• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 13:43
CEST 19:43
KST 02:43
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-60SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-63PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August)8Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE15Weekly Cups (July 20-26): Early returns on 5.0.16b8
StarCraft 2
General
August World Ranking: Clem climbs to #2 Life's Huge Gambling Spree After IEM Katowice 2014 Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Neeb returns to progaming; rejoins ONSYDE SC4ALL II: StarCraft 2 Player Announcement 1/8
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event INu's Battles #19 2-Days Event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL II announced - $10,000 prize pool, Dec 5-6 PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
Mutation # 536 Railroad Switch The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 535 Assembly of Vengeance Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation
Brood War
General
ASL22 General Discussion BW General Discussion Making an Online Broodwar Manager Game BW Drama: Terror's Debt Incident + C9 disbanding BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
SC4ALL II: Brood War - $2500 - Dec 5-6 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues 2v2v2v2 Tournament Escore Tournament - Season 3
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation PvT advise for noobs
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile ZeroSpace Early Access is Now Live!
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The Scarlett Fan Club The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
What is a Gamer?
TrAiDoS
Hello guys!
LIN1s
ASL S22 English Commentary…
namkraft
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4287 users

EVE Corporation - Page 211

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 209 210 211 212 213 2021 Next
https://discord.gg/c8jHgQpMSY

mity hat tree discord if you care
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
December 06 2010 15:15 GMT
#4201
On December 06 2010 22:03 Waxangel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2010 21:07 KwarK wrote:
We literally have around 75 active guys in rifters. It's fucking awesome.


hey fucker, RO16 is starting

pm me what you want done and what my deadline is
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
December 06 2010 15:24 GMT
#4202
On December 06 2010 23:51 Malderon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 06 2010 23:33 Thezzy wrote:
On December 06 2010 22:30 Malderon wrote:
On December 06 2010 20:14 KwarK wrote:
I'm not entirely against the idea of an industrial wing to the corp.


I'm all for it, since then I might get some use out of my Hulk after all :p. Mining in high sec is just not worth it, and I don't trust my knowledge and skill enough to go mining out into low/nullsec alone.


Mining is only worth doing in a group with an Orca, unless you want to be doing something else while you mine.


Then the question is, is it achievable for the corp to get an orca and an active group of miners? In terms of skills, I could get to being able to fly an orca when I get my learning skill SP refunded. Coughing up the necessary isk will be more problematic though :p. Not to mention the fact that my skills in mining would be kind of wasted, so I'd rather keep using my Hulk.

If I still have access to corp finances in a week this is something I'll happily invest in. Motbob is currently seizing all the liquidity for his own vile purposes but worst case scenario I'll invest in you myself.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
December 06 2010 15:30 GMT
#4203
On a related note, motbob, with debts included you've got 8.7b to play with. I can press people for the repayment of those debts if you wish, I'm normally pretty casual about corp debts because liquidity isn't an issue but your call.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Icx
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
Belgium853 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-06 15:47:39
December 06 2010 15:41 GMT
#4204
About the wormhole thing, yes (when you get lucky) you can find good gravi sites even in the lower classes.
+you have the fact that it's 0.0 space without local.

These are points that you can work around, having alts scout out the connected systems, having alts at those connected system, etc.

The biggest problem of all is mass:

So a c1/c2 exit can take around 2 orca jumps back and forth, not counting all the miners and so on.
So going into a wormhole with a gravi, mining it out (or just the abc ores) and then packing everything up and leaving isn't really that feasible since you just can't get everything out again, so your basicly stuck having to wait for a new wormhole to open to preferrably HS (and a good change that that will lead to a place on the other side of k-space of where you want to be).

So that leaves 1 other option for the lower classes:
Set up a pos with a refinery, but again if your just going to mine out that one gravi (and trust me, running into these things is quite rare, like one gravi every two weeks or so, and you can't rely on connected systems, because again you run into mass-problems) you prolly want a small/medium pos, and the refinery's for that suck hard.

