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League of Legends [New forum, check OP!] - Page 1038

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Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 18:22 GMT
#20741
On September 29 2010 02:52 spinesheath wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2010 02:38 Mogwai wrote:
On September 29 2010 02:34 spinesheath wrote:
Hah, Heimer's pretty fun to play. Well at least in the one practice game where I played him he was.
There don't seem to be any up-to-date guides on him, so:

I use a HP/MPen/MP5L/MP5L runepage, that should be decent I guess.
9/0/21 masteries looks decent too.
Items and skill order is where I am unsure/torn. He's my first real AP champ so I am not so sure what items to get.
Start with DRing? Then rush Zhonyas or maybe get RoA -> Zhonya? Should I even bother with defense, and if so, when? Sorc Boots I guess. Should I stack a few DRings early?
I'm thinking about using Teleport/Flash, or is that bad?

ghost flash
2-3 d-rings -> sorc boots -> z-ring
missiles and grenades with a couple points in turrets early just to be able to use them as wards. poke at bitches wif yo missiles.

Ye that's what I was thinking about for skills, completely forgot to mention it. Should I even get the ult before I have W and E maxed?

I think you should do:

missile
turret
missile
nade
missile
ult
missile
turrent
missile

nade > ult > turret

just so you have turrets + snare to run when you have to.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
Juicyfruit
Profile Joined May 2008
Canada5484 Posts
September 28 2010 18:23 GMT
#20742
On September 29 2010 03:16 Southlight wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2010 00:35 Mogwai wrote:
Utah should always be Kass. His Sona's good, but meh, he's still better on Kass.


It's also boiling down to what we need on our team; with Panth/Sion/MF squishies tend to explode so there's a premium on anti-tank, which Kass is. Losing last night to Garen/Shen/Olaf was BS because that would never happen when I'm Kass (free win). I also think perma-snare>1.5-second stun for MF's ult anyways.

Our bans have favoured ridding ourselves of heroes that squash us in teamfights, and if I go back to Kass full time we can shift bans to Mumu>Morg>Vlad I think. Garen's significantly less of an issue with Kassadin.


What happened to Udyr?
ProV1
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States980 Posts
September 28 2010 18:26 GMT
#20743
Twitch proccing the atk speed from Q after pressing R is not fun. His atk speed is ridiculously high.
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 28 2010 18:33 GMT
#20744
What about Udyr? O_o?
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
DefMatrixUltra
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada1992 Posts
September 28 2010 18:38 GMT
#20745
On September 29 2010 03:26 ProV1 wrote:
Twitch proccing the atk speed from Q after pressing R is not fun. His atk speed is ridiculously high.


This is honestly a huge deal, and it's what made me start playing him again. The stupid thing where you HAVE to autoattack to get the proc and you don't even proc until the second (or sometimes third) hit was just utterly retarded. Now if stealth ends for any reason, you get the proc. Makes a lot more sense and is less clunky.
ghen
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States1356 Posts
September 28 2010 18:39 GMT
#20746
On September 29 2010 02:29 Mazer wrote:
Are there any up-to-date threads where numbers are crunched that indicate the best type of rune for each colour?

Maybe it's time to update my pages because they've been pretty much unchanged for a half year.


Spreadsheet I made a few weeks ago. Switch to page 2 and 4

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AmEYMlSWWrzxdGdhRDM2elJVMWVoTDZwVnFBTkNxS0E&authkey=CK3o02Q&hl=en#gid=2

HazMat
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States17077 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-28 18:44:03
September 28 2010 18:41 GMT
#20747
On September 29 2010 00:35 Mogwai wrote:
we're all fucking useless when it comes to playing multiple champs, lol

like, I really should just always play Pantheon. I can play Amumu/Kog/Garen/Xin, but there's a considerable dropoff in my skill without Pantheon (well, I guess my Garen's still rape, LOLOLOLOL).

Utah should always be Kass. His Sona's good, but meh, he's still better on Kass.

Turkey should be Sion. I dunno how but his Sion got a lot better than all his others characters. I guess his WW would still be fine too.

EzPz needs MF/WW/Annie.

Red needs Kayle.

