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[Patch 1.0.0.127: Graves] General Discussion - Page 26
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Zhiroo
Kosovo2724 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On October 20 2011 13:13 overt wrote: He's from the Dominican Republic so he talks with an accent. I read that post in his accent which made it way more enjoyable. Have you heard him in that Interview with Rivington at IPL or IEM (cannot exactly recall which event it was)? No offense intended, but he seriously sounded like he was braindamaged. I really like him as a player, he just seems not to be the one who puts stuff overeloquently. | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:14 Kyhron wrote: its not the attack speed or ult buff thats help its that they normalized his q and increased the damage No they didn't. The only part of Q that changed was the mana cost. The damage was entirely unchanged (unless you mean the minor damage change 2 patches ago--which was like 5 damage at all ranks). On October 20 2011 23:14 Kyhron wrote: In terms of building him id get wriggles just for the passive + lifesteal to help with sustain slightly. Rageblade is definitely a great item on him same with gunblade. Your build seems pretty solid but to me skarner needs some sort of sustain for team fights to really be good. then again its my 2 cents I don't see the need to build lifesteal items when you already have a shield and a heal built into your kit. By far the best survivability stats to build are resists for the same reason. Wriggle's was necessary pre-patch because to jungle sustainably you needed to economize your mana, but that's much less of an issue now. If you absolutely need to itemize sustainability, I don't even think I'd get Wriggle's over Philo Stone, given that Shurelya's is really nice for him. | ||
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lurked
Canada918 Posts
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:32 Sabin010 wrote: Who are some good champs I can build snowballs on and carry games. I want to try out some bravery builds, and have no clue where to start. If you want to carry games, play champs you are best with. Easy as that. At the elo you are probably at, basically everything is good enough to carry. Champions that snowball really hard are generally Assassins like Akali, Talon, Kat. | ||
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:39 Shiv. wrote: If you want to carry games, play champs you are best with. Easy as that. At the elo you are probably at, basically everything is good enough to carry. Champions that snowball really hard are generally Assassins like Akali, Talon, Kat. I think he means champs that you can build SotO/Levi/Mejai's on. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:40 TheYango wrote: I think he means champs that you can build SotO/Levi/Mejai's on. LeBlanc. A good LeBlanc with a stacked Mejai? Everything asplode. | ||
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Shiv.
3534 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:40 TheYango wrote: I think he means champs that you can build SotO/Levi/Mejai's on. Levi new fotm, amirite? | ||
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KaoReal
Canada340 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:00 TheYango wrote: I don't really think the buff really affected his raw power level that much in terms of team-fight strength. 10% ASpd@18 and 0.25 seconds on his ultimate are not huge changes to that. What the changes helped with are improving his flexibility in jungle (he no longer needs his blue buff to jungle effectively, which opens up a lot of stranger jungle starts, as well as allowing him to pass the 2nd blue buff to mid in the relevant matchups), and allowing him more flexible itemization (since he can maintain jungle speed without Wriggle's, it allows him to work into his core items sooner, especially since the Wriggle's stats aren't great for him). With regard to that, I'm curious, what are people building on him? I saw Saint do Wriggles->HoG->Randuin/Triforce/QSS, but I feel like the Wriggle's and HoG aren't that great on him--he doesn't need Wriggle's to clear small camps effectively because of how Q mana is easier to handle now, and HoG just feels wasted because of how he has a strong shield skill (so HP is a somewhat less desirable survivability stat than resists), and since he doesn't scale out that well late-game (so investing in gp5 doesn't pay off huge returns). Rageblade seems like a no-brainer for him, given that he uses all the stats, and can guarantee entering any fight with 8 stacks and keeping them up indefinitely (Rageblade stacks last 4 seconds, and Q's base CD is 3.5). I was thinking of a core looking something like Cloth+5pot->Boots->Rageblade->Aegis->Triforce/GA/QSS in some order. Thoughts? I've always liked my first item to be Sheen; Skarner's mana problems aren't entirely gone, and this gives him the little edge that he needs. He also has one of the highest base attack damage scores in the league as he levels up, and the AP isn't wasted on him. After Sheen and boots (2) are finished, Guinsoo's does sound like the next logical step; it is such an incredibly cost effective item for Skarner, especially when you factor in the effect it has on his passive. You'd finish up the basic build with Trinity Force, I'm guessing, but that doesn't sound like much sustainability or durability to me. I'm not exactly sure where to fit in the Hextech Gunblade, if at all, anymore. | ||
Attakijing
