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On October 16 2012 00:28 nebula. wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:23 ZasZ. wrote:On October 16 2012 00:12 Tobberoth wrote:On October 16 2012 00:08 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On October 16 2012 00:02 Tobberoth wrote:On October 15 2012 23:37 Cirqueenflex wrote:
while we're at it, why would anyone put the date as MM:DD:YY(YY)? It does not make the slightest sense to me. DD:MM:YY(YY) is way more convenient, as it orders the numbers in frequency of change. Even YY(YY):MM:DD would make more sense to me compared to what a lot of people use -.- I always found YYYY-MM-DD the be the only logical way, otherway around when shortening it. It just seems logical to specify as you go, so depending on how exact you want to be, the longer it gets. Just want to know year? YYYY, done. Want month as well? YYYY-MM. Hell, the day matters, so we add it. YYYY-MM-DD. How about time you say? YYYY-MM-DD HH:MM:SS. Logical and consistant. Writing the whole MM-DD-YYYY is ridiculous, it would be like writing time HH-SS-MM. "He finished the race in 1 hour, 20 seconds and 35 minutes." WTF, that's beyond dumb. So it would be ridiculous to say that today's date is October 15th, 2012, despite it being more efficient and quicker to say that than "It is the 15th of October, 2012"? You really think that most laymen believe that mathematical consistency overrides practicality? Note that you switching minutes and seconds to make your comparison doesn't actually make saying the whole length of time any faster, so no one has a justifiable reason to do that. So it's a false analogy between that and the date switch. Saying =/= writing. Say the dates and times anyway you want, just write them in a way which is consistant and makes sense. Should also be noted that this is a language issue. In English, saying october 15th may be easier than 15th october, but this isn't true for many other languages, which is of course a nice bonus in those languages. Doesn't make an impact on writing though. No...saying is not =/= writing. I find it extremely convenient when dates are written in M/D/Y because that's how I say it aloud and how I interpret it on paper. If you write 10/15/2012, I immediately know it's October 15, 2012 because that's how I say dates. If you wrote 15/10/2012, I have to quickly mentally rearrange the numbers to get it into my Month Day, Year format that pretty much all Americans use in speaking. Obviously your mileage varies per culture, but that's the convention here and I don't really see how it affects anybody else. There are more issues with conflicting standards of measurement, but I supplied a post a page or so back about why it would be cost-ineffective and impractical to switch from Imperial to Metric but of course everybody ignored it so they could argue about stupid Americans some more. Of course you find it useful since you're used to it but you can't deny that"the MDY format that pretty much all Americans use in speaking" is really stupid
Ignore the arguments for MDY, post ad hominem. Oh okay.
Anyways, I'm done with this DMY/ MDY conversation. There's really nothing else to say about it.
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Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
it's just a scale problem. a lot of the time people use months as markers within a year and omit the year altogether. this habit arising out of temporal provinciality gives rise to the lingustic habit of giving month then date. it is by no means a universal practice and is only applicable to those with stale lives.
so strictly speaking, americans speak about dates in two steps. first, give the month and day. then, give the year if asked.
the american date system is the trappings of a temporal creature with limited vision. those of us with a more universal date accounting scheme should take pride in the fact that our temporal vision is practically eternal compared to silly americans.
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On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid.
12 AM is midnight; 12 PM is noon (midday) 
Once you remember that, you're pretty much in the clear ^^
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I'd love to use imperial, just because it sounds so much nicer.
"Look at that 30 stone whale sitting there. She's 5 feet tops a drinks a gallon of mayonaise a day. I'd hate to have to walk a mile in her 20 inch giant clown shoes."
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On October 16 2012 00:32 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. 12 AM is midnight; 12 PM is noon (midday) Once you remember that, you're pretty much in the clear ^^
12 AM and 12 PM are plain nonsense. They are neither post nor ante.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
hobbits certainly use imperial. not sure about sauron, probably metric because he's an evil industrialist
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On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid.
Well, most cases you have like 8.7.2012 or 1.4.2012, then you just lost
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Always thought that English dates read like a 17th century royal edict or something. All these "of" and commas and "th" "rd" and "st" are verbose as fuck. Wouldn't hurt to take a hint from the French for once and do it cleanly: 15 Octobre 2012.
