EPTGo go.
Settle this Fight Debate - Page 22
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Smurg
Australia3818 Posts
Go go. | ||
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Dexxus
United States329 Posts
#1: Go pick up a bat if you haven't already. #2: Remember you are fighting YOU. Training is totally irrelevant. #3: If you try to get in on the bat-man he will evade/kick to create distance again. #4: To say that the bat has less destructive power is just plain stupid. | ||
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TreK
Sweden2089 Posts
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ToT)Testie(
Canada723 Posts
Go to your kitchen, act like a crazy person, grab a big kitchen knife and make a few stabbing motions. If anyone catches you, assure them you're not planning anything. Or.. assure them of nothing, your preference really. Anyway, then go pick up your bat, and swing it. Swing the bat constantly for 30 seconds. Stab with the knife constantly for 30 seconds. A lot more stabs than swings. Then, plant your feet like any athlete would when you swing as well. If you don't plant and power up, it's not doing enough damage to take you out. Then, take the knife. Lunge with it a few times. Different angles, realize how versatile it is. And the speed with which it moves. A bat does not add such an incredible amount of distance that it cannot be closed within a few steps. Say they fake stab at you. Or they make some feints. The person with the bat swings, to keep the knife at a distance. Knowing 2/3rds to 80% of the length of his weapon is useless when hitting someone. Any kick after a bat swing will at best be off balance, and have little real power behind it and will only make the bat user more awkward at fighting. You step into that swing after falling back, giving them time to recoil but they swing again. However you'd be within the bats range. It wouldn't knock you out or kill you if you got hit with the middle of the bat, only the end. You must connect with the end of the bat, and even then... I can't see someone taking a single body shot with a bat and not surviving. Pain means very little when your goal is to kill the other person not hurt them and make them say "ow ow I give up" If they swing, you can jump in 2 steps in which it'd be a close range fight and you'd end up with nothing more than a bruise because you couldn't connect with the end of the bat. 1. You can't reverse the momentum after it's reached the halfway point, and if you do you're already fucked because your weapon will do no damage what so ever because of the awkward control you have. 2. If you complete the swing, it will take you some seconds to swing again. The slow motion video you showed only proves the knifes case. Same with the other video. All these men have time where they plant, and get ready. After swinging once it will take them time to swing again. You cannot swing when one is in close range. People won't fly away when they are hit with anything but the very end of the bat. There'll be a "thud" as it connects with a large object that weighs a lot. Go hit something heavy yet planted to the ground fairly sturdily (as we are) with a baseball bat. Athletic or not, it is due to momentum and the motions that bats will always take longer to swing. And to have enough power to do damage, you need to power that swing up. You can't just keep the knife user at bay by holding it like a sword, and poking at him. It's designed, and weighed for it's purpose, swinging from one side to another. Most other motions are awkward. As I said, bat users suck at strategy. And athletic or not these users have the same type of build. An athletic person could close distance just as easily with the knife, if not a bit faster. And a full extension of your arm, and a stab is far quicker than a wide swing with an object. And athletic may mean a blunt weapon may do even less damage as vitals are padded by muscles which may end up damaged, but have done their job protecting vital areas. A knife tears muscles easily, and quickly. | ||
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Smurg
Australia3818 Posts
I'd also ban everyone in the entire thread and be liquiscooped for banninator of the week. Oh how I'd laugh. | ||
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ToT)Testie(
Canada723 Posts
$10 they'd end up with knife. | ||
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a-game
Canada5214 Posts
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bsmd
Peru186 Posts
edit: someone make a poll plz. | ||
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Smurg
Australia3818 Posts
Poll: Who is the most hated person on TL.net? (Vote): Uhh...this kind (Vote): of thing can't be determined (Vote): with a poll. | ||
Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
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Polemarch
Canada1564 Posts
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KovacsFlorian
204 Posts
On December 07 2006 12:16 ToT)Testie( wrote: Thing is, who really controls the fight? I say the knifer. Swing the bat constantly for 30 seconds. Stab with the knife constantly for 30 seconds. A lot more stabs than swings. Say they fake stab at you. Or they make some feints. You step into that swing after falling back, giving them time to recoil but they swing again. However you'd be within the bats range. It wouldn't knock you out or kill you if you got hit with the middle of the bat, only the end. You must connect with the end of the bat, and even then... I can't see someone taking a single body shot with a bat and not surviving. Pain means very little when your goal is to kill the other person not hurt them and make them say "ow ow I give up" If they swing, you can jump in 2 steps in which it'd be a close range fight and you'd end up with nothing more than a bruise because you couldn't connect with the end of the bat. 1. You can't reverse the momentum after it's reached the halfway point, and if you do you're already fucked because your weapon will do no damage what so ever because of the awkward control you have. 2. If you complete the swing, it will take you some seconds to swing again. As I said, bat users suck at strategy. You talk about control, about fake stabs, feints, momentum, timing, strategy ... NONE of this happends into a REAL fight. Most of the real, determined, anger-dominated fights are 4-5 seconds one-charge events. When your system is full of adrenaline all the bullshit about feints..., fake stabs..., control... is long gone. Only the animalic instincts / reflexes remain. The knife user needs precision, emotions control, uber timing. If you aren't trained in martial arts (as the hypothesis for this thread was) you will not have strike precision, timing or control. The bat user does not need precision. He will hit in a general area, starting from knees, up to the head. He doesn't need control. It will just hit you as hard as he can. So I think an untrained bat user will beat an untrained knife user. | ||
