|
On March 15 2015 06:38 Haee wrote:
Pre-Cologne, NiP were on a slump and even during their climb to the final had some sort of divine intervention thing going on (Cobble vs C9), that said NiP deserved their trophy. I think the entire match against C9 was divine intervention. They won both their games 16-14.
I'd favor Fnatic for the finals by a close margin, I still believe they're the best team in the world right now.
I think Fnatic is heavily favored. They have such a stupidly skilled lineup + Pronax who basically has all the tools he needs to do whatever he wants.
On March 15 2015 06:39 Souma wrote:
People cray. Fnatic vs. NiP was gonna be a close series regardless in Cologne. It's hard to predict inter-country matches. Fnatic shoulda lost to Na`vi in Cologne but Na`vi choked so hard. =_=
Just by the fact that the game at that point (and even today) was really unstable because of the ability for CZ/armor buys to just make unwinnable rounds possible, one could say that any series between reasonably top tier teams is going to be close. *shrug*
|
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T
|
On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T
how do you get silver/gold thing?
|
On March 15 2015 06:44 Mensol wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T how do you get silver/gold thing?
isn't the pick challenge thing ?
if you predict well everything you have max point and a gold thing dunno what is it
|
On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T
I feel almost obligated to pick NiP for the finals because I stopped believing in them half way through the tournament. I thought they'd lose to TSM and if not TSM then they'd lose to nV.
The NiP magic is just too fucking strong.
|
You get points for each accurate prediction you make throughout the tourny. Your total points determine whether you get gold or silver.
|
On March 15 2015 06:44 Mensol wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T how do you get silver/gold thing?
+ Show Spoiler +
|
On a side note, I wish other games had this team_pov stream but I know how teams can be pretty opposed to it. It just gives you insight, how team morale is, adds some tension and it really shows the level of difference the best teams have in terms of communication verses the lower tiered teams.
I know im not the only person to ask for this but it really is amazing and I really REALLY wish every tournament adds team_pov streams from this point forward. Wishful thinking though.
|
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
On March 15 2015 06:41 Zergneedsfood wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:38 Haee wrote:
Pre-Cologne, NiP were on a slump and even during their climb to the final had some sort of divine intervention thing going on (Cobble vs C9), that said NiP deserved their trophy. I think the entire match against C9 was divine intervention. They won both their games 16-14. Show nested quote +I'd favor Fnatic for the finals by a close margin, I still believe they're the best team in the world right now. I think Fnatic is heavily favored. They have such a stupidly skilled lineup + Pronax who basically has all the tools he needs to do whatever he wants. Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:39 Souma wrote:
People cray. Fnatic vs. NiP was gonna be a close series regardless in Cologne. It's hard to predict inter-country matches. Fnatic shoulda lost to Na`vi in Cologne but Na`vi choked so hard. =_= Just by the fact that the game at that point (and even today) was really unstable because of the ability for CZ/armor buys to just make unwinnable rounds possible, one could say that any series between reasonably top tier teams is going to be close. *shrug*
Not every top team vs. top team series was close at that time, but at least closer than it is now. iirc Fnatic rolled Dignitas. NiP was just up and down, hard to predict but always pulled it off during big LAN events (hasn't changed, still inconsistent as all hell online).
Fnatic beating VP 2-0 and NiP beating nV 2-0 basically shows that things aren't always going to be close between top tier teams.
|
Yeah, but I don't think anybody really thought that VP was going to put up much of a fight against Fnatic. Sure VP is a great team but I think the vast majority of people were under the impression that even with the crowd Fnatic would really have no problem with them. I wanted VP to win merely because it'd be a great underdog victory and provided that NiP went to the finals would be an interesting rematch of Katowice 2014. Otherwise, I think to most people who have followed the scene, I think that Fnatic going through their brackets relatively uncontested was a foregone conclusion.
I think NiP/nV was a good example of things not always going to be close, but in my limited experience this seems more like an exception that proves the rule, not to mention nV did lose two inexcusable ecos (though to be fair, NiP lost their fair share though at arguably less crucial points) towards the end of that game that really sealed the deal. Still, you're mostly right on this point because that cache game was extremely irregular in how one sided it was and even dust2, even excluding the eco failures by nV rarely looked like nV had any control over the game.
|
I think Fnatic is the best team in the world so them beating out VP wasn't a shocker, even though the games could have gone either way.
Personally I think nV might be getting figured out. Even considering nV might have not been on form, NiP shut down their ecos. Everyone already knows nV would usually lose out on pistols and immediately run over teams with czets and p250s but I felt it was only a matter of time (after some nerfs) until teams could play against what nV would do. Happy underperformed as well
imo. Like the best way I could describe nV's playstyle would be to win out on czets/p250s armor, money fuck you and run you down.
|
On March 15 2015 07:02 Haee wrote:
Happy underperformed as well imo.
I actually wanted nV to lose because I was watching one of their games and I was kind of unsatisfied with how their full gun round executions went. Like you said I think they're super over reliant on anti-ecos and their ability to win pistol/armor rounds. Happy's terrorist executions in full gun rounds is just....very lackluster and seemingly very situated on one of his players (*cough* Kioshima *cough*) making godly entry frags, and you saw that when Kioshima wasn't running into sites and two shotting entire sites, nV's strategies just fell apart.
