On September 27 2012 01:11 paralleluniverse wrote:
On September 27 2012 01:01 kmillz wrote:
On September 26 2012 23:39 Biff The Understudy wrote: [quote] I don't understand why people try to defend Romney on this one. He said what he really thought. You can agree with him, or you can find it plain disgusting, but trying to minnimize it as a "gaffe" doesn't make sense.
It's funny, I remember Bush saying to a group of billionaire "people call you the elite, I call you my base". What is very surprising is that Republicans get more than 1 or 2% votes. That's what weight the interests they represent in the demographic.
I don't understand why people trying to defend Obama on his "you didn't build that" quote. He said what he really thought. You can agree with him, or you can find it plain disgusting, but trying to minimize it as a "gaffe" doesn't make sense.
See how easy that was?
No, I don't think either person meant what they said. It is one-sided distortion of comments taken out of context in BOTH cases. You are completely ignorant if you actually don't realize that Romney was actually saying he doesn't care about trying to convince those people to vote for him. You hear what you want to hear, and what you want to hear is that Romney simply doesn't care about those people AT ALL.
This has already been hashed out and both sides in these forums have agreed that there is a spin on both comments.
What Obama said doesn't need defending. It's a self-evident truth.
If you own a business you didn't build the roads and bridges. Do you disagree with this obvious statement?
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
Neither statement needs defending.
Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine:
What Romney said was that 47% of people feel entitled to government handouts, and that he can't convince them to take personal responsibility. The Obama quote was taken out of context and even deceptively edited in the Republican convention to change it's meaning. Ironically, it was even plastered on the walls of the convention center, built with mostly government money. The Romney quote wasn't taken out of context, the context is in the video.
This is an actual fact, 47% of people actually pay no income tax.
True or false? Much of Romney's statement relies on assumptions about one demographic: The 47 percent of Americans who he says "pay no income tax." So is it true that 47 percent of Americans don't pay income tax? Essentially, yes, according to the the Tax Policy Center, which provides data showing that in 2011, 46.4 percent of American households paid no federal income tax. The same data shows, however, that nearly two-thirds of households that paid no income tax did pay payroll taxes. And most people also pay some combination of state, local, sales, gas and property taxes.
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
He summed up exactly what he was talking about if it wasn't clear enough.
On September 27 2012 02:18 Mazer wrote:
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
No I actually believe what I said, I am not lying to myself, and I think your opinion is disgusting too
Here's the summary:
"The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
You're an ignorant fool for buying into the "you didn't build that" spin. Cheers.
Sigh..quote me, in ANY of that saying anything that remotely implies that I "bought" into the "you didn't build that" spin. Read it more carefully:
I'll show you in bold print that I actually said just opposite:
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
That's not Romney's actual statement in full context though. What he said was (paraphrasing): 47% of people believe they are victims, that they are entitled to such and such, and will not take personal responsibility for their own lives. They vote for Obama and I could never get their vote.
That is blatantly incorrect, as we have proved over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Sorry, i just finished editting my post, please read (i included the full context, and do concede that the message is poorly articulated and actually kind of does sound bad)
Also, the whole point of my last message was to retort the notion I was buying into the "you didn't build that" nonsense.
And....FUCK YOU ROMNEY I HATE TRYING TO DEFEND YOU. It seriously feels like punching myself in the face.
Welcome to xDaunt's world. Republicans and conservatives deserved better this year, that's for damn sure.
On September 27 2012 01:11 paralleluniverse wrote:
On September 27 2012 01:01 kmillz wrote: [quote]
I don't understand why people trying to defend Obama on his "you didn't build that" quote. He said what he really thought. You can agree with him, or you can find it plain disgusting, but trying to minimize it as a "gaffe" doesn't make sense.
See how easy that was?
No, I don't think either person meant what they said. It is one-sided distortion of comments taken out of context in BOTH cases. You are completely ignorant if you actually don't realize that Romney was actually saying he doesn't care about trying to convince those people to vote for him. You hear what you want to hear, and what you want to hear is that Romney simply doesn't care about those people AT ALL.
