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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 2793

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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!

NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.

Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.


If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread
Wegandi
Profile Joined March 2011
United States2455 Posts
October 27 2020 14:59 GMT
#55841
On October 27 2020 23:20 JimmiC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2020 20:00 farvacola wrote:
Wegandi is just listing all of the things libertarians like him hate and then vaguely associating them with people he hates. Combine that with provably stupid shit like "AOC is like Hugo Chavez" and its clear he's not saying true things, he's just railing against an enemy because he's both afraid of them and equipped with a very limited set of ideas with which to impugn them. Meaningless tripe like "strong property rights" is one of the tells, that's as hoveringly empty a signifier as it gets, and when an immoderate starts calling others bad because they aren't moderate, it's clear we're in fantasy land.

Its funny that you bring up meaningless tripes as empty signifiers. I'm starting to see more and more pop up and people are acting as if these are "smart" counters to arguments but when you ask what they mean or how X did them they never seem to have a answer. Around here it seems like "cutting red tape" and anything bad about "bureaucrats" are big time tells that someone is mad but has no idea at what or how to solve anything.

Show nested quote +
On October 27 2020 18:08 schaf wrote:
I don't want to come off as a smug European but in Germany or highest court has a one term limit of 12 years and an age cap at 68. Wouldn't something like this be better than Kavanaugh still making rulings in fourty years thanks to modern medicine? It would take away the importance of a single person for the whole system and give young scholars of law something to dream about.


These types of simple and smart rules would make a big difference. It is sad that it does not happen.

On a side note it must suck to be a awesome judge who has been doing a great job and expected to wait their turn and then all the sudden it becomes put in the youngest person with the right political affiliation so they can stay the longest instead of the best person for the job.

It is strange how much the American right has moved from being so pro merit based to so pro nepotism.


https://www.amazon.com/Death-Regulation-Robbed-Golden-Reclaim-ebook/dp/B07CHKRSFH/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Dr. Mary J. Ruwart&qid=1603808643&s=audible&sr=1-1-catcorr

https://www.fredericknewspost.com/opinion/columns/fda-policies-kill/article_e0d5eec5-f3ea-5f3b-a621-81334e400062.html (Economist Walter Williams)

https://mises.org/library/land-use-regulation-supply-and-demand-analysis-changing-property-rights

https://www.law.nyu.edu/sites/default/files/ECM_PRO_060974.pdf

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/the-regulatory-state-is-failing-us/612220/

https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2020/04/measuring-the-cost-of-regulation-a-text-based-approach.html

https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/too-few-regulations-no-just-ineffective-ones-0

https://www.cato.org/blog/occupational-licensing-reform-moves-forward-0

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/12/captured-economy/547967/

Ya, ya, I can go on as that's just the tip of the iceberg of how inane and labyrinthine the CFR and the administrative state is.

User was temp banned for this post.
Thank you bureaucrats for all your hard work, your commitment to public service and public good is essential to the lives of so many. Also, for Pete's sake can we please get some gun control already, no need for hand guns and assault rifles for the public
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-27 15:03:10
October 27 2020 15:02 GMT
#55842
--- Nuked ---
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
October 27 2020 15:13 GMT
#55843
On October 27 2020 23:45 plasmidghost wrote:
I was somewhat expecting this given how much Bloomberg has done in Florida, but it's still interesting to see if this makes a difference



I forgot all about Bloomberg. When did he say he wasn’t going to run third party anymore? Back in the spring when covid happened?
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18857 Posts
October 27 2020 15:14 GMT
#55844
To circle back to the attempts at legitimizing the illegitimate Hunter Biden story as an October Surprise favor to Trump and his campaign, the New Republic put out a nice piece summarizing the damage stories like that are doing to outlets like the Wall Street Journal. The widening divide between the news and opinion section will force some changes at some point imo.

+ Show Spoiler +
Last week, amid a torrent of bad press, President Trump teased one story as a game-changer. “The Wall Street Journal is working on a very, very important piece, which should be very good,” he said on a campaign call, teasing an explosive story about Joe Biden’s son’s dealings with foreign officials.

