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On September 20 2014 07:22 Resisty wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2014 06:27 Barrin wrote:
Are there any Shadowplay melee types out there? Is jumping from your mount to your target with Overwhelm as fun as I think it must be? Most builds seem to go Shadowplay as a support option just for Overwhelm, Stealth, and Dropback. I tried to think of a Shadowplay build focused on Bloodthirst stacking, sort of like Envenom rogues, but it feels like it's missing too many good skills from the other trees.
Shadowplay is retardedly broken just because of those 3 skills, the entire class is useless otherwise yet its practically required in 95% of builds.
I refuse to play it simply because it breaks the game so damn much, There's zero customization because of it.
Levelling guides if people need them? http://forums.archeagegame.com/showthread.php?33877-Meliran-s-Complete-Archeage-Levelling-Guide
Played all day barely killed a single mob today. Life is good.
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On September 20 2014 09:13 Resisty wrote:
Decided that today was the day I actually sit in queue.
Go for most populated server so I won't be left playing on dead servers in a few months.
New servers come out and character creation gets locked...
lol most popular servers at this time have a 9-10hr queue... i wouldnt suggest this strategy.
Im on the #3/4 server.. and ive been in Q for 3 hours, and still have 800 people in front of me, and is telling me i will be in it for another 2 hours.
GL
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I dinged 50 yesterday and from now on everything is a huge grind in this game. Farming the starter weapons from Hasla will take you a whole day of mindless killing stuff. Building your house will take you weeks of collecting stones and harvesting trees.
Lvling a profession on your own will take months because it's so damn expensive. Obviously paying real money will significantly reduce this time.
People say that owning land isn't necessary but in my opininion it's worth more than anything in the game. Having illegal farms on a big server is not possible because people will always find out and wait you out. If the big majority of people hit lvl 50 I see lots and lots of people getting bored soon, especially if they have no land to play around. Kinda like in Wildstar when people realized that attunement and gearing up will take ages for a casual player.
I still like the game and graphics. Pvping is very fun, too. But it's not a game that keeps the casual playerbase attracted for very long.
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On September 20 2014 17:14 toemn wrote:
I dinged 50 yesterday and from now on everything is a huge grind in this game. Farming the starter weapons from Hasla will take you a whole day of mindless killing stuff. Building your house will take you weeks of collecting stones and harvesting trees.
Lvling a profession on your own will take months because it's so damn expensive. Obviously paying real money will significantly reduce this time.
People say that owning land isn't necessary but in my opininion it's worth more than anything in the game. Having illegal farms on a big server is not possible because people will always find out and wait you out. If the big majority of people hit lvl 50 I see lots and lots of people getting bored soon, especially if they have no land to play around. Kinda like in Wildstar when people realized that attunement and gearing up will take ages for a casual player.
I still like the game and graphics. Pvping is very fun, too. But it's not a game that keeps the casual playerbase attracted for very long.
Your playing an Asian MMO, everything is a huge grind.
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On September 20 2014 09:40 Capped wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2014 07:22 Resisty wrote:On September 20 2014 06:27 Barrin wrote:
Are there any Shadowplay melee types out there? Is jumping from your mount to your target with Overwhelm as fun as I think it must be? Most builds seem to go Shadowplay as a support option just for Overwhelm, Stealth, and Dropback. I tried to think of a Shadowplay build focused on Bloodthirst stacking, sort of like Envenom rogues, but it feels like it's missing too many good skills from the other trees. I refuse to play it simply because it breaks the game so damn much, There's zero customization because of it.
I don't really follow that logic. There's a tree specificall made to have additional Utility and damage potential so that you can complete classes without much mobility and also increase the DPS of them. It enables a lot of classes such as the Trickster, Confessor, Soothsayer and the typical Primeval/Darkrunner/Blighter combos.
It doesn't give away customization, it creates it. It would completely and utteraly broken if you didn't need Shadowplay and could just use any other skilltree to get such mobility and utility.
On September 20 2014 17:14 toemn wrote:
I still like the game and graphics. Pvping is very fun, too. But it's not a game that keeps the casual playerbase attracted for very long.
