US Politics Mega-thread - Page 5580

On March 20 2026 07:10 Hat Trick of Today wrote:


It’s already too late to get allies to help you out in a collision of the willing because Trump and this administration doesn’t believe in even bothering to try manufacturing consent.

Like this administration believes in zero sum everything. They believe nations will come help solve this issue because the world economy is cooked if it isn’t resolved and the US believes it js better positioned than other countries to absorb the blow.

So I don’t think this administration believes it’s made a mistake or has really made a mistake in the context of their belief system because the only thing this administration believes in is in forcefully coercing people to indulge in their zero sum world view.

On March 20 2026 07:14 Yurie wrote:


From my point of view the issue is resolving itself slowly already. Iran is taking full control of the strait and will put up restrictions on which nations that can send ships through. So the global issues will resolve themselves with or without supporting the US vs Iran based on current trends.

On March 20 2026 05:39 KwarK wrote:

Because it's fundamentally wrong in a way that is far beyond the effort you deserve.

The idea that Versailles was soft on Germany and WW2 was harsh on Germany is simply not historically accurate.

After WW2 Germany was partitioned and occupied. It is still occupied. Large chunks of Germany were given away to other countries. Others were completely deindustrialized. The post WW2 settlement was far, far harsher than Versailles.

The idea that American money went into rebuilding Germany after WW2 but not after WW1 completely ignores the Dawes and Young plans. Weimar Germany didn't even pay the reparations, they established a triangular system in which the war debts of Britain and France to America were paid by new loans issued to Germany by American banks. By the time WW2 broke out the outstanding US loans to Germany actually exceeded the total reparations imposed upon Germany at Versailles. Germany wasn't being drained of cash, even after the reparations were taken into account Germany was a net recipient of cash during that period. Cash that was never repaid due to the declaration of war.

And Versailles was not enforced. If at any time during German rearmament Britain and France had stepped in to enforce the terms of Versailles WW2 would have been averted. Versailles didn't cause WW2, a failure to enforce Versailles caused WW2. Britain and France were far, far too lenient on Germany. But of course this is exactly what commentators at the time said too. That there were fundamental causes for WW1 and that none of those had been addressed in the settlement and so of course there would be a second war.

People like simple one line historical explanations that generally go along the lines of "people in the past dumb, people now smart". "If only those foolish allies could have seen that reintegrating Germany into the global economy and treating them with extreme lenience was the way then this all could have been avoided". Having entirely solved the crises of the past at the age of 13 armed only with an introductory hour of study each week for 3 months they move on, confident that they know all that they need to know.

On March 20 2026 05:11 JimmyJRaynor wrote:

If you have a direct rebuttal to the logical flow of my post... go for it. if you do not think it offers a pressure relief valve... state your case.

Dealing directly with your point, the cause of WW2 and the Holocaust is basic high school history. Had the allies
(a) given Germany a viable deal at the end of WW1
(b) not totally demoralized the defeated Germans
(c) the allies behaved as though Germans were beyond redemption as a people
the chance Germans would vote for a leader like Adolf Hitler is a lot lower.

The Treaty of Versailles weakened the German economy, created political instability, fueled anger and nationalism. The Germans would be less likely to be open minded about the only leader giving them hope... Adolf Hitler.

When you defeat your opponent... and then crush them into dust while laughing at them you create a breeding ground for guys like Adolf HItler, Jesse Van Rootselaar, and Marc Lepine to go into suicide-murder mode. Once they are in murder-suicide mode you're fucked. They want to die. You have nothing to bargain. You must stop it before it happens.

Fortunately, the Allies learned this lesson in 1945 and created a completely different kind of peace at the end of WW2 versus WW1 and the Treaty of Versailles.

The 1919 deal was about punishing and weakening Germany, short term settlement, economic strain, blame focused.
The 1945 peace agreement was about controlling, rebuilding, and integrating Germany, long term strategy, economic recovery, and focused on stability.

The Treaty of Versailles imposed stiff reparations, territorial losses, and military limits. This created a politically unstablem, isolated German government. Obviously, this is fertile ground for extremism. After WW2 Germany was occupied and divided, full denazification, military dismantled only initially. Later, a shift towards rebuilding.

after WW2 the allies offered the Marshall Plan and a massive US investment in West Germany. This created prosperity and with people living decent lives.. its hard for extremism to take root. West Germany evolved into a stable democracy. In WW1 Germany was isolated while AFTER WW2 Germany was eventually reintegrated into the global system and NATO.

So you have a criminal... do you lock him up and throw away the key? or do you rehab the guy? I say you rehab him. The Allies rehabed Germany after WW2. The Allies locked Germany up and threw away the key in 1919.