That story was published on Thursday, the night of the final presidential debate. But it appeared in an unexpected place: not on the newspaper’s front page but in its Opinion section. The article, written by Kimberly Strassel, was everything the Trump campaign hoped it would be. It alleged that text messages reviewed by Strassel contained evidence that Biden had been cut into a deal involving his son and a Chinese energy conglomerate. “As Biden refuses to answer questions about this case, voters will have to make up their own minds,” Strassel wrote. “But given Hunter’s exploits in China, Ukraine, Kazakhstan and elsewhere, much more is yet to come.”

For months, Trump and his allies had been hunting for a corruption allegation they could pin on Biden—a search that led to, among other things, Trump’s impeachment. Now, at long last, they had it.

It didn’t last long. Not long after Strassel’s column was published online, reporters from the paper’s news division published a story of their own. They had reviewed the same material as Strassel and come to the opposite conclusion. “The venture … never received proposed funds from the Chinese company or completed any deals, according to people familiar with the matter,” Andrew Duehren and James Areddy wrote. “Corporate records reviewed by The Wall Street Journal show no role for Joe Biden.”

It was the latest skirmish in what The Washington Post’s Paul Farhi described as “a civil war” between the Journal’s news and opinion sides that has been playing out in public for months, a reflection of a larger existential crisis at a paper whose rabidly pro-Trump Opinion section is damaging the credibility of its reporting. The controversy points to a larger crisis surrounding conservative media’s allergy to truth and reporting, which has the capability to destroy the legitimacy of mainstream papers like the Journal.

In July, nearly 300 Journal employees wrote a letter to the paper’s owner, Dow Jones, and publisher, Almar Latour, decrying the lack of standards at the paper’s Opinion section. “Opinion’s lack of fact-checking and transparency, and its apparent disregard for evidence, undermine our readers’ trust and our ability to gain credibility with sources,” the employees wrote. “Many readers already cannot tell the difference between reporting and Opinion. And from those who know of the divide, reporters nonetheless face questions about the Journal’s accuracy and fairness because of errors published in Opinion.”

The Journal’s Opinion section has published a number of propagandistic pieces about the Trump administration, including an op-ed by Vice President Mike Pence that dismissed concerns that the United States was entering a “second wave” of Covid-19 infections as a myth. (In general, when one of your least embarrassing contributors is Peggy Noonan, who spent her Friday column clutching her pearls about Kamala Harris’s dancing, you’re in trouble.)

By the time Strassel published her piece on Thursday, many had concluded that the White House was pushing the Hunter Biden story to credulous (or, in many cases, cynical) journalists as a kind of political Hail Mary. Behind by nine points nationally and trailing in nearly every key swing state, the president and his team were desperate to find 2020’s version of the Hillary Clinton emails story. In Strassel and The Wall Street Journal’s Opinion section, they found eager partners.

On Sunday, The New York Times’ Ben Smith laid out the full-court press made by a White House lawyer, Eric Herschmann, and former deputy White House counsel, Stefan Passantino, to try to turn the story into an election-shaking scandal. The goal, Smith wrote, was straightforward: The Journal’s news division has credibility. Reporting on the entanglements between Hunter and Joe Biden and foreign officials could turn into a major story, as stories about the Clinton Foundation did in 2016. (The “Clinton Cash” stories were published in the Times, in conjunction with right-wing operative Peter Schweizer.)

Then Rudy Giuliani, in a plot twist worthy of a Coen Brothers movie, appeared on the scene. He handed many of the same documents being reviewed by the Journal to the New York Post, which is, like the Journal, owned by Rupert Murdoch. (Many veteran Post reporters refused to touch the Hunter Biden story, as the Times reported last week.) By the time of Thursday’s debate, there was already serious doubt about the credibility of the documents the Post was reporting on and concerns that it was all part of a foreign influence campaign.

