• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:33
CEST 14:33
KST 21:33
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview17Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic7
Community News
FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event13Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster12Weekly Cups (June 16-22): Clem strikes back1Weekly Cups (June 9-15): herO doubles on GSL week4Firefly suspended by EWC, replaced by Lancer12
StarCraft 2
General
The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation How to Recover Stolen Bitcoin: Why Recuva Hacker S Hybrid setting keep reverting. HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview Esports World Cup 2025 - Final Player Roster
Tourneys
HomeStory Cup 27 (June 27-29) FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event $200 Biweekly - StarCraft Evolution League #1 SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] Darkgrid Layout
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Unit and Spell Similarities BW General Discussion NaDa's Body Soma Explains: JaeDong's Defense vs Bisu
Tourneys
[BSL20] ProLeague LB Final - Saturday 20:00 CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [ASL19] Grand Finals
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Trading/Investing Thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
NBA General Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Game Sound vs. Music: The Im…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 644 users

President Obama Re-Elected - Page 46

Forum Index > General Forum
Post a Reply
Prev 1 44 45 46 47 48 1504 Next
Hey guys! We'll be closing this thread shortly, but we will make an American politics megathread where we can continue the discussions in here.

The new thread can be found here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=383301
Deleted User 124618
Profile Joined November 2010
1142 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 17:37:13
April 21 2012 17:35 GMT
#901
As an outsider to US politics, I am slightly disturbed that everyone takes it as granted that the president is either (D) or (R). There are plenty of candidates:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Third_party_and_independent_candidates

But yeah, if I was a US citizen, I would vote Obama so who am I to talk?
mynameisgreat11
Profile Joined February 2012
599 Posts
April 21 2012 17:37 GMT
#902
On April 22 2012 02:35 Greentellon wrote:
As an outsider to US politics, I am slightly disturbed that everyone takes it as granted that the president is either (D) or (R). There are plenty of candidates:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Third_party_and_independent_candidates

But yeah, if I was a US citizen, I *would* vote Obama so who am I to talk?


It is a fact the president is either (D) or (R). Sad but true.
Papulatus
Profile Joined July 2010
United States669 Posts
April 21 2012 17:39 GMT
#903
On April 22 2012 02:35 Greentellon wrote:
As an outsider to US politics, I am slightly disturbed that everyone takes it as granted that the president is either (D) or (R). There are plenty of candidates:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Third_party_and_independent_candidates

But yeah, if I was a US citizen, I would vote Obama so who am I to talk?


Would be great if third parties could gain strength in our political system but unfortunately they don't have anywhere near the money or influence that the republicans or democrats have.
4 Corners in a day.
Etrnity
Profile Joined November 2010
United States88 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 17:41:28
April 21 2012 17:40 GMT
#904
On April 22 2012 02:35 Greentellon wrote:
As an outsider to US politics, I am slightly disturbed that everyone takes it as granted that the president is either (D) or (R). There are plenty of candidates:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Third_party_and_independent_candidates

But yeah, if I was a US citizen, I would vote Obama so who am I to talk?


First past the post system tends to provide one party or another with control in a country, and two main parties overall. Since we don't have a proportional representative parliament, this is why. Pretty easy to understand. Just open a wiki on it.

EDIT: Clarification
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 17:41:24
April 21 2012 17:40 GMT
#905
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.
CajunMan
Profile Joined July 2010
United States823 Posts
April 21 2012 17:43 GMT
#906
On April 22 2012 02:30 PlaGuE_R wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 19 2012 18:24 murphs wrote:
Dear America,

Vote Obama.

Sincerely,
Rest of the fucking world.


Agreed, from France


Aren't you guys about to elect a socialist? I'm sure you'd love Obama lul.
Etrnity
Profile Joined November 2010
United States88 Posts
April 21 2012 17:45 GMT
#907
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.


User was warned for this post
mynameisgreat11
Profile Joined February 2012
599 Posts
April 21 2012 17:50 GMT
#908
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


My personal experiences with Mormonism make me think that I am right in saying that Romney has a stronger affiliation with his faith than Obama.

Neither one of us can definitively say how strong either one's convictions are. All we see are what is presented to us by media. What we think about this specific issue cannot be anything beyond speculation. So, my opinion in my first sentence of this post is just that, an opinion.
mynameisgreat11
Profile Joined February 2012
599 Posts
April 21 2012 17:51 GMT
#909
On April 22 2012 02:45 Etrnity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.


There. Proof that God loves everybody. Unless you're not Christian.

User was warned for this post
frogrubdown
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
1266 Posts
April 21 2012 18:00 GMT
#910
On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.

On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.



No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world.

Make sense now?


Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.



No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).

Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.

edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.


Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)

On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.


He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.




So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.


You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.

Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.

What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage

There's a start to the list.


