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College Football 2008 - Page 31

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Live2Win *
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
United States6657 Posts
November 24 2008 23:36 GMT
#601
then perhaps you should phrase your questions better instead of just saying "why" over and over again.
SAY YES TO STIM KIDS!!! XD
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
November 24 2008 23:54 GMT
#602
Nothing I said was ambiguous.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
ShadowDrgn
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States2497 Posts
November 25 2008 00:00 GMT
#603
On November 25 2008 07:24 Sadist wrote:
Rivals have to be in the same division so they play every year.

edit:

and also it makes traveling easier if they are split by geography.


Georgia and Georgia Tech aren't even in the same conference and they play every year. Florida - Florida State too.

Also, look at how ridiculous the ACC divisions are. They could have split it into north and south, but instead it's divided into the nonsensical "Atlantic" and "coastal" divisions. I assume they didn't want to put Florida State and Miami in the same division because those were both powerhouse programs when the conference was expanded to 12 teams.
Of course, you only live one life, and you make all your mistakes, and learn what not to do, and that’s the end of you.
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
November 25 2008 00:44 GMT
#604
I totally forgot that the ACC was split that way.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
SpiralArchitect
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States2116 Posts
November 25 2008 03:06 GMT
#605
On November 25 2008 08:03 Mindcrime wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 25 2008 07:51 Live2Win wrote:
On November 25 2008 07:29 Mindcrime wrote:
On November 25 2008 07:24 Sadist wrote:
Rivals have to be in the same division so they play every year.


why?

edit:

and also it makes traveling easier if they are split by geography.


meh

uh, because that's where most rivalries spawn. It's now that rival schools are placed in the same conference, more like schools in the same conference become rivals.


We're not talking about how rivalries come about. We're talking about the continuation of existing rivalries. OSU vs. Michigan doesn't become less of a rivalry when one of the teams sucks ass and it wouldn't become less of a rivalry if they were in separate divisions of the conference.

Show nested quote +
Geography matters because this is not the NFL, and schools need to think about the athlete's education as well as sports. It's another reason why they don't want to have a play-off, because a playoff means more games which means longer season for everyone. Then there's the money involved in having to fly across the coutry for some unranked team you're going to smash anyways.

With closer games schools save up money on traveling and scheduling.

On the other hand I wonder how Hawaii does it.... they must fly to every single away game they have.


We're talking about the Big Ten. Under the current system, Penn State already travels to play Iowa, OSU already travels to play Minnesota, and so on.

Penn State to Iowa is nothing compared to splitting the conferences and having to spend time on the west and east coast, not to mention the middle of the country and the south where Football is God. If they were to move the conferences around the nation then teams would have to travel further for each away game, and alot of Southern teams would be traveling out here to stomp the living crap out of whatever team they were playing. The difference in competition between the south and the rest of the nation is huge, though the gap has become considerably smaller lately imo.
TeamLiquids #1 illiterate writer, writin dem wordz is de hardz.
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
November 25 2008 04:24 GMT
#606


The discussion was about the prospect of divisional play within the Big Ten.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
SpiralArchitect
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States2116 Posts
November 25 2008 08:24 GMT
#607
Oh. We were discussing the BCS a few posts up, guess I got excited or something :D
TeamLiquids #1 illiterate writer, writin dem wordz is de hardz.
TheMusiC
Profile Joined January 2004
United States1054 Posts
November 25 2008 09:25 GMT
#608
bottom line is texas gets fucked 100% unless by some miracle tech loses to baylor (not going to happen)

oh well, maybe next year!
tonight
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States11130 Posts
November 25 2008 21:15 GMT
#609
Well, OU is better than Texas at this point in the season so I think it's the right choice. As long is Florida or USC aren't in the national championship game I don't care.
if I come without a thing, then I come with all I need @tonightsend
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-25 21:40:30
November 25 2008 21:36 GMT
#610
On November 25 2008 18:25 TheMusiC wrote:
bottom line is texas gets fucked 100% unless by some miracle tech loses to baylor (not going to happen)

oh well, maybe next year!

Nah, as long as Oklahoma loses to either OSU or Missouri, then an 11-1 Texas plays in the NC game. No way Texas Tech jumps the Horns from that far down.

On November 26 2008 06:15 tonight wrote:
Well, OU is better than Texas at this point in the season so I think it's the right choice. As long is Florida or USC aren't in the national championship game I don't care.

Based on? OU was killing every team they faced before the Red River game also. I honestly thought Texas was going to lose that one. OU's problem on offense is what happens when their running game gets shut down (also see TCU game), and Texas has an outstanding front seven.

Too bad the conference championship is one team per division. imo the best outcome would be to have Texas vs Oklahoma again to determine the Big 12 champion. Missouri hasn't earned the spot as much as Texas/OU/TTU have.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
November 25 2008 21:40 GMT
#611
On November 26 2008 06:36 Signet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 25 2008 18:25 TheMusiC wrote:
bottom line is texas gets fucked 100% unless by some miracle tech loses to baylor (not going to happen)

oh well, maybe next year!