Strassel’s column seems, in retrospect, a last-ditch effort to give the story the veneer of respectability it desperately needed. By batting down Strassel’s column, the Journal’s news side was asserting its independence, refusing to play a part in a partisan scheme. Without that dash of credibility, the story fizzled. “If you’d been watching the debate, but hadn’t been obsessively watching Fox News or reading Breitbart, you would have had no idea what Mr. Trump was talking about,” Smith wrote. “The story the Trump team hoped would upend the campaign was fading fast.”

Smith admitted at the end of his piece that he feels a “deep ambivalence” about this reassertion of gatekeeper power, of journalistic institutions taking extraordinary steps to ensure a political attack is not legitimized. He pointed to an article co-written with John Herrman in 2017 in which Smith and Herrman said, “The media’s new and unfamiliar job is to provide a framework for understanding the wild, unvetted, and incredibly intoxicating information that its audience will inevitably see—not to ignore it.” But the media has not ignored the story per se—outlets have, for the most part, approached the Hunter Biden story with skepticism and context, which was rarely the case with Hillary Clinton’s emails.

As for The Wall Street Journal, it is facing a dilemma familiar to many news outlets owned by Murdoch. Call it the Fox News problem—it’s what happens when you try to run a credible news outlet with a viciously partisan opinion side. In the case of the Hunter Biden story, the Journal was able to assert its independence. But the long-term consequences are apparent; columns like Strassel’s suck the credibility away from newsrooms, just as programs like Tucker Carlson Tonight or Hannity do.

A report compiled by the Journal’s news side that was obtained by BuzzFeed on Friday found that the paper was floundering in the current media landscape. The Journal, BuzzFeed wrote, is “struggling mightily in the current digital and cultural age—such as not covering racial issues because reporters are afraid to mention them to editors, playing to the limited interests of its aging core audience, at times losing more subscribers than it takes in, and favoring ‘a print edition that lands in the recycling bin,’” according to the report.

The Wall Street Journal is that rare thing in the media environment: a right-leaning outlet that does actual reporting. But its reporting is being squeezed on two fronts, its lack of pull in the digital world and the paper’s increasingly deranged Opinion section. In the case of the Hunter Biden story, its news side won a battle. But it might be losing the war.


Will The Wall Street Journal Be Destroyed by its Opinion Section?
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7681 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-27 15:23:42
October 27 2020 15:23 GMT
#55845
On October 27 2020 23:20 JimmiC wrote:
On a side note it must suck to be a awesome judge who has been doing a great job and expected to wait their turn and then all the sudden it becomes put in the youngest person with the right political affiliation so they can stay the longest instead of the best person for the job.

It is strange how much the American right has moved from being so pro merit based to so pro nepotism.


There are so many lawyers, not just judges (look at past SC justices who were never a judge first), in this country, that it’s absurd for anyone to think that selection could be anything other than a political lottery. You could take only the top 99.9th% of jurists and still have more than a thousand resumes to sift through.
The unrealistic sound of these propositions is indicative, not of their utopian character, but of the strength of the forces which prevent their realization.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18857 Posts
October 27 2020 15:26 GMT
#55846
On October 28 2020 00:23 IgnE wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2020 23:20 JimmiC wrote:
On a side note it must suck to be a awesome judge who has been doing a great job and expected to wait their turn and then all the sudden it becomes put in the youngest person with the right political affiliation so they can stay the longest instead of the best person for the job.

It is strange how much the American right has moved from being so pro merit based to so pro nepotism.


There are so many lawyers, not just judges (look at past SC justices who were never a judge first), in this country, that it’s absurd for anyone to think that selection could be anything other than a political lottery. You could take only the top 99.9th% of jurists and still have more than a thousand resumes to sift through.

Sounds like the federal clerkship application process
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45921 Posts
October 27 2020 15:31 GMT
#55847
On October 28 2020 00:02 JimmiC wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 27 2020 23:59 Wegandi wrote:
On October 27 2020 23:20 JimmiC wrote:
On October 27 2020 20:00 farvacola wrote:
Wegandi is just listing all of the things libertarians like him hate and then vaguely associating them with people he hates. Combine that with provably stupid shit like "AOC is like Hugo Chavez" and its clear he's not saying true things, he's just railing against an enemy because he's both afraid of them and equipped with a very limited set of ideas with which to impugn them. Meaningless tripe like "strong property rights" is one of the tells, that's as hoveringly empty a signifier as it gets, and when an immoderate starts calling others bad because they aren't moderate, it's clear we're in fantasy land.

