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On October 17 2011 16:34 Mobius_1 wrote:I am prejudiced against people who use drugs which are more illegal than marijuana, and people who abuse any drug to the detriment of his/her social, academic, and employment functionings. I am also somewhat prejudiced against people who don't use alcohol at all for none-religious reasons, but that's quite a different matter 
Hilarious considering that alcohol is more harmful and more addictive than plenty of those "more illegal than marijuana" drugs.
There are some drugs I'll never touch, opiates are an obvious one, but I urge the non-users to experience in moderation before judging quite so harshly.
Like anything, moderation is the key. People die from excessive WoW-ing, so it's not unreasonable to expect that disrespecting a substance can cause serious harm.
MDMA is worth experiencing once in your life.
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First poll: Having prejudice against somebody who smokes pot every day and uses some psychedelic drugs like shrooms 2-3 times a month is like thinking every black person is some gang from member from ghetto who will try to kill/rob/beat you. Yes there are some idiots who get addicted and do stupid shit but most of users arent,just like there are some ghetto gang members but that doesnt make every black person is one.
Second poll: If somebody is any using kind of drug(even hard ones),still functions normally,and i dont even notice anything is wrong with them why should it negatively affect my opinion of them if all those drugs they are using arent affecting them and they behave and function like any other person who doesnt use any drugs?
If somebody is really fucked up addict who cant function normally and starts doing stupid shit to get some money for more drugs,well that person doesnt need to tell you that he/she uses drugs,you will know it already.
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i dont know and i dont care what you think about drugs, but as long as you buy them you just support the criminals and terrorists that you dislike. i dont know how much people can get more stupid than that lol. ofc it is totally fine if u grow your own and use by yourself. but seriously people should stop subsidizing the terrorists and crime cartels by buying their drugs, it aint helpin anything..
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MDMA is worth experiencing once in your life.
I wouldn't recommend it, while not being physically addictive most people who try it get a strong urge to experince it again since the effect was so awesome.
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On October 17 2011 18:22 TheGiftedApe wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Well I'll say what people do to their own bodies is up to them. But there are certain drugs, some call them "Hard Drugs' which under the influence of people can harm others.( I am tempted to include alcohol with the hard drugs sometimes when i walk past the local college campus) Hard drugs which cause people to have "out of body/mind" experiences are very dangerous and I would never encourage or understand the use of them, so I won't try too. But there is a huge difference between someone who has smoked pot, and someone who has a 100$ a day habit and habitually abuses any drug, designer prescription drugs included. I can see why someone would want to have a couple drinks of alcohol or puffs of a cigarette, but I don't see ANY positive rational behind, oh i'm gonna try some heroin or Meth, there is no road that dangerous drugs will lead you down that will have a positive affect on your life.
However I feel there is a very dangerous trend in today's society(and this thread) of, grouping drugs into certain groups. ie: Soft drugs,(marijuana, alcohol, caffeine, tobaaco), Party Drugs(ecstasy, mushrooms etc) and the "Hard Drugs"(cocaine heroin lsd meth etc.) I feel this is a very dangerous way of classifying things and is very hard for younger minds to comprehend fully. Say a 16 year old, who has parents who smoke cigarettes, and he/she happens to try a cigarette and learns how the tobacco affects him/her. That same kid while obviously understanding that Alcohol is not the same thing as tobacco, has been "programmed" for lack of a better word, to associate tobacco in a similar drug tier as alcohol, marijuana, or other over-the-counter drugs. If this kid's experience with the cigarette was "oh, hey that's not so bad" imo, its logical that they would also think "Oh tobacco is not as bad as I've been told, Maybe (insert other drugs in the same tier here) isn't so bad either." Which can end up being a never ending cycle for certain people until they reach who knows what levels of drug. This classification system while it might work for adults and the Judicial system, I feel it is a dangerous way to approach the subject with kids, and something that should be phased out in of modern psyche, knowledge about each individual drug/substance needs to grow instead of being hidden or taboo in society.