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TreK
Sweden2089 Posts
Thats what they say in movies. Free your mind! | ||
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Luhh
Sweden2974 Posts
On December 07 2006 13:59 KovacsFlorian wrote: You talk about control, about fake stabs, feints, momentum, timing, strategy ... NONE of this happends into a REAL fight. Most of the real, determined, anger-dominated fights are 4-5 seconds one-charge events. When your system is full of adrenaline all the bullshit about feints..., fake stabs..., control... is long gone. Only the animalic instincts / reflexes remain. The knife user needs precision, emotions control, uber timing. If you aren't trained in martial arts (as the hypothesis for this thread was) you will not have strike precision, timing or control. The bat user does not need precision. He will hit in a general area, starting from knees, up to the head. He doesn't need control. It will just hit you as hard as he can. So I think an untrained bat user will beat an untrained knife user. The best strategy with a knife against a bat is to run into the guy, like crashing bullrush style and plant it and yank. So it's 1 swing and hurt the guy enough to win the grapple that ensues unless you manage to stop him dead cold (not likely), and avoid getting stabbed. But of course if it's just a stab and not so much more and you managed to break one of his arms you wouldn't be in such a bad situation perhaps. 2 arms against 1 in wrestling, you get the knife or lock his arm and rip out his eyes etc.. A fight to the death is way different from a streetfight, so I think this one can't easily be determined. I still lean toward the knife though, but I reserve myself and vote: Of thing can't be determined!!! | ||
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Klogon
MURICA15980 Posts
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AmorVincitOmnia
Kenya3846 Posts
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KovacsFlorian
204 Posts
 I would doit, but I don't know how to make pools.  | ||
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fusionsdf
Canada15390 Posts
On December 07 2006 12:10 Dexxus wrote: Some points: #1: Go pick up a bat if you haven't already. #2: Remember you are fighting YOU. Training is totally irrelevant. #3: If you try to get in on the bat-man he will evade/kick to create distance again. #4: To say that the bat has less destructive power is just plain stupid. Wow. Have you ever been in a fight? Let alone a fight with objects? You dont kick You never kick. Not because its unmanly. Or because it looks stupid. You dont kick in a fight because you will get your ass kicked for even attempting it. The arguement for ninja-swinging the bat was more realistic. | ||
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infinity21
Canada6683 Posts
On December 07 2006 13:59 KovacsFlorian wrote: You talk about control, about fake stabs, feints, momentum, timing, strategy ... NONE of this happends into a REAL fight. Most of the real, determined, anger-dominated fights are 4-5 seconds one-charge events. When your system is full of adrenaline all the bullshit about feints..., fake stabs..., control... is long gone. Only the animalic instincts / reflexes remain. The knife user needs precision, emotions control, uber timing. If you aren't trained in martial arts (as the hypothesis for this thread was) you will not have strike precision, timing or control. The bat user does not need precision. He will hit in a general area, starting from knees, up to the head. He doesn't need control. It will just hit you as hard as he can. So I think an untrained bat user will beat an untrained knife user. Nowhere in the original post does it say the people were untrained for combat. It simply states "-Both fighters have the same body type, same skill set, nobody has a clear advantage over the other." If you were ever trained to fight, then you would know that the first thing you learn is to keep cool and not letting your emotions take over. In that cool mental state, the knife has a clear advantage over the bat. The knife user will dance around, inviting the bat user to swing and miss. It's very hard for a bat user to exploit an opening in the knife user but not so hard the other way around. The knife user can simply frustrate and tire out the bat user before moving in for the kill. Imagine the knife user as a boxer and the bat user as a baseball player. The boxer has a much easier time controlling timing and distance compared to the bat user. | ||
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Dexxus
United States329 Posts
On November 26 2006 09:39 exalted wrote: -You cannot use any outside weapons, bite, or do anything other than use the weapons you have. Oh I didn't remember this part... Ok, if you can't kick then GG bat. On December 07 2006 14:23 fusionsdf wrote: Wow. Have you ever been in a fight? Let alone a fight with objects? You dont kick You never kick. Not because its unmanly. Or because it looks stupid. You dont kick in a fight because you will get your ass kicked for even attempting it. The arguement for ninja-swinging the bat was more realistic. WTF... You can EASILY take someones ankle out with a kick. IDK what kind of fighting you do but it sounds like "macho-jock" style where your up in someones face. It doesn't take that much skill to kick someone, and the kick I was referring to was more of a push to create distance. | ||
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