• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 20:16
CET 02:16
KST 10:16
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
[BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 103SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-1822Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises3Weekly Cups (Dec 15-21): Classic wins big, MaxPax & Clem take weeklies3ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !11
StarCraft 2
General
SC2 All-Star Invitational: Jan 17-18 Weekly Cups (Dec 22-28): Classic & MaxPax win, Percival surprises Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou Starcraft 2 Zerg Coach ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !
Tourneys
uThermal 2v2 Circuit OSC Season 13 World Championship WardiTV Mondays $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship $100 Prize Pool - Winter Warp Gate Masters Showdow
Strategy
Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 507 Well Trained Mutation # 506 Warp Zone Mutation # 505 Rise From Ashes Mutation # 504 Retribution
Brood War
General
I would like to say something about StarCraft BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Data analysis on 70 million replays Empty tournaments section on Liquipedia A cwal.gg Extension - Easily keep track of anyone
Tourneys
[BSL21] Grand Finals - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] Non-Korean Championship - Starts Jan 10 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues SLON Grand Finals – Season 2
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Awesome Games Done Quick 2026! General RTS Discussion Thread Beyond All Reason Elden Ring Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Trading/Investing Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Big Programming Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List TL+ Announced
Blogs
Psychological Factors That D…
TrAiDoS
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
StarCraft improvement
iopq
GOAT of Goats list
BisuDagger
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1366 users

South American Politics thread - Page 11

Forum Index > General Forum
Post a Reply
Prev 1 9 10 11 12 13 66 Next
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-15 23:44:08
April 15 2019 23:21 GMT
#201
This could be complicated for some but let me break it down a bit:

The IMF has said it could put together a loan package for Venezuela "in less than six months" if there were to be a political transition.


www.bloomberg.com

No transition, no money for Guaido to implement his plans (taking over the oil for example). They aren't recognizing Guaido for several reasons one being they would be giving money to someone without the authority to secure what it's spent on or reliably pay it back.

They are cutthroat capitalists willing to do anything to make money, if they aren't backing Guaido it's because they don't think he's a smart bet. Nothing in the news or events on the ground indicate that's going to change.

Also worth noting despite some impressions Guaido has been seeking IMF money since the start and the IMF members have consistently failed to recognize him in sufficient numbers for more than 2 months now.

WASHINGTON, Feb 7 (Reuters) - The International Monetary Fund is still awaiting guidance from its member countries on whether to recognize Venezuela’s opposition leader Juan Guaido as the country’s legitimate head of state, IMF spokesman Gerry Rice said on Thursday.


www.cnbc.com

For all intents and purposes they've made their decision.

For those unfamiliar with Venezuela they may be surprised to find out the military has always been corrupt. At least long before Chavez or Maduro got there.

Here's a youtube video from CGP grey explaining how "ruling" works in the real world regardless of the country (similar to my explanation at the very start of all this). 4:00-6:00 covers the meat of it.


Hopefully that's helpful for you RVB.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 15 2019 23:40 GMT
#202
--- Nuked ---
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 16 2019 02:31 GMT
#203
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-16 14:22:45
April 16 2019 06:55 GMT
#204
That CNN article is effectively stenography for an anonymous "defense official" (with no ethical explanation) for why they are anonymous. Can't be sure it was even the same meeting or not something completely different or whether this anonymous "defense official" has any clue.

To the article itself and "deterrence"

Instead, deterrence options could include US naval exercises in the immediate region to emphasize humanitarian assistance and more military interaction with neighboring countries. The idea would be to challenge any Russian, Cuban or Chinese notion that they could have unchallenged access to the region.


I would hope after Iraq (anon officials doing this same thing), or more regionally applicable Cuba (bay of pigs/Missile crisis), we don't go down this road again. Or put any faith in Mike Pompeo, John Bolton, Elliot Abrams and the Trump administration to not be horrific war criminals (some not for the first time).

EDIT: For those unfamiliar with anonymous sourcing ethics, here's the Society of Professional Journalists (SPJ) on it:

– Consider sources’ motives before promising anonymity. Reserve anonymity for sources who may face danger, retribution or other harm, and have information that cannot be obtained elsewhere. Explain why anonymity was granted.


Here's a primer on how to read anonymously sourced stories from 538 (prompted in part by CNN's history with unethical reporting, but before the Lanny Davis one)

When To Trust A Story That Uses Unnamed Sources

journalists themselves also say the practice is overused. They argue that using unnamed sources limits journalistic accountability, since readers and other reporters can’t easily check the accuracy of an account if they don’t know where it comes from. Unnamed sources are often a feature of stories that I would argue are more about reporters showing how savvy and in the know they are than truly informing and enlightening readers.


