Hey everyone, I decided to post here and see what everyone's opinion was on this:
Recently a 5-year friend of mine decided to quit everything and become a pastor. While this was a shock to all of his friends and family, it got me thinking. He's the 3rd of my friends that knows exactly what he wants to do in life by the age of 20 and has a extremely specific plan for it all.
Me on the other hand, I have no idea what I want to do. I have no idea what I'm good at. I don't have any ONE thing that I'm extremely passionate about. Do you think that it's a bad thing that I'm completely lost at the moment, or do you feel like in time everything will become clear. Is there a possibility that maybe not everyone is meant to have and do the one thing that they are extremely passionate about for the rest of their life?
Thanks guy. Always know that the TL community is there when you need them.
Some people get very specific senses of calling early on. Some others only get there when they get there, and can still do great things. 20 is a very early age, so don't worry. Focus on living life, and be on the lookout for things you can do and do them
Have you ever noticed how your opinion and attitude towards things you like / dislike tends to change every 6 months, probably less at younger years....Yeah well it doesn't stop when you get older.
Do what makes you happy and see where life takes you, nothing lasts forever so cherish the good times while they last.
I'd say it's better to start seeking one's path as soon as possible. Try out and discover as many things as possible, it can only be beneficial anyway.
There was a time when I was 19, cruising through life, college education, healthy amount of drugs, sex, and alcohol. But then I always felt empty. It's not "first-world" or a "confused pre-adult" emptiness kind of thing, as far as I can tell, but there was just nothing. Nothing in the world matters, that's how I felt. I suddenly found myself in Cambodia where I got it. It's not a "Eureka I got the whole world figured out now" moment, but it was something that made things clear.
A buddhist monk told me, "Life is simple. Pain is inevitable. Life is in fact pain. But suffering is not. To be human is to love and to do good and to overcome your weaknesses." I do not know if how I understand it is how he meant it, but more than some empty philosophical rhetoric, I see it as a challenge it life. Yeah life sucks, but I just figured the way is to take on life, hunt it down, and make it eat its balls! Hahahaha. I can't objectively tell if I've been slamming in life or not, (still drugs, sex, and alcohol), but how I feel so much better!
you might as well pick something and run with it. if it doesn't work out, pick something else.
if you're at a crossroads and you don't know which path to take, it doesn't help to sit there squinting down both of them. you'll find the right one a lot faster by just trying it.
an interestingish video on people responding to a calling lol. from UBC!!
but uhh... i was pretty paralyzed and i still am, but for differentish reasons. but one advice that may sort of be useful is that, whatever you do. you can do it until you don't enjoy it anymore, then switch to something else. like you can be a pastor for 3 years then be like, ok. time to do something else. you are by no means locked into your decisions, you can always change. assuming you keep your finances in check, or if you have people dependent on your income...
but hmm... what i personally did was just spend my time learning. learning everything i could about everything. "mainly social sciences and philosophy" and yeah, what i cared about slowly formed out of my studies. "cultivating human agency" but umm... what i recommend is doing lots of stuff, volunteering, studying lots of stuff, either formally or from lecture recordings or online courses. like UC Berkeley webcasts. and yeah.
i also took a break from school so you don't have to study all the time. but yeah... yep.
as for motivation... from a social psychological perspective. if a cute girl i liked told be she really liked something, like maybe becoming an electrician, i may end up following her into it lol. "balance theory!!!" but ahh the complexities of life.
Life doesn't have a meaning itself, it has the meaning you give to it.
Don't get obsessed about having a passion or a very particular role in life. If life has no clear directions for you yet, it's ok. Just focus on being happy and proud of yourself.
I think for many, work and life experiences help to truly and completely field the question of what one REALLY wants to do in life, for work and for pleasure.
I don't think that anyone with less than 5 years of work experience really knows what they are good at, and what they in turn want to do - that they would enjoy.
There is a reason why compensation is called pay. MANY people hate their jobs, but it is a means to an end for most.
Well, I knew exactly what I was going to do at the age of 15 (and a bit more vaguely even earlier), but that was because of my natural abilities. Now I'm 22 and I am doing what suits them best.
However, I'm not sure if this is necessarily a good thing. I feel that I've kinda forced myself into this career without considering other possibilities. If I spent some time trying other things, I wouldn't be really good at what I am doing, but what if I found something that I liked better? If you haven't got any specific interests, I think you shouldn't worry and just try different paths.
On August 08 2012 18:10 Kukaracha wrote: Life doesn't have a meaning itself, it has the meaning you give to it.
Don't get obsessed about having a passion or a very particular role in life. If life has no clear directions for you yet, it's ok. Just focus on being happy and proud of yourself.
I was about to say something alike, but Kukaracha perfectly sum what i think.
I wasn't happy in my pointless life until I eventually developed personal philosophies such that I could explain how I think and how the world around me works, and that life is truly pointless, thus so is your happiness or sadness, pain or pleasure.
I would advise you do something moderately productive while trying to find out your direction. I'm at uni, and do I particularly enjoy what I'm doing? Kinda, some days. Yet there's no point in quitting and ending up regretting it later. So I just stroll about, finding different things to do and hoping I like one. Nothing yet, but I've met amazing people along the way.
Instead of putting so much thought into living, just live and see what happens, just make sure you don't lose sight of who you are along the way. End rant.
The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
Everyone knows the biological meaning of life, this is more a philosophical discussion.
Forget about the meaning of life. It's a stupid question. Just find out what you want and what the truth is in everything. Then you will also know who you are and you will be truly living.
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
Everyone knows the biological meaning of life, this is more a philosophical discussion.
There is no meaning to life.
Anything you define or attribute to being the meaning of life is only true to you and is completely arbitrary in nature.
When I was 20, most of my friends knew exactly what they wanted to do career-wise. Ten years later, most have made major career changes at least once. It can be a big psychological hit to realize that the career you've put so much effort and planning into isn't going to work out (or that you don't like it). So it might not be a bad idea to build some flexibility into any plans you make at age 20.
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
Everyone knows the biological meaning of life, this is more a philosophical discussion.
There is no meaning to life.
Anything you define or attribute to being the meaning of life is only true to you and is completely arbitrary in nature.
I fully agree, but I thought that it would be better for this thread to be more open-ended, with people describing what they seek out of life, and what they believe life entails, rather than have people quipping in with the standard 'there is no meaning of life' bit, no matter how true it is.
I think it's important to come to terms with what kind of person you are. If you want to achive great things, you need to start right now. Becoming an expert/master at anything is hard work and dedication. If thats the case I would think it the most worthwhile to investigate a few topics you might like and decide on one of them.
If you're ok with being an "average joe," I think diversity is the key. Inverstigate a wide range of subjects, experiences and impressions (It can be anything from Uni. subject to drugs, volunteering or travelling the world).
I think reading a lot might help to push you on the right path.
You don't need to have some silly so called "meaning" in your life to enjoy it. You have your life now so stop worrying about such things and just have a blast.
But yeah, im kinda in the same boat as you kinda. In terms of job sense i have no idea what i wanted to do or want to do now, i have had 3 jobs in my lifetime and i have been good at all of them (KFC Manager - Office Admin - Office Junior). I still don't know if i will be doing this for the rest of my life but i know one thing i need a job to have money to do my leisure activites i enjoy (play games/drink/go to football matches etc)
So all in all, the only advice i can give is, get a job, any job so you can fund your lesiure activities and continue to do everything you can to make yourself happy, thats the meaning of life to me. Making YOURSELF happy.
If you truly look around you, you will find there is an uncanny consistency to existence. The world, the universe is not a mystery, it is a series of irrefutable truths that reoccur time and time again. Look at human history and culture- love, fear, pain, suffering, death, birth, sex, truth, meaning, family, power- the same forces have persisted for as long as we have existed.
This is Life.
The Meaning of life, is to choose which of these forces you want to fight/embrance and to understand precisely why you have chosen to do so.
And in this cauldron of ubiquitous struggle lifetimes go by, and lifetimes are celebrated for how well you have done the above.
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
Everyone knows the biological meaning of life, this is more a philosophical discussion.
There is no meaning to life.
Anything you define or attribute to being the meaning of life is only true to you and is completely arbitrary in nature.
Don't make the mistake of thinking that subjectivity is the same as arbitrariness or meaninglessness.
Something can be subjective, meaningful, and non-arbitrary. The meaning of one's life is such a thing.
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
Everyone knows the biological meaning of life, this is more a philosophical discussion.
There is no meaning to life.
Anything you define or attribute to being the meaning of life is only true to you and is completely arbitrary in nature.
I'm reading Atlas Shrugged, and that philosophy is presented. It's interesting, but depressing. Having something to live for and give you meaning seems a whole lot more motivating and meaningful.
I like to think the meaning of life is to be happy. Simple as that.