The only good way we managed to mine out the gravi sites in our home system wich was a class 5 (indy alts) was basicly to have a rorqual that compressed the ore to haul it out when an exit opened up.

So ye, my opinion about wh-space mining, unless your living in a system and have everything set up for it, it's just not really worth it, in all those hours of probing, scouting, setting up stuff, waiting for exits to open, or refining at crappy percentages, risks of getting ganked (and yes even if your extremely carefull, they do happen in wh-space), you could have run good well-organized mining ops in high-sec with orca support, and altough you would have generated less isk/h, it's a steady income.
I personally prefer making 5mil/hour whenever I want, then to earn 0mil/h untill I get lucky and I get 20mil/h for 2 hours (just making up some numbers).

Is it possible? yes, but I would advise starting out small and doing a bunch of HS mining ops (I mean, the person that said something about the orca couldn't get the isk for it, and don't fly what you can't afford to lose, in this case, don't take that thing into wh-space untill you have spare cash to replace it), and then just expanding from there, getting some general industry running and then from there on you can always have a look at expanding into wh-space mining.

But even then it's more of a corp/group-activity, since most of the time that will mean living there (for either short time, or permanently) so you will need to have some pvp'ers there, and people that can clear spawns/combat sites that are there, since it's a waste having those and not using them :p


edit:

and about the orca, don't forget about all the leadership skills, yes it's a very good platform to scoop cans, but it's mainly about the bonuses it gives, so you will have to be the fleet commander, and depending on the size of the fleet, you will need to have the needed leadership skills.
Then aside from that you want mining director/foreman at 5

and you prolly also want a mining foreman mindlink
Thezzy
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands2117 Posts
December 06 2010 15:50 GMT
#4205
High-sec Grav sites can also be worth it if HS is where you want to start.
I've come across Large Kernite sites before that had over 1mil m3 worth of Kernite in them (having dozens of 30-50k kernite roids of all types).
Jaspet and Omber should be avoided, but Hemorphite is worth as much as Kernite and Hedbergite is worth *slightly* more. (not worth the low-sec risks, but decent enough to mine in a high-sec grav site)
Playing Terran is like flying down a MULE drop in a marine suit, firing a Gauss Rifle
Ahelvin
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
France1866 Posts
December 06 2010 15:56 GMT
#4206
From Takeshi :
Just a post to tell you guys I'm having some exams to deal with ATM, and that I'll be back soon with T2 turrets trained and my lovely rifter !

Looking forward to learn more with you,

Best of luck in the war !
Join the Liquipedia Zerg Project ! PM me for more information :).
tofucake
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Hyrule19232 Posts
December 06 2010 16:44 GMT
#4207
My alt is training up for mining. Just a few days (3 or so?) until Industry V, then I'll be starting on Astrogeology. I can mine decently now in hisec alone. But usually I bring a Thrasher on my main to speed up mining and provide a bit of defense if I go into ratted belts. Having a full crew would be great, though.
Liquipediaasante sana squash banana
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-06 16:57:28
December 06 2010 16:55 GMT
#4208
So they're chilling on station with an absol and a baddon and only have 4 in local so Karah, Thornton and I are like "fuck it, let's do this". I don't dual/tribox because I don't think we really need it and a crash with implants could be really annoying. We get together cane, torpraven (a mistake in retrospect) and a scimmy and go for it. They immediately undock a cane + stiletto and the fight is on. Karah's raven goes down just before it deaggresses but thornton micros like a boss and stays in the fight, neuting + killing a stiletto as it tackles him and then finishing off the cane as he dies. The absol pilot comes back in a huginn and charges down the scimmy. That leaves me on a battlefield with a new undocked cane, a huginn at 0 on me and a baddon. However karah's reshipping into a drake and thornton into a cane and I've made it like 100k off station. Soz and fleisch are logging on and their spider sense for action immediately realises something is up. Seconds later they're in fleet while Karah and Thornton warp to me (and therefore the huginn), just as my scimmy tank breaks. They gun it down while I'm in low armour, 100m kill for the corp. The baddon docks up and undocks in a geddon which is a bad fucking idea because Karah is back to bumping and we've pulled a fleet out of our ass. We pile onto it and it's desperately trying to kill thornton's t1 cane (only thing he had on hand) but failing. I'm overheating the shit out of my scimitar, the armour is broken, the reps are practically on fire, the invulns barely working and I'm still not doing enough. But thornton can fly, he's slipping out of the optimal and picking off drones. He stays until I can't overheat anymore, keeping the geddon aggressed. Finally he warps out and seconds later it blows up.

