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On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.
And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.
On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now?
Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.
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On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.
He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.
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On April 21 2012 15:56 Jisall wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 14:46 TheToast wrote:On April 21 2012 14:32 CajunMan wrote:On April 21 2012 13:44 CaucasianAsian wrote:
??????/
The Philippines are a sovereign nation We did own the Philippines from the 1800s till the 1940s and we still own Guam. Close enough lol its 1:30 am. We don't "own" Guam. It's a territory of the United States with it's own democratically elected government and representation in the US Congress. If they wanted independence, it's unlikely that the US government would stop them; though it's equally unlikely that they would choose that option. They pay no federal taxes of any kind and in return get defense from the world's strongest military, US financial aid, and ties to the world's largest economy. In short: the world's sweetest deal ever. I don't think Guam has reps in the U.S. congress. Porte Rico is also a territory and they do not have reps either. They do not get to vote in exchange for not paying taxes is the deal they have made. Other then that they are a U.S. Territory and can become a state at any time.
They do have a representative in the US House, though they are a non-voting member. I still count that as representation.
On April 21 2012 16:34 Mordanis wrote:
In my life, I've gone from social conservative to plain conservative to libertarian. I've clearly never even really thought that I'd ever vote for a democrat, but this election is such a mess that I have no idea what I'm going to end up doing. What's Romney going to do? I have no clue. Not even a clue of a clue. I think the man is so desperate to become President that he has no idea of what he'd do once he got in office. What's Obama going to do? I have no fucking clue. The only things he's really done is pass the new health-care law and the Wall St. regulating bill, as well as the buck. I had high hopes he would bring some new freedoms to our personal lives, but the only thing he's done even remotely like that was saying that he would not pass SOPA. I really wish I could vote for someone else, but the only people who would even think about running against them would be even more crazy. TT
My guess is you are one of those people who think you're a libertarian but you really aren't. No real libertarian would seriously consider voting for Obama, considering under his administration we have seen one of the greatest expansions of government in US history; over 1000 new federal regulations, $5 trillion in new US debt, drastic expansions of the powers of federal bureaus like the TSA, a government take over of the student loan system, and a new law where the government can force US citizens to buy insurance.
I remind you that true libertarians are people who want minimal possible governance and minimal possible taxes. If you support Obama, trust me, you are no libertarian lol.
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On April 22 2012 01:31 Roe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:22 xDaunt wrote:On April 22 2012 01:02 Roe wrote:On April 22 2012 00:51 xDaunt wrote:On April 22 2012 00:48 Roe wrote:On April 22 2012 00:30 xDaunt wrote:On April 21 2012 16:43 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On April 21 2012 16:40 Vessel wrote:On April 21 2012 11:50 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:On April 21 2012 11:40 CajunMan wrote:
[quote]
The problem with that is only about 8% of the US don't believe in a god of some kid and even more believe in other stuff (voodoo, etc) So really your stuck in the same boat as a lot of people I wish there was a viable Libertarian and fiscal conservative but it ain't gonna happen. I'm trying to find the article that was posted a couple of days ago about Atheism is risisng in the U.S. faster than those being converted. This group, sometimes collectively labeled the "Nones," is growing faster than any religious faith in the U.S. About two thirds of Nones say they are former believers; 24 percent are lapsed Catholics and 29 percent once identified with other Christian denominations. If growth continues at the current rate, one in four Americans will profess no religious faith within 20 years. Silverman hopes that as nonbelief spreads, atheists can become a "legitimate political segment of the American population," afforded the same protections as religious groups and ethnic minorities. But he's not advocating a complete secular takeover of the U.S. — nor would he be likely to achieve one, given the abiding religious faith of most Americans. SourceEDIT: Found it. Someone please correct me if I am wrong because it is late, but isn't one of the indicators that the end of the world is imminent when a non-believer is elected into office? Seems like the religious right is already armed against an atheist president if their holy book tells them that it will signal the end of the world. I may be wrong, it is late and I am tired. I would think that if an Atheist President was elected the majority of the country would be secular, nonbeliever etc. and rightfully view those that aren't as nut jobs. So everyone who is religious is a nutjob? Nice. I was under the impression you could be secular (separation of church and state) while being religious personally. That's debatable, but you should agree the person you quoted could believe this. No, he clearly doesn't because he also included the word "nonbeliever." It is bigotry on parade. It's your own bias on parade. He said people who aren't secularists, nonbelievers etc. are nut jobs. I'm sure you can understand the logical implication of that sentence being "secularists or nonbelievers or...etc." My bias on parade? This coming from a guy who won't even accurately state what was said despite it being in writing? First, you omit the term "nonbeliever." Now you are rewriting what he said by inserting "or's" where there were none before. What you're doing goes well-beyond mere spin and interpretation at this point. It's outright misrepresentation. I was under the impression you were talking only about the secular part because I didn't think anyone could make a mistake like you did, but I guess I was wrong. If you understand any bit of logic you should know why I put the "or" in there. And really, enough of this xDaunt. You try your hardest to spin things to a conservative bias but end up nothing more than a fool.