Its funny that you bring up meaningless tripes as empty signifiers. I'm starting to see more and more pop up and people are acting as if these are "smart" counters to arguments but when you ask what they mean or how X did them they never seem to have a answer. Around here it seems like "cutting red tape" and anything bad about "bureaucrats" are big time tells that someone is mad but has no idea at what or how to solve anything.

On October 27 2020 18:08 schaf wrote:
I don't want to come off as a smug European but in Germany or highest court has a one term limit of 12 years and an age cap at 68. Wouldn't something like this be better than Kavanaugh still making rulings in fourty years thanks to modern medicine? It would take away the importance of a single person for the whole system and give young scholars of law something to dream about.


These types of simple and smart rules would make a big difference. It is sad that it does not happen.

On a side note it must suck to be a awesome judge who has been doing a great job and expected to wait their turn and then all the sudden it becomes put in the youngest person with the right political affiliation so they can stay the longest instead of the best person for the job.

It is strange how much the American right has moved from being so pro merit based to so pro nepotism.


https://www.amazon.com/Death-Regulation-Robbed-Golden-Reclaim-ebook/dp/B07CHKRSFH/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=Dr. Mary J. Ruwart&qid=1603808643&s=audible&sr=1-1-catcorr

https://www.fredericknewspost.com/opinion/columns/fda-policies-kill/article_e0d5eec5-f3ea-5f3b-a621-81334e400062.html (Economist Walter Williams)

https://mises.org/library/land-use-regulation-supply-and-demand-analysis-changing-property-rights

https://www.law.nyu.edu/sites/default/files/ECM_PRO_060974.pdf

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/05/the-regulatory-state-is-failing-us/612220/

https://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2020/04/measuring-the-cost-of-regulation-a-text-based-approach.html

https://www.cato.org/publications/commentary/too-few-regulations-no-just-ineffective-ones-0

https://www.cato.org/blog/occupational-licensing-reform-moves-forward-0

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/12/captured-economy/547967/

Ya, ya, I can go on as that's just the tip of the iceberg of how inane and labyrinthine the CFR and the administrative state is.

I'm not going to a read a bunch of links you googled, you are more or less proving my point it is not that those tripes do not have meaning, it is that most people people who use them don't understand it and don't know where or how it happens.


He's engaging in a debate strategy known as the Gish Gallop:
"The Gish gallop is a technique used during debating that focuses on overwhelming an opponent with as many arguments as possible, without regard for accuracy or strength of the arguments. The term was coined by Eugenie Scott and named after the creationist Duane Gish, who used the technique frequently against proponents of evolution.[1][2]" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop#:~:text=The Gish gallop is a,or strength of the arguments.

He's not interested in arguing in good faith.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
JimmiC
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada22817 Posts
October 27 2020 15:39 GMT
#55848
--- Nuked ---
Deleted User 173346
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
16169 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-27 16:17:09
October 27 2020 16:12 GMT
#55849
--- Nuked ---
Nevuk
Profile Blog Joined March 2009
United States16280 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-27 16:17:38
October 27 2020 16:17 GMT
#55850
I think it was right after super tuesday. His threat was always just about keeping Bernie or Sanders from winning. I don't think it would have mattered. He has the charisma of dry toast.
Deleted User 173346
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
16169 Posts
October 27 2020 16:24 GMT
#55851
--- Nuked ---
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43988 Posts
October 27 2020 16:30 GMT
#55852
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany11835 Posts
October 27 2020 17:08 GMT
#55853
On October 28 2020 01:30 KwarK wrote:
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.


That sounds highly unlikely.