Regarding the M-D-Y order, chinese-style YYYY-MM-DD is the best one because you gain the advantage of lexicographical ordering being the same as chronological ordering. So if you have a ton of excel files or whatever all named YYYY-MM-DD-blabla.xls they'll all be in the right order, whereas if you name then MM-DD-YYYY you're fucked and will have to resort to awkward measures such as putting them in yearly subfolders etc.
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On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid.
Any day before the 13th of a month, and you're screwed.
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On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What about for example 8.5.2012?
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2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid.
Yeah, and if I write 03/04/2013 do you know off the bat if I'm talking about March 4th, 2013 or April 3, 2013? Because I sure as hell don't.
Most comprehensible way, for me, is Y/M/D (largest unit to smallest unit), but no one uses it here.
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On October 16 2012 00:37 Souma wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. Yeah, and if I write 03/04/2013 do you know off the bat if I'm talking about March 4th, 2013 or April 3, 2013? Because I sure as hell don't. Most comprehensible way, for me, is Y/M/D (largest unit to smallest unit), but no one uses it here.
You should go to the Middle Kingdom
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On October 16 2012 00:34 Passion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:32 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. 12 AM is midnight; 12 PM is noon (midday) Once you remember that, you're pretty much in the clear ^^ 12 AM and 12 PM are plain nonsense. They are neither post nor ante.
12 AM is midnight... and that's 12 hours ante meridiem, meaning before midday. So technically that one's accurate.
12 PM is midday... and that's not 12 hours post meridiem- after midday- quite obviously. But I think they used that terminology of "12 PM" to keep it consistent with the 12 AM. Making it 0 PM or 0 AM would confuse the hell out of people, considering most don't know what AM and PM even stand for lol. 12 hour days, so end off with a 12. Easy enough to remember, I guess.
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On October 16 2012 00:34 Passion wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:32 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. 12 AM is midnight; 12 PM is noon (midday) Once you remember that, you're pretty much in the clear ^^ 12 AM and 12 PM are plain nonsense. They are neither post nor ante.
12 AM is midnight because it's the beginning of the morning and 12 PM is noon because it's the beginning of the afternoon.
Makes as much sense as could be hoped for tbh. Could've been a Fahrenheit-style mess, like the guy who invented AM/PM did it during a nice afternoon at 16:00 so the AM/PM change happens at 16:00. 15:00 would be 3AM, 17:00 would be 5PM and 03:00 would be 3PM. Now that would be a mindfuck.
Edit: This beginning of the morning stuff is my personal trick for remembering it, doesn't mean it was created with that in mind, the poster above me is more exact on this matter.
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2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On October 16 2012 00:40 nebula. wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:37 Souma wrote:On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. Yeah, and if I write 03/04/2013 do you know off the bat if I'm talking about March 4th, 2013 or April 3, 2013? Because I sure as hell don't. Most comprehensible way, for me, is Y/M/D (largest unit to smallest unit), but no one uses it here. You should go to the Middle Kingdom
Lol or Japan. :p
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On October 16 2012 00:42 Souma wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:40 nebula. wrote:On October 16 2012 00:37 Souma wrote:On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. Yeah, and if I write 03/04/2013 do you know off the bat if I'm talking about March 4th, 2013 or April 3, 2013? Because I sure as hell don't. Most comprehensible way, for me, is Y/M/D (largest unit to smallest unit), but no one uses it here. You should go to the Middle Kingdom Lol or Japan. :p
Or anywhere in Europe... Pretty much any place ever except english speaking countries.
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Haven't read the whole topic, way too many pages.
A little off-topic, since the last page appears to be about date and time.
I read that 95% of the world uses metric. Personally (being from Canada), I use metric for everything except height and weight. Of course I know my measurements in metric, but it's easier to visual when using imperial.
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On October 16 2012 00:44 Tobberoth wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 00:42 Souma wrote:On October 16 2012 00:40 nebula. wrote:On October 16 2012 00:37 Souma wrote:On October 16 2012 00:30 Toadesstern wrote:
Noone cares about D/M/Y or M/D/Y though. If I type 16.10.2012 everyone knows I'm referring to tomorrow.
If you're typing 10.16.2012 I immediately know you're referring to tomorrow. :p
What's really maddening is people using the AM/PM-system, especially when referring to 00:00AM and 00:00PM in combination with dates. No idea which out of those 2 is the one that stands for 24:00 and if it says 00:00 DAY-X I have no idea if it's on the start of DayX (between DayX and Day(X-1)) or at the end of DayX (between DayX and Dax(X+1)).
