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European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread - Page 1221

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Although this thread does not function under the same strict guidelines as the USPMT, it is still a general practice on TL to provide a source with an explanation on why it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion. Failure to do so will result in a mod action.
xM(Z
Profile Joined November 2006
Romania5299 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-12 17:08:27
January 12 2019 17:08 GMT
#24401
the last part to everyone but the first part might be to my assumptions only: EE = Eastern EU?
And my fury stands ready. I bring all your plans to nought. My bleak heart beats steady. 'Tis you whom I have sought.
Sent.
Profile Joined June 2012
Poland9322 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-12 17:11:57
January 12 2019 17:10 GMT
#24402
Do you mean my post? By "South" I meant Portugal, Spain, Italy and Greece.
You're now breathing manually
Godwrath
Profile Joined August 2012
Spain10155 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-12 19:58:48
January 12 2019 19:53 GMT
#24403
On January 13 2019 02:08 xM(Z wrote:
the last part to everyone but the first part might be to my assumptions only: EE = Eastern EU?

Eurozone is described in many ways so it is confusing, to be honest. If I read Big J post I don't know if he is talking about Eastern Europe, the eastern Europe that isn't in the European Union, or the eastern Europe that does not have the euro.

If I had to guess I would bet he is talking about countries which are not tied to the EU in a monetary fashion in eastern Europe, so yeah eastern EU.
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-13 23:47:52
January 13 2019 23:47 GMT
#24404
The European Commission wants to change the decision making in tax questions. At the moment an unanimous vote has to be passed from all member states. This should change to a qualified majority vote, so you need 55% of the member states with 65% of the population.

This is going to be huge in my opinion, in particular because with the UK leaving it will be very hard for Germany to find alliances with veto powers. Even with Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxemburg, Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Austria and Ireland on board German interests could not veto + Show Spoiler +
The selection is pretty much just all "Northern" states, due to the close economic ties to Germany
. Germany would have to compromise with Eastern European countries if the South pushes the issue on tax questions.
The big states of the "Southern" bloc - France, Spain, Italy - would have veto power if they act together.
+ Show Spoiler +
This is generally a German problem of the Brexit in other questions, where there are already qualified majority votes. Without its close UK ally in question of taxes and trade, the bloc of countries strongly integrated into the German economy like the Netherlands, Finland and Austria won't have a veto power anymore.


warding
Profile Joined August 2005
Portugal2397 Posts
January 14 2019 00:10 GMT
#24405
On January 13 2019 00:43 Big J wrote:
SE is part of the Euro. EE is not. That's the difference why one growths economically and the other one is in endless recession.

This is silly. Lithuania, Estonia, Latvia, Slovakia and Slovenia are part of the Euro and are doing fine - coincidentally, that is also the list of the most developed EE countries (bar Czechia maybe). SE's slow economic growth has nothing to do with the Euro, or the EU for that matter, and everything to do with not having great political and economic institutions and a having a lack of competitive industries.
Poegim
Profile Joined February 2017
Poland295 Posts
January 14 2019 19:06 GMT
#24406
Not sure its good place for it but, why not. Polish mayor (Gdansk city) stabbed 2 days ago on biggest polish charity event.



Died today. Pretty sure it will impact election this year.
[ RANKGIM.EU ] Aka: Poezja[T4], Zulu. [[ Probably second best player in the world. In honor of my best friend Moagim, he was a Kraken from the sea. Poegim ]]
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States24154 Posts
January 14 2019 19:09 GMT
#24407
On January 15 2019 04:06 Poegim wrote:
Not sure its good place for it but, why not. Polish mayor (Gdansk city) stabbed 2 days ago on biggest polish charity event.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTqg31mXXHE

Died today. Pretty sure it will impact election this year.


Is that the guy who stabbed him walking triumphantly around the stage unmolested?
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Poegim
Profile Joined February 2017
Poland295 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-14 19:16:05
January 14 2019 19:14 GMT
#24408
Yes, ppl didnt get whats going on, there was many lights, it was final of counting (event tradition) and guy with knife had "media" ID. But yeah its incredible, how it looks.
[ RANKGIM.EU ] Aka: Poezja[T4], Zulu. [[ Probably second best player in the world. In honor of my best friend Moagim, he was a Kraken from the sea. Poegim ]]
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
January 14 2019 21:30 GMT
#24409
I am not sure this video of a man being killed on stage is appropriate.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 14 2019 21:46 GMT
#24410
Agreed. A minimum some sort of content warning and a better description of what that video is would be appropriate.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
ughdumbpeople
Profile Joined January 2019
1 Post
Last Edited: 2019-01-15 01:17:42
January 15 2019 01:00 GMT
#24411
--- Nuked ---
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 15 2019 01:04 GMT
#24412
Nice burner account bro.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Big J
Profile Joined March 2011
Austria16289 Posts
January 15 2019 08:36 GMT
#24413
This is not recent news and for non-German speakers the power of her words might not be accessible, but since I personally find her words incredibly liberal for a socialist I wanted to remind everyone of Rosa Luxemburg's (and Karl Liebknecht's) death 100 years ago.
"Freedom is always also the freedom of those who think differently."
tomatriedes
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
New Zealand5356 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-15 09:44:41
January 15 2019 09:02 GMT
#24414
On January 11 2019 23:25 Nyxisto wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2019 22:56 abmhm wrote:
I am merely looking for a route towards a populist alternative to that same sort of compromise because I think that neoliberalism as it was created by those scholars has basically come to serve to the benefit of the very wealthy, especially over the past 30-50 years. The wealthy have distanced themselves from the proletariat more and more over the decades, whereas the various social movements and demographic shifts in that time have resulted in increased difficulty for the people at the bottom.