One thing that really disappoints me with all of our modern technology and medicine, There are still no clear warnings to the public about what the serious possible affects of ALL THINGS people consume can be. As the post above me stated, everything is just a Chemical or a combination of chemicals, these chemicals are taken into our bodies and produce a reaction from our brain. Personally I see no difference in a person who drinks 3-4 cups of coffee a day to keep going, and someone who has 3-4 drinks of alcohol or smokes some marijuana everyday. They all negatively affect your health and an addiction is an addiction. Even things that don't negatively affect your physical health can be addictive just the same and affect you negatively in other ways. Yes there is a sticker on packs of cigarettes that tells me I am about to die of cancer, but there is no label on the wrapper of a Mcdonald's Big mac that I am x% more likely to become obese, or die of a heart attack by consuming this product. Hell I know people(a person to be exact) who works out at the gym 7 days a week twice a day and have completely lost all premise of what it is to be human. If your going to coddle the public and tell them whats bad and whats good, it's better to warn of other serious harmful substances/products. I'm sick of seeing all these television Lawyers telling me to "Call Now!!" if you took this pill and now are dying of some strange disease, it's absolutely ridiculous.(The people who take all these crazy diet pills or get botox etc is an addiction all it's own, some more dangerous than any drug that can be bought on the black market, but that's for another thread)
On another note, I'd like to put a persistent myth to bed, as I feel it's very unfair to generalize so wildly on a very deep subject matter. Just because someone smoked some weed doesn't mean, OMG you will never reach your full potential or you will be a stoner for life and people who drink a lot will get fat and eat mcdonalds forever and have a shitty job for the rest of their life. To me it sounds like a weak minds reaction to a specific case. Do some people smoke weed and become lazy stereotypical stoners? yes, Do ALL of them? no, Do some people smoke weed and become superstar musicians or artists? yes, Is it solely because they smoked some weed? no, Do some people drink too much and get liver cancer? Yes, do some people get liver cancer without ever drinking alcohol? yes! The subject of drug use even today in 2011 is not one of absolutes and every individuals experiences with them will differ. I would be willing to bet any amount of money or whatever property you find valuable, that 99.9% of these cases you see of a depressed person abusing a drug to cover up an emotion, is not due to their use of a drug, but because of other factors in their life that a Mental Health Professional could help them through. the problem is the stigma in today's society not just the drugs. For every known case of someone going down the wrong path with a drug, there is an unknown case of someone you don't know who has used a drug but not abused it and lived a perfectly happy and fulfilled life.
The ideal of, oh you should get 4.0 gpa in high school and, go to an ivy league university, marry your beautiful High School sweetheart at 25 and have kids at 30, become rich and successful, is a modern mystique and a side effect of the Middle Class. In the end you have to figure out what makes you happy, and what do you enjoy in life. I know plenty of people who work "shitty" jobs and don't have any money and never went to college that are perfectly happy. And I know plenty of "successful" graduate students who are out of their mind with stress and have lost all knowledge of what it feels like to be genuinely "happy". Who are you as a human being to say what someone else's potential is, and what it is not. Your made up ideal of what other people should do with their lives is a dangerous way to look at society and is why we don't live in Monarchies/Dictatorships anymore(for the most part lol) Shame on you.
So to op's question, and to end my ramblings, I choose other. I'm no saint, I judge people incorrectly all the time, but I'm always willing to look at someone by their actions or words, rather than by something they choose to do in their free time, or something they choose to put into their body. "People are strange, when your a stranger."
This was a very good post. You should all read it!
Lots of drugs are more similar to caffeine or other "soft-drugs" than you would think. Would you think the same way about coffee addicts as you say about "drug" addicts? Is it only because of the law? Some of you should really try to open up and get some more experience or at least knowledge before you put on such hard judgments. Be a little open minded, before you judge imo. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but at least know what you talk about before you "know for sure".
Of course I will have different opinions about other ppl when they say they use drugs. But that is because everything they do and say will change my opinion about other ppl all the time. If it will be in a negative, positive or just no reaction at all really depends on the situation. As long as people dont get addicts or hurt others, I dont give a shit.