This is how your post would look if it wasn't the case:
"I dinged 50 yesterday and I'm pretty much done with the game. I got everything I need during my leveling phases and now there's no stuff left to do. Everyone is still trying to get Lv50 and I can't properly PvP with them for that reason. It's really boring and dull and they really should've thought of more endgame content. I think this is just another game like SW:TOR"
Hope you get my point. It is an MMO - the only way to "lock away" progression is to put it behind the grinding-bar. Everything else would be too freaking easy because the MMO works like that.
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On September 20 2014 23:07 KeksX wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2014 09:40 Capped wrote:On September 20 2014 07:22 Resisty wrote:On September 20 2014 06:27 Barrin wrote:
Are there any Shadowplay melee types out there? Is jumping from your mount to your target with Overwhelm as fun as I think it must be? Most builds seem to go Shadowplay as a support option just for Overwhelm, Stealth, and Dropback. I tried to think of a Shadowplay build focused on Bloodthirst stacking, sort of like Envenom rogues, but it feels like it's missing too many good skills from the other trees. I refuse to play it simply because it breaks the game so damn much, There's zero customization because of it. I don't really follow that logic. There's a tree specificall made to have additional Utility and damage potential so that you can complete classes without much mobility and also increase the DPS of them. It enables a lot of classes such as the Trickster, Confessor, Soothsayer and the typical Primeval/Darkrunner/Blighter combos. It doesn't give away customization, it creates it. It would completely and utteraly broken if you didn't need Shadowplay and could just use any other skilltree to get such mobility and utility.
His point is that the skills are so good that pretty much any combination of 2 trees wants shadowplay as a 3e tree instead the other options.
It limits options because instead of playing X / Y / Z you should be playing Shadowplay / X / Y
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On September 20 2014 23:10 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2014 23:07 KeksX wrote:On September 20 2014 09:40 Capped wrote:On September 20 2014 07:22 Resisty wrote:On September 20 2014 06:27 Barrin wrote:
Are there any Shadowplay melee types out there? Is jumping from your mount to your target with Overwhelm as fun as I think it must be? Most builds seem to go Shadowplay as a support option just for Overwhelm, Stealth, and Dropback. I tried to think of a Shadowplay build focused on Bloodthirst stacking, sort of like Envenom rogues, but it feels like it's missing too many good skills from the other trees. I refuse to play it simply because it breaks the game so damn much, There's zero customization because of it. I don't really follow that logic. There's a tree specificall made to have additional Utility and damage potential so that you can complete classes without much mobility and also increase the DPS of them. It enables a lot of classes such as the Trickster, Confessor, Soothsayer and the typical Primeval/Darkrunner/Blighter combos. It doesn't give away customization, it creates it. It would completely and utteraly broken if you didn't need Shadowplay and could just use any other skilltree to get such mobility and utility. His point is that the skills are so good that pretty much any combination of 2 trees wants shadowplay as a 3e tree instead the other options. It limits options because instead of playing X / Y / Z you should be playing Shadowplay / X / Y
This is a direct result of proper design, though. If you want to achieve certain things, you have to pick certain skilltrees.
You still get a ton of builds to choose from, there are more Shadowplay-based builds out there than the amount of average classes in other MMOs.
The alternative would be the design of "if you want to achieve certain things, do whatever." which I call "the GW2 approach".
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Theres a handful of builds that don't require shadowplay.
It is not good design to have 90% of all "good" builds require one certain class / skill set. It gets stale and old fast having people just expect you to have X (in this case shadowplay)
Don't get me wrong, you can make alot of things work without shadowplay, they're just better WITH shadowplay and only a few specific builds are not. I run archery / Defence / Auramancy (Bastion) and its basically a gimped Primeval.
Theres also the whole "Better take shadowplay during traderuns since stealth makes it rofl easy to avoid people" too. In my guild anybody who doesnt have shadowplay respecs to it during traderuns for ez mode.