To me it's clear that the purpose of life is to experience life in order to get experience, rise your consciousness and be ready for the next plane at the time you "die".
Physical world is a playground like a school, instead there is no teacher, you are the teacher. Up to you.
On August 09 2012 02:30 Odoakar wrote: There really isn't any meaning to capitalism. We wake up every morning, go do our 8-10 hours shift, come back home, eat, sleep. Rinse, repeat.
fixed it for you
edit: If you'll read Hannah Arendt's The Human Condition (which I highly recommend), you will discover that what you are referring to is the meaninglessness of "labor" (animal laborans) as opposed to "work" (homo faber). It is in the nature of capitalism to reduce all work to labor, which is purely metabolic (as opposed to work, which is something lasting). This is why we speak of artistic production as "content," as it exists only in order to justify the box.
Don't worry once you get older it will become apparent how unrealistic everything Rand ever said was.
Anyway I'm surprised you know many people who know what they want in life at 20, all through college (and after) you will constantly meet people who have no idea what they're doing and still searching. I wrestled with that question for a long time, I remember being 18-22 and looking around at the people who just knew what they wanted to do and were doing it. I was really jealous of it, because I just wanted something I could put my whole being into and go for.
Ultimately I wouldn't try to worry about it too much, but spend effort doing new things and learning new skills and hobbies because you will be surprised at the directions your interests take when you put effort towards expanding what you're capable of as a person. I know people who have had a singular goal in life since they were 2 and I know people who didn't figure it out until their 40s. I've never been extremely passionate about anything except dudes playing video games and things worked out okay for me, I worked hard at it because it's all I wanted to do and an opportunity presented itself to do just that.
On August 09 2012 02:30 Odoakar wrote: There really isn't any meaning to life. We wake up every morning, go do our 8-10 hours shift, come back home, eat, sleep. Rinse, repeat.
Depressing ain't it. We're all looking for something to change in our lives to make truly happy. I mean leisure activities are great and all, but eventually you get tired of it. When I lay in bed at night after another typical work day, the usual routine at the gym, and a little bit of games and chatting over skype with friends... just wonder what would life be if I had one strong passion towards something that I would think about every waking moment I would have.
That passion to create something that really makes you feel like you've fulfilled your quest in self-actualization ya know. But that will never come to us, we always have to chase after it of course. If you can't find that feeling in what you're doing now, then it's time to move on to something else. It's too bad that student loans are such a nasty burden in life after college =_=. Even if you find a great job it's always on your mind. So if you aren't happy with what you're doing right now, too bad your stuck with it because you have to make ends meet and save up for you next endeavor.
Meaning of Life (brought to you by Monty Python): 'Try and be nice to people, avoid eating fat, read a good book every now and then,get some walking in, and try and live together in peace and harmony with people of all creeds and nations.'
On August 08 2012 20:38 DigiGnar wrote: The meaning of life is to pass on your genes. Simple as that. I mean, why do you think chicks even have orgasms? For fun? No, because it increases the chance of getting pregnant.
it's so unbelievably bizarre that we just all found ourselves here. i think the most reasonable course of action then is to try my best to enjoy it. having an objective is kinda like having found meaning, right?
The Purpose of Purpose by Dawkins. He's a biologist, dabbles in the metaphysical, in a lot of debates, etc.
He basically asserts that "Why?" is a silly question to ask about life. As humans, we want to attribute purpose to it, but it's really a silly sentiment. Really good watch if you have an hour.
Hey everyone, I decided to post here and see what everyone's opinion was on this:
Recently a 5-year friend of mine decided to quit everything and become a pastor. While this was a shock to all of his friends and family, it got me thinking. He's the 3rd of my friends that knows exactly what he wants to do in life by the age of 20 and has a extremely specific plan for it all.
Me on the other hand, I have no idea what I want to do. I have no idea what I'm good at. I don't have any ONE thing that I'm extremely passionate about. Do you think that it's a bad thing that I'm completely lost at the moment, or do you feel like in time everything will become clear. Is there a possibility that maybe not everyone is meant to have and do the one thing that they are extremely passionate about for the rest of their life?
Thanks guy. Always know that the TL community is there when you need them.
Op
Ive been there, i feel like my whole life that ive been searching for something that im passionate about. In my opinion i just havent found it yet, that or there are so many things that i enjoy doing that not one activity dominates the others. Its just when other people describe their passions it never feels the same to me. Ive never shared that feeling of wanting to do only one thing for the rest of my life.
I would say, keep trying new things, you never know what you will find tomorrow.
It wasn't long after I discovered Starcraft that I pursued my lifelong dream of Creation. Since 1999 I have devoted all of my energy and being to bringing my worlds to life. From modding to writing to voice acting to music and 3d modeling. But because of my disabilities, my skills have never improved past entry level in anything I've ever done. Years of fighting depression and lethargy gradually destroyed my passion and desire to try to fight on, and for the last 2-3 years I have done absolutely nothing but waiting to die. Was I wrong to devote to my dreams? I do not believe so.
Sometimes there is no meaning to life, and often you may find any dreams you did have are inaccessible to you. The importance is to make the moment bearable. I stopped thinking about the future and only about the moment. I have never lived, and will never live, a happy life. Being content is all I can ask for. If I can manage that, then for the moment I am stable. Through stability and balance I hope to find peace before the end. I won't, but it's all I have to hope for.
On August 08 2012 21:53 paralleluniverse wrote: The meaning of life? The economists have it right, the meaning of life is utility maximization.
As for figuring out what you want to do with your life, you're better off being lost then being a pastor.
Oh yeah? I disagree. What an ignorant post >.> just because you aren't religious (or whatever you are, atheist, or otherwise) doesn't mean everybody feels the same way. I would much rather do what makes me happy than be "lost." If that's being a pastor, janitor, engineer, or CEO of Apple, it beats being lost.
If I sensed some sarcasm I wouldn't respond like this, but I don't.
Life has no innate meaning. We're animals that have evolved to be pretty intelligent (compared to other animals, at least), on a single planet in a universe that is almost incomprehensibly big which we only dimly understand. We have about 80 or so revolutions around the sun on this little ball of rock and water, and then we return to the nonexistent state we were in for the past 13 or so billion years. Much of your life was determined when you were born (where, when, to who, etc) and by what your genes are, and you've been shaped by so many outside forces and even today (and probably for the rest of your life) you are being push around by society in ways that you perhaps don't realize.
So don't worry about life's "meaning", just enjoy it. Do something useful for the future, or drink the day away - they're both equally valid choices. As long as you're fulfilled no one can say that you've wasted your life. Don't know what to do? That's ok too, and don't be in any rush either - you've got you whole life to figure out your place. Even if you go to bed on the last day of your life unsure of your past, of who you are and who you could have been, take comfort knowing that every day huge numbers of your fellow homo sapiens struggle with the same thing. You've been given the gift of existence for a few years, experience it and enjoy it, don't live in fear of it.
On August 08 2012 21:53 paralleluniverse wrote: The meaning of life? The economists have it right, the meaning of life is utility maximization.
As for figuring out what you want to do with your life, you're better off being lost then being a pastor.
Oh yeah? I disagree. What an ignorant post >.> just because you aren't religious (or whatever you are, atheist, or otherwise) doesn't mean everybody feels the same way. I would much rather do what makes me happy than be "lost." If that's being a pastor, janitor, engineer, or CEO of Apple, it beats being lost.
If I sensed some sarcasm I wouldn't respond like this, but I don't.
as Rome: Total War has always said, priests can devote 50% of their life to their god and 50% to being useful.
