|
|
On June 29 2011 00:41 Tachyon wrote: Why didn't the list include chess? =( Best board game ever made, and most complex. Chess isn't the most complex board game by a long shot. Go is much more complex and there are more complex games out there still!
Myself, I really like monopoly and diplomacy. Unfortunately they are both quite long and need quite a few players.
|
|
On July 01 2011 22:36 ChrisXIV wrote:I played Settlers a few times and got owned hard. Just too luck-based*. ._. It's a fun game when everybody is drunk, but against people who count the number of resources you have, and therefore deny trading... * + Show Spoiler +There was one game, where the only numbers that wouldn't get me resources were 2, 6 and 12. The dice went like this: 6 6 2 (me) 7 7 12 (me) 7 2 6 (me) ... I counted. I didn't get anything for 12 rounds. I'm still bitter about this game, as you might notice.
Amusingly, after years of playing I finally bought Settlers, as in just 6 months ago. I spent a long time decrying its failings as a game of any real skill above that of The Game of Life, but I have since come around to accept it as a legitimately good game.
I think that ultimately, many games in which die-rolling is a critical mechanic can lead to some very frustrating games when the dice don't "behave", and I hear you there!
My argument used to be that assuming statistically average die results, in most games of Settlers (base set only, no expansions), the probable winner could be determined after the first round due to resource distribution relative to proximity to trading ports. Which, unless I'm completely failing to read you correctly, is a similar grief to yours. Not exactly the same, just similar. My argument utterly fails for a few reasons: 1) The number of dice rolls made in a game of Settlers isn't nearly enough by many orders of magnitude to expect results anywhere close to the theoretic distribution. 2) Skilled Catan players will all see the same things and can direct the flow of the game through trading (or the refusal to do so).
So I have since relaxed and come to love the Settlers.
The dice still make me mad sometimes, though. I try to keep it in check, but I'm only human. A drink does help, though.
+ Show Spoiler +I played a Battletech tournament game many years back and was losing very badly because the dice were really not playing in my favor, despite the fact that I was strategically and tactically out-maneuvering my opponent. I started nerdraging and grousing about the scenario and the inherent advantages of my opponents position... then I got my mid-game reinforcements (per the scenario) and simultaneously, the dice turned. My opponent was the picture of grace itself at what should have been a foregone conclusion in his favor became a massacre of his remaining forces. I always just remember that game when I start to get mad at dice rolls or card draws.
|
Yup! A couple of people have mentioned it. Good, good game. Oh, and you can play it online.
Like, say, right here.
Although then you can't see whose face twitched when you steal from someone as the Thief.
|
Citadels is awesome, yes. The funny thing is the game goes through a couple of stages, depending on experience with the game.
1. Just got the game, game revolves around using the murderer/thief well. Game is awesome and fun. 2. Players start noticing that killing and thieving doesn't nessarily help them win, just makes the other player lose. Purple buildings are everything now. Game is 'boring, luck based, shallow'. 3. Players finally figure out that you can pull off amazing bluffs (and win) if you heavily incorporate table-talk into your play and get them to not suspect you or gang up on someone else. Game is suddenly skill-based and awesome again.
Luckily, I'm in stage 3 with most of the people I play with;)
|
United States7488 Posts
On July 01 2011 10:42 Picklesicle wrote: Well, I'm actually going to preface by saying that if I could, I would likely trade one of my Space Hulk sets for Twilight Struggle. I am watching the GMT posts like a hawk for when they reprint it.
From what I hear, Twilight Struggle is due for its reprint this August (at least that's what I recall reading on BGG recently). And of course it's a game I'd highly recommend, as long as you have a second player often enough to play it with.
Also much thanks regarding the Space Hulk additions, very informative/helpful!
|
You guys forgot Space Hulk.
User was warned for this post
|
On June 29 2011 08:16 Zocat wrote:Fyrewolf I have played the old Civilization (not Advanced though) and I have to say it's one of the most boring games out there 
I don't even remember playing civilization vanilla, but it must have been pretty bad with only 1 trade card in most piles, only non-tradable calamities, tech cards run out etc. But with the expansion pack making it advanced civilization (and western extension map!) it is without a doubt the best game ever made. Only reason it's so unknown is because it's been out of print forever and mostly older people have played it.