Haha, please, this is ridiculous. Here's the full statement again for your review because I'm not sure that you're even looking at it:
"I would think that if an Atheist President was elected the majority of the country would be secular, nonbeliever etc. and rightfully view those that aren't as nut jobs."
Let me make this really easy and break down the phrase in bold and give you a lesson in grammar at the same time:
Here's the subject of the sentence: "the majority of the country"
Here is the first verb: "would be," which is a form of "is" or "to be" in its infinitive form
Here is the first predicate adjective that describes the subject of the sentence: "secular"
Here is the second predicate adjective that describes the subject of the sentence: "nonbeliever" (arguably this is a predicate nominative, ie a noun, but that's okay)
Here is the second verb: "view" (ie a majority of the country view[s])
Here is the adverb modifying "view": "rightfully"
Here is the object of the second verb (what is being viewed): "those"
Here is an adjective phrase describing "those": "that aren't" Clearly what those "arent" in this sentence is "secular, nonbeliever, etc"
And finally, here is the simile at the end describing "those that aren't": "as nutjobs."
So let me omit the first phrase and rewrite the second phrase to make it really easy to understand what the problem is:
"The majority of the country would rightfully view those that aren't secular, nonbeliever, etc, as nutjobs."
I don't even understand why you're bothering to defend what was said. It's not like it's any secret that there is probably a majority of people on TL who hold this view (I'd bet that you're included). I personally don't even find the statement to be offensive so much as I find it amusing -- particularly because it came from a mod. Imagine if someone said any one of the following: "All atheists are nutjobs." "All democrats are nutjobs." "All liberals are nutjobs." Does anyone really doubt that nothing short of a warning would be issued? This is why I pointed the original statement out.
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On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now? Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.
No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).
Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.
edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.
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On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.
Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...
So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure
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Saying you're a christian is mandatory, if you want to be president. The american people would never vote for an open atheist.
Saying you're a mormon is weird even by american standards, you put yourself in the crossfire for no reason. So yes, chances are he is an actual mormon believer.
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On April 22 2012 01:43 squanzo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Okay, I can almost guarantee that I will be "warned" for this post. But let's look at something very interesting here.
A poster, on the front page, wrote the following:
"Dear America,
Vote Obama
Sincerely,
Rest of the fucking world."
Which is supposedly entirely acceptable among the guidelines on the first page.
First, let's review the first page guidelines.
1) Civility, please.
2) Keep the hyperbole to a dull roar.
3) Keep the thread on topic. This is about Obama vs Romney in the US Presidential Election. Please avoid talking about people who will not be on the ballot in November. Talk about these people elsewhere.
4) Fact check.