You're born, you live and you die. When you're born, you get a name, a secret true name that nobody else knows. You spend that lifetime learning it, the angles and curves of it; you learn to inhabit it, you learn who you are. You become acquainted with its delicacy, its beauty, the lapidary outline of a soul. And sometimes, when things are bad, fate asks you to put that name away, somewhere safe, locked up tight, so that it will stay clean. Behind a door in a room you never knew about. There are no do-overs. No second chances to make things right if you frak them up the first time. You make your choices and you live with them, and in the end, you are those choices. And if you believe your name is gone forever, that your hands are too dirty to retrieve it, you could fool yourself that it's gone forever. That you've given it away and damned yourself. I don't agree. Innocent is not the same as not guilty, and fixed is not the same as unbroken. The day everything gets so terribly awesome that you can rest forever, without a single rough patch coming on the road: that's a long wait. Best to take your chance when you can, to reclaim the light inside what you are, and what you've proven capable of becoming. To make the long walk back, from the altar to the temple. Better to find the best ending possible; to hit the end of line and skip down to the next, to straddle that salt, that end of line, like poetry. Better to hear the angel, begging you to step across: into the new shape, into the story to come.
oh well I associate my meaning of life with death. When I will be old and be thinking I have left nothing more to do and pass out with a smile on the face. I think meaning of life is to learn learn learn so that in afterlife you would know something, as there will be no books or internet for sure.
you know, as babies we think the world revolves around us. we believe that nothing exists outside ourselves. but as we get older we become more aware of our surroundings, initially starting with our family to relatives to friends to community to state to country to the entire world. even here on teamliquid we find ourselves together because we have a common passion. we feel these connections that compel us to believe that we are a part of something larger than ourselves, that we can make a difference and change the world and shape the pages of history books
throughout the history of the world, many billions of people have been born and have died. many billions. 90% of those people who have once existed, no one remembers their name, their face, their life. we only know about those people who have shaped the course of history, the rest is all a faceless mass of humans who have existed but have since perished, forever to be forgotten in graves or in ashes or at the bottom of the ocean
why do you think solitary confinement is regarded as one of the cruelest forms of torture? because as humans we are social creatures. we wish to have an impact on others, it might be for selfish reasons like money or fame, or it might be because we want to help others and feel that feeling of accomplishment which no amount of wealth or friends can buy
but, in essence, i think what most people are seeking is that feeling that, they can have an impact on the world (in some way), and that they can see people who recognize their achievements and make them feel welcome. otherwise at the end of the day we are all going to find ourselves as cosmic dust, with future generations not ever remembering any of us, unless we can something that we enjoy, all the while living and experiencing life for ourselves, authentically, turning over every unturned rock and dancing in the rain like a free bird who had been once caged. we want to live life to the fullest, enjoy our life, and also find interests, hobbies, subjects that we enjoy, people we enjoy being around, and at the end of the day to discover or invent or reinvent something that we will be known for, because we are just as afraid of regret of having never "lived life" as we are of being a part of that faceless mass of people who have long since decomposed in the soil
money and friends don't matter outside of having those experiences and memories and feelings that you have tried your best, regardless of whether you think you "failed" or "succeeded". it's the journey that counts, not the destination. usually when you see a famous person or read about them on wikipedia, you see only the destination part, but the journey was just as important (if not more so) for shaping who they are. i believe it's john f kennedy who said something like, "happiness is not about having money or friends, but about feeling that you have lived up to your potential"
in the end it is not death we fear, but the prospect of being forgotten. it is not failure we fear, but the prospect of mediocrity. it is not always the spotlight we seek, but we have misgivings about becoming only a grain of sand on a beach, a drop of water in the ocean. at the end of the day we want not to serve only ourselves and do what makes us happy, but also to feel the warmth of recognition from others who might share our passion and value our contributions
So I was traveling around you know doing a lot of wierd jobs given time to think on this. So I jump ship in Hong Kong and make my way over to Tibet, and I get on as a looper at a course over in the Himalayas. A looper, you know, a caddy, a looper, a jock. So, I tell them I'm a pro jock, and who do you think they give me? The Dalai Lama, himself. Twelfth son of the Lama. The flowing robes, the grace, bald... striking. So, I'm on the first tee with him. I give him the driver. He hauls off and whacks one---big hitter, the Lama---long, into a ten-thousand foot crevasse, right at the base of this glacier. Do you know what the Lama says? Gunga galunga... gunga, gunga-galunga. So we finish the eighteenth and he's gonna stiff me. And I say, "Hey, Lama, hey, how about a little something, you know, for the effort, you know." And he says, "Oh, uh, there won't be any money, but when you die, on your deathbed, you will receive total consiousness." So I got that goin' for me, which is nice. Not the meaning of life but maybe I'll see
If you're comfortable with what you are then I wouldn't advice you to make drastic changes, but if you feel like something is wrong, go for it, try to find the answer. It won't be easy but it is rewarding, at least spirituallywise. You will feel like a more complete person. Though it may be only temporary, and most likely it actually will be temporary, your searching will be a lil' easier next time. It's the expirience that we live for. At the end, life is short. Good luck, have fun.
Since the OP begins with a pastor's choice, and hitherto we have thoughts from Richard Dawkins, Douglas Adams, and Monty Python, I'd like to inject a word the Bible has to say about it. Particularly so, given how many pastors in the US (OP nation) draw from it for their profession.
From the book of Ecclesiastes, the conclusion to King Solomon's search for meaning in life.
Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:
Fear God and keep His commandments, For this is man’s all. NKJV
For how to employ yourself, jobs, and the like, it's pretty normal to think you have the clue at 20 and totally change it at 25. Maybe not even find it until 30. Work hard at whatever you're in at the moment to really know if its for you, and always keep an open mind to other opportunities.
On August 09 2012 04:58 IcedBacon wrote: The meaning of life is to reproduce, that's what every living thing before us has strived to do.
Biological Imperative != Meaning of Life
As sentient beings we can chose our own meaning.
Not really. Everything is set in motion. We are all being pushed down a hill and death is at the base. Any "meaning" of life is merely a delusion, which I guess is fine if that's what people need to drag themselves to their jobs in the morning.
Hmm, I think you can be passionate about more than one thing though. Of course if you only dedicate yourself to a single interest then you will most probably become better at it than if you hadn't. But I don't think being passionate necessarily have to be limited to focusing on just one thing though. You can be passionate about many things, you just need to prioritise how much time to dedicate in each subject.
Anyways, I don't think meaning ultimately has anything to do with what you DO, but rather with who you are. I don't believe there is any kind of "true meaning" that is dependand on what we decide on our own. I think meaning simply is something you have to find, something preexistant that relates to who and what we are as human beings. Personally I am convinced that humans are created in the image of God. I believe our purpose is actually to glorify Him. In my experience, it is when we do that, only then can we find a lasting joy in life.
I was inspired by this thread so I actually wrote a blog on TL.net about that just now. ^^
The meaning of life? Maybe there is no meaning. People always search for answers their questions... but in their quest, they always find more questions.
I think what you need to do is: balance it between doing what you want to do, and doing what you need to do.
There is no meaning to life. That is my honest opinion.
All of our existences are meaningless and ultimately useless, no matter what we achieve. Any goal I set for myself has no lasting impact on the outcome of my life. One day, I will die. What comes after is none of my concern.
Sure, some people will be remembered (and will work to be remembered) for a longer span than others, but eventually time will erase these memories and there will be nothing left, except some impersonal entries in a history book (or PDA or hologram database, who knows).
That doesn't mean I don't enjoy being alive, though. On the contrary, I have found that if I am free of false goals and aspirations which will never amount to anything, I can appreciate life as a span of years in which I am free to have fun and do whatever I want, before going back to my natural state of non-being.
That's all life is to me, sort of a metaphysical playground or theme park. My existence is an accident and nothing of value will be lost when I die. It took me a while to come to terms with this, but I'm glad I did.
I would recommend checking out the works of the late Romanian philosopher Emil Cioran, who had many interesting things to say on this subject. Example quotes:
"The fact that life has no meaning is a reason to live --moreover, the only one."
"Is it possible that existence is our exile and nothingness our home?”
“To live entirely without a goal! I have glimpsed this state, and have often attained it, without managing to remain there: I am too weak for such happiness.”
In my opinion growing up is all about letting go of all those unrealistic dreams you had as a kid. 99% of people aren't doing a job they are passionate about. You are one of the lucky one's if you get a job that is even mildly enjoyable.
I see people are posting based on the thread title and not the actual OP
I think you have to follow your passions to an extent, not because of that slim chance that you'll make it, but because of the adventures, experiences and friends that may result.
It is all up to you how to achieve that balance of security and passion that works for you. Some make tons of money in their youth and then throw it all away because they haven't found happiness. Others find spiritually fulfilling paths but struggle financially their whole lives. Some find a happy mix of good career and fun hobbies, others neither.
Just keep your mind open and pick what feels right based on your needs, dreams, hopes and fears.
Weather you have a goal or not doesn't matter to be honest, as long as you have a will to exist and your not constantly questioning yourself on your reasoning of existence going down into depression you should be fine don't worry....
On August 09 2012 04:58 IcedBacon wrote: The meaning of life is to reproduce, that's what every living thing before us has strived to do.
Yeah, but past organisms were struggling to survive in the face of their hostile environment. Now, we control our environment and by overpopulating it we are destroying it and might very well destroy ourselves. That stuff really doesn't apply anymore, and some people ought to reproduce (dedicate their life to the children of the future), while others should make life itself better. I look at parents of the working class and they have their hands full with work and the children so they are just useless when it comes to building a better world...In Quebec proof of the government being corrupt is released every other week and people just sit in front of their tv, revolted, go to bed and work the next day, rage during their break and lunch, then go home and repeat, and the same government is elected. Most of the people that have kids are beyond pathetic (I don't blame them, they have their hands full) but my point is that a better world will not be built by parents, but by dedicated individuals without families.
