EPTa place for max 350.000 people for an event with 1-1,5 million people ... it was so sure ...
rip for all 19 dead people and i hope all 300 injured get well soon ... its so tragic
19 people killed at the Love Parade - Page 4
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ColorsOfRainbow
Germany354 Posts
a place for max 350.000 people for an event with 1-1,5 million people ... it was so sure ... rip for all 19 dead people and i hope all 300 injured get well soon ... its so tragic | ||
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Zexion
Sweden971 Posts
On July 26 2010 08:08 Chairman Ray wrote: I think it's for the better that it happened. This will not only deter people from coming to future loveparades, but also deter people from attending overcrowded events as a whole. You're saying that people learn from their mistakes? No, we don't. Especially not when big things like this happens. Why do we still have wars for example? And I also think this is a case of conformity, at least a big part of it. Of course they knew there would be problems...it's quite obvious. The main responsibles were probably just greedy/lazy or whatever you want to call it, while those who worked under them didn't say anything because of conformity. There has been cases like this before and there will be more. Remember the Space shuttle Columbia disaster in 2003? Or the Challenger disaster in 1986 (I wasn't born then so I don't really "remember" it)? I'm sure there were people who knew that something was wrong... | ||
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Monsen
Germany2548 Posts
On July 26 2010 18:50 BeMannerDuPenner wrote: thats what pisses me off so hard. the people really responsible for this crap wont be punished and the love parade(a really amazing thing) ends because some retard greedy idiots with no fkkin clue were too stupid to realise that 1,5m people in a 250k area with only one entrance which is also the only exit might be a problem. Well no. The Loveparade will end because it was an sponsored event which no sponsor in their right mind will want to be associated with now. The mass panic in Roskilde was just as terrible, but they could go on (with some major security improvements) just fine. However I'm pretty sure that there will some kind of commercial festival (with tickets and thus a limited amount of ppl) to take the Loveparades place. There's just too much money to be made from all those Ravers. | ||
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furymonkey
New Zealand1587 Posts
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Electric.Jesus
Germany755 Posts
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ghermination
United States2851 Posts
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Lennon
United Kingdom2275 Posts
Imagine being stuck in the middle of one million sweaty people stacked like sardines being knocked around on a warm day. It would be hard to breathe and there would be no way of getting out because there was only one small exit. You'd try to look back but just see thousands of panicked faces. How sad. | ||
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furymonkey
New Zealand1587 Posts
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imperator-xy
Germany1366 Posts
On July 26 2010 19:03 ColorsOfRainbow wrote: i am from krefeld that is the city next to duisburg and all trains stopped here after that and i heard about it ... i am happy i am no techno fan because of the near i would be there 100% ... still the chance to be one of the deaths is about 0,001%, so you dont realy have to be scared i dont get why they chose an area as small as that. why not just do it on a autobahn like 2 years before in dortmund but people going crazy is not the organizers fault, people are just stupid if the police tells them to turn around and leave and they still try to go in | ||
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PhilGood2DaY
Germany7424 Posts
This shit didnt happen due to stupid people acting like retards. You can put a million 'clever' people not on drugs in the exact same position and the outcome is the same. Im getting so sick oft freaking idiots saying it was due to drugs/alcohol or people pushing. When there is a big event everyone wants to get in. When half wants out and half wants in on the same route which is faar to small shit is just bound to happen. Its just so crazy. Imagine you and your girlfriend being there and because shes just physically weaker simply dies.. Crazy stuff.. cliffnotes: Its not the peoples faults but the organizers. Its not the stupid mass of people on drugs that caused this. It doesnt matter which kind of persons are in this position as long as there is not enough space and basically no where to go u can put any kind of group in this situation the outcome will always be the same: Fighting for survival.. | ||
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besiger
Croatia2452 Posts
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figq
12519 Posts
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Prdors
United States67 Posts
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BluzMan
Russian Federation4235 Posts
On July 26 2010 20:05 besiger wrote: have you ever been in situations like that, how about you don't call people idiots right off the bat, i have been on both ends of big crowds like that, and have literally seen people start pushing from the back for no other reason than to fucking push forwards because they cant be bothered to wait a few minutes, im not saying thats exactly what happened here, but there are always idiots in a crowd and just chalking everything up to survival instinct doesn't make it right. This man is right. Crowds are very predictable and well-studied. It's not that you can call some people 'idiots' and claim it's their responsibility. No, due to the predictability of the crowd as a whole it's completely organizer's fault and they will have to face punishment. I've been in huge crowds myself, seen people lose conscience, nearly lost it myself. It's not that people inside are stupid, it's just that you're absolutely not informed about what happens in the farther reaches of the crowd and the only people you can see are those 5-10 around you. It takes a vector of will do densify the crowd (like every individual has to reach some kind of goal). It takes a desire to get out for it to start a panic which is uncontrollable. And yeah there will always be like 1% of real idiots inside that push for no real reason, but that 1% is enough to make things hot. | ||
