Wow really distrubing stuff, whats worse is that, at least to me, it looked like he was enjoying it.
On November 02 2011 10:37 Kimaker wrote: While I don't agree with the reason, I see nothing wrong there with the immediate punishment. Yes (having now read the full context of her condition) that was too much. But corporal punishment overall isn't bad.
For me it was the continuation of the conversation that got me riled up. Corporal punishment is fine, I myself was raised with corporal punishment as a possibility, but the fact that he didn't let it go was a bit much for me. Honestly, everyone's going to freak out and say she should be removed from the house, but I think that's ridiculous. She got belted. Woo hoo. Getting belted hurts like a son of a bitch, but it's nothing seriously harmful.
And please don't pull the "mentally scarring" card out. It's not. I promise you.
I completely disagree with your entire statement, How is it ok to physically beat someone just because they're your children, if you did this to someone random on the street it wouldnt be ok, so why is it fine to do this to children? You cannot promise me its not mentally scarring, as when taking into account individual differences it will scar some, to varrying degrees, if 1/100 gets scarred the entire practice is wrong in my opinion. Its damaging to the relationship development between parent and child as well as studies showing it can lead to higher rates of violance/substance abuse. Most respected medical authorities have made their views clear in that regard. There are far better ways to instill discipline and command respect than beating it into children. It just seems to be the easier way of doing it. In my opinion the negatives of corporal punishment far outweight the positives.
i don't understand why this is surprising to most people, most of you act like these people are immune to breaking the law but when it becomes a priest or someone of religious authority it's automatically assumed. judges and people of higher authority within the system just hide it better but i'm sure if they were to get their dirty laundry aired out just like everyone else, they would be guilty just as all the corrupt priest.
i'm pretty sure these judges are too busy judging others and know how the whole system works that no one ever suspects them of committing crimes. he should definitely be removed. you do NOT have the right to be a hypocrite if you're a judge, as someone who upholds the law and makes decisions about who's right and wrong according to the law. what you hold others accountable for in the court of the law applies to you even more so because you're a judge, you are not above it. he was probably too busy judging other peoples personal lives he forget to judge himself. it honestly disgust me that people like this exist.
On November 02 2011 10:57 Zephirdd wrote: while I do agree that "physical punishment" isn't as bad as people make it out to be, there are limits and this guy goes over the limits A LOT. It's sickening, actually.
I mean, most of it isn't even about how he was trying to "teach" the girl, it was just "you brought this to yourself", "I'm mad at you", "take it on". It wasn't teaching, it wasn't a lesson, it was pure need to vent on her, the pure need to "show who is in control". There are situations and situations, and this is not a correct situation.
It's even sad that a guy like that is a Judge IMO.
Exactly. It's not the style of punishment that's bad, it's the delivery. Corporal punishment can be an effective way to teach lessons, but this was not a lesson.
I agree. I was raised with corporal punishment and it's absolutely fine to smack a kid (in a non-damaging way) to get a point across that words cannot. This, though, was stupid vengeance and absolutely disgusting.
It's child abuse. He's telling his daughter that she doesn't deserve to live in that house, how bad she is, and after he gets mad and talks all that shit to her he leaves and comes back saying he didn't get his beating in yet. Jesus Christ. That's not parenting, that's a little man with anger issues taking them out on someone who has to depend upon him.
Disgusting. There's a difference between punishment and taking out your anger on a young girl. Anybody who knows how to parent knows that when you interact with people (let alone your own children) you should act out of fairness, not abusing others for your own iniquities.
What? Why do you think it is fine? What point can you get across that words cannot? http://www.cmaj.ca/content/161/7/805.long Seems to indicate it does far more harm then good.
"Among the respondents without a history of physical or sexual abuse during childhood, those who reported being slapped or spanked "often" or "sometimes" had significantly higher lifetime rates of anxiety disorders (adjusted odds ratio [OR] 1.43, 95% confidence interval [CI] 1.04-1.96), alcohol abuse or dependence (adjusted OR 2.02, 95% CI 1.27-3.21) and one or more externalizing problems (adjusted OR 2.08, 95% CI 1.36-3.16), compared with those who reported "never" being slapped or spanked. There was also an association between a history of slapping or spanking and major depression, but it was not statistically significant (adjusted OR 1.64, 95% CI 0.96-2.80)."
This is based on logical fallacy. It implies causation when actually, it is NOT that people who are beaten are more likely to develop anxiety disorders, etc ... BECAUSE of the punishment. It IS that, in families and socioeconomic situations where corporal punishment is being used, the circumstances are more likely to result in anxiety disorders, etc...
Corporal punishment is exponentially higher in the Bible belt and in poor socioeconomic states, which are both associated with situations more conducive to the study's findings than the direct punishments. Your argument misses the point entirely.