This has already been hashed out and both sides in these forums have agreed that there is a spin on both comments.
What Obama said doesn't need defending. It's a self-evident truth.
If you own a business you didn't build the roads and bridges. Do you disagree with this obvious statement?
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
Neither statement needs defending.
Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine:
What Romney said was that 47% of people feel entitled to government handouts, and that he can't convince them to take personal responsibility. The Obama quote was taken out of context and even deceptively edited in the Republican convention to change it's meaning. Ironically, it was even plastered on the walls of the convention center, built with mostly government money. The Romney quote wasn't taken out of context, the context is in the video.
This is an actual fact, 47% of people actually pay no income tax.
True or false? Much of Romney's statement relies on assumptions about one demographic: The 47 percent of Americans who he says "pay no income tax." So is it true that 47 percent of Americans don't pay income tax? Essentially, yes, according to the the Tax Policy Center, which provides data showing that in 2011, 46.4 percent of American households paid no federal income tax. The same data shows, however, that nearly two-thirds of households that paid no income tax did pay payroll taxes. And most people also pay some combination of state, local, sales, gas and property taxes.
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
He summed up exactly what he was talking about if it wasn't clear enough.
On September 27 2012 02:18 Mazer wrote:
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
No I actually believe what I said, I am not lying to myself, and I think your opinion is disgusting too
Here's the summary:
"The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
You're an ignorant fool for buying into the "you didn't build that" spin. Cheers.
Sigh..quote me, in ANY of that saying anything that remotely implies that I "bought" into the "you didn't build that" spin. Read it more carefully:
I'll show you in bold print that I actually said just opposite:
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
That's not Romney's actual statement in full context though. What he said was (paraphrasing): 47% of people believe they are victims, that they are entitled to such and such, and will not take personal responsibility for their own lives. They vote for Obama and I could never get their vote.
That is blatantly incorrect, as we have proved over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Sorry, i just finished editting my post, please read (i included the full context, and do concede that the message is poorly articulated and actually kind of does sound bad)
Also, the whole point of my last message was to retort the notion I was buying into the "you didn't build that" nonsense.
And....FUCK YOU ROMNEY I HATE TRYING TO DEFEND YOU. It seriously feels like punching myself in the face.
Welcome to xDaunt's world. Republicans and conservatives deserved better this year, that's for damn sure.
Personal opinion, but no, I don't think Republicans deserved better this year. If you take a look at the other candidates of the Republican primary you can see what kind of wackjobs are leading the party. We all think Romney's a bad candidate, but just remember that he actually had to beat other leading figures to get the nomination.
I have never been partisan in my life before this election, and even supported Bush for re-election. The current Republican party is at an all-time low though. They deserve what they got. And now I'm a flaming liberal.
Well atleast we know the Jewish population is supporting Obama now over Romney, aren't Jewish people more often then not convservative.
Every generalization ever would say yes but the answer is HELL no.
Well I was just bringing up the point due to the financers of the ad and I thought I saw earlier in the thread that people where debating who the Jewish community will support.
On September 28 2012 04:00 RCMDVA wrote:
12 Jewish democratic Senators. 0 Republican
And offhand I think the only conservative Republican Jew is Eric Cantor in the House.
I didn't know your ratios for Jewish representation by party.
Thanks for the info.
A lot of Jewish Americans are liberal on social issues but aren't confident that Obama supports Israel enough. Then again when Netanyahu does stuff like drawing on his Batman cartoon bomb clip art at the U.N. this is probably less of an issue than it was in 2008.
What the fuck is this? Show n' Tell time? When did this turn into a kindergarten book report?
Well atleast we know the Jewish population is supporting Obama now over Romney, aren't Jewish people more often then not convservative.
Every generalization ever would say yes but the answer is HELL no.
Well I was just bringing up the point due to the financers of the ad and I thought I saw earlier in the thread that people where debating who the Jewish community will support.
On September 28 2012 04:00 RCMDVA wrote:
12 Jewish democratic Senators. 0 Republican
And offhand I think the only conservative Republican Jew is Eric Cantor in the House.
I didn't know your ratios for Jewish representation by party.
Thanks for the info.