I guess some people would complain it takes too long, but that what makes a game epic in my book.
|
Gardens Deck Game-online Dominion game
My first game where I actually knew all of the cards . I made up a nice gardens deck strategy on the fly and it worked brilliantly. Who knew that buying masses of 3 cards + masses of coppers while accepting every curse and copper thrown at me(I felt like a beggar ) could actually end up with a result this great?! :D
Also, I really think that the one sea expansion(I forget the name ) is the best from my online experience so far. Now, any ideas for how to teach my friends and family this game? I'm considering showing a youtube video that teaches them in just 5 minutes(where they can pause/rewind and ask me questions). I heard that the rule book is ugly which is one of the reasons I'm considering a youtube video. My older brother(I'm a teenager) is coming home tomorrow where I'm going to introduce him to Dominion and see what he thinks before I buy it (I need someone to play it with me ). Any tips to introducing new players? I will be learning along side of course but mostly just to memorize the real pictures.
|
On July 02 2011 10:40 3FFA wrote:Gardens Deck Game-online Dominion gameMy first game where I actually knew all of the cards  . I made up a nice gardens deck strategy on the fly and it worked brilliantly. Who knew that buying masses of 3 cards + masses of coppers while accepting every curse and copper thrown at me(I felt like a beggar  ) could actually end up with a result this great?! :D Also, I really think that the one sea expansion(I forget the name  ) is the best from my online experience so far. Now, any ideas for how to teach my friends and family this game? I'm considering showing a youtube video that teaches them in just 5 minutes(where they can pause/rewind and ask me questions). I heard that the rule book is ugly which is one of the reasons I'm considering a youtube video. My older brother(I'm a teenager) is coming home tomorrow where I'm going to introduce him to Dominion and see what he thinks before I buy it (I need someone to play it with me  ). Any tips to introducing new players? I will be learning along side of course but mostly just to memorize the real pictures.
If you think the Youtube video will work, go for it.
Otherwise, I actually think the rule book for the Base Set/Intrigue is really nice. I think the quality of the rule books steadily declines and the one for Alchemy is downright unreadable. I read rulebooks at night in bed to help myself to sleep (I kid you not) and that one kept me awake trying to decipher the typos, utter lack of punctuation and general uselessness contained therein.
My personal method for teaching the game to new people is to + Show Spoiler +start with either the Base Set or Intrigue and lay out the table (including dealing the initial hand), without setting out the Kingdom cards. I then select a set of Kingdom cards to cover the range of types of cards there are. Explain a hand: 5 cards drawn from the top of your deck. Explain the types of cards (Treasure, Victory, Action, Kingdom). Explain how the game ends and what the goal is. Now explain each type of card. I always start with Victory because it's easy: they give you points, but [generally] clog up your deck. Then I like to move on the Treasure because it is also easy: it counts as money to buy stuff. Then Action cards. Show an example of each of +cards, +actions, +money, +buys and trash. Explain that the game goes in phases per player: actions then buys. I find that this is often a big initial question. Actions, then buys. Explain each type and make sure to note that if several options exist, then go in order down the card. Also note that anything "special" is pretty darn self-explanatory on the card. Make sure that people understand that +money gives virtual money. You don't get to pick up a treasure card. Try not to go into strategy, stick to the mechanics of the game. This is particularly important for Trashing. Certainly show what can be done (like Remodel, Bridge and Workshop), but shy away from getting too strategy-y. The AH HA moments in Dominion are glorious, as you yourself note... Show that some Kingdom cards have multiple types (like Great Hall, Nobles and Harem), if you have those kinds of cards. Now show Attack cards, give a brief explanation of how they work (pretty self-explanatory on the card) and then show Defense cards. If you're using intrigue be sure to point out that Secret Chamber doesn't actually stop the attack. Don't worry about Curse cards: if there is an Attack card that utilizes them someone will ask. Deal with it then. Do tell people that at least for their first couple of games, if they ever have enough money to buy a Province, then buy a damn Province. It's like building workers in Starcraft: until you understand the subtlety of when not to build workers, then just keep building workers! Now lay out 10 Kingdom cards and play the game. If people aren't quite comfortable yet, play two or three rounds with cards face up (it'll go fast and you can get to a real game sooner if you accommodate peoples' initial discomfort) then get into it. If you or anyone else is aware of the Chapel strategy, do not play your first game with Chapel on the table! If you want to be nice, you can teach the Chapel strat later when people are hooked and excited and analyzing left and right... or you can be a little meaner and "teach" them the Chapel strat the next time it hits the table.  I tend to go for the former, but that's because I'm me.  Spoilered so that those who know all about Dominion don't have to wade through this.