Only looks at THREE YEAR OLDS. Who beats a three year old? I dunno. I will completely concede that point, but that study is incredibly limited and has no bearing on the use of corporal punishment in general, only on three year olds. Three year olds don't understand causation yet, how could they learn from almost ANY method, including corporal punishment.
EDIT: Also, this DOES NOT ADJUST FOR SOCIOECONOMICS. So I disregard it. That is an incredibly POORLY corrected study. Any study looking at behavior without socioeconomic stratification is a waste of time.
Did you actually read it? Table 2 bro. All the factors they adjusted for, including "Mother's annual household income," education level, and "Use of drugs and/or alcohol"
I'm suprised some people are saying corporal punishment helped them. If my dad ever tried to abuse me like this, I probably would have pulled a knife on him or something. Pretty sure they're countless studies out there showing corporally punished kids with more problems on average than other kids.
On November 02 2011 11:24 Paperplane wrote: Wow it's surprising corporal punishment is still so popular. Here it's really frowned upon, a slap is acceptable but I cannot believe people are defending belting children.
Pretty much this. I didn't know people really belted children anymore.
From what I've experienced a spank or two on the butt as an infant gets the point across; but on a girl her age I don't see how any physical punishment will actually help. When I was her age my parents always sat down with me and just talked and that went a very long way.
On November 02 2011 11:13 GhostFall wrote: Yeah the actual punishment doesn't seem bad at all to me.
He whipped her with a belt below the waist. I'd be worried if he started hitting her face or something, but below the waist is just pain for punishment.
I don't see abuse, I just see strict parenting. I think it's stupid so many people see this as abuse. More kids need this type of punishment nowadays.
The part where he got angry tho, is the part that is questionable.
You've gotta be a troll, or don't know what it's like to be loved. Strict parenting? How is taking your anger out on your child strict parenting? How bad is it to use the internet? Does it literally deserve being physically and verbally abused like that? Do you understand how this is going to affect her? SHIT, the world DEPENDS on the internet, and she's probably going to be afraid for the rest of her life to use it.
He did hit her above the waist, and even threatened to beat her in the face if you didn't hear that. "I'll beat your fucking face with a closed fist!!!" Seriously, how the fuck is that okay? I can't love my dad because he used to beat the crap out of me. I can forgive him, but I don't care if he dies. In fact, I used to wish he would die. Every night, I would pray for him to be stabbed at the prison he worked at. Think that's okay for a child to do every night? Think it's natural and healthy?
The fact that she posted this in such a fashion tells me she probably fantasized about killing her parents time and time again, probably every night when she was trying to sleep, but couldn't.
I don't know exactly what "beat the crap out of me" entails but I got it pretty good from my dad, for some pretty "weak" reasons and I don't hold it against him. I realized at a young age that A. he was trying to help me and B. his efforts, while the most effective given the tools he possessed for the job...still didn't give him the desired effect. Essentially I was beat for "nothing" 9 times out of 10. Regardless of that fact I am still thankful I wasn't one of those little shits that never got actual punishment.
this is messed up in so many ways -_- really hoping there is some retribution or at least some realization that corporal punishment is wrong, there are much more effective means of torturing a child as well, words work just fine if that is your aim
Want the bastard to burn and he will by the time reddit, 4chan, youtube, most news publishers get through with him, let alone the law.
But if you haven't done already, please go to her youtube page: http://www.youtube.com/user/shoehedgie On it, alongside this horrific video, are clips of her playing the piano. And she is spectacular. Going by her recent video, she write in the description that she received a scholarship because of her gift.
This is a video of her playing the themes of a few video games.
Let's look out for each other people. much love <3
Well, I am not a lawyer, nor a judge, but as a human being, I see this as going beyond disciplining your child, and child abuse
I mean, disciplinary action especially with a weapon such as a belt, would only call for 3-4 lashes AT MOST to have 7 minutes of him, hitting his DAUGHTER with extreme force, is just one I could not bare to watch, whats even worse and I am even more disgusted with, is the mother, not only did she not do anything she also PARTICIPATED! where has the sanctity of being a parent gone in those two.
and for those who believe they are disciplining their child,one does not say "I should beat your ass into submission" to their child while disciplining them
I was spanked growing up and for me it became a joke. We'd laugh about it while we were being spanked. It wasn't effective in the least. There's tons of better ways to raise your kid IMO.
What that dude was doing is straight up abuse, he was getting off on that shit. The only way you do that to a 16 year old (who has palsy, is that legit?) is if you're getting your rocks off on it. You'd have to be out of your mind to pull that on a healthy 16 year old, especially boy. I'd have killed my dad if he pulled that shit at 16.
