EPTWarcraft III: The Frozen Throne - Page 63
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lestye
United States4163 Posts
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AssyrianKing
Australia2111 Posts
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3point14
Germany890 Posts
The idea of Wc3 of 1999, where you play with kind of WoW perspective could work too. maybe in a 1on1, both players have to bring villages under control and recrute party members for skirmishes | ||
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Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
On June 09 2015 01:44 3point14 wrote: the (seriously) best way would be, Blizz doing Wc4 on kickstarter. then they can give us exactly what we think, Wc4 is worth, probably something around 2 billion$. The idea of Wc3 of 1999, where you play with kind of WoW perspective could work too. maybe in a 1on1, both players have to bring villages under control and recrute party members for skirmishes Sorry, but that's sort of ridiculous. Blizzard is one of the biggest developers out there. They don't need Kickstarter. They sunk who knows how many millions of dollars into Project Titan, only to scrap it all in the end. This isn't the first time they've done this either (hello Starcraft: Ghost). Money is not the issue. Blizzard doing a Kickstarter would be so incredibly greedy... | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7031 Posts
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3point14
Germany890 Posts
Kickstarter can serve as an indicator of how much the people want Wc4; plus, it means they dont risk anything and dont even have to allocate money. Also, like with many Remakes, the fans really want it, so it might make more sense to let them donate, because those donations might be 20x bigger than a normal purchase. but its prob not an option for Blizz. | ||
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killa_robot
Canada1884 Posts
On May 30 2015 03:22 Spaylz wrote: Honestly, I would be more than happy if they released a new RTS with an entirely new franchise. The Warcraft franchise is tiiiiiiired. It has been way overdone. Just villains never completely dying or, when they do die, coming back to life and whatever. Space ships. SC2's story is pretty subpar. Wings of Liberty's story was decent, but Heart of the Swarm basically tore the plot apart and undid everything it achieved. Diablo 3's story is okayish. Nothing outstanding. At this point, Diablo games are basically a newish story with an ending we already know: we defeat Diablo. Then he somehow comes back. Overall, I think Blizzard would do well to leave behind their franchises and turn them into legacy stuff. Then they could build new worlds, like what they are doing with Overwatch. We need new things, new stories, plots which can surprise us. All three of Blizzard's franchises have been rehashed to death. So I want a RTS à la WC3, but within a new franchise. But I doubt it will happen. Blizzard has lost their touch with storytelling. Tends to happen when companies get as big as they have; they have to make stories appeal to everyone, which ironically ends with the quality of the story being terrible. It's a shame, but their time has come and gone. | ||
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lestye
United States4163 Posts
On June 09 2015 05:51 killa_robot wrote: Blizzard has lost their touch with storytelling. Tends to happen when companies get as big as they have; they have to make stories appeal to everyone, which ironically ends with the quality of the story being terrible. It's a shame, but their time has come and gone. I can see that, I think it happened with WC3's story, a lot of that story telling was rehashed BW stuff atop of retconning Warcraft 2 and nothing really new or impressive. Characters were great but the story itself was really rehashed. | ||
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Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
On June 09 2015 06:44 lestye wrote: I can see that, I think it happened with WC3's story, a lot of that story telling was rehashed BW stuff atop of retconning Warcraft 2 and nothing really new or impressive. Characters were great but the story itself was really rehashed. As much as I love WC3's story, this is true. While it's not a copy-paste sort of deal, the stories of Kerrigan and Arthas are awfully too similar. The campaign was still damn cool, but yeah. I don't know where this comes from. I think it may be due to Chris Metzen having too much influence in the writing. It's possible to have solid story telling in games. Just look at Final Fantasy (ok not all of them, but most of them have outstanding stories, and while they don't necesseraly have to worry about continuity, it is a long franchise with many titles). The story of Heart of the Swarm was laughable as well. | ||
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lestye
United States4163 Posts
On June 09 2015 07:04 Spaylz wrote: As much as I love WC3's story, this is true. While it's not a copy-paste sort of deal, the stories of Kerrigan and Arthas are awfully too similar. The campaign was still damn cool, but yeah. I don't know where this comes from. I think it may be due to Chris Metzen having too much influence in the writing. It's possible to have solid story telling in games. Just look at Final Fantasy (ok not all of them, but most of them have outstanding stories, and while they don't necesseraly have to worry about continuity, it is a long franchise with many titles). The story of Heart of the Swarm was laughable as well. The story of HOTS is the same problem I have with WC3's story, we're just rinse repeating at this point and nothing really interesting going on. idk, I think the demands of a good story has changed a lot because of games like Final Fantasy and his talent hasnt really scaled. Like we can laugh at Warcraft II's story being really simple and not really told very well looking at Brood War, if that makes sense. I also think they need to like test run their story, it seems to me like the write the script and then they do it, without asking people "is this an interesting story?" There's no dry run for the story and no one to note how its boring/uninteresting/overdone hence we get D3's story. | ||
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Spaylz
Japan1743 Posts
On June 09 2015 08:52 lestye wrote: The story of HOTS is the same problem I have with WC3's story, we're just rinse repeating at this point and nothing really interesting going on. idk, I think the demands of a good story has changed a lot because of games like Final Fantasy and his talent hasnt really scaled. Like we can laugh at Warcraft II's story being really simple and not really told very well looking at Brood War, if that makes sense. I also think they need to like test run their story, it seems to me like the write the script and then they do it, without asking people "is this an interesting story?" There's no dry run for the story and no one to note how its boring/uninteresting/overdone hence we get D3's story. I think HotS' story is far worse than WC3's. It basically undid everything that happened in WoL. From half of the story and up, the whole point of WoL's story is to purge Kerrigan and "unzerg" her. Then we do. And then in HotS, she goes right back to being a Zerg. Talk about character development. | ||
