On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
Do you honestly believe that? That people will learn from their mistakes and always think back to the massacre of the 24th of July, 2010, whenever an event might get crowded? That there aren't already tons of occurrences every year where people had to die for the stupidest of reasons?
And I'm going to pretend that what you meant to say is, "It's tragic that these people died. I hope this serves as a lesson for future events."
Yes, I believe that after this event, most people will not learn, but organizers of all sorts of events will take notice. People dying of stupidity will decrease as well. If this tragedy deters a slim 100,000 people from attending the next loveparade, I think that's a benefit. You don't need an absolute 0 stupidity deaths to call it a benefiting change.
from what ive read they wont hold another love parade ever because of this, but I dont think it will change much with stampedes like this, a few years back a bunch of people died at a festival because it started to rain and they all flooded into the subway crushing people to death, I cant imagine a more stupid and horrible way to go, and as long as there are big crowds its gonna happen when panic sets in.
On July 26 2010 08:12 besiger wrote: it just disgusts me that people kept packing in at the entrance, how fucking hard is it to see you cant fit more people in
Maybe it's a good thing that they didn't know something was going on.. It could have been bigger otherwise.
On July 26 2010 08:10 twiggy wrote: Lots of people are blaming the organizers. Sure, it's easy to do that. But I say blame the people who attended (or at least those that were involved in the stampede).
It's their job to think about the security, it's not like crowd phenomenons are something new. The path of the love parade or the estimation of people coming? There is definitely something that the organizers fucked up.
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
You're right, this never happened before and this is why it happened. NEVER AGAIN WILL PEOPLE GET TRAMPLED TO DEATH FOR NOW, WE HAVE THE EXPERIENCE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HUMAN HISTORY.
But no seriously, get acquainted with common sense. This happens all the time. In 3 days we'll forget and in 3 months it'll happen again. Those 19 people died for nothing.
On July 26 2010 08:12 besiger wrote: it just disgusts me that people kept packing in at the entrance, how fucking hard is it to see you cant fit more people in
Maybe it's a good thing that they didn't know something was going on.. It could have been bigger otherwise.
On July 26 2010 08:10 twiggy wrote: Lots of people are blaming the organizers. Sure, it's easy to do that. But I say blame the people who attended (or at least those that were involved in the stampede).
It's their job to think about the security, it's not like crowd phenomenons are something new. The path of the love parade or the estimation of people coming? There is definitely something that the organizers fucked up.
well its true that the organizers should have prepared better, but it just kind of makes me sick when the news try to pile all the blame on them, like the all the people involved had no responsibility. Now I dont know the whole story but from what i gathered the rest of the people that were at the tunnel entrance, people that were in no danger, just kept trying to get in even though they were told to stop and to go back because there is no more room, and I blame those people as much as the organization.
The people did not die in the tunnel. All of them were found on the one side of the tunnel, where there was a ramp leading up. So far it is believed that most of the people who died, died because they fell down, while they were trying to climb up the wall where the ramp was. I couldn't find any information on the exact change of events, don't know if panic occured so the people tried climbing up the wall, or if they fell down and then panic occured.
Nevertheless, it was a really terrible location choice by the organizers. Also incredible that they turned down a proposed security plan that would have allegedly provided far more safety for the crowd, because it was too expensive... And the fuck is wrong with people!? Why would you trample over anybody?? Especially, if there is no real danger like a fire or armed nutjobs...
While I agree the organizers are partially responsible, I also agree with the people who say much of the blame falls on the people who went there. In particular the people who came in last are dumb fucks. This isn't the first time this has happened but everytime it does hopefully it deters some people from going to such events as well as knock some sense into organizers.
It sounds terrible but natural selection at work...
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
You're right, this never happened before and this is why it happened. NEVER AGAIN WILL PEOPLE GET TRAMPLED TO DEATH FOR NOW, WE HAVE THE EXPERIENCE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HUMAN HISTORY.
