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Rimstalker
Germany734 Posts
http://www.spiegel.de/wissenschaft/technik/italiener-andrea-rossi-will-fusionsreaktor-erfunden-haben-a-935081.html says that the scientists from Stockholm and Uppsala found strong indicators that it does indeed work - but not proof -, but it's so revolutionary that they would want a 2nd round of experiments. Both scientists quoted say they are pretty sure that there was no cheating involved. | ||
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Broetchenholer
Germany1964 Posts
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Superouman
France2195 Posts
Can't they just acknowledge they are bullshiting everyone? I know it's hard but it's stll better than getting humiliated from the results. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On November 27 2013 20:14 Broetchenholer wrote: I really don't understand this. The system either provides the power he advertises or it does not. If it does not, which is overwhelmingly plausible, he goes to jail for fraud and fals advertising, earning nothing from this, except that some scientist will remember his name for being that hoax guy... If it does provide the energy, why being so secretive about it? This thing would make one of the biggest industries on earth absolete, you want to go out to the public and show everyone you are right about this, so that your project cannot be stopped by your sudden and eunexpected death OR sell it to an energy mega corporation for a ridiculous amount of money. But you don't advertise it shadily. It makes no sense whatsoever... If this would be forum, i would say this guy just trolls for the attention, anything else would be completely unlogical... He did actually sell it. It does not belong to him anymore from what I've read. Some business in the US owns it now. | ||
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Danglars
United States12133 Posts
On November 27 2013 20:23 Ropid wrote: He did actually sell it. It does not belong to him anymore from what I've read. Some business in the US owns it now. Originally I thought it was bought by a Greek business. Or, at least one of his E-Cat applications in a shipping container was. Simply the lack of a massive news story on its success gave me doubts as to its efficacy. I would expect a company thoroughly satisfied with his ECats in series to publish its success. | ||
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Cascade
Australia5405 Posts
On November 27 2013 17:32 phil.ipp wrote: yeah yeah its coming .. you just have to wait a little bit more ... Sums it up imo.  Well played.  | ||
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Broetchenholer
Germany1964 Posts
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Maenander
Germany4926 Posts
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LaLuSh
Sweden2358 Posts
If it's a hoax, well then nobody cares. | ||
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Umpteen
United Kingdom1570 Posts
For instance, you heat the EC up, and it proceeds to generate more heat than you put in. So far, so fossil fuel. So why isn't it self-sustaining? How can the heat from the resistance coils be enough to start the reaction, but the greater heat generated by the reaction be insufficient to prolong it? Then there's the way the input power was measured, which absolutely reeks of stage magician trickery. The investigators were allowed to monitor the cables connected to the 'control box', but not the cables connecting the control box to the reactor, on the grounds that the waveform used to heat the resistance coils was a 'trade secret'. Fuck off. You're heating up some metal. If you're worried about disclosing waveforms, just attach an old-fashioned voltmeter with a needle. Only you can't, can you, because that would reveal you're sneaking power into the device the whole time. | ||
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Dekoth
United States527 Posts
So if it works, it will Never see the light of day. If it doesn't work, then obviously it would never see the light of day. Either way there is Zero chance of this "Revolutionizing" anything because those in power wouldn't have it. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + I don't actually believe this, he's actually just fucking with everybody because he likes money. | ||
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hypercube
Hungary2735 Posts
On November 28 2013 00:20 Dekoth wrote: Bought by "US" company. So if it works, it will Never see the light of day. If it doesn't work, then obviously it would never see the light of day. Either way there is Zero chance of this "Revolutionizing" anything because those in power wouldn't have it. How about this: If it doesn't work the oil companies killed it. If it does work... well, it doesn't, but see above. | ||
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BlackJack
United States10574 Posts
On November 30 2013 14:49 hypercube wrote: How about this: If it doesn't work the oil companies killed it. If it does work... well, it doesn't, but see above. Yep, no matter what happens there will be a significant group of people that believe in it and nothing will ever change their mind. If it never comes to fruition then the only explanation to them is that it was sabotaged by the powers that be. Just another conspiracy for their gullible delusional minds to yammer about. | ||