I don't think thats good design at all tbh, having one class be optimal for nearly everything limits customisation to X/Y instead of X/Y/Z like Gorsameth said. How long can you go on doing pvp with people who have shadowplay before that entire element becomes boring. Wouldn't you rather fight a complete mixture of classes.
Its poor balance.
Still, this game is fucking AMAZING. I have too much to do and not enough resources to do it. D:
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And to anybody STILL having long ass queues, if NA is really that much worse, switch over to EU for a while if you want, instaqueues on Aier all day long for patrons, probably the same for the newer servers and F2P queues cant be that bad.
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switched from Kyprosa to Aier
having 3000 queues for patrons was just not bearable
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I don't think it's bad design. What would you do instead? Put stealth and that utility in every other skilltree? Then you'd have the GW2-Approach.
Put those skills into another, single skilltree? Then that skiltree would be incredibly OP.
It's not XLGames' problem that everyone wants to be able to gank in Open World and have Shadowplay to stealth and surprise enemies. Thats what most people get it for anyway. But Shadowplay opens a ton of fun builds as well that would otherwise not be possible, Confessor and Soothsayer being the ones I repeat over and over again because they're a blast to play.
I mean, you don't complain that you need Battlerage for generic melee skills as well, right? And I'd argue that for any Melee based builds, Battlerage is much more a must-have than shadowplay. You can do without Shadowplay and be a little less viable, but going without Battlerage? You gotta be insane if you want a melee fighter without Battlerage! 
(Don't get me wrong I don't want to make you sound bad or anything, I just think that the class system in ArcheAge is generally very well thought-through although it's not perfect at all. The last MMO I played was GW2 and compared to that, ArcheAge's class system is the product of a genius.)
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On September 20 2014 23:40 KeksX wrote:I don't think it's bad design. What would you do instead? Put stealth and that utility in every other skilltree? Then you'd have the GW2-Approach. Put those skills into another, single skilltree? Then that skiltree would be incredibly OP. It's not XLGames' problem that everyone wants to be able to gank in Open World and have Shadowplay to stealth and surprise enemies. Thats what most people get it for anyway. But Shadowplay opens a ton of fun builds as well that would otherwise not be possible, Confessor and Soothsayer being the ones I repeat over and over again because they're a blast to play. I mean, you don't complain that you need Battlerage for generic melee skills as well, right? And I'd argue that for any Melee based builds, Battlerage is much more a must-have than shadowplay. You can do without Shadowplay and be a little less viable, but going without Battlerage? You gotta be insane if you want a melee fighter without Battlerage! (Don't get me wrong I don't want to make you sound bad or anything, I just think that the class system in ArcheAge is generally very well thought-through although it's not perfect at all. The last MMO I played was GW2 and compared to that, ArcheAge's class system is the product of a genius.)
I would not have stealth in an open world pvp game just because it will always be super good for it.
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On September 20 2014 23:42 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2014 23:40 KeksX wrote:I don't think it's bad design. What would you do instead? Put stealth and that utility in every other skilltree? Then you'd have the GW2-Approach. Put those skills into another, single skilltree? Then that skiltree would be incredibly OP. It's not XLGames' problem that everyone wants to be able to gank in Open World and have Shadowplay to stealth and surprise enemies. Thats what most people get it for anyway. But Shadowplay opens a ton of fun builds as well that would otherwise not be possible, Confessor and Soothsayer being the ones I repeat over and over again because they're a blast to play. I mean, you don't complain that you need Battlerage for generic melee skills as well, right? And I'd argue that for any Melee based builds, Battlerage is much more a must-have than shadowplay. You can do without Shadowplay and be a little less viable, but going without Battlerage? You gotta be insane if you want a melee fighter without Battlerage! (Don't get me wrong I don't want to make you sound bad or anything, I just think that the class system in ArcheAge is generally very well thought-through although it's not perfect at all. The last MMO I played was GW2 and compared to that, ArcheAge's class system is the product of a genius.) I would not have stealth in an open world pvp game just because it will always be super good for it.
Agreed, stealth in general is just a super retarded mechanic for PvP.