But no seriously, get acquainted with common sense. This happens all the time. In 3 days we'll forget and in 3 months it'll happen again. Those 19 people died for nothing.
This event has a guaranteed effect on future loveparades. The probability of 19 people dying in a loveparade is the same regardless of which year it happens, so essentially, we are saving the 19 people that would have died next year by having them die this year. That in itself is a fair trade. On top of that, there is definitely a good chance that people will learn from this. It doesn't have to be a million people being saved, just a few thousand people will suffice. Heck the people reading this thread will probably think twice about going to major events in the future. That will amount to an overall more people saved.
I think you are wrong about this event being forgotten. It will be forgotten in the media for sure, but it will not for event organizers. As an engineer, I am taught of all the bridges that collapsed, all the buildings that fell down, etc, and why it happened. This will make a difference to future organizers, it doesn't have to be a 100% difference.
On July 26 2010 08:37 ggrrg wrote: And the fuck is wrong with people!? Why would you trample over anybody?? Especially, if there is no real danger like a fire or armed nutjobs...
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
I don't think a lesson was learned here, expect the same thing at the next parade. SAD BUT TRUEEEEE.
On July 26 2010 08:37 ggrrg wrote: And the fuck is wrong with people!? Why would you trample over anybody?? Especially, if there is no real danger like a fire or armed nutjobs...
It's natural. You and I would do the same.
Yes. It's not like anybody decides "Hey, there is a poor guy on the ground, lets trample him to death!". When you are in an area without exit, being pushed around by a trillion other people in the same situation you can't choose where to stand and where not to - if they push you on top of somebody, you cannot step to the side or something. Also you are probably worried for your own safety in the first place... I have always shun crowds, for a good reason it looks like. Considering what kind of shit is going on every day all over the world 19 people does not sound like a lot frankly, but what makes me sorry the most is that it happened at the Loveparade of all places and that several hundreds of thousands of people are probably are shocked, feel responsible and had this huge event of love and peace turned into a desaster.
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
You're right, this never happened before and this is why it happened. NEVER AGAIN WILL PEOPLE GET TRAMPLED TO DEATH FOR NOW, WE HAVE THE EXPERIENCE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HUMAN HISTORY.
But no seriously, get acquainted with common sense. This happens all the time. In 3 days we'll forget and in 3 months it'll happen again. Those 19 people died for nothing.
This event has a guaranteed effect on future loveparades. The probability of 19 people dying in a loveparade is the same regardless of which year it happens, so essentially, we are saving the 19 people that would have died next year by having them die this year. That in itself is a fair trade. On top of that, there is definitely a good chance that people will learn from this. It doesn't have to be a million people being saved, just a few thousand people will suffice. Heck the people reading this thread will probably think twice about going to major events in the future. That will amount to an overall more people saved.
I think you are wrong about this event being forgotten. It will be forgotten in the media for sure, but it will not for event organizers. As an engineer, I am taught of all the bridges that collapsed, all the buildings that fell down, etc, and why it happened. This will make a difference to future organizers, it doesn't have to be a 100% difference.
19 people saved "this year instead of next year" being a fair trade makes no sense. That's like me shooting a guy in the head and saying "well, you were going to die eventually anyways. It's not like anything's going to change that."
Also, if this truly will deter future deaths, then explain to me why people still drink and drive? 25,000 people die from drunk driving accidents every year, yet no matter how many people seem to die, people still feel inclined to get behind the wheel drunk out of their minds.
It's not a fair trade. It's simply a disaster that could have been avoided.
On July 26 2010 08:40 On_Slaught wrote: While I agree the organizers are partially responsible, I also agree with the people who say much of the blame falls on the people who went there. In particular the people who came in last are dumb fucks. This isn't the first time this has happened but everytime it does hopefully it deters some people from going to such events as well as knock some sense into organizers.
