|
On November 09 2011 19:09 anomalopidae wrote:Hmmm, when I played as Byzantium I've actually been ahead in tech compared to the big European nations while keeping the oriental tech, maybe you weren't active trader at start so you've fallen behind, or you've just grown too big 
Byzatium is odd, just like Teutonic Order (the like, only Westernized nation in the East). You either go North into people in your own Tech Group, South and East into people of lesser Tech Groups, but lesser land as well or into Italy where everyone's Tech fucking skyrockets because of their small size.
...I hate playing Byzatium.
|
On November 08 2011 16:48 Caller wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2011 15:36 Tewks44 wrote:On November 08 2011 15:16 Caller wrote:On November 08 2011 14:54 Tewks44 wrote:
I've been playing this for some time and here's some guidelines I've felt have helped. Please free free to add any/adjust the ones I mention
1.Maintain your economy. Don't take loans to finance your empire and only maintain a military you can support.
2. Only go to war if you have a Causis Belli, the stability penalty isn't worth it.
3. Before going to war look at the alliances. Don't enter a war you won't be able to win.
4. Use your merchants. Try to have a presence in the richest centers of trade.
I'm still in the early 1400s but so far I've felt like using these guidelines I've been able to not only maintain my empire, but expand it. Let me know if you guys have any other pointers of if you think one of these guidelines can be bent/broken under some circumstances? while 1 and 3 are common sense, 2 and 4 are a bit more meh: You should consider declaring war without a casus belli if, say, you are a smaller country attacking a larger one. Because you can only win when the larger country is weak, you may have to attack without a casus belli. As for merchants, if your country has the wrong sliders, merchants will cost you money and won't generate any income (because they get outcompeted). Alas, there is still much more to this game that I have yet to understand. Are there any comprehensive guides you can suggest so I can learn more about how sliders work and such? just use expected value. 5 merchants in a 1000 value trade center give you about 100 income annually. so each merchant gives you about 20 gold. assume a merchant stays for one year. it costs 10 gold to send a merchant. if u have a 50% chance of competing for a seat, expected value is 10 gold. So basically, you lose a merchant. Now if you had 90% compete chance, you have expected value of 18 gold, which is then worth it. as a general rule, trading nations want free trade, then plutocracy, in that order. Unless you happen to own more than half of the world's total trading centers (in value), in which case mercantilism becomes more worth it.
The compete chance is only for getting in in the first place, so it's possible (and quite common) to get in on a 50% compete chance and get kicked out the next month. As a general rule I wouldn't bother on anything less than 65-70% even before counting merchant cost vs CoT value.
On November 09 2011 03:57 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On November 09 2011 03:44 Skilledblob wrote:On November 09 2011 03:10 Euronyme wrote:On November 09 2011 02:55 Skilledblob wrote:On November 09 2011 02:37 Euronyme wrote:
Has anyone tried playing the Livonian order or whatever they're called? How exactly are they formed? historically they were the remains of the Teutonic Order. After the Teutonic order was beaten by Poland and Lithuania its baltic regions split apart and thus the Livonian order was formed. The Order it self was always a part of the Teutonic Knights but after the Teutons became vassals to Poland the Teutons split up into Prussia ( polish vassal ) and the Livonian Order I mean in game. What's the mechanic that forms them? They have an awesome looking flag imo :3 they dont get formed. You start at the time where they exist in the game or you wont see them That's not true. I've seen them pop up.
Nationalist Rebels.
On November 09 2011 19:09 anomalopidae wrote:Hmmm, when I played as Byzantium I've actually been ahead in tech compared to the big European nations while keeping the oriental tech, maybe you weren't active trader at start so you've fallen behind, or you've just grown too big
You're better off with bad tech in the early game so you can westernize.
|
Just poking here, is there interest in a succession game here? Meaning each player plays a given amount of time, maybe 20 years, gives a nice report on what happened, and then gives the safegame on to the next player?
|
That sounds fun, as long as we do not pick a nation that's too terribly hard. It wouldn't be fun to see the game end after one or two players.
|
That sounds like a nice idea :p
and yeah, the country properly need to be a country that don't need to wait 10 years to get money, then 10 years for the absolutely right moment to attack !
|
I have not yet thought about specifics, was just looking if there is enough interest to warrant starting something, but in my opinion it should be something small or middle-sized in europe, or maybe one of the close muslim countries, since there is the most action for most of the game. But once we have enough people interested, i will just start an other thread for this with some polls on what we play.