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Northern Ireland22212 Posts
3000th position in queue, got booted from queue, now I'm 500
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On September 21 2014 00:24 ahswtini wrote:
3000th position in queue, got booted from queue, now I'm 500
I just had a similar situation. On the second try I got to 120 in queue and got booted, now I'm 1200 
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EDIT: Oh my god i have a tendency to write giant posts in this thread wtf!
Yep, stealth is a stupid mechanic and the basis of why shadowplay is so overused. Whoever saw the need to throw 2 movement skills in there is clinically insane too
KeksX, You said "What would you do instead? Put stealth and that utility in every other skilltree?" it's basically that already only removing more customisation by taking up a class spot. Wouldn't you agree? Considering everybody who chooses not to use it is put at a disadvantage immediately it really isn't much of a valid choice.(other than some certain builds like pure tank/heal etc)
Your argument about battlerage is kinda flawed, since you need the skill that define what type of character you are, the "main" ones being Battlerage for melee, Archery for bows, Sorcery(/ Occultism) for magic. You're always going to need to make that choice, thats part of the customisation and choosing what you are in every game, those classes aren't OP or overused or broken, they're just the bread and butter of what you want your character to be. If you dont have a class that defines what basic type of character you are, how do you get around that? Im honestly interested how you'd solve this ^^
This is seen in the KR / RU versions of the game where the most used and top pvp builds in the game ALL contain shadowplay.
The foreseeable future of archeage is laid out for us already with the other versions of the game.
1) What type of class do you want to be Melee/Ranged/Magic
2) Heres shadowplay or would you rather have a disadvantage?
3) What other class would you like with that?
There are always going to be classes that fit well together and some that dont, but shadowplay is currently a must have in nearly everything and thats not right since it removes an entire third of the customization. The sad thing is there really isnt much they can do about it. (Well i'd love to see them make the stealth only usable in PvP and last X seconds along with nerfs to their TWO freakin' movement skills to put them more in line but that is never happening :D )
Whats with so many comparisons to GW2 too, not you, Aier chat is full of comparisons to GW2 also and i don't see the likeness of the games. GW2 is so completely different, if you didn't like the game for whatever reason that's fine alot of people didnt but i don't really see grounds to start drawing comparisons between the two.
Either way, its fine if you think theres nothing wrong with shadowplay but it really does remove alot of the customization and you can't deny its top-dog over every other class for utility. At the end of the day this game is still fking amazing.
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Also SkilledBlob if you're West, PM me in game and i can help you out / invite you to my guild if you'd like, Capped is my IGN
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anyone playin dahuta east?
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@Capped:
You don't get my point. You are complaining that people are picking Shadowplay or rather that TOO many pick Shadowplay.
I say: It's not because of the game but everyone wants to be the "cool damage dealer".
It's the same issue everyone wants to play Mid in DotA2/LoL. People want to be the cool guy in front.
There are a ton of builds not based on Shadowplay but they, most of the time, have nothing to do with being in front and dealing the damage. But thats what most people want, so naturally, they pick Shadowplay-based builds.
Shadowplay is just a great addition to damage-based builds. So is Songcraft for Support-Based builds, Defense/Auramancy/Vitalism for Tank-based builds and so on.
For one purpose, one thing is better than the other. Thats only natural and not bad design at all.
If you dont have a class that defines what basic type of character you are, how do you get around that? Im honestly interested how you'd solve this ^^
I don't mind that at all, as I said in my opinion it is just good design and fixes a lot of issues.
There are always going to be classes that fit well together and some that dont, but shadowplay is currently a must have in nearly everything and thats not right since it removes an entire third of the customization.