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lestye
United States4163 Posts
On June 09 2015 09:10 Spaylz wrote: I think HotS' story is far worse than WC3's. It basically undid everything that happened in WoL. From half of the story and up, the whole point of WoL's story is to purge Kerrigan and "unzerg" her. Then we do. And then in HotS, she goes right back to being a Zerg. Talk about character development. Oh yeah I agree. HOTS to me lost based on the awful dialogue alone. | ||
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AssyrianKing
Australia2111 Posts
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Grumbels
Netherlands7031 Posts
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Yoav
United States1874 Posts
On June 05 2015 05:39 3point14 wrote: another symmetrie that I like, is that in the campaign, every race fights every other race at some point This was actually one of my frustrations playing ROC the first time. In ROC, the first two campaigns don't do this (unlike SC1 or BW, which very carefully did). Instead you had: Humans vs. Orcs Humans vs Undead (which was most of the campaign) Undead vs Humans (which was almost all of the campaign, if you count the elves as reskinned humans) Undead vs Orcs Orc and NElf got to fight everybody, so that was cool. But there was a LOOOOONG stretch in there that was just Human v Undead from each side. | ||
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intotheheart
Canada33091 Posts
On June 09 2015 09:10 Spaylz wrote: I think HotS' story is far worse than WC3's. It basically undid everything that happened in WoL. From half of the story and up, the whole point of WoL's story is to purge Kerrigan and "unzerg" her. Then we do. And then in HotS, she goes right back to being a Zerg. Talk about character development. I feel like they could've gone a lot farther than they did with the whole "what does it mean to be human or zerg in this universe" sort of discussion, especially with Stukov being around again. | ||
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3point14
Germany890 Posts
Arthas' story is better than many movies, the orcs get their own lovely story and the nightelves get a truly epic worldsaving one. What games are the best storywise for you? Prob Deus Ex for me (despite it being deliberately overloaded with conspiracys), BG2, Wc3 ^^ , Jedi knight 2 and many more, just cant think of them right now | ||
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Stratos_speAr
United States6959 Posts
On June 09 2015 08:52 lestye wrote: The story of HOTS is the same problem I have with WC3's story, we're just rinse repeating at this point and nothing really interesting going on. idk, I think the demands of a good story has changed a lot because of games like Final Fantasy and his talent hasnt really scaled. Like we can laugh at Warcraft II's story being really simple and not really told very well looking at Brood War, if that makes sense. I also think they need to like test run their story, it seems to me like the write the script and then they do it, without asking people "is this an interesting story?" There's no dry run for the story and no one to note how its boring/uninteresting/overdone hence we get D3's story. The difference between WC3 and HotS is quality. WC3 had a lot of quality and polish. Yea, the story telling elements were exactly creative or new, but it was presented incredibly well. HotS is absolutely horrendous. The actual game play is, of course, great, but everything about the story is utterly atrocious, beginning with WoL. Diablo 3 is the exact same way. Nothing that Blizzard has ever done with story (or game play) has been really innovative. However, prior to SC2 and Cataclysm, it was still good. the earlier Warcrafts/Diablos (and obviously SC/BW) were all well-done. Everything came together both aesthetically and story-telling wise to make the story immersive and engaging. The simplicity of old WC/Diablo stories was a strong point, not a weakness (and was also a limitation of technology/resources). SC's story has been talked about to death. WC3's greatly expanded on the story-telling capabilities they had, and they did it really well. Then shit hit the fan when Blizzard tried to start making things more movie/comic book-esque and tried to make the story more "appealing to the masses" or more "character-oriented" or whatever other excuses you want to put in there. There's no argument about the fact that basically everything concerning Post-WotLK WoW, SC2, or Diablo 3 story is absolute trash, from the plot points to the actual scripts. If we remember, when WoL/HotS were released, there were 30-page essays written on many gaming forums about all of the plot holes and problems with SC2's story and script. | ||
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Grumbels
Netherlands7031 Posts
Wings of Liberty: SC:Legacy reviews Wings of Liberty (link) Starcraft II: The anti-narrative (link) Retconning Weakens Story (link) Heart of the Swarm: Gradius' HoTS Story Review (link) Heart of the Swarm: an Empire or a Menace? (link) <-- this one is very good especially In my opinion the WoL campaign was very engaging and the story is functional in the sense that it creates gameplay diversity, so I didn't mind the fact it was badly written. HotS on the other hand was literally the worst video game story I've ever encountered. I actively hate it and it made me instantly stop caring about the story resolution in Legacy of the Void. | ||
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3point14
Germany890 Posts
One interesting thing that has poisened the joy of many videogames for me, is how stupid the storywriters seem to think their audience is. In Sc2 there are those news broadcasts, where Kate refuses to go with the propaganda. It is done so plainly and unsubtle that it hurts. Blizz really wanted to make sure, nobody misses the sarcasm of Kate, but it felt like im a baby, that is being spoonfed. This was also the problem in Dragonage, Mass Effect (supposedly a smart game), Fallout 3 and is also the reason why I dont want to get to deep into the Warhammer universe. In Dragonage 1 your dog is making a racket in the kitchen, then you have the choices: 1: Tell him to shut up 2: Make the ninja notice: maybe he wants to tell me, something is wrong here The choice is yours Sherlock, we hope you feel damn smart about your genius and courageous decisicion to actually trust your dog, because not totally everybody will choose this option after reading both! And then the game is called a challenging adventure with complex quests.. | ||
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