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Starparty
Sweden1963 Posts
On July 26 2010 09:16 travis wrote: how is that natural selection at work? you could have easily been one of those 19 people... it's not just people who made the dumb decision of continuing to enter that died. is there some kind of meaning to his post that I am missing? How is it that mods complain about "the influx of retarded posters" "so many retarded posters it's so hard to handle", and then we get people like this, that make this post, on literally his FIRST POST, and he's only warned? uh, excuse me, this seems like a pretty obvious perm ban - get this idiot off the site immediately forever. am i missing something? this isn't the only post like this I've seen where some idiot makes a horrible horrible post and only gets a warning. im sorry but it just pisses me off so bad when other people get banned for posts that don't contain malice or negativity and are much better than this, but then this guy makes this post for literally his first post and we are going to keep this kind of guy on the site. ok whatever mods, if you want to continue to deal with this guy in the future i guess that's your business, meanwhile the rest of us will try to ignore the shit on our screen. However distasteful, the pun is still decent. There have been alot of pun posts regarding news threads like these and it seems a little rough to me to kick out a perm ban in this specific occasion. It just turns into a debate about what we are allowed to joke about and not. For reference "Stomp" is commonly used as describing dancing at a techno or trance rave. | ||
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PhilGood2DaY
Germany7424 Posts
When there is such a small space for so many people; people who want to go in different directions through it u just cant blame the behaviour of 300.000 persons. It makes no sense. Just watch some of the footage and tell me anything else would have happened if u put chilled, calm and friendly people in the same situation. If a group of 200.000 tries to get out and a group of a even higher amount tries to get in u can be as friendly and nicely as u want.. this shit is bound to happen. Its not the 1 % fault. The 1 % doesnt change anything about the death toll. | ||
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besiger
Croatia2452 Posts
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Corvi
Germany1406 Posts
and yes, officials stated that this was the last love parade. | ||
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Redx
Netherlands77 Posts
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zuqbu
Germany797 Posts
On July 26 2010 19:53 MaGic~PhiL wrote: To all people here who still dont get it: This shit didnt happen due to stupid people acting like retards. You can put a million 'clever' people not on drugs in the exact same position and the outcome is the same. Im getting so sick oft freaking idiots saying it was due to drugs/alcohol or people pushing. When there is a big event everyone wants to get in. When half wants out and half wants in on the same route which is faar to small shit is just bound to happen. seconded. when uninvolved people talk about the loveparade attendence, they use names such as "ravers" and assume everyone there is is drunk, stoned or buffed by various illegal drugs. i'm not denying some people are, but the mayority are pretty normal, from all ages between 14 and 60. i would even say most people don't care for the music at all and are just curious onlookers, or just being there for the sake of having been there. EDIT: now that i think about it, my grandmother was at the 2007 loveparade in essen just out of sheer curiosity. she was 85 then. and i don't suspect my grandmother to have taken any drugs, nor being interested in electronic music. my girlfriend and i were at the parade 2008 in dortmund, and originally planed to spend the whole day there but decided to leave after one hour because it was overcrowded. it was impossible to enjoy, we ended just being pushed around. in dortmund, there were multiple entries/exits to the area, despite this it took us about 1 1/2 hours to leave. due to our personal experiences, we weren't interested in the event this year. after hearing about the mass panic and tragedy we were shocked. after phoning up our relatives and friends who had planned to be there, and finally hearing from everyone that they were luckily ok and not hurt, we were getting more information about the venue in duisburg. i have grown up in muelheim, right next to duisburg. i know the place quite good, and it started to grow on me that this event shouldn't have been hosted there in the first place. projecting the masses of people i have experienced 2 years ago, into this far smaller space, with just one bottleneck entrance/exit is giving me headaches. the main station in duisburg is an even tighter space btw, and traffic there collapsed during the whole day. i have heard from friends, that due to overcrowding people were pushed onto the rail tracks, and trains commuting there (if at all!) were driving at walking speed max. it seems like pure luck, that not more accidents happened there. duisburg has a total of about 490,000 inhabitants, and if the numbers are correct, there were about three times as many people just in the city centre. this city does not have the infrastructure and space needed to host such an event, and it should have been cancelled like the one in bochum which was planned one year ago. | ||
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