Nah, as long as Oklahoma loses to either OSU or Missouri, then an 11-1 Texas plays in the NC game. No way Texas Tech jumps the Horns from that far down.

Show nested quote +
On November 26 2008 06:15 tonight wrote:
Well, OU is better than Texas at this point in the season so I think it's the right choice. As long is Florida or USC aren't in the national championship game I don't care.

Based on? OU was killing every team they faced before the Red River game also. I honestly thought Texas was going to lose that one. OU's problem on offense is what happens when their running game gets shut down (also see TCU game), and Texas has an outstanding front seven.



texas wont go ahead of them if they didnt even play in the conf title game.

How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
November 25 2008 21:46 GMT
#612
On November 26 2008 06:40 Sadist wrote:
texas wont go ahead of them if they didnt even play in the conf title game.


Won't go ahead of who? Assuming Texas is able to win Thursday to finish 11-1...

If Oklahoma loses, either to Mizzou or OSU, then that's 2 losses. Texas would have 1 loss, and they've beaten OU. This is clear-cut. The only time a BCS conference team with fewer losses than a participant was left out of the BCS championship game was 2007 Kansas, and they had an exceptionally weak schedule.

Missouri? Same thing - the Tigers have 2 losses and one of them was to Texas.

They'll absolutely go over Texas Tech even if the Red Raiders win the conference. TTU's strength of schedule is crap thanks to playing Eastern Washington, SMU, and Massachussetts. Even if the voters for some reason decide that Texas Tech should go from being 4-5 spots below Texas right now to jumping the Horns after they make the amazing statement of beating Baylor, it won't be by enough to offset the sure edge Texas will have in the computers.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
November 25 2008 23:05 GMT
#613
On November 26 2008 06:46 Signet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2008 06:40 Sadist wrote:
texas wont go ahead of them if they didnt even play in the conf title game.


Won't go ahead of who? Assuming Texas is able to win Thursday to finish 11-1...

If Oklahoma loses, either to Mizzou or OSU, then that's 2 losses. Texas would have 1 loss, and they've beaten OU. This is clear-cut. The only time a BCS conference team with fewer losses than a participant was left out of the BCS championship game was 2007 Kansas, and they had an exceptionally weak schedule.

Missouri? Same thing - the Tigers have 2 losses and one of them was to Texas.

They'll absolutely go over Texas Tech even if the Red Raiders win the conference. TTU's strength of schedule is crap thanks to playing Eastern Washington, SMU, and Massachussetts. Even if the voters for some reason decide that Texas Tech should go from being 4-5 spots below Texas right now to jumping the Horns after they make the amazing statement of beating Baylor, it won't be by enough to offset the sure edge Texas will have in the computers.



bama could still go ahead of them
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-26 00:14:09
November 26 2008 00:08 GMT
#614
On November 26 2008 08:05 Sadist wrote:
bama could still go ahead of them

Yeah, Bama will surely go as long as they win out. I'm assuming the title game will be SEC vs Big 12. Doubtful that both Florida and Bama would go, since the loser would have just lost the day before final rankings come out, and in 2006 the voters showed that they have a clear aversion to same-conference rematch title games.

USC is also a long shot, and might not win the Pac 10 which eliminates the conference champion argument. Penn State needs a miracle.

imo, this crap is just more proof that we need a playoff. I'll agree that it's ridiculous for Texas to be national champions but not Big 12 champions... on the other hand, it'd also be ridiculous for Missouri to (hypothetically) claim the conference title over Texas despite a worse record and losing their head-to-head. The way conference championship games are set up is pretty dumb... you can back in by playing in a weak division then negate the entire regular season in just one game.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-26 00:43:14
November 26 2008 00:38 GMT
#615
On November 26 2008 09:08 Signet wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 26 2008 08:05 Sadist wrote:
bama could still go ahead of them

Yeah, Bama will surely go as long as they win out. I'm assuming the title game will be SEC vs Big 12. Doubtful that both Florida and Bama would go, since the loser would have just lost the day before final rankings come out, and in 2006 the voters showed that they have a clear aversion to same-conference rematch title games.

USC is also a long shot, and might not win the Pac 10 which eliminates the conference champion argument. Penn State needs a miracle.

imo, this crap is just more proof that we need a playoff. I'll agree that it's ridiculous for Texas to be national champions but not Big 12 champions... on the other hand, it'd also be ridiculous for Missouri to (hypothetically) claim the conference title over Texas despite a worse record and losing their head-to-head. The way conference championship games are set up is pretty dumb... you can back in by playing in a weak division then negate the entire regular season in just one game.



Well, you never know.

If bama loses by a last second field goal or something they might have a chance.

The bullshit from 06 was that if you werent a conf champ how could you play in the title game (even though it happened before)

If texas doesnt get to the title game Id love to hear the logic these assholes use after saying the exact opposite in 06.

The same thing happened last year with georgia even.