Since you keep saying it removes customization lets actuallyt take a look at it:
Viable builds without Shadowplay:
Skullknight, Defiler, Abolisher, Templar, Dreambreaker (Tank and DD for some)
Battlemage, Cabalist, Demonologist, Revenant, Arcanist (Magic DD)
Archon (Tanky DD)
Cleric, Hierophant, Tomb Warden [Templar] (Support and Heal)
Paladin, Hexblade (Melee DD / support)
Viable builds with Shadowplay:
Primeval, Trickster, Stone Arrow (Archer DD)
Enigmatist, Spellsinger, Reaper, Daggerspell (Magic DD
Darkrunner, Blighter, Outrider, Shadowblade (Melee DD)
Confessor, Soothsayer (Healer DD)
(I didn't account for 1v1, group vs group and raid vs raid, it's all mixed)
Those are just out of my head. I probably forgot something but do you see a pattern? It's just DDs that utilize Shadowplay and basically always the same combination + a different third skill.
But you're not limited to it if you want, especially as a mage you can build a lot of builds without it.
So for damage dealers, you do have a point. It seems that there are a lot more viable DD combos WITH shadowplay than without it - but it's not binary. It's not either be DD and pick Shadowplay or play a non-DD class.
But in return there's also a few classes that would otherwise not be possible. There are 3 magical DDs with stealth and 2 viable Healers with DD-potential. And I'm 100% positive that there are many classes which haven't been yet discovered that don't utilize Shadowplay as well.
The biggest cut to non-Shadowplay builds btw was the Healing split. Before that, we had a few more classes without Shadowplay:
Edgewalker, Necromancer, Cultist, Justicar, Sorrowsong, Boneweaver, Shaman etc.
About GW2:
As I said, I do this comparison because it is the MMO I played prior to ArcheAge. I merely try to compare the way you build builds in those games.
EDIT:
Damn this post became huge as well lol. Sorry for that dude!
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On September 21 2014 01:38 KeksX wrote:@Capped: You don't get my point. You are complaining that people are picking Shadowplay or rather that TOO many pick Shadowplay. I say: It's not because of the game but everyone wants to be the "cool damage dealer". It's the same issue everyone wants to play Mid in DotA2/LoL. People want to be the cool guy in front. There are a ton of builds not based on Shadowplay but they, most of the time, have nothing to do with being in front and dealing the damage. But thats what most people want, so naturally, they pick Shadowplay-based builds. Shadowplay is just a great addition to damage-based builds. So is Songcraft for Support-Based builds, Defense/Auramancy/Vitalism for Tank-based builds and so on. For one purpose, one thing is better than the other. Thats only natural and not bad design at all. Show nested quote +If you dont have a class that defines what basic type of character you are, how do you get around that? Im honestly interested how you'd solve this ^^ I don't mind that at all, as I said in my opinion it is just good design and fixes a lot of issues. Show nested quote +There are always going to be classes that fit well together and some that dont, but shadowplay is currently a must have in nearly everything and thats not right since it removes an entire third of the customization. Since you keep saying it removes customization lets actuallyt take a look at it: Viable builds without Shadowplay: Skullknight, Defiler, Abolisher, Templar, Dreambreaker (Tank and DD for some) Battlemage, Cabalist, Demonologist, Revenant, Arcanist (Magic DD) Archon (Tanky DD) Cleric, Hierophant, Tomb Warden [Templar] (Support and Heal) Paladin, Hexblade (Melee DD / support) Viable builds with Shadowplay: Primeval, Trickster, Stone Arrow (Archer DD) Enigmatist, Spellsinger, Reaper, Daggerspell (Magic DD Darkrunner, Blighter, Outrider, Shadowblade (Melee DD) Confessor, Soothsayer (Healer DD) (I didn't account for 1v1, group vs group and raid vs raid, it's all mixed) Those are just out of my head. I probably forgot something but do you see a pattern? It's just DDs that utilize Shadowplay and basically always the same combination + a different third skill. But you're not limited to it if you want, especially as a mage you can build a lot of builds without it. So for damage dealers, you do have a point. It seems that there are a lot more viable DD combos WITH shadowplay than without it - but it's not binary. It's not either be DD and pick Shadowplay or play a non-DD class. But in return there's also a few classes that would otherwise not be possible. There are 3 magical DDs with stealth and 2 viable Healers with DD-potential. And I'm 100% positive that there are many classes which haven't been yet discovered that don't utilize Shadowplay as well. The biggest cut to non-Shadowplay builds btw was the Healing split. Before that, we had a few more classes without Shadowplay: Edgewalker, Necromancer, Cultist, Justicar, Sorrowsong, Boneweaver, Shaman etc. About GW2: As I said, I do this comparison because it is the MMO I played prior to ArcheAge. I merely try to compare the way you build builds in those games. EDIT: Damn this post became huge as well lol. Sorry for that dude!
