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ChrisXIV
Austria3553 Posts
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf3/servers/show/9b9f34ca-0f6f-4d19-99e5-15cb8fe48943/iPlay-bg-Battlefield3-Rush/ 16v12 Me:"Can we balance the teams pls?" *Bad luck* And we only had one tank on Operation Firestorm, because the other one would just blow up at random intervals... | ||
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John Madden
American Samoa894 Posts
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RaLakedaimon
United States1564 Posts
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quickshot10101
Canada54 Posts
Some random MP gameplay | ||
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Fumble
156 Posts
None the less when I finally started using it, its merely just a tool for people that are not use to the clutter of battlefield 3. I guess I can kind of understand the utility of it if you have difficulty spotting campers when they are hiding under debris. Hell Im sure everybody has walked by an enemy within thinking it was already a dead corpse or you completely cannot see him at all due to a broken piece of wall covering 80% of his body. But I wouldnt trade it for any of the other scopes that gives you real sniping ability or better and easier aim up close. However there are some good uses for it. For instance in operation firestorm, in the dark warehouses. Sometimes some dude will be in the upper floor ready to snipe your partner's head off. A quick scan of the INRV will quickly reveal what would take much more attention to find otherwise. But i dont really think it op at all especially given that there are tools like the MAV, t-ugs, tanks can unlock motion sensors and spotting. Its kind of like how people claim the SCAR is broken but I dont really think its op either (though tbh, im more on the border on this one). SCAR is getting nerfed regardless though. SCAR is not my style but it definitely is a good gun. For my engineer, i use the SG553 which is the co op gun. I prefer it over the SCAR so far. I havent given the AN-91 or that G3C gun or whatever its called a fair shot yet though. | ||
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ChrisXIV
Austria3553 Posts
On November 16 2011 02:35 Fumble wrote: Its kind of like how people claim the SCAR is broken but I dont really think its op either (though tbh, im more on the border on this one). SCAR is getting nerfed regardless though. SCAR is not my style but it definitely is a good gun. For my engineer, i use the SG553 which is the co op gun. I prefer it over the SCAR so far. I havent given the AN-91 or that G3C gun or whatever its called a fair shot yet though. SCAR-H itself isn't broken. Standing alone it's "just" a really good gun, like the AEK/F2000. But it's on the engineer class. Now you have the class, that specializes in taking down vehicles, and give it one of the best guns in the game. Suddenly the assault class is reduced to reviving and healing, because for everything else, why not pick engineer? | ||
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Sm3agol
United States2055 Posts
On November 16 2011 04:34 ChrisXIV wrote: SCAR-H itself isn't broken. Standing alone it's "just" a really good gun, like the AEK/F2000. But it's on the engineer class. Now you have the class, that specializes in taking down vehicles, and give it one of the best guns in the game. Suddenly the assault class is reduced to reviving and healing, because for everything else, why not pick engineer? This. Pick engi.....use explosives perk. Spam rockets everywhere while still being competitive or even better than any other class at close-medium range. It's not balanced, but it is fun as hell when you're that engineer. Had an 8000 point game(after ribbons,etc) my highest yet last night. Found a few ribbons I didn't even knew existed. Apparently there is a squad kill ribbon. All with one SCAR clip. | ||
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Rob28
Canada705 Posts
On November 16 2011 04:34 ChrisXIV wrote: SCAR-H itself isn't broken. Standing alone it's "just" a really good gun, like the AEK/F2000. But it's on the engineer class. Now you have the class, that specializes in taking down vehicles, and give it one of the best guns in the game. Suddenly the assault class is reduced to reviving and healing, because for everything else, why not pick engineer? Ah, finally someone has put into words what I've been unable to communicate. Totaly agree with this statement. In my game, I've purposefully been levelling everything except the engineer class (haven't even unlocked mines for it yet, that's how little I've been playing it), because its super ease means I won't need to invest as much time into it as other classes. Hell, I'm going on my 3rd Assault service star now before I bother levelling my engy. Playing engineer... I dunno just makes me feel noobish, you know? And this is coming from a guy who regularly users IRNV scopes and has two grenade launcher service stars... | ||
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Fumble
156 Posts