I think it is very normal that you dont have a burning passion for something. Not everyone does, and then theres a bunch that burns for something but dont have the discipline to go through with it. I'm 23 and I know exactly what I want to do with my life. I don't know exactly how I'll get there or what education or job I'll end up with (studying exercise physiology atm). But I don't care, I know all I want to do is become a bodybuilder, no matter what my family and friends say. It is like a very basic feeling, quite hard to explain. In my mind is like one level below instincts, maybe on the level with sexual orientation etc, something I believe will never change.
Keep at it, you might find out along the way, or you might not. The most important thing is to realize that it is never too late. If you find out what you want to do when you are 20, 30, 40 or 50, do it, you only live once.
I don't think it's a problem that you don't know exactly how you want to live your life, or what you want your future occupation to be. Plenty of people enter into a university with an undeclared major, or switch after their freshman or sophomore year (or make drastic changes later in life), and that's totally fine. In fact, you can justify these switches by saying that you have more experience now, and that you can make better informed decisions later in life.
I was not one of those people though. From a very young age, I knew I wanted to teach math. I was great at math, loved learning it and all of the puzzles and mysteries and logic it entailed, and I happened to like educating in general. As I pursued this dream of mine, my college courses reinforced this decision- and so more experience justified this as well. It wouldn't have been the end of the world if I changed my mind. However, I'm now more certain than ever that I want to stay with math education, and I have a bachelor's, master's, and am going for my PhD in math/ math education.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with not knowing everything you want from your life at any one point in time. From a biological standpoint, your job is to pass on your genes... but not everyone wants to get married and have kids. I do, but I don't scold people who don't. Hell, half of my friends would suck as parents anyway (and so not having kids would probably be a better decision for them lol).
The meaning of life is for you to find happiness and success before you die, but those two things are person-specific. My happiness and success are different than yours, or your parents' (remember that!), or anyone else's. And you don't need to find them right away. Just be open to new things and learn from your experiences (and mistakes), and you'll be happy and successful
On August 09 2012 09:37 Pimpmuckl wrote: I want to learn i think. Interesting things, opinions from people i don't know yet on topics i did not yet understand.
There isn't any identifiable point to life, anyone telling you oterwise is just deluded or making stuff up.
That being said, you're alive, so you might as well enjoy it. Find whatever makes you happy, and pursue it, whatever it may be. (Although if what makes you happy consists of say: murdering people, then be prepared for some resistance.) That's my philosophy at least.
Life noun 1. the condition that distinguishes organisms from inorganic objects and dead organisms, being manifested by growth through metabolism, reproduction, and the power of adaptation to environment through changes originating internally. 2. the sum of the distinguishing phenomena of organisms, especially metabolism, growth, reproduction, and adaptation to environment. 3. the animate existence or period of animate existence of an individual: to risk one's life; a short life and a merry one. 4. a corresponding state, existence, or principle of existence conceived of as belonging to the soul: eternal life. 5. the general or universal condition of human existence: Too bad, but life is like that.
My meaning of life is simple. As long as I can provide for my family( Keep a roof over our heads, foods on the table and a little bit of entertainment everynow and then) While maintaining my hobbies and friendships then im happy. As long as I have everything I need and some of the things I want Im settled.
I had an epiphany about a year ago when I was struggling to finish coursework so I could get a better job with even more money and probably hours. I thought about what I really wanted and worked out that I already had it. As long as your not stupid with your money you dont really need a great deal.
Why work for more if its only going to take away the rest of the things I enjoy
(Note: I earn probably an average salary and so does my wife. Im paying off a mortgage and in no rush to do so. I like my neighbourhood so we dont have any intentions of moving. We dont have kids yet, In time I will probably get a better job or my work will promote me and as long as my hours remain the same I will be happy. I only do 40 hours a week leaving me alot of free time for the other things in life).
holy shit that's like the worst life advice... no let me correct myself, that's like the worst fucking video on the planet.
I'm sorry, but I find someone named Derrida posting in a thread on inherent inextricable meaning profoundly ironic.
lol what are you talking about, Derrida became obsessed with death and the meaning of life in the late stages of his life
I just mean he championed the idea of deconstructing inherent conceptual hierarchy, and was one of the fathers of postmodernism. The notion of an inherent meaning associated with life implies a hierarchy of values or ideas. In fact, to clarify what I responded to, critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
Edit: Actually, that's not even true, the notions that Derrida put forth themselves implied a hierarchy of values or ideas, making his life's work a performative contradiction. Oh, English department, when will thou stopst trolling us?
On August 09 2012 10:04 sevencck wrote: critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
All postmodernist theory is hypocritical in this fashion...
On August 09 2012 09:37 Pimpmuckl wrote: I want to learn i think. Interesting things, opinions from people i don't know yet on topics i did not yet understand.
On August 09 2012 10:04 sevencck wrote: critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
All postmodernist theory is hypocritical in this fashion...
holy shit that's like the worst life advice... no let me correct myself, that's like the worst fucking video on the planet.
I'm sorry, but I find someone named Derrida posting in a thread on inherent inextricable meaning profoundly ironic.
lol what are you talking about, Derrida became obsessed with death and the meaning of life in the late stages of his life
I just mean he championed the idea of deconstructing inherent conceptual hierarchy, and was one of the fathers of postmodernism. The notion of an inherent meaning associated with life implies a hierarchy of values or ideas. In fact, to clarify what I responded to, critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
Edit: Actually, that's not even true, the notions that Derrida put forth themselves implied a hierarchy of values or ideas, making his life's work a performative contradiction. Oh, English department, when will thou stopst trolling us?
On August 09 2012 10:04 sevencck wrote: critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
All postmodernist theory is hypocritical in this fashion...
Believe me when I say I agree.
yeah I was going to reply by saying that introducing deconstruction as the ultimate capability of reasoning faculty already establishes a hierarchy of values or ideas, but you edited to say the same thing or as nietzsche would say, the will to power is the will to value
Oh and, if Derrida watched that video, he would probably cockslap the retard named Tyler and whisper in his ear "wake the fuck up, son."
Meaning of life is just to live and experience everything this universe has to offer. This happens over the span of countless lifetimes.
So don't worry about not knowing what your meant to do with your life. Funny thing is your actually doing exactly what you need to do in any given moment. Just be open and alert, soak in what is happening around you and make the most of it.
Most importantly remember that everything is a learning experience, so ask yourself, What am I learning in this moment? You might be surprised by the answer, and start to notice how events chain together to give you that experience.
holy shit that's like the worst life advice... no let me correct myself, that's like the worst fucking video on the planet.
I'm sorry, but I find someone named Derrida posting in a thread on inherent inextricable meaning profoundly ironic.
lol what are you talking about, Derrida became obsessed with death and the meaning of life in the late stages of his life
I just mean he championed the idea of deconstructing inherent conceptual hierarchy, and was one of the fathers of postmodernism. The notion of an inherent meaning associated with life implies a hierarchy of values or ideas. In fact, to clarify what I responded to, critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
Edit: Actually, that's not even true, the notions that Derrida put forth themselves implied a hierarchy of values or ideas, making his life's work a performative contradiction. Oh, English department, when will thou stopst trolling us?
On August 09 2012 10:06 sam!zdat wrote:
On August 09 2012 10:04 sevencck wrote: critiquing something as the "worst life advice" also implies a hierarchy of values or ideas, something Derrida philosophically stood against.
All postmodernist theory is hypocritical in this fashion...
Believe me when I say I agree.
yeah I was going to reply by saying that introducing deconstruction as the ultimate capability of reasoning faculty already establishes a hierarchy of values or ideas, but you edited to say the same thing or as nietzsche would say, the will to power is the will to value
Oh and, if Derrida watched that video, he would probably cockslap the retard named Tyler and whisper in his ear "wake the fuck up, son."
I've never really understood the concept of "meaning".
How can anything possibly have meaning? It's just a word made up by humans like love and hate. It has no scientific grounds, such as a word like cause and it's going to vary person to person.
To me, even if I knew every truth in the universe I would insist there is no meaning because the word itself has no meaning.
Happiness, love, knowledge-- um, that is somehow meaning?
If God's real-- ok?? where's meaning in that?
The reality is that we are no more special than a rock or a star; a God or an angel-- everything is equally worthless.
On August 09 2012 10:23 xrapture wrote: I've never really understood the concept of "meaning".
How can anything possibly have meaning? It's just a word made up by humans like love and hate. It has no scientific grounds, such as a word like cause and it's going to vary person to person.
To me, even if I knew every truth in the universe I would insist there is no meaning because the word itself has no meaning.
Happiness, love, knowledge-- um, that is somehow meaning?
If God's real-- ok?? where's meaning in that?
The reality is that we are no more special than a rock or a star; a God or an angel-- everything is equally worthless.