This is a fiction. Global inequality is falling, Western European inequality has been stable for the last say, thirty years and is at low levels in general. Eastern Europe might have technically gotten more unequal but only because it is ten times better off and has started to generate wealth,

A small gif to illustrate the transformation
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Maybe Americans can make the case that 'neoliberalism' has affected them particularly negatively, but barely anyone else. The current populism has nothing to do with economics, and in so far as it has (most job losses occur not to globalisation, but to automation) is entirely unaddressed by populist revolt.


Not true:

Inequality has been on the rise across the globe for several decades. Some countries have reduced the numbers of people living in extreme poverty. But economic gaps have continued to grow as the very richest amass unprecedented levels of wealth. Among industrial nations, the United States is by far the most top-heavy, with much greater shares of national wealth and income going to the richest 1 percent than any other country.


...

Since 1980, the share of national income going to the richest 1 percent has increased rapidly in North America (defined here as the United States and Canada), China, India, and Russia and more moderately in Europe. World Inequality Lab researchers note that this period coincides with the rollback in these countries and regions of various post-World War II policies aimed at narrowing economic divides. By contrast, they point out, countries and regions that did not experience a post-war egalitarian regime, such as the Middle East, sub-Saharan Africa, and Brazil, have had relatively stable, but extremely high levels of inequality.


https://inequality.org/facts/global-inequality/
iamthedave
Profile Joined February 2011
England2814 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-01-15 11:15:57
January 15 2019 11:11 GMT
#24415
On January 12 2019 20:10 Gorsameth wrote:
Italy's political system was screwed up well before refugees came prominently into the picture, see Berlusconi.


relevant:


On January 12 2019 22:09 Silvanel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 12 2019 11:14 Nyxisto wrote:
Compared to the Hold that PiS have on Poland or Orban has on Hungary I honestly don't think the general Southern European situation even compares. Vox seems to resemble the AfD more than it does a mainstream party, and I would guess neither is going to run Germany or Spain soon.

Italy is pretty bad yes. But then again Italy is also plagued by a year long refugee debate that has completely screwed up the political system.


This year we will have parlimentary elctions in Poland, PiS will most likely win again but hopefully they wont have absolute majority and will need to go in coaltion with someone. That will be better to everyone.


Those guys are pretty terrifying. Poland's been feeling on the verge of diving headfirst into religiously driven totalitarianism for a while now. I knew a Polish film maker a while back who worked on some documentaries about the politics over there, and it's frightening the way they talk about a whole raft of issues. And of course there's the old red flag of state media. Despite their passionate hatred of Russia they look a lot like a less competent version of Putin's Russian state right now..
I'm not bad at Starcraft; I just think winning's rude.
zatic
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Zurich15366 Posts
January 15 2019 20:15 GMT
#24416
On January 15 2019 18:02 tomatriedes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2019 23:25 Nyxisto wrote:
On January 11 2019 22:56 abmhm wrote:
I am merely looking for a route towards a populist alternative to that same sort of compromise because I think that neoliberalism as it was created by those scholars has basically come to serve to the benefit of the very wealthy, especially over the past 30-50 years. The wealthy have distanced themselves from the proletariat more and more over the decades, whereas the various social movements and demographic shifts in that time have resulted in increased difficulty for the people at the bottom.


This is a fiction. Global inequality is falling, Western European inequality has been stable for the last say, thirty years and is at low levels in general. Eastern Europe might have technically gotten more unequal but only because it is ten times better off and has started to generate wealth,

A small gif to illustrate the transformation
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Maybe Americans can make the case that 'neoliberalism' has affected them particularly negatively, but barely anyone else. The current populism has nothing to do with economics, and in so far as it has (most job losses occur not to globalisation, but to automation) is entirely unaddressed by populist revolt.