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On October 17 2011 17:21 Tincuradan wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 17:06 AutomatonOmega wrote:Nowhere in that article does it say he was a daily smoker. Also he died of fucking pneumonia. There's a chance that, if he was a daily smoker, that it contributed to his death. You're right, corrected. Christopher Hitchen's defense of his tobacco use: I've knowingly taken a risk with my lifestyle, and lost the bet. Though I've taken more out of it than it out of me. http://www.nypost.com/p/pagesix/too_much_most_gymPmotE2JM6FPEV0NDCQOIt's disgusting how many Christian news reportings are gloating about his throat cancer. Or subtly suggesting it's the wrath of god for his sin of disbelief. It's exactly this linking between substance use and sin which keeps prohibition laws in place. Hitch 
And yeah, I wasn't pointing to Sagan's occasional weed indulgence as contributing to his death in any way because of any inherent wrongness/immorality/sin, but rather because he died of pneumonia, a condition that doesn't readily lend itself to harming one's lungs with foreign matter, just to be clear.
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in regards to 'most dangerous'... tobacco kills the most people every year by a huge margin, then alcohol (direct poisoning; not counting eventual liver failure and such). then Hepatitis from Heroin (a lot less than alcohol poisoning). Death from everything else is basically a footnote to death statistics
also, I have never had a bad time on drugs. and some of the greatest writers of all time did heaps of drugs (Hunter S Thompson, Huxley, PK Dick, etc). You haven't unlocked your potential until you've tried amphetamines
In regards to OP's question, I think people who are prejudiced against a person just because they've smoked some weed or something are complete dicks. but each to their own
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On October 17 2011 18:56 Snusdosa wrote:Show nested quote +5th? Where does that number come from ? I'd say it's 2nd next to heroin.
TL is filled with hypocrites... http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2009/nov/02/david-nutt-dangerous-drug-listIt's the biggest study on drugs in the UK yet, David Nutt - who after the report concluded that the only logical thing to do would be to legalize marijuana considering alcohol being legal despite the giantic health issues associated with it - got fired after the study was published. People are really dumb, they're basing their opinion on things on what their governments tell them, they dont think for themselves. "But pot is illegal there must be a reason for that herp derp", yeah, reason being the ones you've elected to run your country is a bunch of tards. thanks for the source. interesting article. Not that surprising he got fired considering what politics are these days like you said.
Funny thing is even Kofi Annan agrees marijuana should be legalized. But lobbies are too powerful. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13624303
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Hmm.. Thought people would be more open minded here. How many people you know using cannabis for example? I know some and they are normal people. I don't get how it would affect the personal side of this fellow if he uses something. I absolutely hate tobacco but it has no negative impact on the person in my mind. Why would pot be different? Is it just because it is illegal due to conservative meanings?
Random fun usage =/= junkie. Junkies are another story and this has nothing to do with junkies this OP.
"I've seen drug use and abuse do nothing but hurt the people around me." Only negative impact in your life with something like pot is that you probably have to deal with shady dealers.
Again drug addiction is different and sad story, and if someone uses pot to escape world the problem doesn't lie in the pot it lies in the persons other parts of life.
e: Fun thing to think about.. How many people you know being addicted to coffee and people being addicted to pot? Don't answer, just think about it from different perspectives.
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On October 17 2011 19:02 Snusdosa wrote:I wouldn't recommend it, while not being physically addictive most people who try it get a strong urge to experince it again since the effect was so awesome. and the effect will never be the same.
I'd agree that it's something definitely worth experiencing.
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On October 17 2011 19:15 Nizaris wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 19:02 Snusdosa wrote:MDMA is worth experiencing once in your life. I wouldn't recommend it, while not being physically addictive most people who try it get a strong urge to experince it again since the effect was so awesome. and the effect will never be the same. I'd agree that it's something definitely worth experiencing. As a person that looks experiences in life being the most valuable thing, you make it sound very tempting hehe. :D
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Drug is a pretty ambiguous term. Is a drug anything that temporarily alters your brain chemistry? If that's the case then we are grouping things like chocolate and heroin under one big umbrella. To get past this issue people typically use the phrase "Illegal Drugs" to describe substances that are "abused." There's a problem here. Is a drug that is illegal automatically more harmful than a legal drug?