I don't understand your point. It's not like Romney publicly expresses the right views on these issues with you suspecting that that is just a ploy to disguise his real, Mormon positions. He is open about exactly where he stands on them, and it is roughly the same place as most of the rest of his party (if not slightly better). So why do you even have to consider his Mormonism instead of just looking directly to his views?
mynameisgreat11
Profile Joined February 2012
599 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 18:03:01
April 21 2012 18:02 GMT
#911
On April 22 2012 03:00 frogrubdown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.

On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.



No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world.

Make sense now?


Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.



No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).

Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.

edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.


Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)

On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.


He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.




So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.


You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.

Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.

What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage

There's a start to the list.


I don't understand your point. It's not like Romney publicly expresses the right views on these issues with you suspecting that that is just a ploy to disguise his real, Mormon positions. He is open about exactly where he stands on them, and it is roughly the same place as most of the rest of his party (if not slightly better). So why do you even have to consider his Mormonism instead of just looking directly to his views?


He was raised and is active in a community of people whose beliefs I find offensive. Just because other republicans hold similar views, and are not mormon, doesn't make me feel any different about him.
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 18:10:40
April 21 2012 18:08 GMT
#912
On April 22 2012 02:45 Etrnity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.

When Christ speaks of the poor and the young, never does he qualify his statement by saying "only the chosen". Jesus gave the bread both to the "children" and the "dogs". If the final hand of justice truly is at the hand of God, then you too, then are in no position to judge those outside of the church. That right is in God alone.

Futhermore, if philosophy and theology are to be separate, as both the neo-orthodoxy and the philosophers have argued for, then there is always to be a secular space so that deference can be given to both. What both the fundamentalists and the liberal Protestants don't seem to understand is that the separation is necessary for both.

edit: I don't even understand the point of your entire post as a reply to mine. Liberation theology is still rooted within a Christian context.
frogrubdown
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
1266 Posts
April 21 2012 18:10 GMT
#913
On April 22 2012 03:02 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 03:00 frogrubdown wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

[quote]
We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.

On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

[quote]
We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.



No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world.

Make sense now?


Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.



No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).

Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.

edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.


Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)

On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

[quote]
We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.


He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.




So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.


You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.

Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.

What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage

There's a start to the list.


I don't understand your point. It's not like Romney publicly expresses the right views on these issues with you suspecting that that is just a ploy to disguise his real, Mormon positions. He is open about exactly where he stands on them, and it is roughly the same place as most of the rest of his party (if not slightly better). So why do you even have to consider his Mormonism instead of just looking directly to his views?


He was raised and is active in a community of people whose beliefs I find offensive. Just because other republicans hold similar views, and are not mormon, doesn't make me feel any different about him.


Nothing I said was supposed to change your opinion about Romney. I'm just saying that his being a Mormon gives you no additional information on how detestable his views are on the issues you care about because he openly expresses views that are detestable in that area and they are the views you would expect any Republican to hold. Knowing he is a Mormon shouldn't add anything to your confidence that he holds detestable views, because you already know what those exact views are.
Velocirapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States983 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-21 18:15:23
April 21 2012 18:14 GMT
#914
On April 22 2012 03:00 frogrubdown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.

On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.



No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world.

Make sense now?


Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.



No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).

Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.

edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.


Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)

On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.


He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.




So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.


You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.

Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.

What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage

There's a start to the list.


I don't understand your point. It's not like Romney publicly expresses the right views on these issues with you suspecting that that is just a ploy to disguise his real, Mormon positions. He is open about exactly where he stands on them, and it is roughly the same place as most of the rest of his party (if not slightly better). So why do you even have to consider his Mormonism instead of just looking directly to his views?


I think both sides of this argument are talking about different things. People who feel it isnt an issue are basically saying that his relationship to God is irrelevant since it has not shown up excessively in his policies. People who are saying it is an issue are not talking about that relationship at all but instead about his relationship with other Mormons who are known as largely invested in a literal interpretation of scripture and ecclesiastic hierarchy.

Basically the real question is, do personal associations matter?
mynameisgreat11
Profile Joined February 2012
599 Posts
April 21 2012 18:16 GMT
#915
On April 22 2012 03:10 frogrubdown wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 03:02 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 03:00 frogrubdown wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:20 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:08 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:56 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
[quote]

In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.

On April 22 2012 01:45 Zoesan wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
[quote]

In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.



No, I just think that anyone faithful to mormonism has serious problems making logical decisions and seriously impaired judgment. Thus I don't want that person to become the most powerful man in the world.

Make sense now?


Can you provide examples of his bad decisions and impaired judgement? Because that's what I'm asking. If he really does these things then you should be listing them and explaining why they are bad. Instead you're just tying in Mormonism as illogical, without showing how Romney has been illogical, or how Mormonism has lead him to those actions.