These are some of the reasons I find GrayZone to be a far more reliable source on this topic in general, though still imperfect of course.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 16 2019 14:16 GMT
#205
--- Nuked ---
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 19 2019 21:47 GMT
#206
--- Nuked ---
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 24 2019 23:04 GMT
#207
--- Nuked ---
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 26 2019 00:19 GMT
#208
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
April 26 2019 00:30 GMT
#209
Alternatively the US could mind it's business and the UN and other aid agencies could increase aid through existing channels and negotiations returned to by the opposition that was surprised by Guaido swearing himself in.

I think though, with consideration for the situation in Yemen and US support of Saudi Arabia, it can get a lot worse before the US stops it's approach.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 26 2019 00:45 GMT
#210
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-26 02:36:46
April 26 2019 02:35 GMT
#211
Again though, with consideration to Yemen and Saudi Arabia, the sanctions never have been and never will be in support of marginalized people in Venezuela and the US will always oppose any leader that doesn't welcome their neocolonialism.

A leader that transfers that stolen wealth to anyone but US oligarchs and their lackeys will always be painted as a monster and be opposed by the US. You can look at any country in the world and see that their obedience to US economic interest always supersedes how they treat their or other people.

If Maduro agreed to steal the money to give to US oligarchs they'd hold a parade for him instead of trying to overthrow him.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 26 2019 02:40 GMT
#212
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-26 02:45:59
April 26 2019 02:45 GMT
#213
Do you know anything about Guaido before he swore himself in as President? You just keep talking about him like your unfamiliar or simply disregarding his history.

You can say "because they support one doesn't mean they will only support that type" but if you don't have a counter example it sounds like wishful thinking at best.

I don't forget at all that Russia and China exist, their (recent) foreign policy is indisputably less horrific than the US from my perspective.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 26 2019 04:09 GMT
#214
--- Nuked ---
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23535 Posts
April 26 2019 04:47 GMT
#215
I was just trying to establish whether your faith in Guaido was tempered by researching his history before he swore himself in as president or it was, as it seemed to me, without consideration for it.

I gather by your response it's the latter.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
April 26 2019 05:25 GMT
#216
--- Nuked ---
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5296 Posts
April 26 2019 05:35 GMT
#217
you're not supposed to wait until you happen across another Hitler; based on history, one should be better at predicting them.

i find your Guaido allegiance to blind and unrealistic.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-26 06:08:10
April 26 2019 06:06 GMT
#218
--- Nuked ---
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5296 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-26 07:13:08
April 26 2019 07:08 GMT
#219
from
...none of what you said was guaranteed to happened has.
he was postulating based on history, asking for caution in the case of Guaido.
you are all in for Guaido with your hopes running high while history showed a different story riddled with mini-Hitlers coming from the side of 'the good guys'.

he's not arguing which one is better, Maduro or Guaido but rather that you've learned nothing from history.
the honest course to proceed here is you to admit you argue on faith/hope alone and are to emotionally invested to acknowledge that there's a good chance Guaido will be just as bad with some chances that he would be worse than Maduro.

his promise of restoring the constitution and the judicial branch
that's to thin to go on; look at Turkey and what Erdogan did with his judicial branch.

i think what would satisfy GH on an argumentative basis is for you to hypothesise that Guaido has failed(is as close to Maduro as it gets as far as ruling the country goes), then make a case for what could be possible courses of action to remedy your fuck up('cause you put it there).

Edit: basically, in the case of the lesser evil, it's on you, the one driving the change, to have fail-safes for a worse case scenario and you have nothing but hopes and dreams.
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-26 07:49:56
April 26 2019 07:24 GMT
#220
--- Nuked ---
Prev 1 9 10 11 12 13 66 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 7h 44m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft519
JuggernautJason158
StarCraft: Brood War
Artosis 859
Shuttle 148
Rock 8
Hm[arnc] 7
Dota 2
monkeys_forever386
NeuroSwarm90
Counter-Strike
summit1g11039
tarik_tv7024
fl0m1315
minikerr33
Other Games
Liquid`RaSZi2963
JimRising 425
Maynarde147
Mew2King43
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick57846
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH131
• musti20045 36
• Mapu4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21857
League of Legends
• Doublelift7969
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
7h 44m
Wardi Open
10h 44m
RotterdaM Event
16h 14m
Patches Events
18h 44m
PiGosaur Cup
23h 44m
OSC
1d 10h
SOOP
2 days
OSC
2 days
OSC
3 days
SOOP
5 days
[ Show More ]
The PondCast
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
IPSL
6 days
DragOn vs Sziky
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 21
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S1: W3
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Thunderfire SC2 All-star 2025
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
Nations Cup 2026
Underdog Cup #3
NA Kuram Kup
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League Season 23
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.