Without knowing much about ArcheAge it seems it just boils down to sustain.
If you don't have the sustain to keep you alive go shadowplay as 3rd. And as always in scumbag-pvp you have A LOT of glass cannons thus alot of shadowplaying.
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On September 21 2014 01:50 bluQ wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2014 01:38 KeksX wrote:@Capped: You don't get my point. You are complaining that people are picking Shadowplay or rather that TOO many pick Shadowplay. I say: It's not because of the game but everyone wants to be the "cool damage dealer". It's the same issue everyone wants to play Mid in DotA2/LoL. People want to be the cool guy in front. There are a ton of builds not based on Shadowplay but they, most of the time, have nothing to do with being in front and dealing the damage. But thats what most people want, so naturally, they pick Shadowplay-based builds. Shadowplay is just a great addition to damage-based builds. So is Songcraft for Support-Based builds, Defense/Auramancy/Vitalism for Tank-based builds and so on. For one purpose, one thing is better than the other. Thats only natural and not bad design at all. If you dont have a class that defines what basic type of character you are, how do you get around that? Im honestly interested how you'd solve this ^^ I don't mind that at all, as I said in my opinion it is just good design and fixes a lot of issues. There are always going to be classes that fit well together and some that dont, but shadowplay is currently a must have in nearly everything and thats not right since it removes an entire third of the customization. Since you keep saying it removes customization lets actuallyt take a look at it: Viable builds without Shadowplay: Skullknight, Defiler, Abolisher, Templar, Dreambreaker (Tank and DD for some) Battlemage, Cabalist, Demonologist, Revenant, Arcanist (Magic DD) Archon (Tanky DD) Cleric, Hierophant, Tomb Warden [Templar] (Support and Heal) Paladin, Hexblade (Melee DD / support) Viable builds with Shadowplay: Primeval, Trickster, Stone Arrow (Archer DD) Enigmatist, Spellsinger, Reaper, Daggerspell (Magic DD Darkrunner, Blighter, Outrider, Shadowblade (Melee DD) Confessor, Soothsayer (Healer DD) (I didn't account for 1v1, group vs group and raid vs raid, it's all mixed) Those are just out of my head. I probably forgot something but do you see a pattern? It's just DDs that utilize Shadowplay and basically always the same combination + a different third skill. But you're not limited to it if you want, especially as a mage you can build a lot of builds without it. So for damage dealers, you do have a point. It seems that there are a lot more viable DD combos WITH shadowplay than without it - but it's not binary. It's not either be DD and pick Shadowplay or play a non-DD class. But in return there's also a few classes that would otherwise not be possible. There are 3 magical DDs with stealth and 2 viable Healers with DD-potential. And I'm 100% positive that there are many classes which haven't been yet discovered that don't utilize Shadowplay as well. The biggest cut to non-Shadowplay builds btw was the Healing split. Before that, we had a few more classes without Shadowplay: Edgewalker, Necromancer, Cultist, Justicar, Sorrowsong, Boneweaver, Shaman etc. About GW2: As I said, I do this comparison because it is the MMO I played prior to ArcheAge. I merely try to compare the way you build builds in those games. EDIT: Damn this post became huge as well lol. Sorry for that dude! Without knowing much about ArcheAge it seems it just boils down to sustain. If you don't have the sustain to keep you alive go shadowplay as 3rd. And as always in scumbag-pvp you have A LOT of glass cannons thus alot of shadowplaying.
yep pretty much this. at the moment PvP is very burst dmg focused ( part of it is a inherent design flaw in AA ) . It's always the same though in every game. But as the game keep moving on and people get better gear and higher HP numbers the burst dmg builds will fade out for more group and sustain oriented builds.
btw I love my templar, tanks like a beast and does great healing. I am using plate armor at the moment ( only made it to level 35 so far ) and it's great to see all the cookie cutter physical dmg classes despair :D
I am playing as Harani to whoever it was that asked.
