EPT"I get why people are upset"
- Yeah well Jeeves draws 3 fatigue cards.
...okay?
Mistress of Pain + Auchenai Soulpriest Bug - Page 3
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Fleetfeet
Canada2682 Posts
"I get why people are upset" - Yeah well Jeeves draws 3 fatigue cards. ...okay? | ||
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TAMinator
Australia2706 Posts
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NewSunshine
United States5938 Posts
On December 13 2014 06:00 Fleetfeet wrote: Sure, but technically the wording implies infinite loop. As would Bouncing Blade + Commanding Shout, which also has exceptions that prevent it from being an infinite loop. I mean, I'm not offended by the idea that priests can oneshot themselves, but it -IS- inconsistent for them to allow this infinite loop while specifically working around others. There's nothing inconsistent at all. In the case of Bouncing Blade, it was up to Blizzard's discretion as to what happens with Commanding Shout, since it's a corner case that isn't clear based on card text. For the Mistress of Pain loop to not kill you, they would have to make the card behave differently from how it's written, or otherwise change the card or rules about damage. Since it's such a rare case that can't be used with any consistency, and something a Priest should know to avoid, they're choosing to leave it as is, and let the cards do exactly what they say. | ||
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Fleetfeet
Canada2682 Posts
On December 13 2014 13:30 NewSunshine wrote: There's nothing inconsistent at all. In the case of Bouncing Blade, it was up to Blizzard's discretion as to what happens with Commanding Shout, since it's a corner case that isn't clear based on card text. For the Mistress of Pain loop to not kill you, they would have to make the card behave differently from how it's written, or otherwise change the card or rules about damage. Since it's such a rare case that can't be used with any consistency, and something a Priest should know to avoid, they're choosing to leave it as is, and let the cards do exactly what they say. Jeeves reads "At the end of each players' turn, that player draws until they have 3 cards". If you don't already know how card drawing works in hearthstone, it would be fair to assume that it would kill you if you if a Jeeves was on the board, and you entered fatigue state with less than 3 cards in your hand, because it would attempt to draw until you had 3 cards. Obviously, it would be STUPID if it worked that way, but it's completely understandable were someone to read the text that way. Similarly, the paladin card Divine Favor implies the same effect, where it would keep drawing until you have X number of cards in your hand. Again, this is NOT actually what happens with the card, and you in truth attempt to draw a number of cards that -would- give you the same number of cards as your opponent, provided you have those cards to draw. It does NOT do exactly what the card says exactly to avoid an infinite loop scenario. + Show Spoiler + Yeah, I know that this is what S1eth was talking about - Hearthstone's mechanics consider each fatigue draw a "card", even though it doesn't actually exist in your hand. Still, unless you know this tidbit of esoteric knowledge, the way the cards read point to fatigue draw until death. So yes, I do think that the Mistress of Pain + Auchenai Soulpriest scenario is inconsistent, even though it's doing exactly what the card text says. | ||
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NewSunshine
United States5938 Posts
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Fleetfeet
Canada2682 Posts
Iunno. It's not that important to me that I need to argue about it forever, it just struck me as odd in its inconsistency of design, but I can appreciate that its left in as kinda a joke. | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
On December 13 2014 13:46 Fleetfeet wrote: Jeeves reads "At the end of each players' turn, that player draws until they have 3 cards". If you don't already know how card drawing works in hearthstone, it would be fair to assume that it would kill you if you if a Jeeves was on the board, and you entered fatigue state with less than 3 cards in your hand, because it would attempt to draw until you had 3 cards. Obviously, it would be STUPID if it worked that way, but it's completely understandable were someone to read the text that way. Similarly, the paladin card Divine Favor implies the same effect, where it would keep drawing until you have X number of cards in your hand. Again, this is NOT actually what happens with the card, and you in truth attempt to draw a number of cards that -would- give you the same number of cards as your opponent, provided you have those cards to draw. It does NOT do exactly what the card says exactly to avoid an infinite loop scenario. + Show Spoiler + Yeah, I know that this is what S1eth was talking about - Hearthstone's mechanics consider each fatigue draw a "card", even though it doesn't actually exist in your hand. Still, unless you know this tidbit of esoteric knowledge, the way the cards read point to fatigue draw until death. So yes, I do think that the Mistress of Pain + Auchenai Soulpriest scenario is inconsistent, even though it's doing exactly what the card text says. The thing is if you have played physical card games then you know that whenever something say draw 'x' cards, the first thing people do is figure out what 'x' is and then pick up all the cards at once. I know this isn't spelled out in any rule, but this is how 99% of people respond when they play. Unless it's something like Dominion's version of tutors where it specifically says draw until you find something. But that sort of thing does not yet exist in Hearthstone. I also don't see what's so esoteric about taking damage if you can't draw a card, that's also how other games with partial fatigue mechanics work (Might & Magic Duel of Champions for example, blanking on others). Maybe it's just confusing since Magic / Pokemon use an auto-loss if you can't draw mechanic, so the finer points of draw or take damage are lost on people from those backgrounds (M&M is not really all that played I know). | ||
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Fleetfeet
Canada2682 Posts
Also I and most of the people I know that play HS have no other card game background. I'm assuming a fair amount of the game's population doesn't have experience from other card games to draw from. | ||
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Wuster
1974 Posts
On December 13 2014 16:45 Fleetfeet wrote: While you wouldn't know about fatigue damage from overdraw until you first experience it, that wasn't the esoteric tidbit I was referring to. What I was referring to was the fact that, in cases of overdraw, a fatigue draw is considered "a card" even in situations where the card text says to draw till you have X number of cards in hand, as in the case of Divine Favor and Jeeves. That's not something that would be common knowledge, and until you know that, you would almost definitely read Divine Favor as "If you play this on the verge of fatigue, you fucking kill yourself". I was actually talking about the same thing as you. Also I and most of the people I know that play HS have no other card game background. I'm assuming a fair amount of the game's population doesn't have experience from other card games to draw from. Fair enough, people around here talk about Magic so much that I forget the audience for Hearthstone isn't ex-magic players and more likely how you say - introduced to card games via Hearthstone. And I can accept / imagine that it's very different interpreting rules yourself versus trying to figure out how a computer is going to do it for you. | ||
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