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On October 24 2014 07:30 crms wrote:
This is my first character on Hardcore Seasonal so gear options are a bit uhh scarce. I'll try to address each bit of advice!
1) Strong-arms are hard to find, I found (1) pair so far and... they were Lightning and Strength, so that... really sucks. Is it worth using Lightning Strong-arms (reroll the Str) over 20% cold 6% crit bracers?
2) Sounds good, I'll try that out tonight
3) Yes, unfortunately it's the best weapon I've had drop so far, I will keep looking!
4) I have a thing of the deep, but it's really poorly rolled and even using reroll it's not going to match my current. Is it worth it? I'd probably lose like 10% dps 10% toughness and the 15% haunt dmg, but gain the frog pick-up range. I also have a poorly rolled Homonculous. What would you recommend? I'm currently gambling Mojo's so hopefully something comes up soon.
5) I've only kept the dog because TMF, I actually have a pretty nicely rolled Leoric signet, but I wasn't sure if a TMF dog, to assist with damage soaking and output would be better than a higher dps ring (like 5%) and no dogs. Someday I'll get unity/SOJ but yeah. :|
Thanks for the help.
you can go no dogs w/ horrify
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Horrify is better than dogs in almost every circumstance. Keep gambling Mojo. A snake will really help. Unless you have a Goldwrap and a Hoarder gem, thats when you want a frog.
Your bracers are kind of maybe a little better than a poopy Strong arm but still need to go one you get a better Mojo
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so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know.
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The TMF dog is good, but only if you're using a serpent. without the serpent you're better off locking stuff down than having one dog to block for you. That changes if you get a snake and can get the 30% damage mitigation. Pretty much the best thing for keeping you alive until double unity.
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Cool, thanks for all the help guys.
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On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know.
jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now
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On October 24 2014 14:11 Frolossus wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know. jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now
Not to argue with you, but after CDR, you want a balance of Crit Stats. 10 CD for each CC. If you've got a lot of CD already, CC will help you more than more CD will.
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On October 25 2014 00:37 Terranasaur wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2014 14:11 Frolossus wrote:On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know. jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now Not to argue with you, but after CDR, you want a balance of Crit Stats. 10 CD for each CC. If you've got a lot of CD already, CC will help you more than more CD will.
right but CD is harder to gear for cause the main slots are jewelry and gloves.
CC rolls on jewelry, gloves, head, bracer, off hand
and CC rolls higher on the 1:10 ratio than CD
gloves are 10 cc/50cd
rings are 6cc/50cd
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On October 25 2014 01:05 Frolossus wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2014 00:37 Terranasaur wrote:On October 24 2014 14:11 Frolossus wrote:On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know. jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now Not to argue with you, but after CDR, you want a balance of Crit Stats. 10 CD for each CC. If you've got a lot of CD already, CC will help you more than more CD will. right but CD is harder to gear for cause the main slots are jewelry and gloves. CC rolls on jewelry, gloves, head, bracer, off hand and CC rolls higher on the 1:10 ratio than CD gloves are 10 cc/50cd rings are 6cc/50cd
Exactly my point. Thats why blindly prioritizing CC over CD is a bad idea.
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On October 25 2014 01:23 Terranasaur wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2014 01:05 Frolossus wrote:On October 25 2014 00:37 Terranasaur wrote:On October 24 2014 14:11 Frolossus wrote:On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know. jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now Not to argue with you, but after CDR, you want a balance of Crit Stats. 10 CD for each CC. If you've got a lot of CD already, CC will help you more than more CD will. right but CD is harder to gear for cause the main slots are jewelry and gloves. CC rolls on jewelry, gloves, head, bracer, off hand and CC rolls higher on the 1:10 ratio than CD gloves are 10 cc/50cd rings are 6cc/50cd Exactly my point. Thats why blindly prioritizing CC over CD is a bad idea.
then we are in agreement over my original statement
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On October 25 2014 01:50 Frolossus wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2014 01:23 Terranasaur wrote:On October 25 2014 01:05 Frolossus wrote:On October 25 2014 00:37 Terranasaur wrote:On October 24 2014 14:11 Frolossus wrote:On October 24 2014 11:01 crms wrote:
so horrify and a DPS upgrade ring is better than dogs + tmf? IF horrify is in the build is CDR>CC>CD? Or only to a certain break point?
the only reason i ran dogs > horrify is because I figured TMF dogs might be better, but I don't really know enough about TMF or dog mechanics to make that call accurately.
I have a hoarder gem but no goldwrap yet, but that's good to know. jade doc is pretty much all about cdr->cd->cc right now Not to argue with you, but after CDR, you want a balance of Crit Stats. 10 CD for each CC. If you've got a lot of CD already, CC will help you more than more CD will. right but CD is harder to gear for cause the main slots are jewelry and gloves. CC rolls on jewelry, gloves, head, bracer, off hand and CC rolls higher on the 1:10 ratio than CD gloves are 10 cc/50cd rings are 6cc/50cd Exactly my point. Thats why blindly prioritizing CC over CD is a bad idea. then we are in agreement over my original statement
Unless you somehow have way more CD than CC...