On November 16 2011 04:34 ChrisXIV wrote: ] SCAR-H itself isn't broken. Standing alone it's "just" a really good gun, like the AEK/F2000. But it's on the engineer class. Now you have the class, that specializes in taking down vehicles, and give it one of the best guns in the game. Suddenly the assault class is reduced to reviving and healing, because for everything else, why not pick engineer? Assault use assault rifles, engineer uses carbine. In close-mid range, their guns dont have much difference. Its the long range where assault rifles really shine over carbine. SCAR at the end of the day does not do as well long range compared to any of the guns you have as an assault class. That to me is a really big selling point for assault class. Their primary weapon functions well across all tables, close, mid and long range. | ||
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Sm3agol
United States2055 Posts
On November 16 2011 05:38 Fumble wrote: Assault use assault rifles, engineer uses carbine. In close-mid range, their guns dont have much difference. Its the long range where assault rifles really shine over carbine. SCAR at the end of the day does not do as well long range compared to any of the guns you have as an assault class. That to me is a really big selling point for assault class. Their primary weapon functions well across all tables, close, mid and long range. AS well. It is still bloody well competitive with any assault rifles, which it should not be. An engi should only be able to compete with an assaults firepower at really close range. Heck, in most class based games, the engi types get shotguns and super short range/high rpm sub-machine guns. In this game engis get an amazing 9 rockets(with perk), a frags nade, AT mines, and a carbine that is better than all but a few GUNS in the game, much less rifles. That is a HECK of a lot of utility, considering how "niche" the other classes are. Engis are the only class which can literally take on anything in the game, almost evenly, at all but very long ranges. This being said, the classes aren't specialized enough that any one kit/class really seems OP. A good player can dominate with just about anything in the game. It's just that the engi has the most options for point whoring in the entire game. | ||
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Rybka
United States836 Posts
On November 16 2011 05:38 Fumble wrote: Assault use assault rifles, engineer uses carbine. In close-mid range, their guns dont have much difference. Its the long range where assault rifles really shine over carbine. SCAR at the end of the day does not do as well long range compared to any of the guns you have as an assault class. That to me is a really big selling point for assault class. Their primary weapon functions well across all tables, close, mid and long range. Assault guns don't function as well as the SCAR at close range though, which is where ~50% of shootouts take place. You're not at much of a disadvantage if you're playing at flags, as opposed to between them. ...and you have multiple tools to deal with vehicles effectively. ...AND one of these is landmines, which allow you a significant chance for completely passive double and triple kills. ...AND you have the option to ditch mines, still maintain lethal threats to air AND ground vehicles, AND gain the ability to heal your own vehicles. Did I mention passive triple kills from across the map while out-gunning the assault/commando class at close range? Even with heals and great guns at 50+ meters, it's pretty tough to hang with the points that engis can rack up. | ||
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Belisarius
Australia6233 Posts
Engineers should be anti-vehicle, not anti-everything. Also, On November 16 2011 02:35 Fumble wrote: In my opinion, INRV does not need to be nerfed. I used it for a bit when I unlocked it and tried it out on various situations for limited amounts of time but quickly changed back to other scopes. I remember way back my friend was telling me how good INRV (although he was not claiming it to be as godly as you guys make it out to be) and I was under the impression it would allow you to see through smoke and all that crap. None the less when I finally started using it, its merely just a tool for people that are not use to the clutter of battlefield 3. I guess I can kind of understand the utility of it if you have difficulty spotting campers when they are hiding under debris. Hell Im sure everybody has walked by an enemy within thinking it was already a dead corpse or you completely cannot see him at all due to a broken piece of wall covering 80% of his body. But I wouldnt trade it for any of the other scopes that gives you real sniping ability or better and easier aim up close. However there are some good uses for it. For instance in operation firestorm, in the dark warehouses. Sometimes some dude will be in the upper floor ready to snipe your partner's head off. A quick scan of the INRV will quickly reveal what would take much more attention to find otherwise. But i dont really think it op at all especially given that there are tools like the MAV, t-ugs, tanks can unlock motion sensors and spotting. IRNV is highly comparable to a concept like auto-inject larva. It doesn't make you unbeatable - Nestea could still turn it off and obliterate everyone - but it makes the game so much easier that you may as well use it, and that's bad design. It doesn't really matter whether you can personally convince yourself not to. | ||