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On September 21 2014 05:40 Skilledblob wrote:Show nested quote +On September 21 2014 01:50 bluQ wrote:On September 21 2014 01:38 KeksX wrote:@Capped: You don't get my point. You are complaining that people are picking Shadowplay or rather that TOO many pick Shadowplay. I say: It's not because of the game but everyone wants to be the "cool damage dealer". It's the same issue everyone wants to play Mid in DotA2/LoL. People want to be the cool guy in front. There are a ton of builds not based on Shadowplay but they, most of the time, have nothing to do with being in front and dealing the damage. But thats what most people want, so naturally, they pick Shadowplay-based builds. Shadowplay is just a great addition to damage-based builds. So is Songcraft for Support-Based builds, Defense/Auramancy/Vitalism for Tank-based builds and so on. For one purpose, one thing is better than the other. Thats only natural and not bad design at all. If you dont have a class that defines what basic type of character you are, how do you get around that? Im honestly interested how you'd solve this ^^ I don't mind that at all, as I said in my opinion it is just good design and fixes a lot of issues. There are always going to be classes that fit well together and some that dont, but shadowplay is currently a must have in nearly everything and thats not right since it removes an entire third of the customization. Since you keep saying it removes customization lets actuallyt take a look at it: Viable builds without Shadowplay: Skullknight, Defiler, Abolisher, Templar, Dreambreaker (Tank and DD for some) Battlemage, Cabalist, Demonologist, Revenant, Arcanist (Magic DD) Archon (Tanky DD) Cleric, Hierophant, Tomb Warden [Templar] (Support and Heal) Paladin, Hexblade (Melee DD / support) Viable builds with Shadowplay: Primeval, Trickster, Stone Arrow (Archer DD) Enigmatist, Spellsinger, Reaper, Daggerspell (Magic DD Darkrunner, Blighter, Outrider, Shadowblade (Melee DD) Confessor, Soothsayer (Healer DD) (I didn't account for 1v1, group vs group and raid vs raid, it's all mixed) Those are just out of my head. I probably forgot something but do you see a pattern? It's just DDs that utilize Shadowplay and basically always the same combination + a different third skill. But you're not limited to it if you want, especially as a mage you can build a lot of builds without it. So for damage dealers, you do have a point. It seems that there are a lot more viable DD combos WITH shadowplay than without it - but it's not binary. It's not either be DD and pick Shadowplay or play a non-DD class. But in return there's also a few classes that would otherwise not be possible. There are 3 magical DDs with stealth and 2 viable Healers with DD-potential. And I'm 100% positive that there are many classes which haven't been yet discovered that don't utilize Shadowplay as well. The biggest cut to non-Shadowplay builds btw was the Healing split. Before that, we had a few more classes without Shadowplay: Edgewalker, Necromancer, Cultist, Justicar, Sorrowsong, Boneweaver, Shaman etc. About GW2: As I said, I do this comparison because it is the MMO I played prior to ArcheAge. I merely try to compare the way you build builds in those games. EDIT: Damn this post became huge as well lol. Sorry for that dude! Without knowing much about ArcheAge it seems it just boils down to sustain. If you don't have the sustain to keep you alive go shadowplay as 3rd. And as always in scumbag-pvp you have A LOT of glass cannons thus alot of shadowplaying. yep pretty much this. at the moment PvP is very burst dmg focused ( part of it is a inherent design flaw in AA ) . It's always the same though in every game. But as the game keep moving on and people get better gear and higher HP numbers the burst dmg builds will fade out for more group and sustain oriented builds.
That depends entirely on scaling.
If dmg scales faster then hp you will get the exact opposite. Which is for example what happened in WoW.
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EPT