A lot of Jewish Americans are liberal on social issues but aren't confident that Obama supports Israel enough. Then again when Netanyahu does stuff like drawing on his Batman cartoon bomb clip art at the U.N. this is probably less of an issue than it was in 2008.
What the fuck is this? Show n' Tell time? When did this turn into a kindergarten book report?
On September 27 2012 01:11 paralleluniverse wrote:
On September 27 2012 01:01 kmillz wrote:
On September 26 2012 23:39 Biff The Understudy wrote: [quote] I don't understand why people try to defend Romney on this one. He said what he really thought. You can agree with him, or you can find it plain disgusting, but trying to minnimize it as a "gaffe" doesn't make sense.
It's funny, I remember Bush saying to a group of billionaire "people call you the elite, I call you my base". What is very surprising is that Republicans get more than 1 or 2% votes. That's what weight the interests they represent in the demographic.
I don't understand why people trying to defend Obama on his "you didn't build that" quote. He said what he really thought. You can agree with him, or you can find it plain disgusting, but trying to minimize it as a "gaffe" doesn't make sense.
See how easy that was?
No, I don't think either person meant what they said. It is one-sided distortion of comments taken out of context in BOTH cases. You are completely ignorant if you actually don't realize that Romney was actually saying he doesn't care about trying to convince those people to vote for him. You hear what you want to hear, and what you want to hear is that Romney simply doesn't care about those people AT ALL.
This has already been hashed out and both sides in these forums have agreed that there is a spin on both comments.
What Obama said doesn't need defending. It's a self-evident truth.
If you own a business you didn't build the roads and bridges. Do you disagree with this obvious statement?
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
Neither statement needs defending.
Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine:
What Romney said was that 47% of people feel entitled to government handouts, and that he can't convince them to take personal responsibility. The Obama quote was taken out of context and even deceptively edited in the Republican convention to change it's meaning. Ironically, it was even plastered on the walls of the convention center, built with mostly government money. The Romney quote wasn't taken out of context, the context is in the video.
This is an actual fact, 47% of people actually pay no income tax.
True or false? Much of Romney's statement relies on assumptions about one demographic: The 47 percent of Americans who he says "pay no income tax." So is it true that 47 percent of Americans don't pay income tax? Essentially, yes, according to the the Tax Policy Center, which provides data showing that in 2011, 46.4 percent of American households paid no federal income tax. The same data shows, however, that nearly two-thirds of households that paid no income tax did pay payroll taxes. And most people also pay some combination of state, local, sales, gas and property taxes.
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
He summed up exactly what he was talking about if it wasn't clear enough.
On September 27 2012 02:18 Mazer wrote:
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
No I actually believe what I said, I am not lying to myself, and I think your opinion is disgusting too
Here's the summary:
"The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
You're an ignorant fool for buying into the "you didn't build that" spin. Cheers.
Sigh..quote me, in ANY of that saying anything that remotely implies that I "bought" into the "you didn't build that" spin. Read it more carefully:
I'll show you in bold print that I actually said just opposite:
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
That's not Romney's actual statement in full context though. What he said was (paraphrasing): 47% of people believe they are victims, that they are entitled to such and such, and will not take personal responsibility for their own lives. They vote for Obama and I could never get their vote.
That is blatantly incorrect, as we have proved over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Sorry, i just finished editting my post, please read (i included the full context, and do concede that the message is poorly articulated and actually kind of does sound bad)
Also, the whole point of my last message was to retort the notion I was buying into the "you didn't build that" nonsense.
And....FUCK YOU ROMNEY I HATE TRYING TO DEFEND YOU. It seriously feels like punching myself in the face.
I give you props for defending him this far.