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Fumble
156 Posts
On November 16 2011 06:31 Sm3agol wrote: AS well. It is still bloody well competitive with any assault rifles, which it should not be. An engi should only be able to compete with an assaults firepower at really close range. Heck, in most class based games, the engi types get shotguns and super short range/high rpm sub-machine guns. In this game engis get an amazing 9 rockets(with perk), a frags nade, AT mines, and a carbine that is better than all but a few GUNS in the game, much less rifles. That is a HECK of a lot of utility, considering how "niche" the other classes are. Engis are the only class which can literally take on anything in the game, almost evenly, at all but very long ranges. This being said, the classes aren't specialized enough that any one kit/class really seems OP. A good player can dominate with just about anything in the game. It's just that the engi has the most options for point whoring in the entire game. Yea but the entire point of condensing it into 4 classes was to make it so that all 4 classes were capable in their own right and werent pigeon holed into one niche role. Every role can go out and be aggressive. Hell, you equip the UMP-45 (which is a pretty good weapon) on recon and all of a sudden you got a front line recon player. Your main argument is that engineer is anti tank while being only on par with assault in their primary weapon. For one, i think assault is slightly better in choice of weapons compared to engineer, not by much but slightly. Secondly the defibrillator is a very good tool which many players would trade up for the bazooka. Med pack is also decent but its very situational. You can trade it for assualt class' grenade launcher for a weak anti tank solution. Though I dont. I heard the smoke grenades are amazing though which i think you unlock after 20 kills with the grenade launcher. Med pack vs repair tool. I think overall the repair tool has a bigger effect on a game as a good tank with a engineer as gunner/tank repairer is unstoppable. But obviously it serves no use if your not in a vehicle. Pretty situational which one is better. I'll give the edge to repair tool but sometimes the med pack is really awesome. Bazooka vs defibrillator. No other class can revive someone and it is crucial if you are actually running as a squad. It is also greatly magnified in effect when only squad leader spawn is allowed. Bazooka is just what most ppl want to pick because they look offense oriented gadgets as opposed to being the bitch healer. Why do you need to be a class that takes on everything in a team game? I play assault 75% of the time and eng 25% of the time. There are plenty of times where when defending or even attacking, i could of sniped someone off with my assault rifle but I didnt bother with my carbine as it would just reveal my position without assuring a kill. Which is why I prefer assault more. I dont think any class is overpowered. I think they all have their uses. Though if i were to make an entire team 1 class, i would make it engineer in conquest/rush since there will inevitably be vehicles. In death match or any of the squad modes, i would pick assault. | ||
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mtn
729 Posts
On November 16 2011 09:15 Fumble wrote: Yea but the entire point of condensing it into 4 classes was to make it so that all 4 classes were capable in their own right and werent pigeon holed into one niche role. Every role can go out and be aggressive. Hell, you equip the UMP-45 (which is a pretty good weapon) on recon and all of a sudden you got a front line recon player. Your main argument is that engineer is anti tank while being only on par with assault in their primary weapon. For one, i think assault is slightly better in choice of weapons compared to engineer, not by much but slightly. Secondly the defibrillator is a very good tool which many players would trade up for the bazooka. Med pack is also decent but its very situational. You can trade it for assualt class' grenade launcher for a weak anti tank solution. Though I dont. I heard the smoke grenades are amazing though which i think you unlock after 20 kills with the grenade launcher. Med pack vs repair tool. I think overall the repair tool has a bigger effect on a game as a good tank with a engineer as gunner/tank repairer is unstoppable. But obviously it serves no use if your not in a vehicle. Pretty situational which one is better. I'll give the edge to repair tool but sometimes the med pack is really awesome. Bazooka vs defibrillator. No other class can revive someone and it is crucial if you are actually running as a squad. It is also greatly magnified in effect when only squad leader spawn is allowed. Bazooka is just what most ppl want to pick because they look offense oriented gadgets as opposed to being the bitch healer. Why do you need to be a class that takes on everything in a team game? I play assault 75% of the time and eng 25% of the time. There are plenty of times where when defending or even attacking, i could of sniped someone off with my assault rifle but I didnt bother with my carbine as it would just reveal my position without assuring a kill. Which is why I prefer assault more. I dont think any class is overpowered. I think they all have their uses. Though if i were to make an entire team 1 class, i would make it engineer in conquest/rush since there will inevitably be vehicles. In death match or any of the squad modes, i would pick assault. Which is totally stupid. If i wanted to be in front lines i would've picked Assault. I didn't bother to read the rest of your post. | ||
