EPT[Patch 1.0.0.128: Shyvana] General Discussion - Page 108
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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. - Neo, 9:49 KST, Nov 9th | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On November 08 2011 09:55 barbsq wrote: the only time i ever feel particularly pressed for money in bot lane is if i get absolutely crushed. I don't even know what this means because the phrase 'pressed for money' is so vague. | ||
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
On November 08 2011 09:59 UniversalSnip wrote: Remember oracles is going to get removed at some point. One possibility is that you could make all wards reveal other wards, and have pinks for specifically revealing cloaked units. That way the team that's ahead still gets superior awareness. I don't even know what this means because the phrase 'pressed for money' is so vague. pressed for money means i cannot afford wards? makes sense to me in context :/ | ||
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Seuss
United States10536 Posts
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
On November 08 2011 10:01 barbsq wrote: pressed for money means i cannot afford wards? makes sense to me in context :/ That's because you said it. Pressed for money could mean anything from "I'm able to buy less than the correct number of items a support would be able to buy in an optimally designed game" to "I only have boots." | ||
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rob.au
1087 Posts
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
On November 08 2011 10:08 Seuss wrote: Finding a way for it to be worthwhile to give gold to supports without making them ridiculously imbalanced or just changing who we regard as the "0 CS" supports is probably the most complicated design problem in LoL at the moment. It's not going to be fixed with minor price changes. My opinion is that aura items need to be accessible for cheaper and build into bigger aura item. Something like a "mini aegis" that you can build for like 900gold that then becomes built into the real aegis. Problem right now is that there's no "timing window" where it's worthwhile to give support one or two waves of cs. Supports for the most part have to buy their first gp10 and boots 1, and then 2 wards every 3 minutes minimum. If they get a surplus they usually buy an oracle. For the to actually get items that benefit the team requires a minimum of 2k gold. Obviously, having to accumulate that much gold before it's beneficial for your team means it's better not to bother giving them gold at all. Aura items like aegis are pretty hard to build if you aren't dominating your game. Nonetheless, for teamfight purposes, they're worthwhile to have and will likely have a pretty big swing on the outcome if the enemy team doesn't have it. For that to work though, that gold on the support need to "kick in" way before you fork over 2k gold. If there were lower tier worthwhile support items, then a team can probably spare the support an extra 10cs if they want to utilize that aura item advantage to secure a good first teamfight, for instance. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On November 08 2011 10:08 Seuss wrote: Finding a way for it to be worthwhile to give gold to supports without making them ridiculously imbalanced or just changing who we regard as the "0 CS" supports is probably the most complicated design problem in LoL at the moment. It's not going to be fixed with minor price changes. It's possible that it's already worthwhile to give gold to supports. People just aren't trying it. There's not any empirical evidence showing that supports cleaning up some CS here or there or getting first blood is a bad thing, people just follow the "theorycraft" and bitch at you when you do it. Even in DotA, where farm on your carry scales WAY harder than farm on your carry in LoL, it's still extremely worthwhile for supports to be getting farm--even 5th position supports will generally end the game with 1-2 2k+ gold support items. | ||
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Sufinsil
United States760 Posts
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barbsq
United States5348 Posts
also, very often there are opportunities to creep when your ranged ad has to base. i take full advantage of them as much as i can (while trying to avoid pushing, so nothing like starcalling waves or anything like that), so i'll typically come out of laning phase with about 12-15 cs, which really helps out. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On November 08 2011 10:47 barbsq wrote: there are always a few creeps that the ranged ad misses. certainly you try your best to feed them all to him, but it's just like playing babysitter in dota, you take the cs that your partner cant get to. granted, there are a lot of melee carries that typically end up in these lanes, so there are a lot more missed creeps (i typically dont see opportunities until like 7-8 minutes), but its a similar idea. also, very often there are opportunities to creep when your ranged ad has to base. i take full advantage of them as much as i can (while trying to avoid pushing, so nothing like starcalling waves or anything like that), so i'll typically come out of laning phase with about 12-15 cs, which really helps out. Even hard supports in DotA still clean up CS midgame just like anyone else. If you have a rough laning phase, there's nothing wrong with being the one to clean up a big wave that's pushed to your side, or at least being there to clean up a few CS/XP while AoEing the wave down faster. But if you do that in LoL, everyone crucifies you for it. | ||
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Chrispy
Canada5878 Posts
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
but if you actually want the support to do anything aside from providing utility, then there's a problem. Supports will get melted in like 2 spells if they get anywhere near the enemy team unless they took like half the carry's farm. beyond shurelias and sometimes aegis/starks I don't think that supports can do very much in terms of items. | ||
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mrgerry
United States1508 Posts
On November 08 2011 10:59 Chrispy wrote: I think if the support is going to go GP/10 it would probably be optimal for him to get some CS at the start so he can afford it faster and therefore acquire more revenue. Great idea I will tell my AD this next time I q up. Guaranteed to cause zero rage and understand logic. Or better yet, I'll just take all the cs and buy 4 G/10 items and give him all the wards. THINK OF ALL THE REVENUE AND CAPITAL I COULD OWN | ||
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lurked
Canada918 Posts
On November 08 2011 09:27 Frolossus wrote: http://na.leagueoflegends.com/news/rally-your-friends-ranked-teams-are-coming ranked teams inc Yeah I just saw it too, that's a good thing! I can't wait to see how it's implemented. BTW, is anyone else a bit pissed that they're making all these great changes(Nerf Flash/Clairvoyance, Ranked teams) right after Skyrim's release? I'll have to wait quite a while before experimenting these... ^^ | ||
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CeriseCherries
6170 Posts
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Parnage
United States7414 Posts
Lag in route to double golems, float over the wall instead of around them. Ult a player, proceed to casually float to them before floating away. Try to gank a lone enemy alistar top, he somehow manages to escape two people as myself and akali float over the tribrush wall instead of around it. Somehow managed to win. Riot servers real messed up that game. | ||
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xDaunt
United States17988 Posts
On November 08 2011 12:05 CeriseCherries wrote: -.- the biggest conundrum is when your carry sucks shit at last hitting and then you dont know whether to take the farm or let it go to waste -.- If you're playing at an ELO where there's a risk that your carry is going to be that bad, you shouldn't be picking a support in the first place. | ||
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
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lurked
Canada918 Posts
Of course you rely on your lane-mate's CC(And I'm around 1350 rating, so it's maybe not viable at all at high ELO), but you have sick map awareness with the traps in combo with wards and cv, a heal that boosts your carry's AS, a absurdly long range poke, and she can depend on her cat form and spear to deal decent damage even without dmg items, as the base dmg of her catform skills is quite good, and have a low ap scaling. Anyway, I'm not saying she's up there with the competitive supports, but I'm having a blast playing her support! | ||
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