Score is roughly 310m kill, 190m loss plus we got loot etc.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
December 06 2010 16:55 GMT
#4209
+ Show Spoiler [SPAI] +

[16:46:06] ZxZXWizi > hello
[16:46:12] Wrathful Penguins > lo
[16:46:53] ZxZXWizi > i have some information to sell if interested
[16:47:23] Wrathful Penguins > and what is it?
[16:47:54] ZxZXWizi > just how your current war targets are getting information on you
[16:48:00] Wrathful Penguins > from our forum
[16:48:04] Wrathful Penguins > where it's publicly available
[16:48:13] Wrathful Penguins > and our public channel
[16:48:27] ZxZXWizi > nope
[16:49:02] ZxZXWizi > they have two sources
[16:49:03] Wrathful Penguins > you're gonna have to give me a little more than that then
[16:50:00] ZxZXWizi > look closely at your members and also watch what u say online
[16:50:24] Wrathful Penguins > and how do i tell the difference between you
[16:50:30] Wrathful Penguins > and a guy who has noticed peopel are at war
[16:50:34] Wrathful Penguins > and wants to make some easy isk
[16:50:47] Wrathful Penguins > either give me something and i'll decide if it's valuable or fuck off
[16:51:01] Wrathful Penguins > because as far as i can tell this is a weak ass scam attempt
[16:51:14] ZxZXWizi > well its about trust thats all i can really say ...
[16:51:22] Wrathful Penguins > and i trust my corp members more than you
[16:51:30] ZxZXWizi > ill contact you and give you more details for now i gotta run
[16:51:32] Wrathful Penguins > because you've given me nothing to work with
[16:51:34] Wrathful Penguins > lol
[16:51:36] Wrathful Penguins > sure
[16:51:40] Wrathful Penguins > run along
[16:52:04] ZxZXWizi > i just give you this first
[16:52:11] ZxZXWizi > dont post on your forums
[16:52:17] Wrathful Penguins > er
[16:52:21] ZxZXWizi > they are public u know teamliquid
[16:52:21] Wrathful Penguins > i just said they read our forum
[16:52:26] Wrathful Penguins > they've openly told us they read our forum
[16:52:32] Wrathful Penguins > what you have in fact just given me as a token
[16:52:43] ZxZXWizi > also they have a source inside
[16:52:45] Wrathful Penguins > is that they read the public forum linked in our corp description
[16:52:56] ZxZXWizi > so you can post location where u may be and they will jump to it
[16:53:06] Wrathful Penguins > a source inside what?
[16:53:15] ZxZXWizi > ur corp m8
[16:53:53] Wrathful Penguins > yeah
[16:53:56] ZxZXWizi > i gotta run now...
[16:53:58] Wrathful Penguins > you're gonna have to be more specific
[16:53:59] Wrathful Penguins > sure you do
[16:54:26] ZxZXWizi > just watch ur m8s
[16:54:41] Wrathful Penguins > just watch your fuck the hell off
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Belgo
Profile Joined September 2009
United States721 Posts
December 06 2010 17:06 GMT
#4210
On December 07 2010 01:55 KwarK wrote:
+ Show Spoiler [SPAI] +