I think "meaning" is a shortened way of describing Purpose or point of something. And no everything is not equally worthless, but they are equal in the grand scheme of things. Everything is worthless is a highly negative perspective on existence.
On August 09 2012 10:20 Khul Sadukar wrote: Meaning of life is just to live and experience everything this universe has to offer. This happens over the span of countless lifetimes.
So don't worry about not knowing what your meant to do with your life. Funny thing is your actually doing exactly what you need to do in any given moment. Just be open and alert, soak in what is happening around you and make the most of it.
Most importantly remember that everything is a learning experience, so ask yourself, What am I learning in this moment? You might be surprised by the answer, and start to notice how events chain together to give you that experience.
I've recently started living this way too. It's crazy how much your life turns around once you start just 'living it rather than trying to steer it in the direction you want.
The meaning of life, my belief, is to love other people and care about them as much as you care about yourself. Sacrifice what you can for others, live selflessly.
It should be noted that I am a Christian. So the above is in my religion and what I should be doing. Now, if we're talking about something job related or "future plans", I'm the type of person that has always strived to achieve the highest goal possible. I want to go to the military. I can NOT do a job like a regular soldier. That's not good enough for me. I work hard at everything I do to become better and better and do more stuff. Always learning and expanding. Just being a common soldier (not that there's anything wrong with that, it's just me), is not what I am as a person. I am attempting to join the best of the best, Navy SEALS.
But that, to me, is the meaning of life. To love people and ALWAYS be learning. I cannot stand to sit still and accept a job that doesn't challenge me. I would go crazy. lol. The pursuit of knowledge is one of the greatest things a human being can do.
On August 08 2012 22:58 Pandemona wrote: Lol a Pastor wow xD
But yeah, im kinda in the same boat as you kinda. In terms of job sense i have no idea what i wanted to do or want to do now, i have had 3 jobs in my lifetime and i have been good at all of them (KFC Manager - Office Admin - Office Junior). I still don't know if i will be doing this for the rest of my life but i know one thing i need a job to have money to do my leisure activites i enjoy (play games/drink/go to football matches etc)
So all in all, the only advice i can give is, get a job, any job so you can fund your lesiure activities and continue to do everything you can to make yourself happy, thats the meaning of life to me. Making YOURSELF happy.
No offense to this guy but Frank Zappa said if you follow what your parents say, what your local priests says and what your local politicians say don't complain about a boring life.
Life for me is doing crazy things, things a lot of people would like to do but may hesitate because it could be too radical. I graduated from university at a young age, I had a stable job but after a whole year of working hard and earning money I realized it was all a waste of absolute time, I was missing the big things in life: I expent 3 months reading hardcore mind blowing philosophy like Nietzche or anything I could get my hands on (1984, Chilhood's end both were mind blowing) and doing hard sports like Brazilian jiu jitsu for at least 3-4 hours every day, then I got a shit paying job as a DJ in a brothel/strip club, owned by the italian mafia, that was seriously seriously fun. Now I'm healing from an injury, decided to why not, read a lot of science fiction and learn russian, even when it could be totally useless. I don't care, I enjoy all. Hopefully next year I'm heading to some country in Africa, maybe Liberia or something, if it's a mess, the better I want to see it for myself.
Damn I got to say that when I stopped listening to those people Frank Zappa said life really became seriously fun.
Life, as a general concept, has no inherent meaning.
Specific lives, however, can have meaning. It's up to you to give your life a meaning. Look for things that you care for and in which you would like to make a difference, and fight for them. You can't fight for everything though, so you need to pick your fights carefully, and even then it might take a very long time until you start making a difference.
As to your situation, OP, it's fine to be lost. Try to keep your eyes and your mind open to new ideas, ask for advice from dependable people when you feel lost, and be true to yourself.
whoever is the fittest will pass their genes on to produce more better fit life~
or at least.. thats what we would like to think... in the end, its all just a natural order of existance like physics, chemistry, and other natural science. to ask what the meaning of life is, is to ask the meaning behind the universe... and still, it feels like science is looping itself.. to a degree that we have to ask why the tiniest interactions exists. can i just say, the meaning of life is just existance? or even the universe?
God created you to do amazing things and the only true way to figure out what your purpose is in life is to seek out who he is...since we were made in his image, it is only reasonable that the only way to figure out our identity is to know him.
How?: Simply pray and ask him for help!
Now (before any religious debate blah blah happens).Plenty of people have made it through life without religion and that's just fine...I am happy for them, but this is how I live mine :D
holy shit that's like the worst life advice... no let me correct myself, that's like the worst fucking video on the planet.
Why? "The Game" might not be the classiest thing in the world, but I think he's right in that committing yourself completely to mastery of one thing is the absolute best thing you can do for yourself as a person. I thought it was a great video.
I suggest everyone interested in a scientific view on the meaning of life to read
Frankl, Viktor Man's Search for Meaning. An Introduction to Logotherapy Frankl, Viktor Psychotherapy and Existentialism. Frankl, Viktor The Will to Meaning. Foundations and Applications of Logotherapy Frankl, Viktor The Unheard Cry for Meaning. Psychotherapy and Humanism, Frankl, Viktor On the Theory and Therapy of Mental Disorders. An Introduction to Logotherapy and Existential Analysis, Frankl, Viktor Viktor Frankl Recollections. Frankl, Viktor Man's Search for Ultimate Meaning.
I know how you feel TC, about to be a junior at university and I'm still not totally settled on a major. At this rate it is going to take me 5 years to graduate, possibly even 6 if I switch to a math/science-heavy major, which is a little depressing. Don't have anything useful to contribute to the thread, just saying there are a lot of people in that boat, more than you would expect.
I've never understood this question. I feel like it's trivial either way.
If there's an involved God/creator/power/whatever, the meaning of life is whatever that thing intends it to be. If there's not, meaning is just a human construct, so it's whatever we want it to be.
On August 09 2012 15:46 Belisarius wrote: I've never understood this question. I feel like it's trivial either way.
If there's an involved God/creator/power/whatever, the meaning of life is whatever that thing intends it to be. If there's not, meaning is just a human construct, so it's whatever we want it to be.
I don't want to sound overly pessimistic but my gut feeling is that your friend is not following the right path and is only doing so on "short-term feelings". Being a pastor involves many things, and one of them is life experience and people management.
It is much better to finish your degree and have a reasonable amount of work experience first. Then, when you are at that stage, if that is your calling, then make the jump into the ministry.
In Jesus' time, people were not allowed to begin their public ministry until they were 30 years of age. Working in an occupation (Jesus was a carpenter) and gathering life experience will equip you much better in serving, rather than just jumping into it at 20. There is also a practical side to doing work first - you can save up money.
I've always had life goals of what I wanted to achieve, even since I was roughly 17, I'm currently 24; Here they were: -Enjoy, and be passionate about my career -Always have time for my friends -Been open to new experiences and adventures.
Since then I've changed my Major in college over 11 times, gone to 4 different colleges, and after having one of my best semesters I recently decided to put school on the back burner. When I was 19 years old and my first year in college I lost two of my close friends, due to street racing and drugs, This made me realize I needed to spend as much time as a possibly could with the friends I had, which made my studies suffer and caused me to party a little too much. After getting put on academic probation due to failing all my classes, since I only went to the first day of class, I was fired from my server job, broke up with two girls I loved; I decided to get away and got a job working as a Ski Lift operator. This job was honestly the reason I feel I found purpose and re-ignited my passions, and finding what I truly love. I worked 40hrs a day working by myself on a beautiful mountain called June Mountain in Mammoth Lakes, CA. With soooo much time by myself I was able to clear my head of the bullshit people put in and broke down everything I truly wanted out of life. Even after this year of my life passed I came back and still didn't know exactly what I wanted I knew I wanted to be involved with video games of some sort of way. I got straight A's and 1-2 B's for the year with my major being Computer Gaming Science, Which I just decided to drop out to pursue Pro Gaming, after getting partnered with twitch.tv and getting Accepted into the Razor Gaming House. Granted I've never dedicated so much time to any one thing in my life, But if this is called work, I FUCKING LOVE WORK!
I'm not saying I'm currently making millions of dollars, but when you realize YOU WOULD DO YOUR JOB FOR FREE, is when you know what you'd like to do!
Before I stream everyday I watch a motivation video, and I've become addicted to Tony Robbins, and he seems to sum this up great in 5 points. 1. Raise Your Standards 2. Change Your Limiting Beliefs 3. Model Strategies That Work 4. Intensify Your Emotions 5. Give Much More Than You Expect to Receive
Meet aliens, travel in space, and become a space cowboy. That's one part of my idea the meaning of my lfie. Besides that i'm still figuring it out. - You should lie down on your bed, and start thinking about everything which has ever interested you. Perhaps you will find something which will get you all tingly and a bit excited, and maybe then you can start somewhat forming your own idea of the meaning of life.
