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[Patch 1.0.0.131: Viktor] General Discussion - Page 215

Forum Index > LoL General
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Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 15 2012 06:00 GMT
#4281
I have played with a few 22k+ people, and the big difference between them and the rest of us is that they just dont lose exchanges
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
NotSorry
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States6722 Posts
January 15 2012 06:24 GMT
#4282
is the servers still lagging hardcore?
We have now sunk to a depth at which restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. - Orwell
Kickboxer
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Slovenia1308 Posts
January 15 2012 06:24 GMT
#4283
On January 15 2012 14:47 Kaneh wrote:
to name a few:
Positioning (where you need to be in lane to avoid ganks, where you need to be in a fight to avoid dying)
Map awareness/control (ward locations, buff/dragon, needing to be near baron lategame, when to split, when to group)
Matchup knowledge (including teamfights, like if you can poke or not)
Item knowledge (what to open in lane, what to build if behind, what to build if ahead)
Teamfight knowledge (focus targets, initiate, how to counter)
Picks/Counterpicks
How to farm (not just last hitting, but where to be to soak up waves)
Some technical skills (landing combos, walljumping, dodging skillshots)


Wow this man speaks the truth.
UniversalSnip
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
9871 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 06:27:10
January 15 2012 06:26 GMT
#4284
On January 15 2012 14:39 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2012 14:36 UniversalSnip wrote:
On January 15 2012 14:21 JMC4 wrote:

Ok so my cousin and I were playing a game of lol the other day and we got crushed. It's not that we played bad it was just that we played against some players that were more skilled than us. After the game my cousin asked me what the subtitles of being extremely good like that are. I have no idea, what does separate the good players from guys like me. I know obviously minion farming is important but aside from that do they just have better game sense? What is it that separates the best from the rest?


the best way to find out is to read this thread a lot, watch streams a lot, and play the game a lot. getting better is mostly a matter of time investment


You also have to invest that time into figuring out what mistakes you're making and fixing them. You can put a million hours into a game, but if you never want or try to improve, you never will.


that's true, I should have phrased it as a matter of time invested in trying to get better rather than just time invested
"How fucking dare you defile the sanctity of DotA with your fucking casual plebian terminology? May the curse of Gaben and Volvo be upon you. le filthy casual."
FR4CT4L
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Australia697 Posts
January 15 2012 06:40 GMT
#4285
On January 15 2012 15:00 Two_DoWn wrote:
I have played with a few 22k+ people, and the big difference between them and the rest of us is that they just dont lose exchanges


Wow 22000 where did you find such players!? 0_0
Veni, vidi, vici!
Ryuu314
Profile Joined October 2009
United States12679 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 07:09:20
January 15 2012 07:00 GMT
#4286
On January 15 2012 14:21 JMC4 wrote:

Ok so my cousin and I were playing a game of lol the other day and we got crushed. It's not that we played bad it was just that we played against some players that were more skilled than us. After the game my cousin asked me what the subtitles of being extremely good like that are. I have no idea, what does separate the good players from guys like me. I know obviously minion farming is important but aside from that do they just have better game sense? What is it that separates the best from the rest?

You would be surprised exactly how much of a difference being better at farming will make a player.

Example:
Player A farms up and first backs with 800 gold. Player B farms up and backs with only 450 gold. Player A can buy a doran's item and boots when he gets back in lane, while Player B can only afford boots. Using the edge gained by having an extra doran's item, Player A can win exchanges since he deals more damage, which means he can force the other player back faster and earlier, allowing him to gain an even greater exp and gold lead, which then snowballs into larger and larger advantages. That 350 gold difference can be basically 15 minions over the course of ~5 minutes, in the form of just an extra 1~2 more minion kills per wave.

Or even more subtle, an extra one or two minion kills allows a player to buy an addition potion or ward, which will in turn provide greater sustainability, letting them force and live through an additional damage trade that they can afford, due to their extra potion, which their opponent doesn't have.

Obviously, there's other aspects that separates good players, bad players, and great players. But one thing bad and new players severely underestimate is exactly how much of a difference being good at last hitting creep can make.
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
January 15 2012 07:09 GMT
#4287
On January 15 2012 16:00 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2012 14:21 JMC4 wrote:

Ok so my cousin and I were playing a game of lol the other day and we got crushed. It's not that we played bad it was just that we played against some players that were more skilled than us. After the game my cousin asked me what the subtitles of being extremely good like that are. I have no idea, what does separate the good players from guys like me. I know obviously minion farming is important but aside from that do they just have better game sense? What is it that separates the best from the rest?