[16:46:06] ZxZXWizi > hello
[16:46:12] Wrathful Penguins > lo
[16:46:53] ZxZXWizi > i have some information to sell if interested
[16:47:23] Wrathful Penguins > and what is it?
[16:47:54] ZxZXWizi > just how your current war targets are getting information on you
[16:48:00] Wrathful Penguins > from our forum
[16:48:04] Wrathful Penguins > where it's publicly available
[16:48:13] Wrathful Penguins > and our public channel
[16:48:27] ZxZXWizi > nope
[16:49:02] ZxZXWizi > they have two sources
[16:49:03] Wrathful Penguins > you're gonna have to give me a little more than that then
[16:50:00] ZxZXWizi > look closely at your members and also watch what u say online
[16:50:24] Wrathful Penguins > and how do i tell the difference between you
[16:50:30] Wrathful Penguins > and a guy who has noticed peopel are at war
[16:50:34] Wrathful Penguins > and wants to make some easy isk
[16:50:47] Wrathful Penguins > either give me something and i'll decide if it's valuable or fuck off
[16:51:01] Wrathful Penguins > because as far as i can tell this is a weak ass scam attempt
[16:51:14] ZxZXWizi > well its about trust thats all i can really say ...
[16:51:22] Wrathful Penguins > and i trust my corp members more than you
[16:51:30] ZxZXWizi > ill contact you and give you more details for now i gotta run
[16:51:32] Wrathful Penguins > because you've given me nothing to work with
[16:51:34] Wrathful Penguins > lol
[16:51:36] Wrathful Penguins > sure
[16:51:40] Wrathful Penguins > run along
[16:52:04] ZxZXWizi > i just give you this first
[16:52:11] ZxZXWizi > dont post on your forums
[16:52:17] Wrathful Penguins > er
[16:52:21] ZxZXWizi > they are public u know teamliquid
[16:52:21] Wrathful Penguins > i just said they read our forum
[16:52:26] Wrathful Penguins > they've openly told us they read our forum
[16:52:32] Wrathful Penguins > what you have in fact just given me as a token
[16:52:43] ZxZXWizi > also they have a source inside
[16:52:45] Wrathful Penguins > is that they read the public forum linked in our corp description
[16:52:56] ZxZXWizi > so you can post location where u may be and they will jump to it
[16:53:06] Wrathful Penguins > a source inside what?
[16:53:15] ZxZXWizi > ur corp m8
[16:53:53] Wrathful Penguins > yeah
[16:53:56] ZxZXWizi > i gotta run now...
[16:53:58] Wrathful Penguins > you're gonna have to be more specific
[16:53:59] Wrathful Penguins > sure you do
[16:54:26] ZxZXWizi > just watch ur m8s
[16:54:41] Wrathful Penguins > just watch your fuck the hell off


I don't know...
Why would they have a 15+ gate camp on the Teon-Gel gate?

*dramatic sting*

Gasp!
12 gateways being thrown down, which is standard transition after the two observatory opening
OPSavioR
Profile Joined March 2010
Sweden1465 Posts
December 06 2010 17:06 GMT
#4211
LOL love when EVE gets all serious :D
i dunno lol
tHornstein
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom201 Posts
December 06 2010 17:09 GMT
#4212
On December 07 2010 01:55 KwarK wrote:
thornton micros like a boss and stays in the fight, neuting + killing a stiletto as it tackles him and then finishing off the cane as he dies.