First of all, nobody is sure who will "be on the ballot in November"
So let's do some "Fact checks"
There's going to be a brokered convention. Romney does not have enough delegates to claim he's the running candidate for Republican office. Fact. Therefore, we cannot be sure who will be on the ballot in November. *I* could be on the ballot come November. Therefore, talking about guys like Ron Paul, is talking about someone who may potentially be on the ballot *just like Romney* and is very much in the debate of Obama vs Romney. In fact, a lot of Romney's potential votes come from people who support Ron Paul, just like a lot of Obama's potential votes come from people who support Ron Paul.
The point is, it's ignorant to allow posts like "Vote Obama, Sincerely, Rest of the fucking world"
and then "warn" people who post, and I quote:
pntcrzy United States. April 21 2012 08:20. Posts 3 PM Profile Quote #
Ron Paul
User was warned for this post
Also, since we're on the subject of ignorance, let's look at someone who was temped banned for saying quote:
MCMXVI April 21 2012 07:41. Posts 1027 PM Profile Quote #
A vote for Obama is a vote for Goldman Sachs. Great way to waste your vote!
User was temp banned for this post.
Let's go back to your own guidelines, modbots:
1) Civility, please. (More civil then "sincerely, rest of the fucking world")
2) Keep the hyperbole to a dull roar. (ok - "rest of the fucking world" isn't a hyperbole, I guess /s)
3) Keep the thread on topic. This is about Obama vs Romney in the US Presidential Election. Please avoid talking about people who will not be on the ballot in November. Talk about these people elsewhere. (is about Obama)
4) Fact check. (It's a fact)
Obama's biggest campaign contributors:
1. University of California $1,648,685
2. Goldman Sachs $1,013,091
3. Harvard University $878,164
How's that for some fact checking.
I can do this all day. Seriously. I won't though. Probably because I'll be temp banned. Work your magic bots. I'm being civil, not using hyperbole's, talking about Obama vs Romney, and checking my facts. I'll be waiting.
This thread is being led along like a toddler, and what you speak of...is not part of the gameplan. Before you get red on your face. This will console you if your cold and lonely tonight. Makes me warm and fuzzy after reading this full thread, just like the Repub Nom thread, and the Occupy Thread before that.
+ Show Spoiler +http://demonocracy.info/infographics/usa/derivatives/bank_exposure.html
It mentions that thing of which you speak, and drives home a ridiculous point. I say ridiculous because it's taking how long drive the point home to partisians and antagonists alike. Your guy, their guy. Lately, same guy. Opensecrets.org is pretty plain spoken.
Edit : Spoiler'd quote
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i'm voting for then only serious candidate, barack obama. if ron paul was serious and not a bigot, i might even consider sinking that low.
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Holy crap, out of all the things that are wrong with Romney, people are bashing him for being a mormon?
Mormonism isn't any more ridiculous than any other section of Christianity. Please, leave the religious intolerance to the Republicans. You're making all liberals look bad.
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On April 22 2012 01:43 squanzo wrote:
Okay, I can almost guarantee that I will be "warned" for this post. But let's look at something very interesting here.
A poster, on the front page, wrote the following:
"Dear America,
Vote Obama
Sincerely,
Rest of the fucking world."
Which is supposedly entirely acceptable among the guidelines on the first page.
First, let's review the first page guidelines.
1) Civility, please.
2) Keep the hyperbole to a dull roar.
3) Keep the thread on topic. This is about Obama vs Romney in the US Presidential Election. Please avoid talking about people who will not be on the ballot in November. Talk about these people elsewhere.
4) Fact check.
First of all, nobody is sure who will "be on the ballot in November"
So let's do some "Fact checks"
There's going to be a brokered convention. Romney does not have enough delegates to claim he's the running candidate for Republican office. Fact. Therefore, we cannot be sure who will be on the ballot in November. *I* could be on the ballot come November. Therefore, talking about guys like Ron Paul, is talking about someone who may potentially be on the ballot *just like Romney* and is very much in the debate of Obama vs Romney. In fact, a lot of Romney's potential votes come from people who support Ron Paul, just like a lot of Obama's potential votes come from people who support Ron Paul.
