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[Patch 1.0.0.126: Xerath] General Discussion - Page 50

Forum Index > LoL General
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Prev 1 48 49 50 51 52 156 Next
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 10:34:28
October 08 2011 10:33 GMT
#981
I feel like these lane sustain issues sort of came out of Riot wanting melee laners to be able to solo in a weird way.

Consider a matchup between a melee laner and a ranged one. The ranged laner is going to be able to get a lot of free harass on the melee laner, particularly if the melee laner has no ranged harassment abilities. If you don't want melee laners to get straight-up harassed out of a matchup against a ranged champion, you've got 2 options. First, you could have the melee laner capable of threatening a large amount of burst, so that even if they do take more harass, their own harass puts the opposing laner into the kill zone sooner. Some melee laners are designed somewhat around this--like Garen and Pantheon, though in general I would guess Riot views melee laners capable of one-shotting squishy ranged laners from fairly high health as something many players wouldn't find very fun. This leads to the second option, which is to give melee laners high mitigation and healing abilities, to make harass less effective, allowing them to stay in lane longer.

The latter solution of course creates weird scenarios when these sustainable laners are against each other (as is commonly the case top lane these days). Neither of them are able to get off as much free harassment on the other one that a ranged champion would, and because their healing/mitigation abilities were balanced around deal with ranged laners, in many cases they just outheal the harass that they're capable of putting on each other. Since neither of them can really do anything effectual to the other one, both laners just sit back and farm passively.
Moderator
zalz
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Netherlands3704 Posts
October 08 2011 11:29 GMT
#982
Xerath late-game is so much fun. Deploy behind walls or in the jungle and proceed to obliterate everyone, squishy, tanky, noone of it matters cause you are cutting right through all that magic resistance.

Being able to re-deploy every 2-3 seconds is just so crazy good. Carries and AP carries can't even engage in a fight because your ulti will rape their face from the fog of war.
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14080 Posts
October 08 2011 11:31 GMT
#983
On October 08 2011 13:44 Lancer723 wrote:
You guys should have a TL streaming thread with all your stream links so that only notable TLers can have a thread and also it compiles them in a format that makes it easy to find a TL stream to watch.

That way I can be a homeboy and jsut watch you guys stream.


It's right here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=259585

Whenever people post their streams properly (aka no one on page 2) it gets added prety quickly. =P
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
freelander
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
Hungary4707 Posts
October 08 2011 11:32 GMT
#984
New champ sneak peek:
male with gun

how is that possible on Runeterra
And all is illuminated.
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
October 08 2011 12:57 GMT
#985
Gangplank.

And everyone who builds Hextech Revolver.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
r.Evo
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany14080 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 12:59:34
October 08 2011 12:58 GMT
#986
Wow. I totally forgot how good Swain is top when you pick him properly. (aka vs any bruiser <3)

(Fun fact: Support shouting for Talon to go top and me as Swain to go mid. Real great ideas these people. AP NEEDS TO BE MID WTF. - 1600 real elo hell)
"We don't make mistakes here, we call it happy little accidents." ~Bob Ross
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
October 08 2011 13:24 GMT
#987
On October 08 2011 21:58 r.Evo wrote:
Wow. I totally forgot how good Swain is top when you pick him properly. (aka vs any bruiser <3)

(Fun fact: Support shouting for Talon to go top and me as Swain to go mid. Real great ideas these people. AP NEEDS TO BE MID WTF. - 1600 real elo hell)


The reason why I didn't play him or Irelia recently these days. Need a sololane to get their farm and not enough junglers on normals. I should play more ranked once I get a better connection.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17256 Posts
October 08 2011 14:26 GMT
#988
On October 08 2011 21:57 spinesheath wrote:
Gangplank.

And everyone who builds Hextech Revolver.

Corki, Twitch
twitch.tv/cratonz
Two_DoWn
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States13684 Posts
October 08 2011 14:29 GMT
#989
Twitch has a crossbow.
"What is the air speed velocity of an unladen courier?" "Dire or Radiant?"
Craton
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States17256 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 14:34:43
October 08 2011 14:34 GMT
#990
[image loading]
twitch.tv/cratonz
byFd
Profile Joined May 2006
Germany620 Posts
October 08 2011 14:56 GMT
#991
also gangster twitch
(>°_°)>
rigwarl
Profile Joined January 2011
United States540 Posts
October 08 2011 15:03 GMT
#992
Yea, corki has a freaking plane...