The generalization is correct. CDR > CD > CC
I was just throwing an asterisk on it that if you've got a higher than 10-1 ratio, you should look at increasing CC over adding more CD.
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did a bit more jade practice last night, I really like Horrify, but I think I would prefer dogs if I can gamble a Serpent. I'm using horrify with frog now instead of dogs and TMF. I did a GR21 or 22 last night and comfortably cleared (in terms of speed) with 2m left even after I went to town and waited for Spirit Vessel CD to be up which wasted ~3-4 minutes. The build is way scarier to play than Pets and I'm terrified I'll RIP soon. I don't think I'll go further than GR22 for a bit, until I get some more upgrades and just become more comfortable with the spec.
I like that it requires attention to play Jade but on some level it was nice being mentally checked out and collecting loot with pets hah.
Are DoD/Carnevil builds any good in comparison to standard physical pet or jade? I'm assuming it's probably close to normal pets, and under performs compared to Jade. I might try that build out as well for funzies since I have DoD/Carnivel.
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Crms-1320/hero/52306000
this is my new setup based on your guys suggestions with gear I actually had to swap in. On the quest for Serpent Mojo, SOJ/Unity, Strongarms and a proper weapon!
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On October 25 2014 03:02 crms wrote:did a bit more jade practice last night, I really like Horrify, but I think I would prefer dogs if I can gamble a Serpent. I'm using horrify with frog now instead of dogs and TMF. I did a GR21 or 22 last night and comfortably cleared (in terms of speed) with 2m left even after I went to town and waited for Spirit Vessel CD to be up which wasted ~3-4 minutes. The build is way scarier to play than Pets and I'm terrified I'll RIP soon. I don't think I'll go further than GR22 for a bit, until I get some more upgrades and just become more comfortable with the spec. I like that it requires attention to play Jade but on some level it was nice being mentally checked out and collecting loot with pets hah. Are DoD/Carnevil builds any good in comparison to standard physical pet or jade? I'm assuming it's probably close to normal pets, and under performs compared to Jade. I might try that build out as well for funzies since I have DoD/Carnivel. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/Crms-1320/hero/52306000this is my new setup based on your guys suggestions with gear I actually had to swap in. On the quest for Serpent Mojo, SOJ/Unity, Strongarms and a proper weapon!
In my opinion, the DoD/Carn build is the most fun WD build by far. It does a shit ton of damage, and you can stay reasonably safe. If you've got Zuni Set, the mask and a decent dagger, you might give it a try. You'll want to swap out your BoP and ToxinGem for a Gogok of Swiftness and a Zeij's, and practice on some lower rifts until you learn how to position the little rascals, but that build is hella fun. Didn't realize that was an option.
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DoD/Carnevil is a great build - seems on par with pets without an SMK. On non-HC, I can cruise through GR 30 with meh gear and that build. Zeis is not a uniform choice for that build, since the pet leash range was increased... I end up using BoP anyway.
As for Jade, I haven't played it (though I have a pretty good set of gear sitting around), but it seems like it would be scary HC. Also, in terms of mana spending, keep in mind that using the Creeping Death passive means that the Haunt and Locusts really do last a long time - you can harvest multiple times without having to recast haunt or locust. The same is not true for the toxin gem DoT though.
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He's playing HC. I'd say the lockdown for Zeij is better than BoP by a lot. Personal preference though, for sure.
Totally agree that the pet based builds are going to be safer. I can't imagine playing Jade on HC. Super scary.
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On October 25 2014 03:41 zipz0p wrote:
As for Jade, I haven't played it (though I have a pretty good set of gear sitting around), but it seems like it would be scary HC. Also, in terms of mana spending, keep in mind that using the Creeping Death passive means that the Haunt and Locusts really do last a long time - you can harvest multiple times without having to recast haunt or locust. The same is not true for the toxin gem DoT though.
I'm an idiot. I thought the DOT was removed when you harvested so I had to reapply my haunt/locust again. No wonder I was having mana issues. I have so much to learn about Jade Doc.
Also, you're right, it's super scary but it should be OK once I'm comfortable with the play style, or I'll just die and that will be it. 
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my 3 jades all ripped before 2.1 hit due to comp crashes and i'm just waiting for the next season to make another.
i enjoyed the playstyle way more than pet but i never got an SMK
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DOD/Carn is fun until you get 1-shot shooting into a room with reflect dmg up 
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On October 25 2014 08:03 Frolossus wrote:
my 3 jades all ripped before 2.1 hit due to comp crashes and i'm just waiting for the next season to make another.
i enjoyed the playstyle way more than pet but i never got an SMK
Eh, SMK just makes you feel like roid rage, having the buffs and army up whenever you want. The playstyle doesn't change much. My WD was my first main geared/T6 toon and while I loved being able to do the higher tier content, after you have other options it's not very engaging. He's relegated to gold/boon duty right now.
Never tried Jade though. Might give it a shot when I finally, if ever, get sick of Firebird wiz
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On October 25 2014 08:52 heartlxp wrote:DOD/Carn is fun until you get 1-shot shooting into a room with reflect dmg up
You only get reflected on your own dart which doesn't do much damage. If you're getting one shot by that you're being reckless
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EPT