Dont know what the meaning of life is, but what u should aim for is happiness whatever makes u happy, but u should be considerate of the people around you, and try and share the happiness. Life is boring u if u hate everything and love nothing
Grab two cartons of cigarettes, some money, clothes. Go out, walk, hitchhike, meet people, talk to people, learn their stories, tell yours. Its puzzling how much you learn from a two week trip
On August 08 2012 16:12 OptronX wrote: Hey everyone, I decided to post here and see what everyone's opinion was on this:
Recently a 5-year friend of mine decided to quit everything and become a pastor. While this was a shock to all of his friends and family, it got me thinking. He's the 3rd of my friends that knows exactly what he wants to do in life by the age of 20 and has a extremely specific plan for it all.
Me on the other hand, I have no idea what I want to do. I have no idea what I'm good at. I don't have any ONE thing that I'm extremely passionate about. Do you think that it's a bad thing that I'm completely lost at the moment, or do you feel like in time everything will become clear. Is there a possibility that maybe not everyone is meant to have and do the one thing that they are extremely passionate about for the rest of their life?
Thanks guy. Always know that the TL community is there when you need them.
Op
I think if you are extremely passionate about something, you should definitely pursue it no matter what, cause this will be the thing u will love doing, this will be the thing that will make u happy, cause honestly, too many grownups hate their job and are unhappy with their live and just go for the rest of their lives with a daily routine of hating the job and then showing their unhappines on their families. This is why u have to do what u love and if getting there is hard, well try harder!
and believe me, if ur friend quit everything and became a pastor, he has no idea what he wants in his life, he just chose a simpler route, basically the easy way out and went into the ignorant thinking life.
On August 08 2012 16:12 OptronX wrote: Hey everyone, I decided to post here and see what everyone's opinion was on this:
Recently a 5-year friend of mine decided to quit everything and become a pastor. While this was a shock to all of his friends and family, it got me thinking. He's the 3rd of my friends that knows exactly what he wants to do in life by the age of 20 and has a extremely specific plan for it all.
Me on the other hand, I have no idea what I want to do. I have no idea what I'm good at. I don't have any ONE thing that I'm extremely passionate about. Do you think that it's a bad thing that I'm completely lost at the moment, or do you feel like in time everything will become clear. Is there a possibility that maybe not everyone is meant to have and do the one thing that they are extremely passionate about for the rest of their life?
Thanks guy. Always know that the TL community is there when you need them.
Op
I think if you are extremely passionate about something, you should definitely pursue it no matter what, cause this will be the thing u will love doing, this will be the thing that will make u happy, cause honestly, too many grownups hate their job and are unhappy with their live and just go for the rest of their lives with a daily routine of hating the job and then showing their unhappines on their families. This is why u have to do what u love and if getting there is hard, well try harder!
and believe me, if ur friend quit everything and became a pastor, he has no idea what he wants in his life, he just chose a simpler route, basically the easy way out and went into the ignorant thinking life.
Never measure your life based on those around you. It's one of the simplest and easiest things you can do to ruin yourself, and in the end all you are doing is feeding yourself false envy.
When I was a little kid, I wanted to go to the 9th dimension and defeat the giant monkey. As I grow up, I realise that there is no portal to the 9th dimension (yet). I became an accountant.
I don't believe in religions or anything, and my answer is that life itself is meaningless. You grow up and die. It is up to the individual to create meaning for themselves. Go do some volunteer work at old people shelter and talk to them would be a great start for finding meaning in life. Encourge the old people to tell you their story and life experiences and listen closely.
On August 09 2012 21:30 Dopubalimatu wrote: "What is the meaning of life?I don't know but we might as well do civilization while we're at it" - Eddie Izzard
This is one of the wiser things that has been said so far.
On August 09 2012 20:24 Kukaracha wrote: So many people talk about a scientific perspective... I don't get it.
On August 09 2012 06:59 KNICK wrote: There is no meaning to life. That is my honest opinion.
All of our existences are meaningless and ultimately useless, no matter what we achieve. Any goal I set for myself has no lasting impact on the outcome of my life. One day, I will die. What comes after is none of my concern.
Sure, some people will be remembered (and will work to be remembered) for a longer span than others, but eventually time will erase these memories and there will be nothing left, except some impersonal entries in a history book (or PDA or hologram database, who knows).
That doesn't mean I don't enjoy being alive, though. On the contrary, I have found that if I am free of false goals and aspirations which will never amount to anything, I can appreciate life as a span of years in which I am free to have fun and do whatever I want, before going back to my natural state of non-being.
That's all life is to me, sort of a metaphysical playground or theme park. My existence is an accident and nothing of value will be lost when I die. It took me a while to come to terms with this, but I'm glad I did.
I would recommend checking out the works of the late Romanian philosopher Emil Cioran, who had many interesting things to say on this subject. Example quotes:
"The fact that life has no meaning is a reason to live --moreover, the only one."
"Is it possible that existence is our exile and nothingness our home?”
“To live entirely without a goal! I have glimpsed this state, and have often attained it, without managing to remain there: I am too weak for such happiness.”
man, just bee good in your life, you want to go to heaven right? hell is a bad place to be. Ok I disagree totally with all nonbelievers in afterlife. I bet all our actions are shifting our being which after death goes to some other place or dimension to continue existence. By learning, improving yourself, breaking your own barriers, helping others you improve spiritually or as a being which makes base of yourself in afterlife.
Our lives, universe, other things are not perfect, the real sh*t starts after you die.
In my head, I can imagine things. Those things I imagine exist in some world, not in a metaphysical sense, but the ideas and things I can see in my mind exist in some sense of the word. To our world they are just electrical impulses. That is all. But in my mind, they are something more.
The word world is such a strange thing. I don't mean my thoughts are in a world like we live, but more a pre-interpreted and holistically structured background of meaning.We can only understand it with our practical encounters with it. Hense electrical impulses.
I quote someone much smarter than I to elaborate on this world:
The world is not a possible object of knowledge – because it is not an object at all, not an entity or set of entities. It is that within which entities appear, a field or horizon the conditions for any intra-worldly relation, and so is not analysable in terms of any such relation
What if, in some sense, we are creations just like my thoughts. That is to say, that we have come and been created in a universe by some way we cannot begin to possibly imagine, by some world where there is no such thing as physics, there is no such thing as matter.
And when I say we were created in a universe, I don't mean a universe in a literal sense. Because the meaning of a universe depends upon the context in which we encounter it. And much like my thoughts cannot encounter our metaphysical world, we cannot encounters or experience the place in which our own universe has been created.
By just being alive you are fulfilling your purpose. Without the us, the universe wouldn't exist because no one would be around to sense it. Life is the universe experiencing itself. Without life, the universe might as well not exist because there are no minds around to make it real.
If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?Yes, but no one knows about it, so it might as well have not even happened. It would make no difference.
This same phrase and answer can be applied to the universe.
If a universe exists and no one is around to live in it, does it really exist?Yes, but no one knows about it, so it might as well have not even happened. It would make no difference.
It is us, life, that makes the difference. We give the universe purpose. That is the meaning of life.
Now we are presented with a new problem now that we know the meaning of life. The real big question now is: What is the meaning of the universe?
It has more thinking behind it but for you, the individual, the meaning of life is happiness. Seems like an open door, cause it is. So find out what makes you happy (not pleasure, i mean happiness) and do that. 24/7 if possible.
Charity, positive thinking, pride, avoiding negativity (cyclistic negativity such somebody beating you down is the worst), accepting bad stuff (inevitable), exercise, health, good personal relationships etc.
O and as a last note: don't waste your time trying to figure out questions you can't answer. How the universe was created is actually not that relevant to the individual's happiness.
Oh of course, what people do with their lives is up to them. Nobody can be happy 24/7 though. Your brain couldn't possibly stream those happy chemicals nonstop no matter how fulfilling you find your life to be.
Also, it is not a waste of time, and indeed these questions can be answered with enough meditation. How the universe was created will forever be a mystery, but finding meaning and purpose can be accomplished if you try. I didn't want to further expand on my thoughts about the universe because I didn't want to derail the topic off on a tangent.
The ultimate question with so many answers, or no answer at all.
Short version: Eat, sleep, procreate....or Life has no meaning, any one person's life is pointless/insignificant.
When I was fresh out of high school, I thought I knew everything about 'life', when I turned 21 I knew so much more, same thing when I turned 25. The mind is amazing and your outlook will be forever changing.
Everything you do has meaning, no matter how small, whether you notice it or not. A sentence and a smile to a random stranger could be enough to make them want to keep living, but you would never know.