The most important thing, in my opinion, when teaching any game, is to have a clear idea of the steps through which you want to teach it. Don't let yourself get majorly sidetracked from this: you may get bombarded with questions (I have no idea what you or your family is like), but if you start jumping all over the place, you'll probably get frustrated and your audience will almost definitely get lost and confused. Stick to the plan. Dominion is a very simple game at heart, and you can walk through it in 10-20 minutes depending on your audience.
|
I never let people read the rulebook. There is only one rulebook, there are several people and it can be an absolute snooze fest as they struggle through a ton of information, half of wich is not needed.
For example i play a lot of board games and thus read a lot of rulebooks. After a while you begin to kinda see repeating paterns in game design and you can quikly understand the rule and the reason for a rule. A single read is often all i need.
Then i proceed to go over it in my head till i think i can explain the basics in a few minutes. Some times i even leave out rules on purpose because i think they are too tiny to mention and we will get to them when we get to them.
|
funny i just saw this topic literally 20 minutes after online ordering the dominion box set (game plus two expansions) and cosmic encounter from amazon.
I did this because I downloaded Acension on the iphone $4.99 and it rocks - although games are very short you can complete one in like 5 minutes - so it got me interested again ( I had Carcasonne both app and board game but I didn't really enjoy it much ) and had me watching review youtube videos from the dice tower and that guy highly rated both Cosmic Encounters and Dominion..
|
On July 02 2011 06:12 semioldguy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2011 10:42 Picklesicle wrote: Well, I'm actually going to preface by saying that if I could, I would likely trade one of my Space Hulk sets for Twilight Struggle. I am watching the GMT posts like a hawk for when they reprint it.
From what I hear, Twilight Struggle is due for its reprint this August (at least that's what I recall reading on BGG recently). And of course it's a game I'd highly recommend, as long as you have a second player often enough to play it with. Also much thanks regarding the Space Hulk additions, very informative/helpful!
Cheers.
I'm curious as to your opinion on 3 games you own:
Smallworld
Power Grid
Merchants & Marauders
I have played none of the above, although I have watched a game of Smallworld.
I also made a post in reply in Iranon re. Hive and would be curious as your thoughts on that game as well. Unlike the previous 3, I do have preconceived notions on it but I'd like to compare notes, as it were.
|
On June 29 2011 01:09 Seeker wrote:My all time favorite: ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/J8Rok.jpg) GREAT multiplayer game/tons of fun/infinite possibilites of outcomes.
Not a board game...
Monopoly! CandyLand! Go! Checkers! Yay!!!
|
I cant believe no one has mentioned Cluedo..wtf The object of the basic game is for players to strategically move around the game board (a mansion), in the guise of one of the game's six characters, collecting clues from which to deduce which suspect murdered the game's perpetual victim: Dr. Black (Mr. Boddy in North American versions), and with which weapon and in what room.
|
Hmmm nobody here plays pictionary??
The most mainstream of all board games IMO, maybe after monopoly, but a lot more fun. Very easy to grasp, little rules, almost not a real board-game, but can be hillarious, especially if you're having drinks while playing.
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Uh5Z9.jpg)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pictionary
|
mansions of madness sounds fun as a lovecraft fan
|
![[image loading]](http://www.wizards.com/global/images/ah_prod_houseonthehill_pic1_en.jpg)
Probably my all time favorite board game! I'll let the wikipedia article explain the game. I don't want to inadvertantly spoil anything. :D Betrayal at House on the Hill (Wikipedia)
I just saw Mansions of Madness yesterday and I really want to play. Seems like a mix between Betrayal and Arkham Horror, but that is from my first impression of it.
|
Wow, what an amazing write up and thread! Props to the OP. I like board games, but I always feel like it is too difficult to get enough people together at the same time to play. Especially with more "geeky" games.
I read through this thread a bit fast, but I didn't see anyone mentions the web series Board James! It's from the same guy who does the Angry Video Game Nerd series. Pretty entertaining, check it out:http://cinemassacre.com/category/boardjames/
On June 30 2011 01:38 Hynda wrote:I've had this since christmas (so it's not super new  ) and it really isn't 4-6 hours once you get the hang of it. Our first play through took like 8 hours but now when people know what to do, what does what we can easily do it in 2-3h It does have a very clear time limit in the tech victory you simply can't hop around forever or someone will get that one, aswell as the tech scales so ridiculously that once you reach tier 3/4 defending a capital becomes really really hard.