United States693 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:12 Requizen wrote: his w is a totally new kind of skill and will have a lot of weird utility. all his stats and skills are just absurd. compare him to tristana: he has an inferior escape and a comparable attack speed buff in one skill, a farming/harassing aoe skill like trist E in his q, and his ult is very similar. with his w he's just better.So I take it the new general consensus is that Graves is worth buying? Or do you think he'll get a nerf in the first few weeks? Honestly, he looks like a lot of fun, but I'm always wary of buying new champs only for them to get nerfed right away because of general qq. Hasn't happened in a while, but yeah. but it will take a long time for people to figure out exactly why he is relatively op. so probably 2-3 patches of rampage, then a small nerf like talon got, then a big nerf when the small nerf doesnt help | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
but doesn't Nashor's Tooth have kinda absurd synergy with his kit? | ||
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zodde
Sweden1908 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:57 Mogwai wrote: I don't play Skarnar, so take this with a grain of salt... but doesn't Nashor's Tooth have kinda absurd synergy with his kit? I think so as well, but the general consensus is that Nashor's is bad as an item and should never be built on anything ever... | ||
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Kyhron
United States945 Posts
On October 20 2011 23:57 Mogwai wrote: I don't play Skarnar, so take this with a grain of salt... but doesn't Nashor's Tooth have kinda absurd synergy with his kit? not really.....AS is nice but Ive never had a problem with CDR cuz of his passive. In a weird way AS>CDR with CDR being almost completely unnecessary after 6 or so just cuz your autos will bring your skills off cooldown alot faster than having cdr will. again my 0.02 from what ive noticed/played | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On October 21 2011 00:02 Kyhron wrote: not really.....AS is nice but Ive never had a problem with CDR cuz of his passive. In a weird way AS>CDR with CDR being almost completely unnecessary after 6 or so just cuz your autos will bring your skills off cooldown alot faster than having cdr will. again my 0.02 from what ive noticed/played uhhhh uhhhhhhhhhh it's like ezreal or Ryze, where because of your Hax flat CDR reduction crap, you get even stronger returns off of CDR. This might be irrelevant, but on paper, CDR is absurdly strong on Skarnar. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
Actually I would probably just end up doing frozen heart + wit's end and stack a bunch of AP and be like whatsup, I have a lot of resist and a very spammable shield that gets stronger with AP and is harder to break with my super duper resists. Trinity strong too but you can always just leave it at sheen since he has all the trinity utility as part of himself to begin with. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On October 21 2011 00:02 zodde wrote: I think so as well, but the general consensus is that Nashor's is bad as an item and should never be built on anything ever... EDIT: this was too mean general consensus is that ___ is bad PERIOD END OF STORY is pretty much the dumbest possible reason to abandon it. Nashor's Tooth gives good gold efficiency on the stats it provides, it just so happens that the stats it provides are a really awkward hodgepodge that don't make sense on most characters. They do however make sense on Skarner and I'm not sure why you wouldn't go out of your way to build Nashor's unless you were hogging blue buff all game. | ||
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unichan
United States4223 Posts
On October 21 2011 00:08 Mogwai wrote: well, stop being a stupid little bitch and think for yourself then. general consensus is that ___ is bad PERIOD END OF STORY is pretty much the dumbest possible reason to abandon it. Nashor's Tooth gives good gold efficiency on the stats it provides, it just so happens that the stats it provides are a really awkward hodgepodge that don't make sense on most characters. They do however make sense on Skarner and I'm not sure why you wouldn't go out of your way to build Nashor's unless you were hogging blue buff all game. Smash laying down the law I thought it worked with AP Teemo, but people made fun of me and said it was stupid. So I stopped getting it. | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
This is what I mean. SotO, Mejai's, Levi, Triforce, swifties or whatever it doesn't even matter. I just want a few ideas of some champs that don't need any items, and would benefit from every aspect of the core build. I know it would work on most support champs, but I'm trying to think of a few champs with good ap and ad rations on short cd moves. Irelia and MF come to mind, even GP could work on his Ult and Oranges. I mean there is no point in having a 20 stack mejai's if you're not using ap. The SotO works on the ap guys cause your auto attacks actually do damage with it and you're going to be building a sheen for synergy with the ap/mana and bonus passive. So i'm looking for AP champs that have some AD scaling as well. | ||
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aliasds
Canada555 Posts
On October 20 2011 22:14 br0fivE wrote: I really dont think he makes her obsolete at all, what are you talken about lol They have very similar skillsets (nuke, slow, steroid, aoe), but Graves does more damage, and more importantly his damage is guaranteed as all of it is done in burst. MF on the other hand, has to stand around like an idiot channelling for 2 years hoping that her targets are brain-dead and also standing in her aoe for 2 years. His steroid lasts longer, has shorter downtime, and acts as a wallhopping gap closer. All of his damage is also physical, meaning each skill benefits from the armor pen that you eventually get. Three not-insignificant sources of damage for MF (W passive, E, R) all do magic damage, meaning only her Q and her autoattacks receive your armor pen as well. Graves' Q also has longer range, does more damage, has better scaling, and costs less mana. The only edge MF has on graves is her autoattack range, which is basically made up for by the gap closer on short cd. RIP MF, my favourite ranged ad  . | ||
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