No I can't. I'm afraid for what's to come, because every candidate makes sure that people like him before the vote, that doesn't stop them from doing retarded things once elected (hi bush).

Thus: I distrust him because in my experience any person belonging to something as weird as mormonism (and I know quite a few) to be lacking a couple of marbles.

edit: on second thought, there are a couple of things where I facepalmed IRL, but I can't really remember what they were. If I find them I'll post them here.


Why didn't he do things when he was Governor of Massachusetts then? Or is this some mass mormon conspiracy to get one of them elected so they can turn the country towards new zionism? You do realize that the president doesn't pass laws right? If he proposes some "crazy mormon idea" then the liberals and the conservatives are just going to strike it down and he's going to look like an idiot. (Because a majority of them are protestant/catholic, and they don't want to alienate their bases.)

On April 22 2012 01:49 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:45 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
[quote]

In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


And has Romney said that blacks and women cannot hold positions of power? Is Romney married to a 13 year old? No he's not.
The only one of these you could make a legitimate claim about is him being against gay marriage, (I don't think he donated specifically to block Prop 8 though), and that's fine...but wait...Obama is also against gay marriage.


He's a grown man, who makes his own decisions, and he chooses to be a prominent member of an organization that I find immoral, for the reasons I stated earlier.




So you care more about a persons religious preference then their policies or ideas? I'm sorry but that just sounds like a really weak excuse.


You're ignoring me, but I'll say it again.

Mitt Romney chooses to lead his life as an active and prominent member of the LDS church. I believe the LDS church is immoral, and I believe its immoral to be an active and willing supporter of what they do. I believe his stance on issues will reflect those of the LDS church. Therefore, I don't want him to be president.

What issues you ask?
-Immigration
-Women's choice
-Gay marriage

There's a start to the list.


I don't understand your point. It's not like Romney publicly expresses the right views on these issues with you suspecting that that is just a ploy to disguise his real, Mormon positions. He is open about exactly where he stands on them, and it is roughly the same place as most of the rest of his party (if not slightly better). So why do you even have to consider his Mormonism instead of just looking directly to his views?


He was raised and is active in a community of people whose beliefs I find offensive. Just because other republicans hold similar views, and are not mormon, doesn't make me feel any different about him.


Nothing I said was supposed to change your opinion about Romney. I'm just saying that his being a Mormon gives you no additional information on how detestable his views are on the issues you care about because he openly expresses views that are detestable in that area and they are the views you would expect any Republican to hold. Knowing he is a Mormon shouldn't add anything to your confidence that he holds detestable views, because you already know what those exact views are.


You're right, Romney's stance on key issues and his LDS faith are two separate reasons to not vote for him.

This got started when myself and several others said something to the tune of, "If he believes what mormons believe, than he is bat shit crazy. I don't want a bat shit crazy guy for president." Then somebody said that Obama is christian and therefore crazy too. And then somebody said....

It doesn't matter though, we're all just here to vent and get shit off our chest. Nobody is going to change their mind, and everybody is going to get defensive. I just have a thing where I think Mormon's are totally off their rocker and I never thought, in a million years, that one could potentially become president.
storkfan
Profile Joined March 2012
493 Posts
April 21 2012 18:33 GMT
#916
On April 22 2012 02:30 PlaGuE_R wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 19 2012 18:24 murphs wrote:
Dear America,

Vote Obama.

Sincerely,
Rest of the fucking world.


Agreed, from France

Dear murphs and Plague,

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF.

Sincerely,
America.
Demonhunter04
Profile Joined July 2011
1530 Posts
April 21 2012 19:29 GMT
#917
On April 22 2012 02:51 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:45 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.


There. Proof that God loves everybody. Unless you're not Christian.


lol "proof"?

Anyway, it's sad that being a nonbeliever is worse for you politically than pretty much anything else.
"If you don't drop sweat today, you will drop tears tomorrow" - SlayerSMMA
Zoesan
Profile Joined March 2012
Switzerland141 Posts
April 21 2012 20:35 GMT
#918
I think his comment was facetious
Suffer the pain of discipline or suffer the pain of regret
Etrnity
Profile Joined November 2010
United States88 Posts
April 21 2012 21:00 GMT
#919
On April 22 2012 02:51 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:45 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

I don't believe anyone could do these things, along with the things I mentioned earlier (tithing, baptism) without actually having faith.

We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.


There. Proof that God loves everybody. Unless you're not Christian.


You clearly don't understand what God's love means. He clearly states that he loves all, Beloved and sinners (we are all sinners). He does not call his Beloved to give aid to those that turn their hearts away. Stop being an idiot.
tso
Profile Joined April 2010
United States132 Posts
April 21 2012 21:03 GMT
#920
On April 22 2012 06:00 Etrnity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 02:51 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:45 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:40 koreasilver wrote:
On April 22 2012 02:09 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:57 Etrnity wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:39 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:31 1Eris1 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:27 mynameisgreat11 wrote:
On April 22 2012 01:20 koreasilver wrote:
I really have no opinions on Romney's "real" beliefs but a "nonbeliever" becoming a clergyman isn't as uncommon as people seem to think. In Romney's case it would surprise me even less because of his family's standings within the Mormon church.