And it's easy to be good on CT when you just hold an angle and have godlike aim/reflexes/etc. Not that much strategy and reading the opponent's strats when you just rush upper B tunnels, get a million frags, run away, throw down a smoke and just laugh your ass off as the terrorists ask wtf just happened
|
nV slumping due to getting paid imo. The thing that makes NiP and Fnatic good is that they stay consistent even though they've been getting paid good money by winnings/salary. You see this in pro-sports too, some players stop giving fucks after they get their contracts.
|
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
The overall skill level between the top four teams (Fnatic, VP, nV and NiP) is actually incredibly close and it's really just any given day. Sometimes players perform and sometimes they don't. Fnatic has the luxury of having the best igl in the game who always puts his team in a position to perform more consistently, but I would never, ever count VP out against Fnatic in a bo3 (especially when the first two maps are their best maps). We've seen what happens when the Virtus Plow is at 100%, that stuff is scary. Sadly, VP can't always muster that ability.
As for nV vs. NiP, NiP's proven time and time again that they are the masters at beating other teams on their best maps. They fully prepare on those maps and take teams off guard. It was surprising how dominant they were for sure, but this is nothing new in the history of NiP. I could totally see NiP playing Fnatic on Inferno, Cache and Mirage tomorrow. :|
Also, people hype kioshima way too much; nV's main entry fragger has always been shox and kioshima's numbers do not even compare. In MLG Aspen casters hyped kioshima for a couple of good entries but shox had like twice his numbers. nV's main style on their T side is to force trades around the map anyway and not fast executes (unless ecoing or throwing in a surprise execute) but NiP was obviously prepared.
On that note, nV's mistake this tournament was thinking their usual play would be enough. Just about everything the team did was exactly what they've been doing for months and teams have figured them out. Biggest flop was probably Happy who obviously couldn't do much as NiP just waited for him almost every time. If nV somehow made it to the finals against Fnatic, they woulda gotten crushed regardless.
Edit: Just looked up the numbers. In the past three months shox has had 173 entry frags compared to kioshima's 89. Not even close.
|
On March 15 2015 06:49 Stancel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:44 Mensol wrote:On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T how do you get silver/gold thing? + Show Spoiler +
On March 15 2015 06:48 Makro wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2015 06:44 Mensol wrote:On March 15 2015 06:42 Stancel wrote:
fnatic head, nip heart
who do i pick for my pickem, this decides my gold/silver T_T how do you get silver/gold thing? isn't the pick challenge thing ? if you predict well everything you have max point and a gold thing dunno what is it
thanks guys.
|
People dont hype kioshima for any reason, they hype him because he is fucking good, the thing is VP, nV, NiP and Fnatic all have 5 freaking beast players.
And yes i agree that between the 4 teams its all about how did they woke up that given morning.
Anyway besides that the other reason why Fnatic and nV are still 1 step ahead (even if its the smallest step in the world, hence why they can still be beaten) its because most of the times they get all their 5 players to perform at the level you expect them (1 day its the exception to the rule by the way). VP is the worst in this situation IMO, if they manage to get all their 5 playerss to perform, they could beat anyone, but much more often than not, theres 1 or 2 players performing below their level.
Defining NiP its pretty hard because they have something "extra" when it matters, they could have 2-3 really bad minor tournaments but when a major comes, you know they are going to be tough shit
|
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
He's really not THAT good. Nothing about him says he's "fucking good," not his stats nor his overall performances. In the past three months he's had less entry frags than EVERYONE on his team, (shox at 173, SmithZz 118, NBK 115, Happy 108, kioshima 89) and is tied with SmithZz at 3rd/4th in terms of entry kill ratio (Happy at 1.59, shox at 1.15, SmithZz/kio at 1.1 and NBK at 0.92) and leading up to Katowice he posted a negative score in 13 of his 20 most recent games. He is HIGHLY inconsistent and just because he has a spectacular entry frag here and there it doesn't excuse his inconsistency.
Not saying he's bad but he doesn't deserve the hype he gets. At the very least, he is not the lynchpin of nV's Terrorist side that many have come to think he is.
|
Gonna be so awesome to watch the final tomorrow, heres for another NiP win  Dont get me wrong though I like both teams a lot, but NiP is just the team I gotta go with in all times
|
On March 15 2015 08:53 Souma wrote:
He's really not THAT good. Nothing about him says he's "fucking good," not his stats nor his overall performances. In the past three months he's had less entry frags than EVERYONE on his team, (shox at 173, SmithZz 118, NBK 115, Happy 108, kioshima 89) and is tied with SmithZz at 3rd/4th in terms of entry kill ratio (Happy at 1.59, shox at 1.15, SmithZz/kio at 1.1 and NBK at 0.92) and leading up to Katowice he posted a negative score in 13 of his 20 most recent games. He is HIGHLY inconsistent and just because he has a spectacular entry frag here and there it doesn't excuse his inconsistency.
Not saying he's bad but he doesn't deserve the hype he gets. At the very least, he is not the lynchpin of nV's Terrorist side that many have come to think he is.
about the entry frag stats, it's just the natural development from nV changing shox back to their entry fragger..
|
2nd Worst City in CA8938 Posts
He's been their main entry fragger ever since kioshima's been receiving his hype (which as far as I know took off during MLG Aspen).
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT![[image loading]](http://puu.sh/gAmeQ/2719c70481.jpg)
