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European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread - Page 76

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Although this thread does not function under the same strict guidelines as the USPMT, it is still a general practice on TL to provide a source with an explanation on why it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion. Failure to do so will result in a mod action.
lord_nibbler
Profile Joined March 2004
Germany591 Posts
March 24 2015 16:41 GMT
#1501
Well, yes of course I do.
How do you think they organized the account freezes in Cyprus two years ago?
When you 'spend money' you are just giving an order to your bank to transfer it...
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
March 24 2015 16:43 GMT
#1502
what about the security tech contractor the bank is using
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
lord_nibbler
Profile Joined March 2004
Germany591 Posts
March 24 2015 16:50 GMT
#1503
What about him?
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
March 24 2015 18:21 GMT
#1504
On March 24 2015 12:23 Nyxisto wrote:
they already have and they've thrown them out lol

Oh really? Last I heard was Germany saying to Greece “they have to fulfill their obligations.” How undemocratic!
always_winter
Profile Joined February 2015
United States195 Posts
March 24 2015 18:40 GMT
#1505
On March 25 2015 00:58 lord_nibbler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2015 22:38 WhiteDog wrote:
On March 24 2015 16:52 xM(Z wrote:
so after this bullshit gets negotiated, signed and ratified, how easy would it be for a country(or more) within the EU trade agreement to quit it then switch to a trade with Russia or China for ex?.

It depend : if you are German no pb, you can quit when you desire to do so, if you're not never because germany will make sure you respect the treaty.
I am fairly convinced that there is a fundamental difference between 'normal countries' and Germany in cases like these.
While France was able to leave NATO or Sweden can remain 'neutral' for example, Germany is simply not allowed to make such decisions! Germany lost the war and therefore has no say when it comes to for example deploying US nuclear weapons on it's soil or choosing it's military or economic alliances.

Two years ago in the course of the revelation of the NSA total surveillance activity some telling facts came to the surface. Like for example, that US intelligence services (NSA, CIA and all their civilian contractors) have the guaranteed right to operate inside the country with complete freedom, that there is no right to privacy or lawyer's secrecy of Germans vis-à-vis the NSA.
Or how about the fact, that no Eurofighter jet can take off without a start code from the NSA. And there are dozens of these secret laws. At lot of scholars of law sad that technically Germany is not an independent country but still occupied territory.
I once heard the story of Willy Brandt (one of the best Chancellors we ever had). He had won the election and was ready to be sworn in as the head of state, but before he had to sign an agreement that apparently to this day all German Chancellors have to. He was furious for hours and refused to sign away fundamental rights you would expect from a head of state. But the US made very clear, that there is no Chancellery without his signature, so he buckled.


Someone should have told Tsipras not to waste his time in Berlin on Monday! These scholars sound awfully scholarly.
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-24 18:49:14
March 24 2015 18:48 GMT
#1506
That is definitely not an academic opinion, but pretty much conspiracy stuff. It's basically far-right wingers who think Germany is still occupied , the Jews are running the world together with the Americans, and so on, together with a bunch of other stuff. It has largely grown because of the "alternative" news outlets that have popped up everywhere.
lord_nibbler
Profile Joined March 2004
Germany591 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-24 20:54:25
March 24 2015 20:50 GMT
#1507
Say what? I don't know what made you interpret my post in this direction, but I most definitively did not hint at anything like that.

It is a fairly well known fact (especially among lawyers and constitutional scholars) that there are some laws in Germany that would not fly in any independent country and can only be explained by the conditions of when they were written.
zatic
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Zurich15366 Posts
March 24 2015 20:52 GMT
#1508
On March 25 2015 05:50 lord_nibbler wrote:
Say what? I don't know what made you interpret my post in this direction, but I most definitively not hint at anything like that.

It is a fairly well known fact (especially among lawyers and constitutional scholars) that there are some laws in Germany that would not fly in any independent country and can only be explained by the conditions of when they were written.

And Germans are free to change them. Can you please point to an example that proves Germany is a less independent country, de jure, than her neighbors.
ModeratorI know Teamliquid is known as a massive building
Simberto
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Germany12088 Posts
March 24 2015 22:52 GMT
#1509
On March 25 2015 03:21 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2015 12:23 Nyxisto wrote:
they already have and they've thrown them out lol

Oh really? Last I heard was Germany saying to Greece “they have to fulfill their obligations.” How undemocratic!


