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Nazarid
United States445 Posts
On November 12 2010 23:38 Zoler wrote: Things like this keep making me doubt USA being a civilized country. -.- User was warned for this post pretty stupid thing to say imo | ||
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Carentino
Sweden4 Posts
On November 13 2010 02:17 a176 wrote: Of course the school is not going to allow it. It took me all of a minute to find this, You can't take that quote to mean what you say becuase depending on there placement on the conservative liberal scale they might not have anything against homosexuality. For example I can mention that one of the bishops of the swedish church is a lesbian. So unless you know exactly where they stand you can't take the stand you seem to do. | ||
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Zorkmid
4410 Posts
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Respectfulwon
48 Posts
On November 13 2010 02:26 Carentino wrote: You can't take that quote to mean what you say becuase depending on there placement on the conservative liberal scale they might not have anything against homosexuality. For example I can mention that one of the bishops of the swedish church is a lesbian. So unless you know exactly where they stand you can't take the stand you seem to do. Saying is one thing then actually knowing. In this case, it was clearly broadcasted. | ||
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danl9rm
United States3111 Posts
On November 12 2010 03:39 FishForThought wrote: ... it would be discrimination if they refuse to let her join the formal because of her sexual orientation but it is not discrimination to forbid her to bring guest of the same sex. The formal is hosted by the school, they have all rights to create rules and guidelines for the event. If the event specified that all guests must be males, then there is no discrimination involved. People need to stop getting all defensive and insecure about these things; sooner or later people will cry sexist for not being able to get into an all female/male school because he or she is not that gender, or cry free speech violation for not being able to enter a restaurant nude. This is correct. Thanks Fish. For. Eat? Anyway, I'm against both discrimination (of any kind) and any moral ground that states being/supporting a gay lifestyle is just fine. They are two different things, however. They cross paths sometimes, maybe often, but they are not the same. They should have been allowed to go to the dance regardless of their 'orientation,' but they should not have been allowed to go together as a couple. And that is just what happened. I don't see the problem. All these arguments ever boil down to is what you believe morally. If you believe homosexuality is morally ok, then you probably support the girls in their anger. If you believe homosexuality is morally wrong, then you should disagree that this is a problem. People will argue about discrimination issues, but it has not yet reached that bridge until you first solve the morality question. | ||
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Crushgroove
United States793 Posts
Her sexual preference issue is fair, however. She should be able to go the damn dance with whatever "guest" she chooses. EDIT: After reading the post above me, I retract the last part of the statement. Schools making rules is fine, especially if they apply to everyone. I feel for troubled youth. | ||
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On November 13 2010 01:59 Asjo wrote: I'm curious, since you sound so certain that they are lying, what do you feel puts you in a position to judge whether they are lying. historical precedent. | ||
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Asjo
Denmark664 Posts
If only using historical precedent, you would have to conclude they aren't lying. Since, after all, historically, schools surely haven't lied about the majority of decisions of this kind. That aside, we have to deal with the fact that we know that not all schools are lying about rules they make for formal events - far from it. So, regardless of historical precedent, which can only support suspicion, there must be other factors in this case to give cause for your certainty in judging their motives. Edit: Unless what you mean is that you are using intuition, through a subconscious process judging from fine details where you recognize very specific patterns of behaviour you have observed previously. In other words, it "feels" obvious that they are wrong, even if you don't know why exactly. | ||
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red_b
United States1267 Posts
On November 13 2010 02:59 Asjo wrote: If only using historical precedent, you would have to conclude they aren't lying. Since, after all, historically, schools surely haven't lied about the majority of decisions of this kind. except for that school that told the lesbian girl their prom was canceled then held a secret one she couldnt go to? http://sdgln.com/news/2010/10/26/mississippi-school-pays-dearly-denying-lesbian-student-constance-mcmillen-her-prom-w | ||
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Asjo
Denmark664 Posts
On November 13 2010 03:08 red_b wrote: except for that school that told the lesbian girl their prom was canceled then held a secret one she couldnt go to? http://sdgln.com/news/2010/10/26/mississippi-school-pays-dearly-denying-lesbian-student-constance-mcmillen-her-prom-w I don't get it. Are you making your case by highlighting one instance out of what surely must be millions? If so, what ends does that serve? | ||
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Scrapiron
74 Posts
PRIVATE SCHOOL CHRISTIAN SCHOOL And they can do whatever they want in regards to situations like this. My school (Private, Christian) Expelled a student who became openly gay. Its my guess that if the other students there are Christian, the girls' relationship makes them very uncomfortable and probably would not be unhappy with a similar decision. Also, whats with the pitiful "they took our posters down!" of course they did, it is not an open forum for discussion there. You go to a school like that, you play by their rules. END OF STORY. | ||
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Xahhk
Canada540 Posts
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besiger
Croatia2452 Posts
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
Why can private schools discriminate, but private businesses cannot? For example, if I want to open my own restaurant, not funded by the government or anything, I cannot refuse service to homosexual couples, minorities, whites, etc. Where in the law does it make schools exempt? | ||
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Ympulse
United States287 Posts
On November 13 2010 04:18 FabledIntegral wrote: I have a question for people that keep using hte "private argument." This is not rhetorical, it's an actual question in which I don't know the answer. Why can private schools discriminate, but private businesses cannot? For example, if I want to open my own restaurant, not funded by the government or anything, I cannot refuse service to homosexual couples, minorities, whites, etc. Where in the law does it make schools exempt? It actually depends on what kind of business you are undertaking and wether or not it's open to the public. You can't open a pizza parlor and say 'heterosexual adult white males only' but you could, for example, provide an invite-only service of whatever sort (we'll say a gun club, for sake of argument) and you're able to discriminate however you please. | ||
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MangoTango
United States3670 Posts
On November 13 2010 03:15 Scrapiron wrote: It is a: PRIVATE SCHOOL CHRISTIAN SCHOOL And they can do whatever they want in regards to situations like this. My school (Private, Christian) Expelled a student who became openly gay. Its my guess that if the other students there are Christian, the girls' relationship makes them very uncomfortable and probably would not be unhappy with a similar decision. Also, whats with the pitiful "they took our posters down!" of course they did, it is not an open forum for discussion there. You go to a school like that, you play by their rules. END OF STORY. Long have bigots hidden behind this skirt, but the courts have ruled overwhelmingly that private institutions and religious institutions can still violate civil rights. It doesn't matter that they are closed-enrollment, unless it can be materially proven that the student was removed for a reason other than sexual orientation, the court requiring very strong evidence here. | ||
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
On November 13 2010 04:24 Ympulse wrote: It actually depends on what kind of business you are undertaking and wether or not it's open to the public. You can't open a pizza parlor and say 'heterosexual adult white males only' but you could, for example, provide an invite-only service of whatever sort (we'll say a gun club, for sake of argument) and you're able to discriminate however you please. So say I wanted an invite-only service for a gun club. I could openly state "invitations will only be given out to heterosexual white males. No homosexuals, minorities, or females allowed. If we find out you have any color in your blood you will be asked to leave." | ||
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Ympulse
United States287 Posts
On November 13 2010 04:29 FabledIntegral wrote: So say I wanted an invite-only service for a gun club. I could openly state "invitations will only be given out to heterosexual white males. No homosexuals, minorities, or females allowed. If we find out you have any color in your blood you will be asked to leave." Worded more carefully, yes. | ||
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Wrathgarr
United States32 Posts
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NovaTheFeared
United States7222 Posts
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