I have no kids, many of my friends do. I have no intention of ever spanking any potential children. The only way I'd even consider if is if they did something that like almost got them or someone else killed. My friends are free to discipline their children as they see fit to a point. If I ever catch anyone abusing a kid like that I'll step in and if anyone were to lay a hand on my kid it'd be over in a heartbeat.
Spank your kids if you see fit but that isn't spanking.
On November 02 2011 10:57 Zephirdd wrote: while I do agree that "physical punishment" isn't as bad as people make it out to be, there are limits and this guy goes over the limits A LOT. It's sickening, actually.
I mean, most of it isn't even about how he was trying to "teach" the girl, it was just "you brought this to yourself", "I'm mad at you", "take it on". It wasn't teaching, it wasn't a lesson, it was pure need to vent on her, the pure need to "show who is in control". There are situations and situations, and this is not a correct situation.
It's even sad that a guy like that is a Judge IMO.
Exactly. It's not the style of punishment that's bad, it's the delivery. Corporal punishment can be an effective way to teach lessons, but this was not a lesson.
I agree. I was raised with corporal punishment and it's absolutely fine to smack a kid (in a non-damaging way) to get a point across that words cannot. This, though, was stupid vengeance and absolutely disgusting.
It's child abuse. He's telling his daughter that she doesn't deserve to live in that house, how bad she is, and after he gets mad and talks all that shit to her he leaves and comes back saying he didn't get his beating in yet. Jesus Christ. That's not parenting, that's a little man with anger issues taking them out on someone who has to depend upon him.
Disgusting. There's a difference between punishment and taking out your anger on a young girl. Anybody who knows how to parent knows that when you interact with people (let alone your own children) you should act out of fairness, not abusing others for your own iniquities.
What? Why do you think it is fine? What point can you get across that words cannot? http://www.cmaj.ca/content/161/7/805.long Seems to indicate it does far more harm then good.
"Among the respondents without a history of physical or sexual abuse during childhood, those who reported being slapped or spanked "often" or "sometimes" had significantly higher lifetime rates of anxiety disorders (adjusted odds ratio [OR] 1.43, 95% confidence interval [CI] 1.04-1.96), alcohol abuse or dependence (adjusted OR 2.02, 95% CI 1.27-3.21) and one or more externalizing problems (adjusted OR 2.08, 95% CI 1.36-3.16), compared with those who reported "never" being slapped or spanked. There was also an association between a history of slapping or spanking and major depression, but it was not statistically significant (adjusted OR 1.64, 95% CI 0.96-2.80)."
This is based on logical fallacy. It implies causation when actually, it is NOT that people who are beaten are more likely to develop anxiety disorders, etc ... BECAUSE of the punishment. It IS that, in families and socioeconomic situations where corporal punishment is being used, the circumstances are more likely to result in anxiety disorders, etc...
Corporal punishment is exponentially higher in the Bible belt and in poor socioeconomic states, which are both associated with situations more conducive to the study's findings than the direct punishments. Your argument misses the point entirely.
Only looks at THREE YEAR OLDS. Who beats a three year old? I dunno. I will completely concede that point, but that study is incredibly limited and has no bearing on the use of corporal punishment in general, only on three year olds. Three year olds don't understand causation yet, how could they learn from almost ANY method, including corporal punishment.
EDIT: Also, this DOES NOT ADJUST FOR SOCIOECONOMICS. So I disregard it. That is an incredibly POORLY corrected study. Any study looking at behavior without socioeconomic stratification is a waste of time.
Did you actually read it? Table 2 bro. All the factors they adjusted for, including "Mother's annual household income," education level, and "Use of drugs and/or alcohol"
Lol. You do know "Mother's annual household income" is NOT EQUAL TO "Socioeconomic status." If you judge socioeconomic status you look at WEALTH, which is equated to total worth of fiscal assets. If you knew anything on the subject you'd know that AT THE SAME INCOME, wealth disparities exist between different social, racial, and ethnic groups. Income MEANS NOTHING in and of itself. The average white mother at a given income is likely to have almost TWICE THE WEALTH as the average black mother at the same income.
I am finishing up and getting ready to go into Peds. You can't quote bad study data in my field and tell me it is relevant. Their have been sharp criticisms about old statification measures by anyone who actually works in health care disparities.
people who she nothing wrong with this are sick fucks. yeah i got beat when i was a kid too but both my parents didnt gang up on me with belts and beat the shit outta me. it was just me and my dad he would just pop me in the mouth real quick and say straighten out. tht was the end of it. never took anything more. not once. thts corporal punishment. both parents tag teaming the girl for 10 minutes is not. thts abuse.