Well, i guess the relevant part is what is being unsaid. They have to fulfill their obligations if they expect people to keep lending them more money. Nobody is threatening war on greece or other shit like that, the only threat is to stop throwing money into a hole where you know you won't get it back, ever.
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
March 24 2015 23:19 GMT
#1510
On March 25 2015 07:52 Simberto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 25 2015 03:21 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On March 24 2015 12:23 Nyxisto wrote:
they already have and they've thrown them out lol

Oh really? Last I heard was Germany saying to Greece “they have to fulfill their obligations.” How undemocratic!


Well, i guess the relevant part is what is being unsaid. They have to fulfill their obligations if they expect people to keep lending them more money. Nobody is threatening war on greece or other shit like that, the only threat is to stop throwing money into a hole where you know you won't get it back, ever.

No one is threatening war on Germany either. The request is that Germany allows foreign firms to bring their grievances to the agreed upon forum.

As for Greece a stronger economy is a better credit risk. Don't forget that bit.
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
March 24 2015 23:44 GMT
#1511
On March 25 2015 08:19 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 25 2015 07:52 Simberto wrote:
On March 25 2015 03:21 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On March 24 2015 12:23 Nyxisto wrote:
they already have and they've thrown them out lol

Oh really? Last I heard was Germany saying to Greece “they have to fulfill their obligations.” How undemocratic!


Well, i guess the relevant part is what is being unsaid. They have to fulfill their obligations if they expect people to keep lending them more money. Nobody is threatening war on greece or other shit like that, the only threat is to stop throwing money into a hole where you know you won't get it back, ever.

No one is threatening war on Germany either. The request is that Germany allows foreign firms to bring their grievances to the agreed upon forum.

As for Greece a stronger economy is a better credit risk. Don't forget that bit.

You do know that the TTIP is not in effect yet, yes? So, there is no agreed upon forum yet, and hopefully there will not be, at least if our representatives actually represent us in the negotiations.
Get off my lawn, young punks
JonnyBNoHo
Profile Joined July 2011
United States6277 Posts
March 25 2015 00:52 GMT
#1512
On March 25 2015 08:44 ACrow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 25 2015 08:19 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On March 25 2015 07:52 Simberto wrote:
On March 25 2015 03:21 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
On March 24 2015 12:23 Nyxisto wrote:
they already have and they've thrown them out lol

Oh really? Last I heard was Germany saying to Greece “they have to fulfill their obligations.” How undemocratic!


Well, i guess the relevant part is what is being unsaid. They have to fulfill their obligations if they expect people to keep lending them more money. Nobody is threatening war on greece or other shit like that, the only threat is to stop throwing money into a hole where you know you won't get it back, ever.

No one is threatening war on Germany either. The request is that Germany allows foreign firms to bring their grievances to the agreed upon forum.

As for Greece a stronger economy is a better credit risk. Don't forget that bit.

You do know that the TTIP is not in effect yet, yes? So, there is no agreed upon forum yet, and hopefully there will not be, at least if our representatives actually represent us in the negotiations.

The arbitration courts are already a thing EU member states and the US use to settle international disputes. Currently the TTIP looks to broaden their use as part of the trade deal. This isn't a new thing. I made a post one page back that examined some of the arbitration statistics.
This report is an empirical review of ISDS, based on the record of disputes under existing investment treaties. The key findings are as follows:
 Over 90 percent of the nearly 2400 BITs in force have operated without a single investor claim of a treaty breach.
 There has been an increase in the number of disputes filed in the past ten years. Overall, the rise in disputes has been proportional to the rise in outward foreign capital stock. There are more disputes, but there are also more investors and more capital invested abroad.
 Investors from large capital-exporting economies are active users of ISDS. European countries are a party to over 1200 BITs and account for 47 percent of global FDI stock; in the past decade European investors have filed more than half of investment arbitration claims. Similarly, the United States is responsible for 24 percent of outward FDI stock; U.S. investors have filed 22 percent of ISDS claims.
 Many disputes arise in economic sectors characterized by high levels of state intervention. About 40 percent of filed ISDS claims are in oil, gas, mining, and power generation sectors which often feature prominent state involvement.
 Disputes are also most frequent in states with weak legal institutions. Argentina (53 claims) and Venezuela (36 claims) are the leading respondent states.
 About a third of ISDS cases are settled in advance of a ruling. For disputes which end in an arbitral decision, states win about twice as often as investors. When investors do prevail, awards are a small fraction of the initial claim—on average, less than ten cents on the dollar.
Source

