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http://ca.news.yahoo.com/video/canews-22424922/teacher-suspended-for-giving-zeros-29530108.html
http://www.calgaryherald.com/news/Edmonton teacher suspended giving students zeros/6713603/story.html
I 100% stand by the teacher's decision. If they don't do their work they deserve a zero. The school board just wants to push them through and build their self esteem? I mean comon, give me a fucken break. I can't believe education is the way it is right now, all politics and bureaucracy, producing incompetent kids who apparently have no realization of the consequences of their actions.
Just to clarify, the teacher was giving zeros to people who failed to hand in work. He was not giving zeros to incomplete work. Students were informed and given many chances to complete their work, but they did not until he showed a print out of their marks with zeros on it.
"The physics teacher with 35 years experience said he continued giving zeros when students failed to hand in assignments, instead of using behaviour codes such as “not completed,” which the school requires under its grading and reporting practice.
In Dorval’s physics and science classes, students who didn’t turn in assignments got a printout of their marks showing them how a zero would affect their overall grade. Most times, the strategy spurred students to complete the work, he said. “Once I give that printout, I get a flood of assignments.”
Dorval said he also gives students a handout at the beginning of each school year informing them of his marking practices.
“It says right on there that I still give zeros,” Dorval said. “It’s on that handout I give them at the start that it’s up to them to come to me to make arrangements (to finish the work). I stay after school three days a week and I’m usually in my room at lunch hour, and sometimes the kids have spares so I tell them, ‘You make arrangements with me to come in and make up the work.’ "
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More teachers need to have the guts to give 0s. I used to see many people doing dickall in highschool, and still passed without deserving.
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Wtf? They were missing assignments, of course they're going to get a zero. I don't know why the teacher would be suspended. On another note, I hope that teacher moves to a new, brighter school and quits their current job.
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that is so stupid the only reason the school supsended him is because they want better grades in the schools to get more tax money. School isn't about teaching anymore its about money.
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It's kind of vague. Does "incomplete" mean only a few problems were done or none at all? I'm not arguing that our education system isn't ridiculously and overly lenient (there are definitely classes that even in college I probably deserved to fail, but didn't), but maybe this guy handed out zeros for kids that forgot about the assignment until lunch and did whatever problems they could. They deserve at least some credit for that.
On the other hand, if it was really the kid didn't do shitall during the year, then yeah, this is ridiculous.
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If i recall, there was something about teacher being unable to give students a failing grade. It was only recently that they repealled it and now teacher can fail students.
Regardless I stand by this teacher actions.
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Sweden1159 Posts
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
Basically, I feel that even if my english is good enough for grade A, I cannot achieve it unless I come to almost every class and do every piece of homework, even if I get very high scores on my tests. Is this right or wrong?
In my own perfect world, a grade would reflect how a good a certain student is at said subject, not how much time dedicated into it. After all, when I'm looking for a job, my grades should show how good I am at said thing, not how nice I was in class. Just because I didn't come to every English class doesn't mean I wont come to work every day. I know a guy in my english class who is terrible at english, yet he's given grade C. The only reason for that is because he did his homework and was nice to the teacher.
Me on the other hand, had a grudge with the teacher (along with the rest of the class) and I've been having constant meetings with the principal to get ourselves a new teacher (she has a terrible attitude and constantly mocks us, has an aura of prestige as if we're crap and she's the best, yet she can't even spell the word boulder).
Anyway, back on topic, I'm getting an E this year because I basically haven't come to many of her lessons (I have about 60% attendance rate). I did however get a B on my final exams (called 'Nationella Proven' in Sweden).
Maybe this was abit off-topic, I got abit carried away :D...
EDIT: Just noticed that B is appearently something else in USA compared to Sweden (in Sweden, B is the new MVG, which was the highest grade possible in the previous grading system).
EDIT2: And before all Swedes jump me saying A is the MVG, A is MVG+ (which previously didn't give any points, but A does).
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I wrote an essay on how I want segregation by GPA in school. Got a zero on it for inappropate topic. I really do think teachers are too nice to high school kids. I was lucky not to be one of the typical dumbass high school kid so never cared all too much. But it did sometimes piss me off that they NEVER fail Ben though they fail tests and never does homework. During the graduation ceremony I was looking around thinking to myself how these brain dead faggots even passed class. I then remembered pretty much every non honors teacher offered extra credit, which is bullshit.