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Belisarius
Australia6233 Posts
If I do that for a full minute, and then you run off and get run over by a tank, and then I die because I can't use my primary and I shot all my pistol rounds into your dumb ass, I hope there's a special circle of hell reserved just for you. | ||
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Skullflower
United States3779 Posts
On November 16 2011 09:35 Belisarius wrote: Public service announcement: supports! -ing THROW AMMO. If I'm trying to have sex with your face while jumping, knifing and shooting you with my pistol, you're not doing your job. If I do that for a full minute, and then you run off and get run over by a tank, and then I die because I can't use my primary and I shot all my pistol rounds into your dumb ass, I hope there's a special circle of hell reserved just for you. Hahaha, this made me laugh. Sad but true. I find it funnier when I'm surrounded by teammates on all sides and an enemy runs up on me and knifes me. That's the best >_> | ||
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Psyonic_Reaver
United States4342 Posts
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iinsom
Australia339 Posts
On November 16 2011 09:35 Belisarius wrote: Public service announcement: supports! -ing THROW AMMO. If I'm trying to have sex with your face while jumping, knifing and shooting you with my pistol, you're not doing your job. If I do that for a full minute, and then you run off and get run over by a tank, and then I die because I can't use my primary and I shot all my pistol rounds into your dumb ass, I hope there's a special circle of hell reserved just for you. Haha, i racked up 5 resupply ribbons on an operation clusterfuck server the other night. Because i kept spamming 3 and noone else would. I dont understand why people dont like free points... On an aside, add iinsomlol too battlelog and we can play =) | ||
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askTeivospy
1525 Posts
IRNV is highly comparable to a concept like auto-inject larva. It doesn't make you unbeatable - Nestea could still turn it off and obliterate everyone - but it makes the game so much easier that you may as well use it, and that's bad design. It doesn't really matter whether you can personally convince yourself not to. thats a terrible comparison.... IRNV is just something that makes it really easy to see others but that doesn't mean the other guy can't see the guy with the IRNV. It has a bigger delay on ADS so in close up battles (where you should be able to see someone unless you're literally bad, thus making IRNV moot) it is at a disadvantage. I use a holo+SG553 and IDC if you can use a colouring book scope to colour me all orange. You still have a orange triangle above your head / I've been watching my minimap / you're visible enough to me on my screen so I'll still kill you more than you'll kill me unless I'm assuming i'm invisible behind cover / you have a camp set up in a corner which is what the scope is designed for . I think IRNV should be changed in terms of where it is usable (in beta you couldn't see through fog/muzzleflash, i thought that was cool) in order to force players to switch it up but if it is changed in the way it spots people then sniper glint should also be changed because sniper glint also makes someone easy to spot. No one complains about sniper glint though because people who don't understand angles would be too afraid to admit they'd be terrible at figuring out where a sniper was shooting you from while evading their bullets. Engineer is fine imo, assault recon and supports strengths lie in 4 man squad work. Engineers are the lone wolfing class / 2 man vehicle teamwork class and I do a lot of both of those. When I do do 4 man infantry squad work we run all classes together except recon unless we need the mobile spawn beacon Changes I WOULD agree with regarding engineer though are: -Landmines should be spottable/show up on proximity radar though, they're too easy to use -EXPL upgrade is kinda too much On an aside, add iinsomlol too battlelog and we can play =) only fun people use "lol" at the end of their name :D | ||
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Grettin
42400 Posts
On November 16 2011 16:20 askTeivospy wrote: only fun people use "lol" at the end of their name :D I thought that was some WoW thing or something. | ||
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