From a young age, it seems to me, people are programmed or convinced that if they are not doing extraordinary things(curing diseases, running for president, flying planes, famous singer/actor) then they think they are failures. I believe the opposite, I mean sure, if that's really what you want to do then go for it, but don't feel pressured that you have to. If you get the same satisfaction from being a carpenter building houses as you would performing open heart surgery then what's the difference? People look at you differently? Your parents won't brag about you being a carpenter? You don't drive a BMW?
Even though people seem to love drama, it really is pointless. Even though people seem to love trashtalking others, discussing who is a "loser" and who is "doing well", again it's pointless. Taking peoples opinions of you to heart as truth is pointless.
My point is don't live your life for others, you only get one. Surround yourself with people that take you for who you are, pass on your knowledge and experiences, and take a moment and look out at the water, up in the sky, across a field, sit there and just be.
Why should life have a meaning? Some questions just aren't worth of asking. If you're really looking for an answer, I'd personally say the meaning of life is to pass on your genes to the next generation. Our entire life is governed by them, what we eat, how we eat, how we interact with those around us...It's not that we are mindless robots that obey them, but it's just that our basic "programming" consists of these codes that determine how we act.
Meant to do one thing? I think the concept that we're born for something is a retrospective look at what we have done, plus the optimistic bias = the done things were the best.
So it seems reasonable to assume that the idea that we are born for something is just ridiculous because it is based on old people looking back at their lives.
I am in the same situation as OP, but I do not worry about when I will figure it out I just know that I will, and sometimes just knowing that you will is really all that matters. Let your imagination run wild and chase it.
The Universe is our reason for existing. That's it. None of us chose to be born so we owe nothing to The Universe. We are merely new cogs in the machine, and in 100 years all of us will be dead-- the matter that comprises us will still be here, as it's been here since the beginning of time, but we will no longer be conscious entities. None of our actions, thoughts, or beliefs will have had the slightest impact, as they were just chemical reactions-- no different than any other chemical reaction in The Universe.
We can affix the word "meaning" to aspects of our lives, but it's only to make ourselves feel better. We refuse to believe that we aren't remarkable. Eating, sleeping, and fucking-- what every other animal does until they die, isn't enough for us, because we are all utterly selfish and want to believe we are the Gods of our story, that our path is meaningful and our actions paramount.
So when asked, "what's the meaning of life?" my answer's:
Essentially, there is no meaning. But, there's no meaning to anything. Existence is a state, not a privilege. The universe is. We are.
When I was 19, I was hopelessly depressed. I remember felling an empty dark void in my stomach, life just seemed so monotonous and trivial. Over a long period of time I came to a rather extreme solution. I decided that I had to fill my life with things that I would die for and thus started my pursuit towards happiness and wounder. The meaning of life is a very personal thing and it will be different for each person who actively seeks it out. By asking these questions it will only be a matter of time before you find what you are looking for.
For me I found meaning in wonder. I constantly marvel at the beauty of the Earth and the sky. They are my passion and my inspiration. With my spare time I garden, landscape, bonsai and star gaze....and I get high and game out too of course. My job is to teach others about the wonders I have found. I work at a planetarium and I am a student perusing a bachelors in astrophysics.
I feel that my path was laid before me all I had to do was to take advantage of the opportunities that came my way. I do not have a special or privileged background. I dropped out of high school never truly completing 9th grade. So my advise to you is to keep looking and to keep asking your self what is important to you. And most importantly go where life takes you.
Carl Sagan spoke of our individual pursuits of meaning " We long to be here for a purpose even though, despite much self deception, none is evident. The significance of our lives and our fragile planet is then determined only by our own wisdom and courage, we are the custodians of life's meaning.....If we crave some cosmic purpose let us find ourselves a worthy goal."
Has anyone ever had their mind blown when they thought about the strange possibility that all this happened. And by all this, I mean the universe and everything. I always wondered how strange of a coincidence it is that I'm here, and I wonder why there isn't nothing; Not even empty space, just plain nothing. As I think of it I enter this state of intense amazement. I actually have a mini freak out.
On August 11 2012 13:50 FeUerFlieGe wrote: Has anyone ever had their mind blown when they thought about the strange possibility that all this happened. And by all this, I mean the universe and everything. I always wondered how strange of a coincidence it is that I'm here, and I wonder why there isn't nothing; Not even empty space, just plain nothing. As I think of it I enter this state of intense amazement. I actually have a mini freak out.
Isn't it crazy?
WHY IS THERE SOMETHING INSTEAD OF NOTHING?
I love it
edit: the only conclusion I can come to is that it must be logically necessary
From personal experience, 90% of people these days have NO idea what they want to do with their lives until they're near 30. I am 22 and I know what I would like to do, but it's realistically never going to occur. That I am fine with, best bet is to figure out something you REALLY enjoy, and follow through with something in that area. If you love video games, then look at everything involved in video games, and pursue something in there. Now with that being said, if you love music, and would like to make music, go with that, and if you love video games just as much, then you've got a direction. Basically look at what makes you happy. Not everyone is going to be rich, not everyone is going to be famous, what you need to do is figure out what you could do day in and day out 5 days (or more in many instances) for 30+ years. Figure that out, and you figure out a direction.
Personally, I like writing and being creative with that aspect, I used to write lyrics, and have written a few good short stories that I would use for video game concepts. I also love concept art and video games as a whole. I buy the collectors edition of anything (if I plan to buy it anyway, and sometimes wouldn't have bought, but Halo Reach had a statue that was really nice so I bought it, glad I did, it's a good game...and I didn't like 2 or 3.) JUST for artwork books or figures and such. Being either an eSports journalist or a video game storyboard creator would work for me. I personally would LOVE to be in the eSports scene, but I doubt it will happen, I would be happy to be a game writer, and just follow Starcraft.
This goes without saying, work a meaningless job, someone has to, but aspire to be more, it's a means to an end regardless of circumstances. Let the under-inspired meander around from job to job and never really acquire a career. Find something that makes you happy, and follow through. If you're insightful enough you may find a void nobody really thought of or pursued and then fill it. Look at Day[9] for example, he decided to just go "okay, i'll do a show about showing people how to be better at my passion" and he's doing quite well.
On August 09 2012 04:58 IcedBacon wrote: The meaning of life is to reproduce, that's what every living thing before us has strived to do.
Biological Imperative != Meaning of Life
As sentient beings we can chose our own meaning.
Not really. Everything is set in motion. We are all being pushed down a hill and death is at the base. Any "meaning" of life is merely a delusion, which I guess is fine if that's what people need to drag themselves to their jobs in the morning.
Of course it's a delusion, it cannot be anything else. "Meaning" is compeletely subjective, and we can attribute meaning to whatever we chose.
And some people, like me who works in astronomy, love their jobs and don't need a reason to go there every day. I mean, what else would I be doing all day every day? I would be bored out of my mind if I couldn't keep busy.
And to quote Carl Sagan - "We are a way for the universe to know itself"
On August 11 2012 13:50 FeUerFlieGe wrote: Has anyone ever had their mind blown when they thought about the strange possibility that all this happened. And by all this, I mean the universe and everything. I always wondered how strange of a coincidence it is that I'm here, and I wonder why there isn't nothing; Not even empty space, just plain nothing. As I think of it I enter this state of intense amazement. I actually have a mini freak out.
Anthropological principle.
If all of this hadn't happened, then you would never have been able to think about it because you wouldn't have existed. So this is the only outcome of the universe in which you can consider all the things that could have gone 'wrong', making it the only outcome in which you can ever exist. Making the extremeley improbable existence of you into a certainty.
“It did not really matter what we expected from life, but rather what life expected from us. We needed to stop asking about the meaning of life, and instead to think of ourselves as those who were being questioned by life—daily and hourly. Our answer must consist, not in talk and meditation, but in right action and in right conduct. Life ultimately means taking the responsibility to find the right answer to its problems and to fulfill the tasks which it constantly sets for each individual.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
Logotherapy was developed by neurologist and psychiatrist Viktor Frankl. It is considered the "Third Viennese School of Psychotherapy" after Freud's psychoanalysis and Adler's individual psychology.
Logotherapy is based on an Existential Analysis focusing on the will to meaning as opposed to Adler's Nietzschean doctrine of will to power or Freud's will to pleasure. Rather than power or pleasure, logotherapy is founded upon the belief that it is the striving to find a meaning in one's life that is the primary, most powerful motivating and driving force in humans.