Not true:
Show nested quote +
Inequality has been on the rise across the globe for several decades. Some countries have reduced the numbers of people living in extreme poverty. But economic gaps have continued to grow as the very richest amass unprecedented levels of wealth. Among industrial nations, the United States is by far the most top-heavy, with much greater shares of national wealth and income going to the richest 1 percent than any other country.


...

Show nested quote +
Since 1980, the share of national income going to the richest 1 percent has increased rapidly in North America (defined here as the United States and Canada), China, India, and Russia and more moderately in Europe. World Inequality Lab researchers note that this period coincides with the rollback in these countries and regions of various post-World War II policies aimed at narrowing economic divides. By contrast, they point out, countries and regions that did not experience a post-war egalitarian regime, such as the Middle East, sub-Saharan Africa, and Brazil, have had relatively stable, but extremely high levels of inequality.


https://inequality.org/facts/global-inequality/

Not that it's surprising, but none of the figures on that site deal with global inequality, much less the development of global inequality. It says right there at the top that the following is about how much the richest few own, not how global inequality has changed.
ModeratorI know Teamliquid is known as a massive building
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
January 15 2019 20:27 GMT
#24417
On January 15 2019 18:02 tomatriedes wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 11 2019 23:25 Nyxisto wrote:
On January 11 2019 22:56 abmhm wrote:
I am merely looking for a route towards a populist alternative to that same sort of compromise because I think that neoliberalism as it was created by those scholars has basically come to serve to the benefit of the very wealthy, especially over the past 30-50 years. The wealthy have distanced themselves from the proletariat more and more over the decades, whereas the various social movements and demographic shifts in that time have resulted in increased difficulty for the people at the bottom.


This is a fiction. Global inequality is falling, Western European inequality has been stable for the last say, thirty years and is at low levels in general. Eastern Europe might have technically gotten more unequal but only because it is ten times better off and has started to generate wealth,

A small gif to illustrate the transformation
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Maybe Americans can make the case that 'neoliberalism' has affected them particularly negatively, but barely anyone else. The current populism has nothing to do with economics, and in so far as it has (most job losses occur not to globalisation, but to automation) is entirely unaddressed by populist revolt.


Not true:
Show nested quote +

Inequality has been on the rise across the globe for several decades. Some countries have reduced the numbers of people living in extreme poverty. But economic gaps have continued to grow as the very richest amass unprecedented levels of wealth. Among industrial nations, the United States is by far the most top-heavy, with much greater shares of national wealth and income going to the richest 1 percent than any other country.


...

Show nested quote +
Since 1980, the share of national income going to the richest 1 percent has increased rapidly in North America (defined here as the United States and Canada), China, India, and Russia and more moderately in Europe. World Inequality Lab researchers note that this period coincides with the rollback in these countries and regions of various post-World War II policies aimed at narrowing economic divides. By contrast, they point out, countries and regions that did not experience a post-war egalitarian regime, such as the Middle East, sub-Saharan Africa, and Brazil, have had relatively stable, but extremely high levels of inequality.


https://inequality.org/facts/global-inequality/


This is a disingenuous data-point. Focusing on the share of income going to the 1% within an individual country is meaningless. First off, this says nothing about the composition of income within the rest of the population, and more importantly, rising inequality in countries that build up wealth is not a problem. Inequality between nations has converged, and continues to converge. A country in which everyone is poor and has nothing is perfectly equal. If China was more equal 40 years ago than it is now the simple reason was that it was absolutely destitute.
Ghostcom
Profile Joined March 2010
Denmark4783 Posts
January 15 2019 20:35 GMT
#24418
Why is rising inequality in countries building up wealth not an issue? The only case I can see this to be true is if everyone have enough money to simply be hoarding which I frankly do not think is the situation many - if any - countries (maybe Luxembourg or another similarly small country with a large out-of-country workforce?).
Artisreal
Profile Joined June 2009
Germany9235 Posts
January 15 2019 20:38 GMT
#24419
Everyone losing wealth can also contribute to homogenization with a few very far outliers... This is a bit of a weak point on its own
passive quaranstream fan
Nyxisto
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6287 Posts
January 15 2019 21:40 GMT
#24420
On January 16 2019 05:35 Ghostcom wrote:
Why is rising inequality in countries building up wealth not an issue? The only case I can see this to be true is if everyone have enough money to simply be hoarding which I frankly do not think is the situation many - if any - countries (maybe Luxembourg or another similarly small country with a large out-of-country workforce?).


If you have a country with close to no wealth and you assume that people keep at least some portion of their newly accrued wealth, and that some people generate more wealth than others, then inequality is going to increase by definition. A perfectly poor country is perfectly equal. A moderately wealthy country is not, but simply because some people engage in more productive ventures than others. Some people getting richer faster than others isn't a big deal at all, and there is no way to prevent it that doesn't end in disaster, and no obvious reason why this is bad in and of itself.
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