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I imagine Canada have clear course descriptions like we have in Sweden and here we fail the fucking course if we don't meet the requirements. In Sweden we have IG (Swedish: icke godkänd, rough translation: YOU DID NOT PASS) and if you don't pass your assignments and tests you don't pass the course. This is totally warranted and everything else is bullshit.
Edit: I'm going to university now where they are more strict overall but IMO the same attitude should show across the board. It might be a shock to some kids in high school but education is one of the most important things in they world and if they don't understand what a 0 means for them they will suffer for it in the future.
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I completely agree with the teacher, I hate that they were punished for being right.
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The teacher had every right to give the students zeros for not doing the work.
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On June 03 2012 01:52 Roachu wrote:
I imagine Canada have clear course descriptions like we have in Sweden and here we fail the fucking course if we don't meet the requirements. In Sweden we have IG (Swedish: icke godkänd, rough translation: YOU DID NOT PASS) and if you don't pass your assignments and tests you don't pass the course. This is totally warranted and everything else is bullshit.
Edit: I'm going to university now where they are more strict overall but IMO the same attitude should show across the board. It might be a shock to some kids in high school but education is one of the most important things in they world and if they don't understand what a 0 means for them they will suffer for it in the future.
Every course has a syllabus which outlines course objectives and so forth, in almost every institution.
I was on the flip side of the issue last semester (TAing vs being a student). We had this one student clearly plagiarizing work with 100% certainity (she didn't pass), but she never had to go through the official university guidelines when dealing with plagiarism. It really is silly.
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I am ashamed to say I live in Edmonton. Fucking pathetic... the people in command have no balls to make the right decisions and are scared of pressure from the public. Man up.
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On June 03 2012 01:47 sereniity wrote:
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
Basically, I feel that even if my english is good enough for grade A, I cannot achieve it unless I come to almost every class and do every piece of homework, even if I get very high scores on my tests. Is this right or wrong?
In my own perfect world, a grade would reflect how a good a certain student is at said subject, not how much time dedicated into it. I know a guy in my english class who is terrible at english, yet he's given grade C. The only reason for that is because he did his homework and was nice to the teacher.
Me on the other hand, had a grudge with the teacher (along with the rest of the class) and I've been having constant meetings with the principal to get ourselves a new teacher (she has a terrible attitude and constantly mocks us, has an aura of prestige as if we're crap and she's the best, yet she can't even spell the word boulder).
Anyway, back on topic, I'm getting an E this year because I basically haven't come to many of her lessons (I have about 60% attendance rate). I did however get a B on my final exams (called 'Nationella Proven' in Sweden).
Maybe this was abit off-topic, I got abit carried away :D...
totally disagree with you
you're saying that intelligence should be your mark and effort should be less of it. come on now, how successful you are at a certain job is determined by your quality of work. i don't give a shit if you are extremely smart, if that average kid puts out a better product than you he's doing better than you.
if you're extremely knowledgeable you should be doing better than the average kid if you are putting out the same effort. it sounds like homework still accounts for a chunk of your mark and that is dragging you down. why don't you just.. iunno.. do it if it's that easy. everyone has to do monotonous tasks, that's the effort part of it.
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On June 03 2012 01:47 sereniity wrote:
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
Basically, I feel that even if my english is good enough for grade A, I cannot achieve it unless I come to almost every class and do every piece of homework, even if I get very high scores on my tests. Is this right or wrong?
I think its reasonable to expect to not get an A if you don't do homework and do well on tests. What other way is there to measure your proficiency in the subject, if not for tests/homework/etc?
I will agree that many teachers (especially in lower level classes / high school) put too much weight in homeworks, but at the same time you shouldn't be getting an A if you don't do them at all.
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On June 03 2012 01:47 sereniity wrote:
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
Basically, I feel that even if my english is good enough for grade A, I cannot achieve it unless I come to almost every class and do every piece of homework, even if I get very high scores on my tests. Is this right or wrong?