THAT'S just stupid. Yeah, and if I write 03/04/2013 do you know off the bat if I'm talking about March 4th, 2013 or April 3, 2013? Because I sure as hell don't. Most comprehensible way, for me, is Y/M/D (largest unit to smallest unit), but no one uses it here. You should go to the Middle Kingdom Lol or Japan. :p Or anywhere in Europe... Pretty much any place ever except english speaking countries.
Original quote was speaking about Y/M/D and as far as I know in Europe pretty much everyone uses D/M/Y, which still makes better sense than M/D/Y but still not as much as Y/M/D. I haven't seen Y/M/D used outside of computer-related stuff (for lexicographical ordering) and some countries in Asia.
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On October 15 2012 22:57 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On October 15 2012 19:37 Prog455 wrote:On October 15 2012 12:29 micronesia wrote:On October 15 2012 12:06 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On October 15 2012 12:04 micronesia wrote:On October 15 2012 12:01 GT350 wrote:
What irritates me is how NASA and other established institutions use 128,097 feet/24 miles during the Felix Baumgartner's record skydiving.
Why? I learned that metric is efficient and universal from grade school. But why are institutions still using other forms, especially the hideous imperial unit of measurement? People know how big a foot or a mile is (in fact, even an alien wouldn't have much trouble understanding feet.... can't say the same for meters XD) but they don't know how big a meter or a km is. Obviously this is an oversimplification, but that's generally what it is. I would argue your opinion is wrong. You are equating because of your specific knowledge that an alien would be able to easily understand imperial. Imperial is an absolutely astoundingly awful system of measurement. You can't possibly argue that an alien would find moving up by 10's harder than "Well this is 12, that is 24 and here is 1000 and well 4 make a x and 5 make a z" . I don't see why you think I made such a claim. All I meant was a 'foot' is somewhat self explanatory... it's roughly the length of a human foot. A 'meter' by itself doesn't mean anything as recognizable. I'm not saying feet are better than meters lol... you all need to calm down. Why is this such a touchy subject? Do we need to add it to the list with religion and the like? The thing is that your statement is grossly inaccurate as 1 foot is 30.48 cm long. If you were to gather 50 men and 50 women from your workplace, school, etc. i hardly doubt that you would find more than a few people among those 100, who has a foot that is 30.48 cm +/- 5mm. The average US woman uses a size 9 shoe, which is approximately equal to a foot length of 25.3 cm (or 10 inches). This makes for a 15.3% difference between the average female foot length and the measure 1 foot. In other words: If an average american woman was to measure 10 feet (3.04 meter), based on the length of her own feet, she would 20.4 inches (51.8 cm) off. This means that if you were to measure 3 meters based on your foot size, you would be closer to 4 meters than 3 meters. I think the reason that this is somewhat of a touchy subject, is because of the fact that americans from time to time tend to claim that the american way of doing things is the best, even though it is obviously not. And that is pretty much the case when it comes to measurement systems. Even though the metric system is by far the most convenient, and most widespread, americans still claim that the "standard" system is the best. Needless to say this is not the case for all americans. sources: http://www.i18nguy.com/l10n/shoes.htmlhttp://www.statisticbrain.com/shoe-size-averages/ How is my statement grossly inaccurate. I didn't say "a foot is exactly the length of one foot, and everyone's foot is exactly the same length so this is great!" I said "an alien wouldn't have much trouble understanding feet.... can't say the same for meters." A foot is roughly the length of a human foot. If an alien didn't know what a meter was, I couldn't just say "a meter is roughly the length of a meter!"
So after reading my post again, i find that i should not have used the phrase "grossly inaccurate". That statement was somewhat exaggerated. However, my point still stands that the notion of feet as a measure being more intuitive than the metric system, is limited to people who has grown up using feet and inches rather than centimeters and meters. And even in this case, it may aswell be just as intuitive to say that a distance is equal to 1 step, rather than 1 foot.
In addition to this, it is also worth mentioning that the metric system will be more intuitive, or at least easier to understand, at certain distances. For instance, if you ask for the distance between your home and the nearest supermarket. If i tell you that the nearest supermarket is approximately 300 meters away from your home, you will know that it is just short of 1/3 kilometer. In comparison you could ask the same question. What is the distane to the nearest supermarket. If i told you that the distance is 1760 feet, it is nowhere near as intuitive that the distance is exactly 1/3 mile.
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EPT