On September 27 2012 17:39 kmillz wrote: I have to say I am humbled by alot of the talk on here and thank alot of you for some feedback on many issues, I feel more educated and while I still hope for a Romney win, I have learned alot from both sides and will strive to keep an open mind from now on. My primary concern in politics is to get less government involvement, fairness on all levels, and protecting our freedoms. I am not as optimistic about Romney winning as I was before, but if he doesn't win I hope Obama makes some postitive improvements for country and is willing to come up with something that can combat our struggling economy
As much as we disagree with each other on certain issues, I am glad that there are several pro-republicans in the topic defending their policies and pointing out the failings of democratic ones. Like it was mentioned before this topic has been incredibly informative and we've managed to cover every issue that's been looked at by the media and in so much more detail. Many other political sites just have pundits from both sides bashing each others' heads in without much civility. While there has been the occasional fiery exchange, the regulars here have by and large remained cool-headed and quite open to discussion.
Here's to hoping this topic has made us all a bit more cool-headed and willing to listen to the other side.
On September 27 2012 01:11 paralleluniverse wrote: [quote] What Obama said doesn't need defending. It's a self-evident truth.
If you own a business you didn't build the roads and bridges. Do you disagree with this obvious statement?
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
Neither statement needs defending.
Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine:
What Romney said was that 47% of people feel entitled to government handouts, and that he can't convince them to take personal responsibility. The Obama quote was taken out of context and even deceptively edited in the Republican convention to change it's meaning. Ironically, it was even plastered on the walls of the convention center, built with mostly government money. The Romney quote wasn't taken out of context, the context is in the video.
This is an actual fact, 47% of people actually pay no income tax.
True or false? Much of Romney's statement relies on assumptions about one demographic: The 47 percent of Americans who he says "pay no income tax." So is it true that 47 percent of Americans don't pay income tax? Essentially, yes, according to the the Tax Policy Center, which provides data showing that in 2011, 46.4 percent of American households paid no federal income tax. The same data shows, however, that nearly two-thirds of households that paid no income tax did pay payroll taxes. And most people also pay some combination of state, local, sales, gas and property taxes.
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
He summed up exactly what he was talking about if it wasn't clear enough.
On September 27 2012 02:18 Mazer wrote:
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
No I actually believe what I said, I am not lying to myself, and I think your opinion is disgusting too
Here's the summary:
"The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
You're an ignorant fool for buying into the "you didn't build that" spin. Cheers.
Sigh..quote me, in ANY of that saying anything that remotely implies that I "bought" into the "you didn't build that" spin. Read it more carefully:
I'll show you in bold print that I actually said just opposite:
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
That's not Romney's actual statement in full context though. What he said was (paraphrasing): 47% of people believe they are victims, that they are entitled to such and such, and will not take personal responsibility for their own lives. They vote for Obama and I could never get their vote.
That is blatantly incorrect, as we have proved over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Sorry, i just finished editting my post, please read (i included the full context, and do concede that the message is poorly articulated and actually kind of does sound bad)
Also, the whole point of my last message was to retort the notion I was buying into the "you didn't build that" nonsense.
And....FUCK YOU ROMNEY I HATE TRYING TO DEFEND YOU. It seriously feels like punching myself in the face.
Welcome to xDaunt's world. Republicans and conservatives deserved better this year, that's for damn sure.
Personal opinion, but no, I don't think Republicans deserved better this year. If you take a look at the other candidates of the Republican primary you can see what kind of wackjobs are leading the party. We all think Romney's a bad candidate, but just remember that he actually had to beat other leading figures to get the nomination.
I have never been partisan in my life before this election, and even supported Bush for re-election. The current Republican party is at an all-time low though. They deserve what they got. And now I'm a flaming liberal.
This. I consciously try to be even handed, but I still feel partisan despite it all. The currently republican party has become more polarizing than before. And the side effect is that there are a lot less people in the middle. At the root of it all, I think it's the whole "no compromise" thing they have going on. I know the counter-argument is that the Democrats have not moved right enough for compromise to be possible, but I have to agree to disagree with that. The problem is that if one side refuses to compromise, they can just claim the other side is not compromising enough with them (and this goes both ways).
On September 28 2012 05:43 Souma wrote: The media spins everything to hell but I think some things are deserving of it. I believe Romney's comment falls under that category, but that's my personal opinion.
It deserves scrutiny, but a fair analysis. Definitely not something I want to hear from the person I want to vote for.
Well atleast we know the Jewish population is supporting Obama now over Romney, aren't Jewish people more often then not convservative.