Oooo I will have to take a look at this. I was very skeptical of the previous Civ board game, after all I never was a fan of the video game series until the latest game, Civ V. Finally a buddy of mine convinced me to play and it was epic. Though after attempting to play it like 4 times I still don't think we ever managed to finish a single game. A shorter version would be great.
|
![[image loading]](http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/event-center/arkham-nights/box-left-Arkham-horror.png)
This game will ruin your life. I'm too lazy to make a write-up of why it's so great, so I'll quote this one:
+ Show Spoiler [Arkham Horror] +Hello, youse.
This is the column that will see me looking at Arkham Horror, the board game based on H.P. Lovecraft’s Cthulhu Mythos. It’s a column I only feel prepared to write after spending a few years with the game. You’ve been asking for it, and I live to serve.
I get asked about Arkham Horror all the time. When someone starts taking an interest in board games, it seems that Arkham Horror is a game that draws their eye more than most. I think I know why. People who like board games are probably a bit more likely to be geeky and into reading books than people who don’t. And many of those people will have read Lovecraft. A board game based on Lovecraft’s work is a very attractive prospect, partly because you ask yourself just how a board game could possibly capture the crawling horror and hopelessness of that world.
When I get asked that question – “Hey, man. How is Arkham Horror?” – I know now what to say. This column is that answer in long form.
Arkham Horror is a game for 1-8 players. Each player takes control of an investigator who is tasked with exploring Arkham, collecting clues, and closing the terrible gates that will call forth a Great Old One. No, wait. Let me go again at this. Each player takes control of a set of statistics, has the job of moving around a board picking up tokens that represent “clues”, and must visit spaces on the board that become important as and when a very mechanical card-based AI system decides. Both of these descriptions are simultaneously accurate.
As you visit locations in Arkham, your investigator will have Lovecraftian encounters, as the great scheme unfolds around you. Some of these encounters will test your investigator’s mettle. No, wait. Let me try that again. As you hit spaces on the board, you will draw cards that will describe loose and disconnected events, written by game designers in a “Lovecraft style”. These will sometimes ask you to consult your set of statistics in order to make a dice roll that will decide your fate. All of this is correct.
As the gates open, terrible creatures emerge from the worlds beyond. These creatures, these eldritch impossibilities, start to crawl and leap and bound around Arkham. Their goal is clear – they will send the investigators to the hospital, or the asylum. Actually, wait. Another go-over. As the game progresses, cards will decide when and where cardboard tokens featuring illustrations of monsters appear. These tokens also feature some statistics. Your set of statistics will battle against these statistics through the process of rolling some dice. Occasionally the dice will show unsatisfactory results, and will move your set of statistics to a space on the board that will increase one of those statistics so your game can continue.
Your investigators will stop the Great Old One from rising from its sleep if they manage to close all the gates, but if they fail in their task, if things in Arkham get out of control, the Great Old One will rise and either destroy the universe or engage the investigators in an almost hopeless final battle. No, actually, hold. One more time. Your set of statistics will share in a victory if you visit the mechanically chosen locations in an efficient manner, and stay lucky with a decent amount of dice rolls. However, if some poor rolls are made and you fail to visit the board’s spaces in an optimal way, you will most likely see out the game with a final bout of dice rolling against a set of statistics that is a far greater set of bastards than your set. And that’s the game. All of this.
I would never recommend Arkham Horror to anybody.
There’s a myth that circulates about this game. It’s a massive fucking lie. People say that “IF YOU LOVE LOVECRAFT, YOU WILL ADORE THIS GAME.” It is a crock of shit. Loving Lovecraft is no indicator of whether or not you’ll like this game. Hell, no. So I wouldn’t even recommend it to a Lovecraft fan. If a new gamer ever asks me for a list of games they might like, Arkham Horror wouldn’t pop up on that list even if that list was so long it could fill a Necronomicon. Is this game recommended? No. Let’s get that straight. Let’s give that its own line in the column, and underline it, and put it in bold.
Is Arkham Horror recommended? No.
So Arkham Horror is a bad game, then. We’ve established that. Right? We’re all on board with that now. Arkham Horror, the game that spawned a million expansions, is a bad game. We’ve nailed that down, right? Wrong. Wrong. Arkham Horror is a gaming treasure, a work of dark genius, a terrible unapproachable unfriendly beautiful bastard of a game. Arkham Horror is quite, quite brilliant, and I’m quite in love with it.