For instance scientific research overwhelmingly supports the fact that Cannabis is less harmful than Alcohol. Yet Alcohol is the drug of choice for our society and people consider it to be in an entirely different category. After all, alcohol is not an illegal drug and drinking it responsibly is not abuse.
Looking at another example, there is a hallucinogen taken as a sacrament in South American shamanic cultures called Ayahuasca. To the native culture this sacrament is a medicine for the soul, an important part of their spiritual practice. Westerners who have ventured to South America for the ayahuasca experience have reported immense benefits as a direct result of the experience. Alcohols and cocaine addicts returned home free of their addictions. Some have reported that Ayahuasca allowed them to expand their capacity for empathy and compassion.
The point is that Ayahuasca is an "illegal drug" in the US and if you're caught brewing it you'll end up in jail. Surely no one would argue that Ayahuasca is more harmful than Alcohol, or that it destroys your life. Is a glass of scotch after work more ethical than drinking ayahuasca in a guided session simply because alcohol is legal? Probably not.
Having established the fact that illegal doesn't always mean worse, i want to talk about the word abuse. I saw a previous poster say that using Cannabis is "abuse if you're taking it solely because you like the feeling." I find that statement to be inherently flawed. For example, I like to go skiing.I enjoy the feeling. Skiing is a risky activity, I might hit my head and damage my brain, or hell I might tumble down the slope and break my entire body. Does that make skiing abuse?
Some studies have found thatCannabis has a negative impact on the brain. I'll grant that it might be true, however the studies were always (?) flawed in some way (small sample size, users had taken other drugs, etc). Even if there is a chance that it is harmful to your brain, that doesn't mean that using it is automatically abuse. Eating McDonalds once in a while isn't abuse even though its clearly detrimental to your health.
An adult smoking Cannabis in the privacy of his own home does no harm. If the person was already a lazy jackass he'll still be a lazy jackass when he smokes weed. A successful goal oriented person who smokes weed is still just that, successful. You might argue that there are very few stoners that are successful, but that doesn't automatically mean cannabis had a causal impact on their failure.
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For me it comes down to not really respecting someone's personality/mind when they feel a need to take mind-alterating substances on a regular basis to be able to enjoy themselves or feel worthwhile. Now don't come at me with the weak-ass "everything is a mind-alterating substance" BS; sugar, caffeine and vitamins aren't even remotely close to the effects of alcohol, thc and other drugs.
Drink when you're out partying? Fine. Pretty much anyone does, you don't go to a club to have philosophical discussions. Drink yourself into throwing up? Maybe not so good. Smoke marijuana every so often? Fine. Do as you please. Smoke every day and be high for most of your waking week? Don't expect me to see you as "just someone doing what they enjoy".
Let me ask you, what is the concensus about people who drink every single day, and up to a point where they won't be all 'there' anymore? Not just one glass of wine or something, think along the lines of 4+ beers every day (since that's around the same level of fucked-upness that marijuana tends to give you, at least for me)? You'd label those people alcoholics, don't lie. You'd say they have a drinking problem. You would say they are probably having issues of some sort.
Then why should I be completely fine with people who are stoned every day, most of the day?
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It's not so much discrimination as cold hard fact that you won't be clear as day when you're on drugs - that's the entire point of the stuff. You're not really yourself anymore. When I did weedcake, I laughed about jokes that I didn't even understand or fully hear, even if something in me was telling me that they really didn't make sense. I'd laugh about stuff that wasn't even a joke, just a word that sounded funny. All my 'brilliant discoveries and ideas' that I had that night were utter shit, as the tape recorder I had on during that night proved the next day. Stuff along the lines of "maybe we should put these (decorative cake sprinkles) on that snail over there, that would be awesome!" and a friend responding with "I want pizza", followed by uncontrollable laughter for about 15 minutes.