Every generalization ever would say yes but the answer is HELL no.
Well I was just bringing up the point due to the financers of the ad and I thought I saw earlier in the thread that people where debating who the Jewish community will support.
On September 28 2012 04:00 RCMDVA wrote:
12 Jewish democratic Senators. 0 Republican
And offhand I think the only conservative Republican Jew is Eric Cantor in the House.
I didn't know your ratios for Jewish representation by party.
Thanks for the info.
A lot of Jewish Americans are liberal on social issues but aren't confident that Obama supports Israel enough. Then again when Netanyahu does stuff like drawing on his Batman cartoon bomb clip art at the U.N. this is probably less of an issue than it was in 2008.
What the fuck is this? Show n' Tell time? When did this turn into a kindergarten book report?
Actually, this sends perhaps the strongest message against Iran in a long time.
Regardless of whether you agree with this red line, there's no doubt that this is an effective message.
Michael Tomasky found a hilarious poll that gives us insight into the 'moderate', independent mind.
Fascinating little poll came out from Survey USA exclusively of Seattle Seahawks fans, asking them if they thought the big play was an interception or a touchdown.
A plurality said interception, which got some headlines because it was Seattle fans saying it (and thus going against their team, which benefited from the shite call). But here's what caught my beady eye.
The poll asked people to identify themselves as liberal, moderate, or conservative. Interestingly, liberals and conservatives were in basic agreement that it was an interception not a completed pass: liberals by 53-31, conservatives by 52-29. But moderates came out even: pick 39, completion 38.
Honestly. Can't these people take a stand on anything? It's a good reminder that these swing voters, touted as a great Holy Grail every four years whose pulse it is so crucially important for candidates to catch and understand, are often just people who don't know much about anything or have opinions about anything.
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
Neither statement needs defending.
Since you edited your post, I'll edit mine:
[quote]
This is an actual fact, 47% of people actually pay no income tax.
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me — because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. (Applause.)
If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.
The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
He summed up exactly what he was talking about if it wasn't clear enough.
On September 27 2012 02:18 Mazer wrote:
You're just lying to yourself over this one and it's kinda disgusting.
No I actually believe what I said, I am not lying to myself, and I think your opinion is disgusting too
Here's the summary:
"The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”
You're an ignorant fool for buying into the "you didn't build that" spin. Cheers.
Sigh..quote me, in ANY of that saying anything that remotely implies that I "bought" into the "you didn't build that" spin. Read it more carefully:
I'll show you in bold print that I actually said just opposite:
Actual statement: If you own a business, you didn't build that Actual meaning: If you own a business, you didn't build the roads, bridges, etc.. Actual statement: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about those people. Actual meaning: There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. My job is not to worry about getting those peoples votes
That's not Romney's actual statement in full context though. What he said was (paraphrasing): 47% of people believe they are victims, that they are entitled to such and such, and will not take personal responsibility for their own lives. They vote for Obama and I could never get their vote.
That is blatantly incorrect, as we have proved over and over and over and over and over and over again.
Sorry, i just finished editting my post, please read (i included the full context, and do concede that the message is poorly articulated and actually kind of does sound bad)
Also, the whole point of my last message was to retort the notion I was buying into the "you didn't build that" nonsense.
And....FUCK YOU ROMNEY I HATE TRYING TO DEFEND YOU. It seriously feels like punching myself in the face.
Welcome to xDaunt's world. Republicans and conservatives deserved better this year, that's for damn sure.
Personal opinion, but no, I don't think Republicans deserved better this year. If you take a look at the other candidates of the Republican primary you can see what kind of wackjobs are leading the party. We all think Romney's a bad candidate, but just remember that he actually had to beat other leading figures to get the nomination.
I have never been partisan in my life before this election, and even supported Bush for re-election. The current Republican party is at an all-time low though. They deserve what they got. And now I'm a flaming liberal.