Even if they lose, they will just sit around on a supreme court majority, use that to wreck a few freedoms for women and LGBT people, complain a lot about everything, obstruct whatever they can however they can, get elected again because nothing happens because they block everything, give lots of welfare money to the richest of the rich, and then we are here again.
TheTenthDoc
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
United States9561 Posts
Last Edited: 2020-10-27 17:24:06
October 27 2020 17:23 GMT
#55854
On October 28 2020 01:24 plasmidghost wrote:
I rather like what Biden's doing here. Iowa is a toss-up presidentially and also has a Senate election going on. This is smart to me because if Biden wins the election but doesn't have the Senate numbers to back him up, then it's going to be at least two years of nothing getting passed.

As for the confidence in the Northern states, I know he says he's not overconfident, but I'm still nervous.

Sorry in advance for linking NYT (purely because of their sub model; copied the relevant parts of the article here)

Show nested quote +
Joseph R. Biden Jr. will travel to Iowa this week, he announced on Monday, a sign of confidence that suggests his campaign is significantly expanding its electoral map with just eight days left in the presidential race.

“I’m going to be going to Iowa, be going to Wisconsin, I’m going to Georgia, I’m going to Florida and maybe other places as well,” Mr. Biden said during a stop at a voter center in Chester, Pa.

And in a remarkably bold pronouncement for a Democratic presidential candidate, Mr. Biden declared that he would win Michigan, Wisconsin and Minnesota, three critical battleground states that might be his key to victory. He also said he thought he had a “fighting chance” in Ohio, North Carolina, Georgia and Iowa, states that were once thought to be a reach for Democrats but that recent polls indicate are now up for grabs.

“I am not overconfident about anything,” Mr. Biden said. “I just want to make sure we can earn every vote possible.”

“That blue wall has to be re-established,” he added, referring to the Northern battleground states, which are traditionally Democratic.

Mr. Biden’s call to resurrect the “blue wall,” which Donald J. Trump knocked down in 2016, and his announcement of an intense final push that includes visits to Iowa and Georgia, both states that Mr. Trump won handily, suggest that the Biden campaign feels it is in a position of strength heading into the final stretch.


https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/26/us/politics/biden-iowa-polls.html


From these spots I think Biden is very cognizant of the fact that without a D Senate (or at least a 50/50 Senate) there is no chance of any policy he advocates being passed (and probably no chance of any policies the GOP currently advocate being passed) and there will be no SCOTUS justices appointed during his term. McConnell's GOP would rather stonewall everything than improve the country in any way. Surprised he's not explicitly hitting NC, as Cunningham is pretty pivotal for that strategy and the polls are still pretty tight.
Deleted User 173346
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
16169 Posts
October 27 2020 17:31 GMT
#55855
--- Nuked ---
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
October 27 2020 17:58 GMT
#55856
On October 28 2020 02:08 Simberto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 28 2020 01:30 KwarK wrote:
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.


That sounds highly unlikely.

Even if they lose, they will just sit around on a supreme court majority, use that to wreck a few freedoms for women and LGBT people, complain a lot about everything, obstruct whatever they can however they can, get elected again because nothing happens because they block everything, give lots of welfare money to the richest of the rich, and then we are here again.

The Supreme Court lacks effective authority. Following rulings by the Supreme Court is only a matter of tradition, they have no actual power. The senate could pass laws directly contradicting the Supreme Court and it would have no mechanism of invalidating them. Just give the entire institution the finger and move on.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18857 Posts
October 27 2020 18:06 GMT
#55857
On October 28 2020 02:58 Mohdoo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 28 2020 02:08 Simberto wrote:
On October 28 2020 01:30 KwarK wrote:
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.


That sounds highly unlikely.

Even if they lose, they will just sit around on a supreme court majority, use that to wreck a few freedoms for women and LGBT people, complain a lot about everything, obstruct whatever they can however they can, get elected again because nothing happens because they block everything, give lots of welfare money to the richest of the rich, and then we are here again.

The Supreme Court lacks effective authority. Following rulings by the Supreme Court is only a matter of tradition, they have no actual power. The senate could pass laws directly contradicting the Supreme Court and it would have no mechanism of invalidating them. Just give the entire institution the finger and move on.