Also Miss Fortune, Tristana, Caitlin, Heimerdinger. I'm not quite sure what Urgot fires and Rumble has missles.
ZERG_RUSSIAN
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
10417 Posts
October 08 2011 15:15 GMT
#993
On October 09 2011 00:03 rigwarl wrote:
Yea, corki has a freaking plane...

Also Miss Fortune, Tristana, Caitlin, Heimerdinger. I'm not quite sure what Urgot fires and Rumble has missles.

Tristana, MF and Caitlyn are all girls and Heimerdinger throws wrenches. Urgot counts. Rumble drives a gigantic machine.
I'm on GOLD CHAIN
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-10-08 15:23:51
October 08 2011 15:19 GMT
#994
On October 08 2011 19:33 TheYango wrote:
I feel like these lane sustain issues sort of came out of Riot wanting melee laners to be able to solo in a weird way.

Consider a matchup between a melee laner and a ranged one. The ranged laner is going to be able to get a lot of free harass on the melee laner, particularly if the melee laner has no ranged harassment abilities. If you don't want melee laners to get straight-up harassed out of a matchup against a ranged champion, you've got 2 options. First, you could have the melee laner capable of threatening a large amount of burst, so that even if they do take more harass, their own harass puts the opposing laner into the kill zone sooner. Some melee laners are designed somewhat around this--like Garen and Pantheon, though in general I would guess Riot views melee laners capable of one-shotting squishy ranged laners from fairly high health as something many players wouldn't find very fun. This leads to the second option, which is to give melee laners high mitigation and healing abilities, to make harass less effective, allowing them to stay in lane longer.

The latter solution of course creates weird scenarios when these sustainable laners are against each other (as is commonly the case top lane these days). Neither of them are able to get off as much free harassment on the other one that a ranged champion would, and because their healing/mitigation abilities were balanced around deal with ranged laners, in many cases they just outheal the harass that they're capable of putting on each other. Since neither of them can really do anything effectual to the other one, both laners just sit back and farm passively.


Actually, the situation is much worse in duo lanes in general, where you can get harassed by both the support and the ranged and their support can stop you as much on your support helps, except your support gets zoned out by the double ranged. Thats why you see no melee duos, things like gp and talon are a bit different because for the purposes of laning having a spammable harass that does more damage than auto attack is better than auto attacks. (Think pantheon mid vs ranged ads)

Tanks like chogath, galio, etc, could arguably still lane vs ranged+support because they have a lot of ranged spells, and I suppose thats why the tank+support bot was a meta for US for a lot of the time.

I suppose the reason why melee dps weren't seen out of the jungle for the longest time is that they didn't have the tools to solo let alone duo lane. Thats why jax went under the radar for so long.

How did dota handle this?
rigwarl
Profile Joined January 2011
United States540 Posts
October 08 2011 15:19 GMT
#995
Ah- I wasn't aware the "male" part was critical, is there some Runeterra lore I'm missing?
Flicky
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
England2665 Posts
October 08 2011 15:23 GMT
#996
On October 09 2011 00:19 rigwarl wrote:
Ah- I wasn't aware the "male" part was critical, is there some Runeterra lore I'm missing?


It's just pointing out that most of the "recent" ranged ad carries were all female.

There was a similar thing about female tanks which is why Leona was made.
Liquipedia"I was seriously looking for a black guy" - MrHoon
rigwarl
Profile Joined January 2011
United States540 Posts
October 08 2011 15:37 GMT
#997
Oh ok, I thought the point of that post was saying guns were too advanced technology for this game. Also by Heimer I meant his turrets.
Crazazyasian1337
Profile Joined October 2009
United States362 Posts
October 08 2011 16:47 GMT
#998
Where does poppy belong on a team? Would you put her in a solo lane or in a duo lane? And if you did put her in a duo lane, would you put a dedicated support with her?
;)))))))))
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
October 08 2011 17:03 GMT
#999
Any lane that she can farm in. Typically that could be top against tanky champs who can't deal a ton of damage to her, or bottom with a healer against relatively weak harrass if such a setup ever arises.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Brees
Profile Joined January 2010
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
October 08 2011 17:59 GMT
#1000
akali isn't op but gunblade is. So akali atm is slightly op. look at voyboy's solo q with akali lolzz
Brees on in
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