This. I consciously try to be even handed, but I still feel partisan despite it all. The currently republican party has become more polarizing than before. And the side effect is that there are a lot less people in the middle. At the root of it all, I think it's the whole "no compromise" thing they have going on. I know the counter-argument is that the Democrats have not moved right enough for compromise to be possible, but I have to agree to disagree with that. The problem is that if one side refuses to compromise, they can just claim the other side is not compromising enough with them (and this goes both ways).
Well put, one thing i hate about the party of no is there is no way in hell that will accept anything the resembles compromise and then put up there own bills that are just as partisan and complain when the democrats do the same thing thing. I mean i guess they believe they can have one's cake and eat it too. I think the party is moving to far to the right, i dont think i have ever met a Republican that is as far right as most of those that are in congress.
Well atleast we know the Jewish population is supporting Obama now over Romney, aren't Jewish people more often then not convservative.
Every generalization ever would say yes but the answer is HELL no.
Well I was just bringing up the point due to the financers of the ad and I thought I saw earlier in the thread that people where debating who the Jewish community will support.
On September 28 2012 04:00 RCMDVA wrote:
12 Jewish democratic Senators. 0 Republican
And offhand I think the only conservative Republican Jew is Eric Cantor in the House.
I didn't know your ratios for Jewish representation by party.
Thanks for the info.
A lot of Jewish Americans are liberal on social issues but aren't confident that Obama supports Israel enough. Then again when Netanyahu does stuff like drawing on his Batman cartoon bomb clip art at the U.N. this is probably less of an issue than it was in 2008.
What the fuck is this? Show n' Tell time? When did this turn into a kindergarten book report?
Actually, this sends perhaps the strongest message against Iran in a long time.
Regardless of whether you agree with this red line, there's no doubt that this is an effective message.
Wow...they are 70%? I can't believe how time has flown..I remember a few years back reading about how they were at about 27%, exceeding the amount of uranium enrichment needed, as Ahmadinejad claimed, for medical isotopes. Now they are at 70%? As if it wasn't obvious a few years ago...we are looking at some serious shit coming up soon.
Fascinating little poll came out from Survey USA exclusively of Seattle Seahawks fans, asking them if they thought the big play was an interception or a touchdown.
A plurality said interception, which got some headlines because it was Seattle fans saying it (and thus going against their team, which benefited from the shite call). But here's what caught my beady eye.
The poll asked people to identify themselves as liberal, moderate, or conservative. Interestingly, liberals and conservatives were in basic agreement that it was an interception not a completed pass: liberals by 53-31, conservatives by 52-29. But moderates came out even: pick 39, completion 38.
Honestly. Can't these people take a stand on anything? It's a good reminder that these swing voters, touted as a great Holy Grail every four years whose pulse it is so crucially important for candidates to catch and understand, are often just people who don't know much about anything or have opinions about anything.
People who identify themselves as moderates are not the people politicians go for. Those people usually don't even vote.
People who identify their party as independent are the people that the 2 parties always try to get on their side. Interestingly enough, in that same poll they asked people who affiliated themselves as Democratic, Republican or Independent, and Independent people by far had the strongest opinion of either of the 3, 59% saying the packers intercepted it.
I think after the first debate Romney is going to jump ahead and will never lose the lead. Obama was a terrible choice in 2008 and is an even worse choice now.
On September 28 2012 10:21 Darknat wrote: I think after the first debate Romney is going to jump ahead and will never lose the lead. Obama was a terrible choice in 2008 and is an even worse choice now.
I agree. I mean, look at this picture of Romney.
He is literally glowing with the righteous power of Christ. This is our SIGN, America! Don't reelect obongo! Romney/Ryan 2012!
On September 28 2012 10:21 Darknat wrote: I think after the first debate Romney is going to jump ahead and will never lose the lead. Obama was a terrible choice in 2008 and is an even worse choice now.
In what world do you live in ? It doesn't seem to be reality ... Romney is a terrible candidate . Is Obama a good choice ? Maybe , maybe not but Romney is ten times worse at the least. Everytime i hear him talk or even see him i wanna puke. He's the embodiment of corporate america and whats wrong with politics/politicians.
On September 28 2012 10:37 GT350 wrote: Romney is even worse than Palin. He's been digging his own political grave even deeper with each interview and speech he gives.
EPT
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