lots of games at low level. If you find opportunities to leave your lane and gank another one you should just to get an idea of how successful ganks look and how bad ones look.
Finally, watch some streams. Streams are a really great way to see how people better than you play. You may want to ignore what they say, especially some of the streamers who rage a lot. I would recommend watching bigfatjiji's stream at CLGaming.net. He plays AP carry and is an incredibly smart player. There are lots of other good streamers who will explain stuff too such as Dan Dinh, Chaox, or Doublelift.
If you guys are last pick in a 2.2k elo game, please for the love of God listen to your first pick. They probably know what they are talking about. I just had a Trynd make an utter fool of himself. When he died to a gank I went to his lane so I didn't miss the cannon creep xp. Instantly I was "pushing his lane" and "trash." When he lost his tower he froze his lane without understanding the repercussions of it and we ended up losing all map control as their kennen ran around the map while we were 4v5.
Ultimately, be open to learning from higher elo players. Chances are they know what they're talking about.
Erhm... yes, it looks cool and all but I don't understand his flash. At all. He finished Brand with R+Q+auto if I'm seeing that right. Ulti at that position would have knocked brand into the wall as well. So basicly Q+auto+R would have done EXACTLY the same damage without wasting flash.
Why the fk did he flash and why was it a good play?
Brand e'd him and then sent a q at him. If lee sin just pressed q (he was too close to dodge the brand q by moving from the looks of it) he would have been hit by brand q and stunned. Since flash is instant, he was able to dodge the q stun by flashing behind brand, kick him away, and then q at brand to get out of brand's w and kill him.
If that's the reasoning then him getting into the position of getting Q'd only happened because he was hesitating to Q auto R in the first place.
He hit his Q. He runs around waiting for Brand Q to come out, Brand holds it back just to Q him when he doesn't expect it. I'm not exactly sure how stunning during Q flight works, but it still feels like he misplayed the situation before flashing to avoid Brands Q. :S
On January 15 2012 12:35 LoCicero wrote: If you guys are last pick in a 2.2k elo game, please for the love of God listen to your first pick. They probably know what they are talking about. I just had a Trynd make an utter fool of himself. When he died to a gank I went to his lane so I didn't miss the cannon creep xp. Instantly I was "pushing his lane" and "trash." When he lost his tower he froze his lane without understanding the repercussions of it and we ended up losing all map control as their kennen ran around the map while we were 4v5.
Ultimately, be open to learning from higher elo players. Chances are they know what they're talking about.
What's the right way to play that? If you get raped top and lose your tower should you just ward up and push to keep map pressure?
On January 15 2012 12:35 LoCicero wrote: If you guys are last pick in a 2.2k elo game, please for the love of God listen to your first pick. They probably know what they are talking about. I just had a Trynd make an utter fool of himself. When he died to a gank I went to his lane so I didn't miss the cannon creep xp. Instantly I was "pushing his lane" and "trash." When he lost his tower he froze his lane without understanding the repercussions of it and we ended up losing all map control as their kennen ran around the map while we were 4v5.
Ultimately, be open to learning from higher elo players. Chances are they know what they're talking about.
What's the right way to play that? If you get raped top and lose your tower should you just ward up and push to keep map pressure?
If you're pushed to your tower and the other laner is mia, push your lane back and help your team out. If you notice he is somewhere else on the map take his tower. Punish his team for not having someone in the lane. The faster you push the faster you farm. When you freeze a lane you cs very slowly and don't really deny the other team much because they are getting map objectives with a man advantage.
On January 15 2012 09:19 Brees wrote: you guys should watch more good morgs play like loci. those are the shit morgs that just durp around and get cs. If I have a matchup that isnt bad im going to zone the shit out of you and continually try to hit qs before i heal up with W. She is a gank proof character and you should treat her like one, if you hit 1 Q its a kill. shes not the down syndrome non killing character you make her out to be, i frequently get kills in lane.
she can get ganked but only vs specific heros who can break her shield while still having a disable up
Shield can be baited too, its cooldown is longer than almost any damage/cc spell.
So I found out something strange when I solo queue. I leave SV's stream in background, and when hes doing good, I'm doing good. When hes going bad, I'm playing like trash. I have no idea why.
Erhm... yes, it looks cool and all but I don't understand his flash. At all. He finished Brand with R+Q+auto if I'm seeing that right. Ulti at that position would have knocked brand into the wall as well. So basicly Q+auto+R would have done EXACTLY the same damage without wasting flash.
Why the fk did he flash and why was it a good play?
Brand e'd him and then sent a q at him. If lee sin just pressed q (he was too close to dodge the brand q by moving from the looks of it) he would have been hit by brand q and stunned. Since flash is instant, he was able to dodge the q stun by flashing behind brand, kick him away, and then q at brand to get out of brand's w and kill him.
If that's the reasoning then him getting into the position of getting Q'd only happened because he was hesitating to Q auto R in the first place.
He hit his Q. He runs around waiting for Brand Q to come out, Brand holds it back just to Q him when he doesn't expect it. I'm not exactly sure how stunning during Q flight works, but it still feels like he misplayed the situation before flashing to avoid Brands Q. :S
?
To secure the kill he had to R then do the second Q. If he did the second Q without flashing then he would have ran straight into Brand's Q and get stunned, which was what Brand was expecting. Brand was too far for him to R-Q right after landing his Q, so he basically played it out in one of the best possible scenarios. He wanted to kill Brand and he accomplished that.
On January 15 2012 12:35 LoCicero wrote: If you guys are last pick in a 2.2k elo game, please for the love of God listen to your first pick. They probably know what they are talking about. I just had a Trynd make an utter fool of himself. When he died to a gank I went to his lane so I didn't miss the cannon creep xp. Instantly I was "pushing his lane" and "trash." When he lost his tower he froze his lane without understanding the repercussions of it and we ended up losing all map control as their kennen ran around the map while we were 4v5.
Ultimately, be open to learning from higher elo players. Chances are they know what they're talking about.
What's the right way to play that? If you get raped top and lose your tower should you just ward up and push to keep map pressure?
If you're pushed to your tower and the other laner is mia, push your lane back and help your team out. If you notice he is somewhere else on the map take his tower. Punish his team for not having someone in the lane. The faster you push the faster you farm. When you freeze a lane you cs very slowly and don't really deny the other team much because they are getting map objectives with a man advantage.
What if the other laner can just straight up kill you without the tower? I had one game not long ago as Olaf vs Riven top, where Riven double killed us top because of a really bad level 2 tower dive by the jungler. After that the lane was basically done and my tower went down, but if I pushed up to her tower and she showed up, she could chase me down and kill me before I could get back to my second tower.
On January 15 2012 12:45 dignity wrote: So I found out something strange when I solo queue. I leave SV's stream in background, and when hes doing good, I'm doing good. When hes going bad, I'm playing like trash. I have no idea why.
There must be a scientific explanation for it! Quick! Record everything Saint is doing!
EPT