If you think there's a better forum for dealing with these disputes, fine. But acting as if you're getting sold down the river because of them is unwarranted.
RvB
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands6328 Posts
March 25 2015 09:39 GMT
#1513

Reuters) - Business activity in the euro zone has accelerated much faster than thought this month, in a sign the European Central Bank's bond buying programme may already be paying dividends, a survey showed on Tuesday.

Any indication of a pickup will cheer ECB policymakers, but the surveys also showed firms are still cutting prices to drum up business.

"There is some impetus from quantitative easing, although it is coming at a time when there was already growth, while domestic consumers have benefited from lower prices," said Chris Williamson, chief economist at survey compiler Markit.

As part of its battle to revive consumer prices, which fell 0.3 percent in February, and to spur growth, the ECB is flooding markets with cash, and the roughly 1 trillion euro plan appears to be having an impact.

Markit's Eurozone Composite Flash Purchasing Managers' Index, based on surveys of thousands of companies and seen as a good growth indicator, jumped to a near four-year high of 54.1 from February's 53.3.

That beat the highest prediction in a Reuters poll - well above the median forecast for a modest rise to 53.6 - and was its 21st month above the 50 level that separates growth from contraction.

Markit said the surveys pointed to first-quarter growth of 0.3 percent, matching the previous three months but shy of the 0.4 percent median forecast in a Reuters poll taken earlier this month.

source
phil.ipp
Profile Joined May 2010
Austria1067 Posts
March 25 2015 12:36 GMT
#1514
On March 25 2015 09:52 JonnyBNoHo wrote:
If you think there's a better forum for dealing with these disputes, fine. But acting as if you're getting sold down the river because of them is unwarranted.


why is this unwarranted?

why again should a company get the right to go to some secret court (no transparency) where not even judges rule, where the sentence is ultimate and you cant appeal anywhere?

seriously this sounds like a very bad idea, and the fact that it already exists doesn't mean anything.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
March 25 2015 13:36 GMT
#1515
you realize german is a capital exporting country that would stand to gain from more international investor rights.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
phil.ipp
Profile Joined May 2010
Austria1067 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-25 14:59:02
March 25 2015 14:32 GMT
#1516
is there an indication that investors have problems investing in germany / europe?!?

you make it seem like germany is some third world state where investors fear for their money lol

TTIP is not about investors, its about further globalization, its so that europe and also america cant discriminate against foreign companys.
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-25 15:51:22
March 25 2015 15:46 GMT
#1517
if it is not about investors why are you focused on this investment arbitration system?


the rest of your post shows silliness at a level that is not worth engaging
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
phil.ipp
Profile Joined May 2010
Austria1067 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-03-25 16:27:28
March 25 2015 16:10 GMT
#1518
thats the point, you dont need an investment arbitration system in developed states, you can just go to a regular court with a regular jugde. like everyone else.

why create a second hidden law system.

but hey lets leave it at that, wait for more informations when they finally release the details of the treaty

some things i gathered in the last week, they want to open the energy market
so for example europe companys can drill for that cheap oil (dont know the name)
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
March 25 2015 18:34 GMT
#1519
it's not a hidden system. the treaty laws are right there. ordinary arbitration courts have private evidence and proceedings as well.

unlike a reasonable argument that says the ISDS system is not advancing much remedy, because existing domestic courts already take care of international disputes, you are operating under the false assumption that the ISDS system is a vast expansion of corporate power vs your national governments. this is not really true in the case of the TTIP. it may be true in the case of states like argentina.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States19574 Posts
March 25 2015 19:23 GMT
#1520
The arbitration courts are necessary because regular courts are far too slow to desk with these types of issues. IMO, they do need to have an appeals court so that interpretations are consistent from arbitration to arbitration, it's not a big deal.

Plus, the Eurozone could do with some sort of shakeup that forces their hands so they stop with the constant can kicking.
Freeeeeeedom
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