I was hit as a kid when my parents wanted to punish me. However, it was always pretty clear that it was a form of punishment for going against the rules. Even supposing my parents held incorrect beliefs and punished me based on them, the beatings were pretty straight forward.
This video is something else altogether. I cant understand why anyone wouldnt be disgusted by what they see in the video. Probably just other people whove been beaten as kids trying to compare their own experiences and feel good about themselves. This guy is going on a power trip trying to break his daughter psychologically. Its pretty disgusting watching him trying to get her to submit. I mean seriously, over 7 minutes of footage about the guy beating his daughter. Isnt that pretty excessive?
Also, was it just me or did anyone else feel glad that she was resisting and not turning over like her dad wanted her to?
On November 02 2011 10:57 Zephirdd wrote: while I do agree that "physical punishment" isn't as bad as people make it out to be, there are limits and this guy goes over the limits A LOT. It's sickening, actually.
I mean, most of it isn't even about how he was trying to "teach" the girl, it was just "you brought this to yourself", "I'm mad at you", "take it on". It wasn't teaching, it wasn't a lesson, it was pure need to vent on her, the pure need to "show who is in control". There are situations and situations, and this is not a correct situation.
It's even sad that a guy like that is a Judge IMO.
Exactly. It's not the style of punishment that's bad, it's the delivery. Corporal punishment can be an effective way to teach lessons, but this was not a lesson.
I agree. I was raised with corporal punishment and it's absolutely fine to smack a kid (in a non-damaging way) to get a point across that words cannot. This, though, was stupid vengeance and absolutely disgusting.
It's child abuse. He's telling his daughter that she doesn't deserve to live in that house, how bad she is, and after he gets mad and talks all that shit to her he leaves and comes back saying he didn't get his beating in yet. Jesus Christ. That's not parenting, that's a little man with anger issues taking them out on someone who has to depend upon him.
Disgusting. There's a difference between punishment and taking out your anger on a young girl. Anybody who knows how to parent knows that when you interact with people (let alone your own children) you should act out of fairness, not abusing others for your own iniquities.
What? Why do you think it is fine? What point can you get across that words cannot? http://www.cmaj.ca/content/161/7/805.long Seems to indicate it does far more harm then good.
"Among the respondents without a history of physical or sexual abuse during childhood, those who reported being slapped or spanked "often" or "sometimes" had significantly higher lifetime rates of anxiety disorders (adjusted odds ratio [OR] 1.43, 95% confidence interval [CI] 1.04-1.96), alcohol abuse or dependence (adjusted OR 2.02, 95% CI 1.27-3.21) and one or more externalizing problems (adjusted OR 2.08, 95% CI 1.36-3.16), compared with those who reported "never" being slapped or spanked. There was also an association between a history of slapping or spanking and major depression, but it was not statistically significant (adjusted OR 1.64, 95% CI 0.96-2.80)."
This is based on logical fallacy. It implies causation when actually, it is NOT that people who are beaten are more likely to develop anxiety disorders, etc ... BECAUSE of the punishment. It IS that, in families and socioeconomic situations where corporal punishment is being used, the circumstances are more likely to result in anxiety disorders, etc...
Corporal punishment is exponentially higher in the Bible belt and in poor socioeconomic states, which are both associated with situations more conducive to the study's findings than the direct punishments. Your argument misses the point entirely.
Only looks at THREE YEAR OLDS. Who beats a three year old? I dunno. I will completely concede that point, but that study is incredibly limited and has no bearing on the use of corporal punishment in general, only on three year olds. Three year olds don't understand causation yet, how could they learn from almost ANY method, including corporal punishment.
EDIT: Also, this DOES NOT ADJUST FOR SOCIOECONOMICS. So I disregard it. That is an incredibly POORLY corrected study. Any study looking at behavior without socioeconomic stratification is a waste of time.
Did you actually read it? Table 2 bro. All the factors they adjusted for, including "Mother's annual household income," education level, and "Use of drugs and/or alcohol"
Lol. You do know "Mother's annual household income" is NOT EQUAL TO "Socioeconomic status." If you judge socioeconomic status you look at WEALTH, which is equated to total worth of fiscal assets. If you knew anything on the subject you'd know that AT THE SAME INCOME, wealth disparities exist between different social, racial, and ethnic groups. Income MEANS NOTHING in and of itself. The average white mother at a given income is likely to have almost TWICE THE WEALTH as the average black mother at the same income.
I am finishing up and getting ready to go into Peds. You can't quote bad study data in my field and tell me it is relevant. Their have been sharp criticisms about old statification measures by anyone who actually works in health care disparities.
Race is also included. Between race, education level, and income I think you get a pretty good idea of socioeconomic status. It also included marital status.
EPT