It sounds terrible but natural selection at work...
how is that natural selection at work? you could have easily been one of those 19 people... it's not just people who made the dumb decision of continuing to enter that died.
On July 26 2010 07:54 bibogrape wrote: I guess you can say they were stomped
User was warned for this post
is there some kind of meaning to his post that I am missing? How is it that mods complain about "the influx of retarded posters" "so many retarded posters it's so hard to handle", and then we get people like this, that make this post, on literally his FIRST POST, and he's only warned? uh, excuse me, this seems like a pretty obvious perm ban - get this idiot off the site immediately forever. am i missing something? this isn't the only post like this I've seen where some idiot makes a horrible horrible post and only gets a warning. im sorry but it just pisses me off so bad when other people get banned for posts that don't contain malice or negativity and are much better than this, but then this guy makes this post for literally his first post and we are going to keep this kind of guy on the site.
ok whatever mods, if you want to continue to deal with this guy in the future i guess that's your business, meanwhile the rest of us will try to ignore the shit on our screen.
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
people have been dying in stampedes at concerts for ages. People won't learn from this =/
Yeah, it kind of sucks that because SC2 is coming out, Starcraft is getting a lot more attention and so all the Xbox Live clowns are coming to this community that was good a mere month ago. I really hope that this doesn't go down hill and these little ignorant kids who live off mommy's paycheck go away.
To make a joke about a human life LOST like this is pathetic and that kind of person shouldn't be apart of this, or any community. Sorry to burst the bubble of some of these people but it's NOT COOL seeing as thats what you'r intention was. Idiot.
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole.
I hate this post so much
If it takes people dying in order to tell even organizers to choose their locations wisely, and to tell people to not flood a certain place when told to go back, then it was going to happen sooner or later. You can take your pick when and where it happens, and how many people die from it. I think it could have been a lot worse.
You're right, this never happened before and this is why it happened. NEVER AGAIN WILL PEOPLE GET TRAMPLED TO DEATH FOR NOW, WE HAVE THE EXPERIENCE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HUMAN HISTORY.
But no seriously, get acquainted with common sense. This happens all the time. In 3 days we'll forget and in 3 months it'll happen again. Those 19 people died for nothing.
This event has a guaranteed effect on future loveparades. The probability of 19 people dying in a loveparade is the same regardless of which year it happens, so essentially, we are saving the 19 people that would have died next year by having them die this year. That in itself is a fair trade. On top of that, there is definitely a good chance that people will learn from this. It doesn't have to be a million people being saved, just a few thousand people will suffice. Heck the people reading this thread will probably think twice about going to major events in the future. That will amount to an overall more people saved.
I think you are wrong about this event being forgotten. It will be forgotten in the media for sure, but it will not for event organizers. As an engineer, I am taught of all the bridges that collapsed, all the buildings that fell down, etc, and why it happened. This will make a difference to future organizers, it doesn't have to be a 100% difference.
19 people saved "this year instead of next year" being a fair trade makes no sense. That's like me shooting a guy in the head and saying "well, you were going to die eventually anyways. It's not like anything's going to change that."
Also, if this truly will deter future deaths, then explain to me why people still drink and drive? 25,000 people die from drunk driving accidents every year, yet no matter how many people seem to die, people still feel inclined to get behind the wheel drunk out of their minds.
It's not a fair trade. It's simply a disaster that could have been avoided.
19 this year instead of next year is entirely different from shooting someone. The life of a random individual bears the same value between this year and the next. Shooting a specific person in the head while they are young has a much greater consequence than the person dying of old age.
With your second statement, you are forgetting that it doesn't have to be a 100% stop for it to be effective. People die from drinking and driving. At a result, Your school teaches you not to drink and drink. There are commercials and posters saying that you shouldn't drink and drive. There is a significant fine for drinking and driving. Bartenders take away your keys if you are drunk. The list goes on. Are you saying that 25,000 people will die each year regardless of what we do?
EPT