You would be surprised exactly how much of a difference being better at farming will make a player.

Example:
Player A farms up and first backs with 800 gold. Player B farms up and backs with only 450 gold. Player A can buy a doran's item and boots when he gets back in lane, while Player B can only afford boots. Using the edge gained by having an extra doran's item, Player A can win exchanges since he deals more damage, which means he can force the other player back faster and earlier, allowing him to gain an even greater exp and gold lead, which then snowballs into larger and larger advantages. That 350 gold difference can be basically 10~12 minions over the course of 5 minutes, in the form of just an extra 1~2 more minion kills per wave.

Or even more subtle, an extra one or two minion kills allows a player to buy an addition potion or ward, which will in turn provide greater sustainability, letting them force and live through an additional damage trade that they can afford, due to their extra potion, which their opponent doesn't have.

Obviously, there's other aspects that separates good players, bad players, and great players. But one thing bad and new players severely underestimate is exactly how much of a difference being good at last hitting creep can make.


This.

There is no bigger room for self improvement than to learn how to last hit better. Gold => Items wins games.

... of course, you could cop out and main Junglers, hurr hurr.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
Cloud9157
Profile Joined December 2010
United States2968 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 07:14:37
January 15 2012 07:14 GMT
#4288
Being a jungler is so fucking terrible.

You get blamed for every person that loses their lane. You first picked Irelia and got cp'd by Olaf? Too bad. Not jungler's job to bail you out.
"Are you absolutely sure that armor only affects the health portion of a protoss army??? That doesn't sound right to me. source?" -Some idiot
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14081 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 07:19:41
January 15 2012 07:18 GMT
#4289
On January 15 2012 16:14 Cloud9157 wrote:
Being a jungler is so fucking terrible.

You get blamed for every person that loses their lane. You first picked Irelia and got cp'd by Olaf? Too bad. Not jungler's job to bail you out.


I'm starting to learn the art from the vicious saint.

Top is 0-2 and bitches at you? "You just died twice 1n1 go fix your own mess"
Bot is 0-2 and bitches at you? "You just fed them wards, waste of time, ur on ur own"

Didn't get what he says when mid is behind yet. =D


...but seriously, "It's warded" is like the BEST answer to botlanes bitching about ganks nowadays imoimo.
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
Cloud9157
Profile Joined December 2010
United States2968 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 07:26:15
January 15 2012 07:22 GMT
#4290
Seriously, what is so hard about simply farming? If your lane doesn't favor you in engagements, fucking kill minions and leave the enemy alone unless theres a gank or they dive you.

My favorite was when a fail Soraka/Vayne bot lane bitched at me because I "never ganked". Shaco killed them twice by 4:30 while I was trying to get top a gank on Trynd before he hit 6, or else he wasn't going to die.

Yes, its clearly jungles fault that you're retarded and don't know how to play against Shaco...

Jungle needs to go back to the way it was. Least back then you could camp a lane and not lose experience.
"Are you absolutely sure that armor only affects the health portion of a protoss army??? That doesn't sound right to me. source?" -Some idiot
Alzadar
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada5009 Posts
January 15 2012 07:23 GMT
#4291
Have people experimented much with the Kaiser since his rebuff? Just bought him and I've been wrecking faces.

Miss Fortune carrying enemy team? Np np, now she's carrying our team. :D
I am the Town Medic.
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-15 07:32:42
January 15 2012 07:32 GMT
#4292
On January 15 2012 16:18 r.Evo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2012 16:14 Cloud9157 wrote:
Being a jungler is so fucking terrible.

You get blamed for every person that loses their lane. You first picked Irelia and got cp'd by Olaf? Too bad. Not jungler's job to bail you out.


I'm starting to learn the art from the vicious saint.

Top is 0-2 and bitches at you? "You just died twice 1n1 go fix your own mess"
Bot is 0-2 and bitches at you? "You just fed them wards, waste of time, ur on ur own"

Didn't get what he says when mid is behind yet. =D


...but seriously, "It's warded" is like the BEST answer to botlanes bitching about ganks nowadays imoimo.


To be fair, it might seem like saint's being an ass but he is really good a judging when to gank.
Anyone who watches his stream can tell he's watching lanes and capitalizing with a gank when the lane needs it. The other thing is that saint rarely wastes any jungle time on trying to wait out on a subpar/failed gank. He's not really being a dick, but rather making sure the team as a whole isn't wasting time.