“Ultimately, man should not ask what the meaning of his life is, but rather must recognize that it is he who is asked. In a word, each man is questioned by life; and he can only answer to life by answering for his own life; to life he can only respond by being responsible.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“In some ways suffering ceases to be suffering at the moment it finds a meaning, such as the meaning of a sacrifice.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“Life is never made unbearable by circumstances, but only by lack of meaning and purpose.” ― Viktor E. Frankl
“So live as if you were living already for the second time and as if you had acted the first time as wrongly as you are about to act now!” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“Everything can be taken from a man but one thing: the last of the human freedoms—to choose one’s attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one’s own way.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“The one thing you can’t take away from me is the way I choose to respond to what you do to me. The last of one’s freedoms is to choose one’s attitude in any given circumstance.” ― Viktor E. Frankl
“But there was no need to be ashamed of tears, for tears bore witness that a man had the greatest of courage, the courage to suffer.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“Don't aim at success. The more you aim at it and make it a target, the more you are going to miss it. For success, like happiness, cannot be pursued; it must ensue, and it only does so as the unintended side effect of one's personal dedication to a cause greater than oneself or as the by-product of one's surrender to a person other than oneself. Happiness must happen, and the same holds for success: you have to let it happen by not caring about it. I want you to listen to what your conscience commands you to do and go on to carry it out to the best of your knowledge. Then you will live to see that in the long-run—in the long-run, I say!—success will follow you precisely because you had forgotten to think about it” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“Forces beyond your control can take away everything you possess except one thing, your freedom to choose how you will respond to the situation.” ― Viktor E. Frankl
“Happiness cannot be pursued; it must ensue.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“A human being is not one thing among others; things determine each other, but man is ultimately self-determining. What he becomes - within the limits of endowment and environment- he has made out of himself. In the concentration camps, for example, in this living laboratory and on this testing ground, we watched and witnessed some of our comrades behave like swine while others behaved like saints. Man has both potentialities within himself; which one is actualized depends on decisions but not on conditions.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
“By declaring that man is responsible and must actualize the potential meaning of his life, I wish to stress that the true meaning of life is to be discovered in the world rather than within man or his own psyche, as though it were a closed system. I have termed this constitutive characteristic "the self-transcendence of human existence." It denotes the fact that being human always points, and is directed, to something or someone, other than oneself--be it a meaning to fulfill or another human being to encounter. The more one forgets himself--by giving himself to a cause to serve or another person to love--the more human he is and the more he actualizes himself. What is called self-actualization is not an attainable aim at all, for the simple reason that the more one would strive for it, the more he would miss it. In other words, self-actualization is possible only as a side-effect of self-transcendence.” ― Viktor E. Frankl, Man's Search for Meaning
On August 12 2012 02:05 Rassy wrote: Live has only one goal. To reproduce. Everything else is just for fun.
So you are saying that your goal is the same goal as the cells and organisms that compose you ?
I defy that thought, we are meant for finding our own meaning in life, sure, reproduction is built in our core
But as you pass your genes foward, and spawn offspring you will realize (or most people would) that securing their present and future is more important than making more kids, and so on.
There is always something else to strive for, until you are left with nothing material to acomplish other than your own sense of self-actualization, and thats where the tricky part is.
Because there are cases of people in this world, that managed to simply skip steps of the pyramid and achieve self-actualization without having all their physiological, safety, love and esteem satisfied first.
That's possible because these people have atributed meaning to their existance someway or somehow, and in my opinion that is the true meaning of life, that you are the writer of your own story, it can be anything you want.
In this specific scenario, I would define success as dying in peace, knowing you had courage to go and try to do the stuff you proposed yourself to do, and actively tried to shape yourself and the world to what you believed is the right path, meaning is whatever fuels you to take the next step, to wake up with the willpower to do whatever you are required (of yourself or others) to do day after day after day, despite it being laborsome or having no end in sight.
"To love friends, family, people..." is the consequence of self-actualization, not the means.
You can't just go up tomorrow and say "I'l love everybody". Its an emotional feeling that can only be found through extensive search... by manipulating our emotion to feel that way.
When you stop judging others, that's when you accepted who you are. Its not logical, but emotional.
Quite simply, whatever meaning you wish to give it, in my opinion it does not realy matter. Whatever works for you, because in the end it's going to help you to cope with everything if you can learn to observe and sense things better, without becoming too affected by it or worrying too much.
On August 13 2012 04:46 sam!zdat wrote: so you would engage in mass rape were that possible for you to do?
I have morals.....maybe you dont but I do
But where do those come from?
Is it part of the "meaning" of life? Or is it a different thing? If it is a different thing, what sort of a thing is it?
now your just getting off topic. Your pretty much asking why people dont mass murder
its not the norm, I was taught that is wrong and I will pass that down to my kids, and to them their kids
not really sure what your trying to get at....not sure why I bother responding
No, he was just taking your "meaning of life" to its logical conclusion. I mean, I have nothing against you and you're free to believe whatever you want. But something like "the goal of life to procreate" generally signifies that you haven't really thought it through entirely.
On August 13 2012 04:46 sam!zdat wrote: so you would engage in mass rape were that possible for you to do?
I have morals.....maybe you dont but I do
But where do those come from?
Is it part of the "meaning" of life? Or is it a different thing? If it is a different thing, what sort of a thing is it?
now your just getting off topic. Your pretty much asking why people dont mass murder
its not the norm, I was taught that is wrong and I will pass that down to my kids, and to them their kids
not really sure what your trying to get at....not sure why I bother responding
No, he was just taking your "meaning of life" to its logical conclusion. I mean, I have nothing against you and you're free to believe whatever you want. But something like "the goal of life to procreate" generally signifies that you haven't really thought it through entirely.
lol that statement is ridiculous. who HAS thought life all the way through? no one because then they would have No time to live it! I would say his answer is as legitimate as anyone else who came up with one, and by saying "think about it more" you are disregarding his conclusion without actually presenting an argument about it.
I don't have an answer that i want to post here yet, but I do want to say that I think black people have (had) the best societies because they walked the LEAST before asking themselves what they were looking for. White people walked so much farther and so by the time they either Forgot what they were looking for , or asked themselves again, or claimed they found it (god, eternal youth) and that's why their societies are so fucked up.
they had to organize / distribute power more to survive for longer, and then corruption happened so they didn't want to dismantle and go back to normal. aka god told me to lead you guys etc.
so i would say that a lot of our faults in modern society come from being ridiculous... maybe this is relevant?
On August 13 2012 04:46 sam!zdat wrote: so you would engage in mass rape were that possible for you to do?
I have morals.....maybe you dont but I do
But where do those come from?
Is it part of the "meaning" of life? Or is it a different thing? If it is a different thing, what sort of a thing is it?
now your just getting off topic. Your pretty much asking why people dont mass murder
its not the norm, I was taught that is wrong and I will pass that down to my kids, and to them their kids
not really sure what your trying to get at....not sure why I bother responding
No, he was just taking your "meaning of life" to its logical conclusion. I mean, I have nothing against you and you're free to believe whatever you want. But something like "the goal of life to procreate" generally signifies that you haven't really thought it through entirely.
lol that statement is ridiculous. who HAS thought life all the way through? no one because then they would have No time to live it! I would say his answer is as legitimate as anyone else who came up with one, and by saying "think about it more" you are disregarding his conclusion without actually presenting an argument about it.
All right, let me help you out. Consider some of these questions. If you wake up sterile tomorrow, does your life no longer have meaning? If you have children but they're sterile, does your life still have meaning? If you're gay but you raise several children, does your life not have meaning? If you don't have children but somehow singlehandedly saves the human race from extinction, does your life not have meaning?
I'm not saying that it's wrong, just that if you think it through logically, there are some weird conclusions.
The great biologist goes on the voyage in search of the extraordinary truth that science reveals about death. In this specific scene from Richard Dawkins' video series 'Sex, Death and the Meaning of Life' the very humbling, awe inspiring and (for some) very surreal and harsh reality of death is revealed through the life of the "Arctica Icelandica" clam.
These are amongst the longest living animal on the planet. Some have been found to live for 500 years, or longer.
Why do they live so long? I'm basically rephrasing what the video says, so if you have already watched the section then you don't really have to read this post at all.
But for the lazy, I will say; Evolution has to explain why some species can live so much longer than others. In the case of this clam, there is barely any threat to its survival down at the bottom of the ocean, and nothing can really pierce through its tough outer surface.
It is BECAUSE they have a very large chance of survival that it is a good gamble to stay around for a longer period of time reproducing; whereas something like a salmon has a very poor chance of reproducing so it must throw everything it's got into one big gamble now.
'There is no point in wasting resources on a body lasting 400 years if your chance of making it through the night is pretty slim'
OF COOOOOOURSE there is more to life than just sex and reproduction. We all have our personal meanings that we make for ourselves in this precious life we are given.
But on a genetic level, at the end of our day our bodies are just carriers for genes to move from one generation to the next, and 'survive'
instead of seeing ageing as a grim process, we understand that it is a side effect of how our genes work.
Keep watching the whole documentary and any of Richard Dawkins/Sam Harris/Christopher Hitchens, etc etc. It's all good stuff and will keep you entertained on days off
EPT
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