I don't think it would work quite like that, but some kind of strat that follows this idea may be the best way to push consensus in favor of structural changes we desperately need. We just need to avoid a constitutional convention, the ALEC folks are ready and waiting to do all sorts of mischief if things head in that direction.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
BisuDagger
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Bisutopia19351 Posts
October 27 2020 18:13 GMT
#55858
On October 28 2020 01:30 KwarK wrote:
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.

As a fiscal conservative, I was extremely disappointed with Trump as leader of the party. That being said, I think the Democrats keep fielding too many candidates that talk about solving all our problems with heavy tax systems and massive federal government programs, so it's not like I can even vote for a moderate democrat to lead us through the next four years. I actually voted for a Florida Amendment that would allow everyone to vote in party primaries. My hope is that maybe having democrats be like "Let's all vote for x republican because at least he's not insane and would represent my views well" would help the party have a better representative. And vice versa, I would totally vote in a Democratic primary with the hopes of finding a candidate that will at least take my views into consideration.
ModeratorFormer Afreeca Starleague Caster: http://afreeca.tv/ASL2ENG2
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States43988 Posts
October 27 2020 18:23 GMT
#55859
On October 28 2020 03:13 BisuDagger wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 28 2020 01:30 KwarK wrote:
Hopefully the Republicans will learn they shouldn’t run a candidate who has already been impeached for abusing the office for political gain.

As a fiscal conservative, I was extremely disappointed with Trump as leader of the party. That being said, I think the Democrats keep fielding too many candidates that talk about solving all our problems with heavy tax systems and massive federal government programs, so it's not like I can even vote for a moderate democrat to lead us through the next four years. I actually voted for a Florida Amendment that would allow everyone to vote in party primaries. My hope is that maybe having democrats be like "Let's all vote for x republican because at least he's not insane and would represent my views well" would help the party have a better representative. And vice versa, I would totally vote in a Democratic primary with the hopes of finding a candidate that will at least take my views into consideration.

Ironically I think voting Democrat is the best way to bring fiscal conservatism back into the political dialogue. Republicans in office borrow and spend with the approval of Democrats. Democrats in office borrow and spend with the opposition of Republicans.

That said, the cynic in me thinks Democrats should just stop taxing everyone under $100k in a new tax plan. They seem fine with the ultra rich hoarding all the income so they might as well narrow taxes to just target them if they’re willing to accept that degree of inequality. And the Republicans just got away with paying for another massive tax cut (after the Bush 2 ones) with borrowing without any kind of political repercussions. If the rules don’t matter and you can just do whatever the fuck you like then they should just commit to nobody paying taxes. If populism is the game then play it to win.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
October 27 2020 18:25 GMT
#55860
On October 28 2020 03:13 BisuDagger wrote:
As a fiscal conservative, I was extremely disappointed with Trump as leader of the party. That being said, I think the Democrats keep fielding too many candidates that talk about solving all our problems with heavy tax systems and massive federal government programs, so it's not like I can even vote for a moderate democrat to lead us through the next four years. I actually voted for a Florida Amendment that would allow everyone to vote in party primaries. My hope is that maybe having democrats be like "Let's all vote for x republican because at least he's not insane and would represent my views well" would help the party have a better representative. And vice versa, I would totally vote in a Democratic primary with the hopes of finding a candidate that will at least take my views into consideration.

I'm with you on the disappointment regarding fiscal conservatism. It's just way too dead currently. The reasons for this are many, but we shouldn't get into it unless you're interested.

The big problem with universal party primary voting is strategic voting. Almost every single time, the incumbent politician will win his/her primary. The voters of that party are incredibly incentivized to vote in the opposing party's primary to choose an easier opponent for their preferred candidate. That's a very obvious force to nominate the more "extreme" opponent, to almost guarantee your incumbent an easier fight. Such a case easily trouncing the minority that want to have a partial win no matter who is elected. (California is even worse: Democrats strategically vote for Republicans, because only the top-2 primary winners go to the ballot. Democrat + Republican on statewide office = Democrat always wins. Democrat + Democrat on statewide office = The Democrat with the early lead can lose.)
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
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