|
id love to show you nubs how its done x)
it cant be a german hre country, you can win in 20 years
it cant be france, for obvious reasons
i think the most interesting country would have to be of the weaker tech groups. something in india would be fun. out the way of an overzealous ming (ive seen ai ming get dishonorable scum too many times) then it allows you to expand west into progressively harder enemies, neighbours > persians > turks > polish/hungarian > austira > france
to avoid the game ending too early you need the ai to blob up a bit. seeing a massive hre austria set itself up to be the final boss only to crumble to rebels isnt exciting. there are some mods out there that help avoid this but im not sure if they reduce blobbing too much either.
you can also keep the game more interesting for a longer time by setting specific goals and missions. rather than blobbing across the world you can limit what you do. first few players can secure a decent kingdom but after that capture either a specific province or defeat someone in a war etc etc. the list goes on. the point is something needs to be done to avoid the game being over before its over.
|
Ok, i think that should be enough people to get this started. I will make another thread with some polls, which i will let running for 48 hours and then come to a conclusion. I would also like it if everyone who wants to play makes a post there, players will be in the order of their posts. We will be playing DW 5.1 without any mods for simplicity.
Thread is up, please participate:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=284324
|
On November 10 2011 13:21 turdburgler wrote:
you can also keep the game more interesting for a longer time by setting specific goals and missions. rather than blobbing across the world you can limit what you do. first few players can secure a decent kingdom but after that capture either a specific province or defeat someone in a war etc etc. the list goes on. the point is something needs to be done to avoid the game being over before its over.
It's pretty much impossible to keep the game from being over before it's over, even with ridiculous house rules.
|
That's why you get Magna Mundi once you realize how easy vanilla EU3 is to blob in 
|
On November 11 2011 10:33 Elegy wrote:That's why you get Magna Mundi once you realize how easy vanilla EU3 is to blob in
Or play multiplayer rather than relying on buggy and poorly implemented mods to fix an issue that can't really be fixed.
|
hey guys anyone down for a game today?
I'll play later in the day with a friend, if you're interested pm me.!
|
On November 12 2011 03:41 fofa2000 wrote:
hey guys anyone down for a game today?
I'll play later in the day with a friend, if you're interested pm me.!
I am, but only if we have a fair number of people (say 6+).
|
oh my god I just blew 4 hours on trying to get the teutonic nation to work. I've made it about 50 years before getting bogged in a horrible war that will end me or just causing mass ruin on me.
God I love this game.
|
Who is killing you? HRE Bohemia or HRE Austria?
|
Poland lithuania or denmark sweden. I can't pry novgorod to me beacuse they're in a different religion and end up allying with poland. I can dable in mid russian polotics and germen polotics with a bit of success but I can't withstand the hammer of poland and nov or sweden and denmark. I've successively taken out lithuania and allied with the new eastern euro country that took over from the revolution but poland god damm.
is there some secret to the teutonic order that I'm just missing?
|
What I did when I united Germany as the Teutonic Order was, day 1 before unpause, sell Gotland to Sweden for 80-90 gold.
That Would make Sweden and Denmark less likely to attack, would give some nice startup gold and give me a casus belli on Sweden for later use
Then you should ally with Bohemia or Hungary or maybe Novgorod and take out Poland/Lithuania while they are at war with the Horde.
After that, it becomes easier
|
On November 12 2011 16:06 sermokala wrote:
oh my god I just blew 4 hours on trying to get the teutonic nation to work. I've made it about 50 years before getting bogged in a horrible war that will end me or just causing mass ruin on me.
God I love this game.
Teutonic Order is fun if you know what to do.
Just got bored on a game with them around 1700 when I owned all of Eastern Europe, Scandanavia, British Isles, and Iberian Peninsula.
Here's how I handled it:
Alright, don't unpause yet. There's this little trick that on the very first moment of the game before you unpause, you can get some really nice deals that you normally couldn't diplomatically. First, you need to sell Gotland for some dosh, or release it as a vassal and cancel vassalation later. It is a completely unnecessary province, and all it's there for is so that Denmark/Sweden/Norway can all declare war on you at once and fuck your shit up in a Reconquest CB. Just cut off the tumor and you literally won't have to worry about them for hundreds of years.
Now, see if you can get an alliance with Portugal, Bohemia, Austria, or Novgorod. You can always get at least one. In my game I got Bohemia. You NEED a strong partner who could back you up, because either Lithuania, Novgorod, or Poland are going to get annoyed and just fuck you over. With a strong partner, that is stunted a bit. Be sure to save a diplomat and day 1 declare on Pskov. It has no allies at first, and crank that that Stability slider as far up as you can manage to get your Stab back up to 3. But you need to conquer Pskov. It's going to be frustrating as hell later on having that little territory there. You also need to, when you can afford, send a missionary to your Animist province.