Basically, when I meet someone who is high, I just don't take them seriously anymore or even listen/talk, if at all possible. What they're like at that moment is not what they're like at other times, what they say doesn't mean anything - you're not talking to the real person you're standing in front of. Based on that, when someone is stoned 4 days out of 5, I just don't take them seriously at all or want much to do with them. That's not me thinking they're going to attack me in any way, that's just me not giving a shit about them because they have nothing about them that interests me.
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The poll is flawed. "Is prejudice against drug users wrong?" implies that drug users are some kind of innocent party, and that there is no justification for negative feelings towards drug users... which I think is nonsense. I have negative feelings towards drug users, and I think I am perfectly justified in doing so. At the very least anyone using illegal drugs is directly funding a string of drug dealers which on its own is bad enough, before you even look at any other factors.
My neighbour probably thinks his cannabis is only personal to him, but it sucks to come home and find my house stinking of his filth because it's seeped through under the wooden floorboards into my home.
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+ Show Spoiler +On October 17 2011 19:25 DarQraven wrote: For me it comes down to not really respecting someone's personality/mind when they feel a need to take mind-alterating substances on a regular basis to be able to enjoy themselves or feel worthwhile. Now don't come at me with the weak-ass "everything is a mind-alterating substance" BS; sugar, caffeine and vitamins aren't even remotely close to the effects of alcohol, thc and other drugs.
Drink when you're out partying? Fine. Pretty much anyone does, you don't go to a club to have philosophical discussions. Drink yourself into throwing up? Maybe not so good. Smoke marijuana every so often? Fine. Do as you please. Smoke every day and be high for most of your waking week? Don't expect me to see you as "just someone doing what they enjoy".
Let me ask you, what is the concensus about people who drink every single day, and up to a point where they won't be all 'there' anymore? Not just one glass of wine or something, think along the lines of 4+ beers every day (since that's around the same level of fucked-upness that marijuana tends to give you, at least for me)? You'd label those people alcoholics, don't lie. You'd say they have a drinking problem. You would say they are probably having issues of some sort.
Then why should I be completely fine with people who are stoned every day, most of the day?
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It's not so much discrimination as cold hard fact that you won't be clear as day when you're on drugs - that's the entire point of the stuff. You're not really yourself anymore. When I did weedcake, I laughed about jokes that I didn't even understand or fully hear, even if something in me was telling me that they really didn't make sense. I'd laugh about stuff that wasn't even a joke, just a word that sounded funny. All my 'brilliant discoveries and ideas' that I had that night were utter shit, as the tape recorder I had on during that night proved the next day. Stuff along the lines of "maybe we should put these (decorative cake sprinkles) on that snail over there, that would be awesome!" and a friend responding with "I want pizza", followed by uncontrollable laughter for about 15 minutes.
Basically, when I meet someone who is high, I just don't take them seriously anymore or even listen/talk, if at all possible. What they're like at that moment is not what they're like at other times, what they say doesn't mean anything - you're not talking to the real person you're standing in front of. Based on that, when someone is stoned 4 days out of 5, I just don't take them seriously at all or want much to do with them. That's not me thinking they're going to attack me in any way, that's just me not giving a shit about them because they have nothing about them that interests me.
if you met Richard Branson or Ted Turner while they were blazed would you listen to what they had to say?
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I smoke pot occasionally and that hasn't stopped me from going to school or work. In my mind if someone can use drugs and still be a "productive" member of society then who cares. My friends dad smoked crack but he also owned his own business ran it quite successfully. My parents used to smoke pot and both of them are very successful. I myself drink alcohol smoke cigarettes and pot. I also go to school have two jobs and still find time to play SC2. It's all about moderation .
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On October 17 2011 19:31 Hairy wrote: The poll is flawed. "Is prejudice against drug users wrong?" implies that drug users are some kind of innocent party, and that there is no justification for negative feelings towards drug users... which I think is nonsense. At the very least anyone using illegal drugs is directly funding a string of drug dealers which on its own is bad enough, before you even look at any other factors.
Dude.. purchasing new clothes very often means you are funding slavery in poor countries. Tobacco has had a history of using children for cheap labor in the tobacco fields. When you choose the cheaper meat in the supermarket you are supporting companies exploiting farmers in third world countries, you're ruining things for farmers in your own country as well as contributing to pollution and global warming.