Shake needs Nid.

lol, I dunno, we all play characters that just aren't quite good enough IMO. Let's step it up and become tier whores guiz! We must all aspire to be Aaerox level tier whores, capable of playing everyone in Elementz's tier 1. And we need a twitch player :p.
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2010 00:31 Brees wrote:
On September 29 2010 00:26 Mogwai wrote:
On September 29 2010 00:16 StuffedTurkey wrote:
On September 29 2010 00:10 Mogwai wrote:
no joke, we need to start banning twitch, I'd rather play vs. 100 vlads than 1 good twitch. rat is so fucking gay.

utah just needs to not suck with range carries and take up twitch again :D

<3 utah

oh, and that's another problem with our team now that I think about it. we have no one who plays morg/vlad. I can play Kog/Garen/Amumu, EzPz can play MF, but we don't have people who can punish the other team for letting us have morg and/or vlad unless Aaerox is playing. So basically we just hope that they ban along expected guidelines and let EzPz have MF and let them have Morg and then hope that they sleep on twitch. meh, I'm starting to hate this meta.


you guys dont ban morg wut? who you ban?


our standard bans are vlad and amumu. Utah, relearn janna and let's just CP mummies.

I don't really need Nid. I can play a lot of easymode champs like Amumu, Ashe, Sion, Taric, Kennen, Garen and if needed, Udyr (I'm not a very good jungler, but my udyr w/l is pretty good)

I know Aaerox plays Twitch so we should just run a babysit twitch team comp.
Twitch, Kayle, Sona to lane with Kayle for epic lols, nidalee and ww/udyr.
www.youtube.com/user/ShakeDrizzle | League and SSBM content creator | Armada's Youtube Editor
myopia
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2928 Posts
September 28 2010 18:44 GMT
#20748
EzPz is a pro Ezreal, he carries us baddies hard
it's my first day
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 18:47 GMT
#20749
ezreal is pretty forgettable next to kog, mf, and trist right now IMO.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
ghen
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States1356 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-28 18:52:44
September 28 2010 18:50 GMT
#20750
On September 29 2010 03:14 Navi wrote:

Kog'maw hybrid
+ Show Spoiler +
Hey guys, I've been working on a Kog'Maw build for quite a bit now. I've been seeing people theorycrafting about AP builds, and I totally agree with them that if built correctly it could be stronger than pure AD. However, I see Kog'Maws building Tears of the Goddess and try to R spam as they build up their mana pool (to keep up their R-spam late game?) and going for pure AP and very little else. I think that this is the wrong way to go about it, as using Kog'Maw only for his R, while fun and useful while turret hugging or pushing, makes very little use of his sick passives and his ridiculous range with w. I think that making use of his w (which scales with AP as well, with enough AP you can get 11% of their life with each proc or something ridiculous like that) with AP and attackspeed is the right way to go.

I start off with the a doran's shield (or blade if you can manage it), and build zerks. Then I go into bloodrazors. Seems pretty normal so far. But then I deviate from regular builds by getting a Stinger, which gives attackspeed and a 10%cdr. If you can get your jungler to give you the third blue by this point, you can have nearly full cdr on your w which makes you very hard to lane against if you're still even in the laning phase at all. The stinger gets made into a Nashor's tooth, which has attack speed, AP, mregen, and 25% CDR, all of which are fine on Kog'Maw. As long as you are not spamming R nonstop, you should have absolutely no mana problems by this point even without blue (it just allows you to do that, but you don't need that too badly yet). If the game isn't over by now, I pick my choice of Rylai's or Zhonyas and build the next whenever I can and then by now the game should be over. I prefer getting Rylai's first because the AP gets your w to about 8 or 9% of their life per hit. Combined with bloodrazors and Rylai's slowing effect, you are an absolute monster in teamfights. Additionally, Nashor's tooth is enough to keep your w's cooldown to 9 seconds, which means you only have 3 seconds every fight at which point your w is not on. Rylai's and Zhonyas together give you so much survivability that you are nearly impossible to kill as long as you have your team somewhere nearby.