That being said, a lot of it goes back to what Cloud9157 is just now referencing. Would help janglers if the lanes were such fk sucks in the head.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
rizzla
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States45 Posts
January 15 2012 07:34 GMT
#4293
I have seen several Mords lately. Mostly they have been doing better than they used to.
League of Legends | rizzla23 | 1597 Highest ELO
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
January 15 2012 07:35 GMT
#4294
On January 15 2012 16:34 rizzla wrote:
I have seen several Mords lately. Mostly they have been doing better than they used to.


wai hallo thar~
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
January 15 2012 07:37 GMT
#4295
On January 15 2012 08:20 57 Corvette wrote:


Someday I hope I can be as good as this guy

My friend who almost exclusively plays lee sin, does shit like this all the time. It's scary how good lee sin can get with good mechanics.
liftlift > tsm
NeoIllusions
Profile Blog Joined December 2002
United States37500 Posts
January 15 2012 07:39 GMT
#4296
Too bad Coobie kinda stop playing. He was probably the first impressive high elo player who played exclusive LS. Cruzer is pretty damn good too.
ModeratorFor the Glory that is TeamLiquid (-9 | 155) | Discord: NeoIllusions#1984
wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
January 15 2012 07:40 GMT
#4297
On January 15 2012 09:11 overt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2012 09:00 Alaric wrote:
I've never really felt threatened by any Morgana I saw. One beat me, but I played badly (and now I want to smartcast Q on Gragas). I'm also arguably at a quite lower level than most of you, but they always seem to assume "Oh it's Morg, ez modo, I don't have to try hard" and thus not be able to do that well if the game isn't handed to them.


The thing about Morg though is that she probably won't kill you in lane unless you fuck up. All she has to do to win the lane though is play smart and even then she can play a little reckless and still out CS you and not die to you. Her mid and late game is really strong and she has one of the best ults for any AP carry not to mention the massive utility she brings to a team.

So while she won't crush lanes she can easily out CS you and still find time to gank your top or bottom while being a monster midgame and late game champ. She isn't like 100% our team wins cause we have Morgana or anything like that it's just that she really has very few bad match ups and even her "bad match ups" she can still survive in lane.

One of the things about AP mid in general, especially with morgana, is that even 1 small misshap can just spell insta-death. This is why I like playing Gragas, he's generally tanky enough to survive despite getting caught over 1 stupid mistake.
liftlift > tsm
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
January 15 2012 07:42 GMT
#4298
Its damn hard to gank bot lane these days. The enemy team has to be flat out balls retarded for it to actually succeed.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Attakijing
Profile Joined June 2011
United States693 Posts
January 15 2012 07:46 GMT
#4299
On January 15 2012 16:00 Ryuu314 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 15 2012 14:21 JMC4 wrote:

Ok so my cousin and I were playing a game of lol the other day and we got crushed. It's not that we played bad it was just that we played against some players that were more skilled than us. After the game my cousin asked me what the subtitles of being extremely good like that are. I have no idea, what does separate the good players from guys like me. I know obviously minion farming is important but aside from that do they just have better game sense? What is it that separates the best from the rest?

You would be surprised exactly how much of a difference being better at farming will make a player.

Example:
Player A farms up and first backs with 800 gold. Player B farms up and backs with only 450 gold. Player A can buy a doran's item and boots when he gets back in lane, while Player B can only afford boots. Using the edge gained by having an extra doran's item, Player A can win exchanges since he deals more damage, which means he can force the other player back faster and earlier, allowing him to gain an even greater exp and gold lead, which then snowballs into larger and larger advantages. That 350 gold difference can be basically 15 minions over the course of ~5 minutes, in the form of just an extra 1~2 more minion kills per wave.

Or even more subtle, an extra one or two minion kills allows a player to buy an addition potion or ward, which will in turn provide greater sustainability, letting them force and live through an additional damage trade that they can afford, due to their extra potion, which their opponent doesn't have.

Obviously, there's other aspects that separates good players, bad players, and great players. But one thing bad and new players severely underestimate is exactly how much of a difference being good at last hitting creep can make.

Whenever reginald is getting serious he just says all of these points again and again. He obviously knows a lot of other ways to get good but he always says that when someone asks him how to get better and they arent 2k or higher he always tells them the same thing.
Speaking to people who are really new at the game i guess the best way to think about it would be to see k/d as a side result of laning, not the goal. If you are really dominating someone in lane they won't just have a bunch of deaths, they will have no xp and no cs (compared to you). This means they are literally useless late game and just feed your team gold each time they die, which pretty much makes your game a 4v5.
Hidden_MotiveS
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Canada2562 Posts
January 15 2012 07:46 GMT
#4300
Go nocturne or twitch :p
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