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shaftofpleasure
Korea (North)1375 Posts
On November 30 2013 14:49 hypercube wrote: How about this: If it doesn't work the oil companies killed it. If it does work... well, it doesn't, but see above. illerinatee IMO | ||
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xM(Z
Romania5299 Posts
On November 27 2013 20:14 Broetchenholer wrote: I really don't understand this. The system either provides the power he advertises or it does not. If it does not, which is overwhelmingly plausible, he goes to jail for fraud and fals advertising, earning nothing from this, except that some scientist will remember his name for being that hoax guy... If it does provide the energy, why being so secretive about it? This thing would make one of the biggest industries on earth absolete, you want to go out to the public and show everyone you are right about this, so that your project cannot be stopped by your sudden and eunexpected death OR sell it to an energy mega corporation for a ridiculous amount of money. But you don't advertise it shadily. It makes no sense whatsoever... If this would be forum, i would say this guy just trolls for the attention, anything else would be completely unlogical... or, it does work but no one knows why or how which makes it unpatentable but sellable. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7032 Posts
On November 30 2013 14:49 hypercube wrote: How about this: If it doesn't work the oil companies killed it. If it does work... well, it doesn't, but see above. Suddenly I have an image of mailmen trying to assassinate the inventor of the telegraph. | ||
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hp.Shell
United States2527 Posts
You can read the long form here, the actual patent application. There are actual equations describing the reactions, and similar documentation included. It is far too long to quote here. http://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2009125444&recNum=1&maxRec=&office=&prevFilter=&sortOption=&queryString=&tab=PCTDescription I found this link by clicking a full-text and image link from uspto.gov, after searching for Public Patent Application Information under PCT with code PCT/IT2008/000532 (uspto.gov does not allow for direct linking of the result page.) | ||
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Cascade
Australia5405 Posts
On December 01 2013 01:33 hp.Shell wrote: I posted this in the other (closed) topic. Perhaps it will be an interesting read here as well. You can read the long form here, the actual patent application. There are actual equations describing the reactions, and similar documentation included. It is far too long to quote here. http://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/detail.jsf?docId=WO2009125444&recNum=1&maxRec=&office=&prevFilter=&sortOption=&queryString=&tab=PCTDescription I found this link by clicking a full-text and image link from uspto.gov, after searching for Public Patent Application Information under PCT with code PCT/IT2008/000532 (uspto.gov does not allow for direct linking of the result page.) Skimming through quickly, I can't find anything helpful in that link. He refers to E=mc2 as "the einstein equation", which is a very silly thing to do outside popular literature... (this is Einstein's equation in real science) The equations he has is 1) the beta decay, which has been known for many decades. 2) A calculation of how much energy he would gain, IF the reaction he claims actually happens. Which any particle physics student can repeat. Well, the closer I look, the more lol it seems, and the less he seems to know about this... but well, not surprised. edited for manners | ||
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Abraxas514
Canada475 Posts
http://periodictable.com/Isotopes/029.72/index.p.full.html for more isotopes. Here is one method for producing Cu-67: http://www.google.com/patents/US20130083882 67 has a half life of 2.5764d which makes it difficult to use. Compare to U-235 and U-234 with half lives of 10E8 and 10E5 years. If you could isolate the copper and then flow it into the reaction chamber in one building, I could see this as a possibility. (No need to compare neutron capture to annihilation. Just saying the isotope is decaying so rapidly just handling it would be a problem.) Another issue would be in natural occurrence of the isotope, which no website can validate, which makes it seem like it's impossible to find in nature. ELI 1st year physics student: While the patent makes sense from a first-law point of view, the isotope isn't found in nature and would need to be made in a lab. This lab would need to package the copper within a day or two or lose half of its energy and decay rate. From a second-law point of view it should be impossible to create the isotope, combine it, and generate net work through a heat engine likely operating at 500K-1000K. Unless he has a secret way of making radio-isotopes...... | ||
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