Masovia or whatever is next. You should get a mission, or just a straight up CB to conquer them. You need to take that whenever possible and Vassalize them. NOT ANNEX. VASSALIZE. You need dem vassals early on. That can also apply to Pskov if you really want to, but they're far too out of the way and unimportant to be worth it IMO. But Masovia (I do hope I'm talking about the right nation here, too lazy to open up the game) is great to take because when you inevitably declare on Poland, their troops will do all the conquering of the Northern provinces for you.
Novgorod is that old man looming in the corner ready to fuck your puckered asshole when you aren't ready for it. Hence, when they get into their inevitable war with Muscowy or anyone else for that matter -- you need to strike hard and fast. Take their provinces closest to you and secure them, worry about the provinces with no forts later. They take like 3 months to get to at a time and it's really not worth it until you get the majority of their fort'd provinces secure and their army down. You must vassalize them. I can not stress this enough. Do NOT annex them, do not take ANY land from them (yet). Just vassalize them. You should, in hopefulness, have two VERY strong allies now. Novgorod, and one of the others. Preferably Bohemia or Austria. You are now ready for war with Poland/Lithuania. Build up a 15 stack army, wait for a CB or send in spies/insults to provoke them. Lithuania also gets a CB against you (which they usually take) around 1450 (don't quote me on that) and that's also a good opportunity. I'd also suggest waiting until they get fucked over by Golden Horde. GH doesn't annex much land, just waits for the Tribute offer from Poland/Lith.
Your first war with Poland/Lithuania is your most important. Your conquering of land is hardly important, in fact, I conquered almost no land my first time. It was breaking up treaties (separating Lithuania/Poland as allies and vassals mainly), taking their dosh, reducing their sphere (reduces sphere = less diplomatic skill), so on and so forth. As well as a few rich provinces up north that I wanted. Now begins the time when you simply build up your economy, tech, etc. as you slowly wittle Poland/Lithuania down and conquer them. If you want to annex them and release them as vassals, or just vassalize them when possible I guess you could do that. I was going for shits and gigs and I just annexed them. And once I got Poland down, I diplo-annex Masovia.
The thing to remember is this: You become OP in the late game. Golden Horde can fuck you up, Bohemia/Austria/Brandenburg can fuck you up, Muscowvy can fuck you up. Pretty much everyone can fuck you up. However, the glory in this, is that most of your enemies are in the Eastern tech group and you're in the Western. Once you handle Lithuania/Poland, make sure to keep Novgorod as your bro. You'll need them to hold off the Hordes, especially as you move south towards the Balkans (or should I say "if" you do, but I liked to do that).
Now if you expand far too fast like me because you're just so fucking good (ie: lucky), the Protestant Reformation will happen around the same time that you form Prussia and that's where the fun begins. You pretty much got an even split on your countries religions. It turned out for me that a 1/4th were Reformed, 1/4th were Protestant, 1/3rd were Catholic and the rest were Orthodox. I ended up going for Reformed as more and more Catholics started turning that, but the revolts from this is fucking ridiculous. Take the Religious Toleration National Idea's. I took one and Bill of Rights personally because I also had Time of Troubles event which basically gave every province a 15% revolt risk per month, so that was not particularly fun.
Once you get settled after forming Prussia and getting your religion sorted out, it's smooth sailing from then on out. You can push west into Bohemia/Austria/Brandenburg (take it one at a time and make sure to have one of the other two helping you, preferably the Emperor) and then take care of the rest. Once you conquer Austria, Annex them and release as a vassal. They get like 4 provinces and still, somehow, get like 30-40k troops to always help you in wars. It's hilarious.
Then you just go from there on what you want to do. Basically nothing else can kill you at that point.
This was on Very Hard / High Aggression / No Lucky Nations, by the by for my experience
|
Wow thanks I'm going to go do that right now.
|
On November 13 2011 07:32 sermokala wrote:
Wow thanks I'm going to go do that right now.
Yeah no problem.
About the time that Novgorod stops being useful is around the time that Muscowy/the Eastern Hordes catch up to them. I just canceled vassalation, because honestly -- it's not worth protecting them that late into the game. Just let the Hordes wittle them down, let the revolts go crazy and form a bunch of smaller nations, etc. I know it will also be tempting to move into the East for easy provinces, I recommend against it. Low population, basically no money to be gained, no forts -- it's just not worth it. If you want to do it for appearances (IE: Form Prussia with Russian borders or some shit) by all means, there is absolutely reason why you CAN'T do it -- it is probably the easiest strat out there to do. However, pushing West and into Scandinavia potentially is far more profitable.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