So say Oklahoma loses and texas tech wins and gets in, how the FUCK can you put texas ahead of them even if they lose? Thats the exact same thing that happened to georgia. IMO Penn State should go over USC, even though I thinK USC is better. lost by a last second field goal to iowa, compared to getting pushed around by oregon state.

PS College football and this system is super gay unless your team is on top ;(
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
tonight
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States11130 Posts
November 26 2008 00:57 GMT
#616
But, without this system we wouldn't be having these spirited discussions every year. I think it just makes the whole NCAA more exciting for the public in general. Yes, everyone below top 2 will always want a playoff that's just a fact, but for marketing and money reasons it will never happen.
if I come without a thing, then I come with all I need @tonightsend
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
November 26 2008 01:02 GMT
#617
On November 26 2008 09:38 Sadist wrote:
If texas doesnt get to the title game Id love to hear the logic these assholes use after saying the exact opposite in 06.

Really depends on how it happens.

For example, what if OU loses to OSU and the B12 Championship is Missouri vs Texas Tech. Missouri wins. Then Texas is the only team in the B12 with just one loss and they beat Missouri. This makes them the best team in the conference, regardless of whether they have a pretty trophy to show for it. In my opinion, overall record trumps everything else unless one team just faced an extremely weak schedule.

Or, what if all 3 teams win this week and OU goes to the B12 championship. Now, this ignores the fact that Texas beat Oklahoma, but the voters are saying that OU is the better team anyway. Then Missouri beats OU. The argument is that the voters got it wrong the first time - Texas should have been ahead of Oklahoma - and this is no reason to punish the Longhorns just because the voters got it wrong before the conference championship game.

If Texas Tech goes to the conference title game and wins, then I think it's harder to make an argument. They're basically arguing that Texas should have gone to the conference championship game after TTU was blown out by Oklahoma and overall played a much weaker schedule than Texas - that these factors outweigh Tech winning on a last second pass at home. TTU beating Missouri doesn't prove anything since Texas also beat Missouri.


Like you said, it's happened before. I think the clearest example is 2003 Oklahoma. Is there really an argument that Kansas State, with 3 regular season losses, was the best team in the Big 12? Of course not. In 2003 we could have just chosen USC vs LSU instead. What about this season? Say Florida is the SEC Champ and Missouri is the Big 12 Champ (beating Oklahoma). Oregon State will wind up Pac 10 champs if they win just one more game. Texas Tech, Texas, and USC are all sitting at 11-1 and all clearly had better seasons than Missouri and Oregon State. Being "conference champion" doesn't mean you're the best team in your conference. I really don't put a lot of weight into that argument for inclusion in national championship games. I mean, should we include Penn State just because they're Big Ten champions? Makes no sense. That's just rewarding them for playing in a conference that doesn't have a championship game and that is having a down season.
The reason I thought Florida should have gone over Michigan in 2006 was because a) Ohio State and Michigan had just played the last weekend of the season, so an immediate rematch would be silly since Florida had the same record and hadn't lost since October and b) Florida faced a far, far tougher schedule than Michigan. Mostly the latter.
Signet
Profile Joined March 2007
United States1718 Posts
November 26 2008 01:04 GMT
#618
On November 26 2008 09:57 tonight wrote:
But, without this system we wouldn't be having these spirited discussions every year. I think it just makes the whole NCAA more exciting for the public in general. Yes, everyone below top 2 will always want a playoff that's just a fact, but for marketing and money reasons it will never happen.

I dunno, March Madness generates a lot of discussion and publicity. If a playoff is done well, it would produce just as much money and marketing potential.

But yeah, the playoff is unlikely to happen for a while. The Rose Bowl and Jim Delany are too strongly against it.
Sadist
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States7328 Posts
November 26 2008 03:21 GMT
#619
Last year georgia was arguably better than LSU and didnt get a chance to be in the SEC title game because of a loss to tenn. They had 2 losses, didnt get in.

Im just saying, from the precedent that everyone bitched about in 06 with Michigan, It would be horseshit if texas got to go and didnt win their conf. A rematch had already happened with Florida vs Florida State in the NC game, Michigan had to play OSU on the road, and came back from being down big. Im still bitter =[
How do you go from where you are to where you want to be? I think you have to have an enthusiasm for life. You have to have a dream, a goal and you have to be willing to work for it. Jim Valvano
tonight
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States11130 Posts
November 26 2008 04:02 GMT
#620
On November 26 2008 12:21 Sadist wrote:
Last year georgia was arguably better than LSU and didnt get a chance to be in the SEC title game because of a loss to tenn. They had 2 losses, didnt get in.

Im just saying, from the precedent that everyone bitched about in 06 with Michigan, It would be horseshit if texas got to go and didnt win their conf. A rematch had already happened with Florida vs Florida State in the NC game, Michigan had to play OSU on the road, and came back from being down big. Im still bitter =[

Ever since that I've hated Florida.
if I come without a thing, then I come with all I need @tonightsend
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