In my own perfect world, a grade would reflect how a good a certain student is at said subject, not how much time dedicated into it. After all, when I'm looking for a job, my grades should show how good I am at said thing, not how nice I was in class. Just because I didn't come to every English class doesn't mean I wont come to work every day. I know a guy in my english class who is terrible at english, yet he's given grade C. The only reason for that is because he did his homework and was nice to the teacher.
Me on the other hand, had a grudge with the teacher (along with the rest of the class) and I've been having constant meetings with the principal to get ourselves a new teacher (she has a terrible attitude and constantly mocks us, has an aura of prestige as if we're crap and she's the best, yet she can't even spell the word boulder).
Anyway, back on topic, I'm getting an E this year because I basically haven't come to many of her lessons (I have about 60% attendance rate). I did however get a B on my final exams (called 'Nationella Proven' in Sweden).
Maybe this was abit off-topic, I got abit carried away :D...
I learned this hard way when I was like 10 years old. After that I've done 10grade worth things only on those things that I can be arsed to do. Other stuff I just put minimal effort or cheat. I've become really bitter with how school works.
Also having ADD makes school even more boring. Not like it's anyone elses fault tho.
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Odd my 6th grade teacher used to give 0's to students for not paying attention. He never got fired but he was a good a teacher. Self-esteem is just self-evaluation of how you did your work and they should feel bad if they deserve a zero. Oh well they should fight that but its up to them...
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The school system in Canada has become very wishy-washy over the past five years or so. Both of my parents have been teachers for around 30+ years. The entire education system has become a complete joke that my parents are both pretty sick and tired of it. Students have unlimited amount of time to hand in assignments from when they are assigned to the end of the term. This rule by the school board essentially is telling teachers not to set deadlines on their projects because students have whatever freedom they want.
My mother has wanted to fail many students in recent years, but, holding kids back without the parents permission is basically impossible so every kid basically gets a free ride through elementary and junior high. (You can fail high school).
All this is doing is setting up our society to be completely lazy, have no accountability, and letting kids do whatever they want. Never mind the fact after high school when they enter the real world for work, or go to University/College they get completely screwed over because they have no idea how hard it is to actually WORK. Just look at how many first year University/College kids drop out.. they flunk because they thought it would once again be an easy free ride.
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On June 03 2012 01:47 sereniity wrote:
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
Basically, I feel that even if my english is good enough for grade A, I cannot achieve it unless I come to almost every class and do every piece of homework, even if I get very high scores on my tests. Is this right or wrong?
In my own perfect world, a grade would reflect how a good a certain student is at said subject, not how much time dedicated into it. After all, when I'm looking for a job, my grades should show how good I am at said thing, not how nice I was in class. Just because I didn't come to every English class doesn't mean I wont come to work every day. I know a guy in my english class who is terrible at english, yet he's given grade C. The only reason for that is because he did his homework and was nice to the teacher.
Me on the other hand, had a grudge with the teacher (along with the rest of the class) and I've been having constant meetings with the principal to get ourselves a new teacher (she has a terrible attitude and constantly mocks us, has an aura of prestige as if we're crap and she's the best, yet she can't even spell the word boulder).
Anyway, back on topic, I'm getting an E this year because I basically haven't come to many of her lessons (I have about 60% attendance rate). I did however get a B on my final exams (called 'Nationella Proven' in Sweden).
Maybe this was abit off-topic, I got abit carried away :D...
That's a bit of a dicey question I think, since your grades should be a reflection of your knowledge, or maybe rather acquired knowledge. On the other hand how is anyone supposed to know if you're not there? My experience is a lot of courses are poorly structured as they require a lot of attendance in order to pass while the literature might be most of what you need to learn. In university courses attendance doesn't mean shit unless there are mandatory introduction lectures or seminars, but the your score on the exams are what counts. In high school thought most of what counts to your grade is done during classes together with exam results. Though in my experience nobody who skips out on a lot of classes aren't going to post a good result on exams or assignments.
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On June 03 2012 01:47 sereniity wrote:
As I go to school myself I find this a very interesting subject, a question I often bring up is "Are your grades a reflection of your knowledge/skill, or your work put into the class?"
back in the days when i was in school, i often felt like it was mostly a reflection of boobs
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EPT