The point is, it's ignorant to allow posts like "Vote Obama, Sincerely, Rest of the fucking world"
and then "warn" people who post, and I quote:
pntcrzy United States. April 21 2012 08:20. Posts 3 PM Profile Quote #
Ron Paul
User was warned for this post
Also, since we're on the subject of ignorance, let's look at someone who was temped banned for saying quote:
MCMXVI April 21 2012 07:41. Posts 1027 PM Profile Quote #
A vote for Obama is a vote for Goldman Sachs. Great way to waste your vote!
User was temp banned for this post.
Let's go back to your own guidelines, modbots:
1) Civility, please. (More civil then "sincerely, rest of the fucking world")
2) Keep the hyperbole to a dull roar. (ok - "rest of the fucking world" isn't a hyperbole, I guess /s)
3) Keep the thread on topic. This is about Obama vs Romney in the US Presidential Election. Please avoid talking about people who will not be on the ballot in November. Talk about these people elsewhere. (is about Obama)
4) Fact check. (It's a fact)
Obama's biggest campaign contributors:
1. University of California $1,648,685
2. Goldman Sachs $1,013,091
3. Harvard University $878,164
How's that for some fact checking.
I can do this all day. Seriously. I won't though. Probably because I'll be temp banned. Work your magic bots. I'm being civil, not using hyperbole's, talking about Obama vs Romney, and checking my facts. I'll be waiting.
QFT, thanks for running the facts. I'm glad you're on this thread to put some sense in.
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On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now? Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions. No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush). Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles. edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.
Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)
On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.
So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.
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On April 22 2012 02:07 Josealtron wrote:
Holy crap, out of all the things that are wrong with Romney, people are bashing him for being a mormon?
Mormonism isn't any more ridiculous than any other section of Christianity. Please, leave the religious intolerance to the Republicans. You're making all liberals look bad.
No it actually isn't. I personally dislike any organized religion, but mormonism is so extreme and so sect-like that it makes it by far worse.
And you still didn't get my point: I don't trust his judgment.
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On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith... So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure
If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.
Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.
Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.
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as usual both choices are terrible. Not going to even bother voting.
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On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now? Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions. No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush). Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles. edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here. Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.) Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier. So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.
You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.
Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.
What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage
There's a start to the list.
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On April 22 2012 00:57 darthfoley wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 00:36 storkfan wrote:On April 21 2012 23:53 Drakon wrote:I vote Dr. Ron Paul, im suprised with us all on the internet it should be really easy for everyone to do a lil research and see that he is the best candidate. Oh yeah, and get off some of those mainstream websites  you might have heard of the black out of ron paul. plus he has some of the most amazing youtube vids lol. www.dailypaul.com agreed Ron Paul 2012, the only reasonable option Lol this blind ron paul love makes me head hurt. Ron Paul is about 50% reasonable and the other 50 insane. He's way too utopian, and unfortunately his econ policies would be detrimental to almost all americans.
oh how on earth would we survive if the federal reserve did not inflate us into malinvestment fueled booms and destroy our living standards with inflation. how did people survive before this wonderful invention..
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On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now? Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions. No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush). Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles. edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here. Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.) On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier. So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse. You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again. Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president. What issues you ask? -Immigration -Women's choice -Gay marriage There's a start to the list.
IMO if you choose to murder an innocent baby, you should also choose to go to jail. you have a problem with this?
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On April 22 2012 02:24 storkfan wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world. Make sense now? Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions. No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush). Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles. edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here. Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.) On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church. I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith. We are still talking about politicians, right? In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades. Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality. Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck. The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency. Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill. Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13. Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons. I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal. And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not. The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage. He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier. So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse. You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again. Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president. What issues you ask? -Immigration -Women's choice -Gay marriage There's a start to the list. IMO if you choose to murder an innocent baby, you should also choose to go to jail. you have a problem with this?
You know how I stand already. If you would like to argue about pro-choice/pro-life, feel free to PM me so we don't derail the thread.
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On April 19 2012 18:24 murphs wrote:
Dear America,
Vote Obama.
Sincerely,
Rest of the fucking world.
Agreed, from France 
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EPT