How can all of this be simultaneously true?
WHY BOARD GAMES ARE DIFFERENT
We’re on a PC gaming site here. We’re all guys who play computer games. Board games aren’t computer games, and not only because we play them on a table, and worry about someone spilling a drink on them. We often love board games for different reasons than we love computer games.
Sometimes, you’ll read a review of a computer game that might read something like this:
“I thought this game would be ACE! But, I was bummed (Always knew you were a bum! – Ed) out when I realised that there was no sense of immersion! Immersion means when you’re totally into something, and there was no sense of that! Immersion, I mean! I always felt like I was playing a game, because all that gamey stuff like life points and stuff were all so in your face! And the only thing I want in my face is Megan Fox’s bo**bs, know what I mean lads?! The mechanics of the game were so distracting! Mechanics means, like, the way the game works! (I wish you’d get some work done! – Ed (SNIP! – Senior Ed))”
Board games are different. Sure, while you might love a board game for the sense of immersion it provides, or the way the game lifts off the table and fills the room, you also might love it for how beautiful the mechanics are. It’s like looking inside a clockwork watch. That fascination, as you see how all the pieces fit together, how everything is timed to perfection, how balanced it all is. With a beautiful board game design, you can love it for that craftsmanship you can feel with every turn. Take Scotland Yard, with its beautiful hidden movement system. Or Pandemic, with its clever and thematic “shuffle and place back on TOP” mechanic.
Or Arkham Horror, with its million moving parts coming together to simulate a terrible alien intelligence.
THE GAME KNOWS
That’s what we often say when we play Arkham Horror.
“The Game Knows.”
In our last game, Joanne’s investigator was sent to hospital after an attack by a Gug. Suddenly, monsters who had stubbornly refused to move for the entire game started to head south, gathering outside the hospital gates, blocking Joanne in.
“The Game Knows.”
My character, a private eye, found a unique item. “Hey,” I said, foolishly. “If I take this unique item to the Silver Twilight Lodge, I can complete my plot!” The very next card we picked up told us that a gate was to open on Silver Twilight Lodge. Monsters spilled out.
“The Game Knows.”
The joy, strangely, is not in the theme. It’s not really about that. The joy is in how the game’s mechanics make the theme work. The joy is in seeing the cogs and wheels turning, spitting out monsters, making you believe that there must be some intelligence at work. How can the game know when the game doesn’t know? How have the designers made this game know? How have the designers made us know this game can’t know, but think it does? That’s where the beauty of Arkham Horror lies. That’s what you need to love, before you can love it.
You see, all that stuff I explained earlier, about what’s happening thematically and what’s actually happening mechanically, is the reason why you can’t recommend Arkham Horror to anyone who is new to board games. AH doesn’t deliver theme up front – it delivers heavy mechanics, and then those mechanics start to build the feel of the theme. It’s a weird dynamic. I hated the game when I first played it. I was chugging these pieces around, doing all this administration work for the game AI. Move this here, then put that there, then these monsters move down here, and these monsters move up here… The theme was nowhere. It was all rules and headaches and consulting flowcharts. But now, a long time later, with the rules down pat and the mechanics flowing quickly, I can admire that AI. I can listen to the hum of the engine. I can see how it delivers that Lovecraftian hopelessness not through flavour text on the cards, but through the elaborate tick-tocking of a clockwork terror machine, designed to break you the fuck down.
Some people, though, will never see past the surface of the bookkeeping and will just feel the clumsy clunk-clunking of an overly complex boredom machine. And that is perfectly understandable. Not everyone enjoys geeking out over the inner workings of something. It’s possible that some of these people love Lovecraft, and are looking for some instant horror, but only find the maddening dancing of Chekaroolz, the Mad God of How The Fuck Do You Close A Gate? Believe me, loving Lovecraft has nothing to do with whether this game works for you or not. Arkham Horror is a game for people who love board games. Its a game for people who love how board games work. The Lovecraft stuff comes later, much later, but then it comes hard and comes right. The game is alive, and thinks impossible thoughts.
So, that question…
“Hey, man. How is Arkham Horror?”
My answer?
“Ask it yourself.”
Also great fun (I'm surprised it hasn't been mentioned yet), especially if you can get the maximum number of players (though you can also have one person control more than one piece):
![[image loading]](http://www.areyougame.com/images/large/lgRB26117.jpg)
Also, Risk is a terrible game.
|
|
|
|