[quote]
We are still talking about politicians, right?


In the LDS church, a 'nonbeliever' becoming a bishop is unheard of. Period. It can't happen unless you've been ordained with the melchezedek priesthood, which you get several years after getting the Aaronic priesthood. You can't be in that position without being an active and faithful member for decades.

Yes, we are still talking about politicians. If you read back the last 2-3 or pages, you'll see that myself and others are concerned about having the country run by somebody who we feel has a fragile grip on reality.



Have you seen any of Romney's policies or his programs? None of them are Mormonized or anything like that. If you want to use Mormonism as an excuse not to vote for him, you need to provide some substanial reasoning; because "he's a Mormon" just makes you sound like some evangelical redneck.


The mormon church is homophobic, sexist, and racist. I believe Romney will carry these traits to the presidency.

Homophobia - The LDS church donates millions in support of California's prop 8, an anti-gay marriage bill.

Sexist - Women cannot hold the priesthood, or any position of authority in the church. The church embraced polygamy until it became clear that they could not achieve statehood, at which time the prophet had a revelation that God told him that polygamy was now bad. Joseph Smith, the church's founder, married one of his wives when she was 13.

Racism - Blacks could not hold the priesthood until 1978, which also meant they couldn't be married and sealed in the temple, or ever go to the highest kingdom of heaven with the other mormons.

I don't like homophobic, racist, and sexist people. I don't want one of them as our president. Mormonism is a big deal.


Obama is called a Christian, but he doesn't keep to the beliefs of the faith...

So religion is always followed by a president, instead of it being just a title?....sure




If you read my posts in the last few pages, I give some examples of things an active LDS member must do in order to be considered mormon. In short, its not something you can really fake.

Most Christian religions, on the other hand, are pretty easy to affiliate with with minimal effort.

Like the poster above says, I believe Obama's stated religious beliefs are nothing more than a necessity to be elected. JKF could come back from the dead, but if he said he was atheist, he ain't getting elected.

Besides the fact that Obama actually has some intimate knowledge and understanding of some theologies and has some connection with liberation theology, right? His connection with Christianity is a lot stronger than what someone would do to just put an appearance. Obama is probably a more honestly practicing Christian than most of the GOP runners of the past year, and he could probably sustain an actual academic dialogue with theologians better than every GOP runner.


Christianity doesn't have to do with social justice, nor helping the poor. A thorough reading of the Bible would tell you that. Justice is a term reserved to God, not for man to engage in, and the Bible calls Christians to help other Christians, no where does it say to help non-secularists. We are to go out and let the light of the Lord shine, but not to give aid to those that turn their hearts from the Heavens.


There. Proof that God loves everybody. Unless you're not Christian.


You clearly don't understand what God's love means. He clearly states that he loves all, Beloved and sinners (we are all sinners). He does not call his Beloved to give aid to those that turn their hearts away. Stop being an idiot.


eternal torture is love

User was warned for this post
...
Prev 1 44 45 46 47 48 1504 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
HomeStory Cup
11:00
XXVII: Day 2
TaKeTV 2621
ComeBackTV 819
IndyStarCraft 335
CranKy Ducklings218
Rex129
3DClanTV 83
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 335
Rex 129
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 36825
Calm 8983
Rain 2899
Horang2 2042
Flash 1721
Bisu 1408
Shuttle 1352
Soma 700
Hyuk 491
BeSt 325
[ Show more ]
actioN 275
Last 192
Soulkey 188
TY 101
Rush 74
Bonyth 57
Noble 55
sorry 46
Killer 41
Free 27
Shinee 22
NaDa 22
Movie 21
[sc1f]eonzerg 17
IntoTheRainbow 16
GoRush 16
Icarus 15
Shine 14
Backho 14
Yoon 13
SilentControl 11
zelot 9
soO 9
ajuk12(nOOB) 8
Terrorterran 1
Dota 2
Gorgc5047
XcaliburYe302
Fuzer 167
febbydoto1
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor251
Other Games
singsing1735
B2W.Neo673
DeMusliM449
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream26461
StarCraft: Brood War
CasterMuse 25
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Michael_bg 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 1630
• Ler92
Upcoming Events
CSO Cup
3h 27m
BSL: ProLeague
5h 27m
Hawk vs Dewalt
SOOP
20h 27m
SHIN vs ByuN
HomeStory Cup
23h 27m
BSL: ProLeague
1d 5h
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV European League
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV European League
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Rose Open S1
2025 GSL S2
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
HSC XXVII
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.