Just to fix this, I killed the cane and was 20km away from anything that could do significant damage to me with a stiletto on me. I neuted/raped the fuck out of the stiletto and being prealigned to the sun I could have gtfo'd at will. However at that point kwark had me stabilised and I went back in to brawl up the abaddon. Everything got a bit hazy from there but I remember blowing up back on the undock.
Dacendoran
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States825 Posts
December 06 2010 17:40 GMT
#4213
I dont think you have a spy, but if you do (think that you have a spy) just talk about valuable info in fleet and anyone not in fleet boot from TS and all your problems are solved.
tmonet
Profile Joined January 2010
United States172 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-06 18:18:56
December 06 2010 17:46 GMT
#4214
On December 07 2010 01:55 KwarK wrote:
I don't dual/tribox because I don't think we really need it and a crash with implants could be really annoying.


l know I'm inactive but I'll help you out if you want.
wp | moe moe kyun!~~~ ♥
TurpinOS
Profile Joined February 2010
Canada1223 Posts
December 06 2010 17:46 GMT
#4215
Stiletto staying in med neut range, makes sense
http://eve.znaor.hr/pimpmydomi/
Inzek
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Chile802 Posts
December 06 2010 17:49 GMT
#4216
we need some real time com... i been around all day... just havent logged into eve...(watching tv series), i could have helped
Stork FAN!!!
pahndah
Profile Joined August 2009
1193 Posts
December 06 2010 18:10 GMT
#4217
There's that one guy that's on alot but hasn't gone on any OP yet, I bet he's a spy.
KwarK
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States44207 Posts
December 06 2010 18:26 GMT
#4218
Just flattened their bs fleet. I believe we just killed 2 canes, 1 drake and a phoon and narrowly missed kills on two tempests and an absolution. They tried brawling with RR BS and we just lolowned them with cruisers, bcs and tracking disruptors. They spent half the battle with a rifter as primary but he just kept on slugging and I got the reps on him. No matter what they hit him with that rifter would not die. Killmails incoming.

They all mass logged off afterwards. 100 > 230.
ModeratorThe angels have the phone box
Belgo
Profile Joined September 2009
United States721 Posts
December 06 2010 18:28 GMT
#4219
Holy crap...wish I was home.
12 gateways being thrown down, which is standard transition after the two observatory opening
Warri
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany3208 Posts
December 06 2010 18:28 GMT
#4220
On December 07 2010 02:40 Dacendoran wrote:
I dont think you have a spy, but if you do (think that you have a spy) just talk about valuable info in fleet and anyone not in fleet boot from TS and all your problems are solved.

Hey luc, do you have a char called dacendroran too? If yes we met in lowsec yesterday! :D
Prev 1 209 210 211 212 213 2021 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 17h 17m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ByuN 764
ProTech67
BRAT_OK 42
SHIN 19
MindelVK 15
StarCraft: Brood War
Mini 752
Soulkey 371
firebathero 235
Dewaltoss 112
ggaemo 111
Sharp 33
Rock 19
scan(afreeca) 15
Dota 2
Gorgc16559
qojqva1730
420jenkins217
League of Legends
Grubby2690
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox1666
C9.Mang0581
Mew2King103
Chillindude16
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor316
Liquid`Hasu138
Other Games
FrodaN1344
B2W.Neo748
Beastyqt569
WinterStarcraft464
uThermal240
ToD174
Hui .149
ArmadaUGS109
UpATreeSC56
XaKoH 54
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick760
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH278
• StrangeGG 47
• Reevou 4
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• Pr0nogo 3
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2290
• WagamamaTV589
League of Legends
• Jankos1848
• Nemesis1166
Other Games
• imaqtpie1158
• Shiphtur264
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Weekly
17h 17m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 16h
INu's Battles
1d 17h
Percival vs Zoun
Cure vs Rogue
ByuN vs Classic
Clem vs NightMare
PiGosaur Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
INu's Battles
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
[ Show More ]
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 22: Qualifier #1
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
ASL Season 22: Qualifier #2
K-JUNGMAN
RSL Revival: Season 6
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5
Escore Tournament S3: W6
Escore Tournament S3: W7
CSLAN 4
ASL Season 22
Escore Tournament S3: W8
Acropolis #5 - TRS
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
Thunderpick World Champ.
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
Logitech G Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.