Your argument is very flawed.
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I don't give a shit if someone gets some white powder in front of me and snorts it. It doesn't poison me, it's his choice, I don't care. But a person smoking next to non-smokers - that's what really makes me mad ! As for the "different type of drugs" argument - coke users don't smell nearly as bad as marijuana junkies, is it a prejudice to stay away from the awful marijuana smell ?
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On October 17 2011 19:36 Snusdosa wrote:Show nested quote +On October 17 2011 19:31 Hairy wrote: The poll is flawed. "Is prejudice against drug users wrong?" implies that drug users are some kind of innocent party, and that there is no justification for negative feelings towards drug users... which I think is nonsense. At the very least anyone using illegal drugs is directly funding a string of drug dealers which on its own is bad enough, before you even look at any other factors. Dude.. purchasing new clothes very often means you are funding slavery in poor countries. Tobacco has had a history of using children for cheap labor in the tobacco fields. When you choose the cheaper meat in the supermarket you are supporting companies exploiting farmers in third world countries, you're ruining things for farmers in your own country as well as contributing to pollution and global warming. Your argument is very flawed. I don't buy clothes from anywhere I know uses sweatshops, and I don't really buy that many to begin with. I don't smoke tobacco, and I buy meat farmed from local sources. It might be more expensive, sure, but I have plenty of money saved because I don't waste it on cigarettes....
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On October 17 2011 19:33 Immaterial wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On October 17 2011 19:25 DarQraven wrote: For me it comes down to not really respecting someone's personality/mind when they feel a need to take mind-alterating substances on a regular basis to be able to enjoy themselves or feel worthwhile. Now don't come at me with the weak-ass "everything is a mind-alterating substance" BS; sugar, caffeine and vitamins aren't even remotely close to the effects of alcohol, thc and other drugs.
Drink when you're out partying? Fine. Pretty much anyone does, you don't go to a club to have philosophical discussions. Drink yourself into throwing up? Maybe not so good. Smoke marijuana every so often? Fine. Do as you please. Smoke every day and be high for most of your waking week? Don't expect me to see you as "just someone doing what they enjoy".
Let me ask you, what is the concensus about people who drink every single day, and up to a point where they won't be all 'there' anymore? Not just one glass of wine or something, think along the lines of 4+ beers every day (since that's around the same level of fucked-upness that marijuana tends to give you, at least for me)? You'd label those people alcoholics, don't lie. You'd say they have a drinking problem. You would say they are probably having issues of some sort.
Then why should I be completely fine with people who are stoned every day, most of the day?
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It's not so much discrimination as cold hard fact that you won't be clear as day when you're on drugs - that's the entire point of the stuff. You're not really yourself anymore. When I did weedcake, I laughed about jokes that I didn't even understand or fully hear, even if something in me was telling me that they really didn't make sense. I'd laugh about stuff that wasn't even a joke, just a word that sounded funny. All my 'brilliant discoveries and ideas' that I had that night were utter shit, as the tape recorder I had on during that night proved the next day. Stuff along the lines of "maybe we should put these (decorative cake sprinkles) on that snail over there, that would be awesome!" and a friend responding with "I want pizza", followed by uncontrollable laughter for about 15 minutes.
Basically, when I meet someone who is high, I just don't take them seriously anymore or even listen/talk, if at all possible. What they're like at that moment is not what they're like at other times, what they say doesn't mean anything - you're not talking to the real person you're standing in front of. Based on that, when someone is stoned 4 days out of 5, I just don't take them seriously at all or want much to do with them. That's not me thinking they're going to attack me in any way, that's just me not giving a shit about them because they have nothing about them that interests me. if you met Richard Branson or Ted Turner while they were blazed would you listen to what they had to say?
Probably not, since what they'd have to say at that point is probably not what they are famous or to be respected for. Furthermore, I couldn't take a word they'd say seriously because if they truly are "blazed" then they're most likely to be babbling about irrelevant shit or not making much sense, if my experiences with drugs are anything to go by.
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