I actually got a pentakill after I was playing on my friend's account solo q because they killed our ww who was nashoring, and then garen/taric/sona decided to be silly and attack them right as they killed nashor while I finished off the blue golem. by the time I got near enough to start w'ing them, my team had died and I managed to kill two of them off with w and r (the vision from R is just sexy) and kiting, and when three of them had me surrounded in a bush, I zhonya'd, flashed into our red, r'd them, and kited them with r, w, and e. Rylai's alone gives you so much slow and survival, with Zhonya it just seems plain unfair.

I take flash/cleanse, because cleanse->flash-> e is usually enough to keep you alive early game, and cleanse + zhonya makes you very difficult to instagib. If you're confident enough to play with flash/ghost or have a team that can help you chase while keeping you alive, I would definetly go for it.

As for runes, an attackspeed page would probably still be optimal, but you can really run whatever the hell you like (which is what I love about this build as of now, because I only have arpen runes and 2 rune pages since i changed from EU D=) as the items give you so much stats. Lategame, elixer pump is mandatory: if your team is getting into big teamfights pretty early, you can start pumping green right after razors, and after you get rylai's blue is also quite valuable because quite a large amount of damage comes from your spells at this point (as if they hadn't already!).

I think that the greatest pros of this build are the survivability that the Zhonyas give you combined with the AoE slows you obtain from your rylais is just so great. I mean, most people wouldn't be justified in getting either in an AD build your DPS is still stellar, with the bloodrazors+ boosted w.

I would think a 9-0-21 would work best with this, as the spell pen and cdr on summoners helps a lot with survivability and damage output for your razors and w and whatnot.
If this is already a really common build, I apologize for your time. Otherwise, try it out!
edit: i'm a vulture :o


I agree with this. Phr0st actually told me to try this build and it works like a dream. I don't like cleanse taking the place of ghost though, but that's completely personal preference. I'm thinking instead of Rylais though to just get an NLR and assess from there. I don't seem to ever need the extra slow on my spells
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 18:58 GMT
#20751
l2kogmaw

d-blade
boots
d-blade
recurve bow
mercs
banshee's
then finish bloodrazors

you don't need to hit harder, you just need to be harder to kill. tank maw is too pro.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
Juicyfruit
Profile Joined May 2008
Canada5484 Posts
September 28 2010 19:08 GMT
#20752
On September 29 2010 03:33 Southlight wrote:
What about Udyr? O_o?


You don't seem to play him much anymore =I
Southlight
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States11768 Posts
September 28 2010 19:15 GMT
#20753
On September 29 2010 04:08 Juicyfruit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2010 03:33 Southlight wrote:
What about Udyr? O_o?


You don't seem to play him much anymore =I


My runeset is worse than the people I play with who can jungle O_O

Also, Kassadin.
oraoraoraoraoraoraoraora
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 19:18 GMT
#20754
Pantheon is too pro in the jungle.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
BloodNinja
Profile Joined June 2010
United States2791 Posts
September 28 2010 19:20 GMT
#20755
On September 29 2010 03:50 ghen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 29 2010 03:14 Navi wrote:

Kog'maw hybrid
+ Show Spoiler +
Hey guys, I've been working on a Kog'Maw build for quite a bit now. I've been seeing people theorycrafting about AP builds, and I totally agree with them that if built correctly it could be stronger than pure AD. However, I see Kog'Maws building Tears of the Goddess and try to R spam as they build up their mana pool (to keep up their R-spam late game?) and going for pure AP and very little else. I think that this is the wrong way to go about it, as using Kog'Maw only for his R, while fun and useful while turret hugging or pushing, makes very little use of his sick passives and his ridiculous range with w. I think that making use of his w (which scales with AP as well, with enough AP you can get 11% of their life with each proc or something ridiculous like that) with AP and attackspeed is the right way to go.

I start off with the a doran's shield (or blade if you can manage it), and build zerks. Then I go into bloodrazors. Seems pretty normal so far. But then I deviate from regular builds by getting a Stinger, which gives attackspeed and a 10%cdr. If you can get your jungler to give you the third blue by this point, you can have nearly full cdr on your w which makes you very hard to lane against if you're still even in the laning phase at all. The stinger gets made into a Nashor's tooth, which has attack speed, AP, mregen, and 25% CDR, all of which are fine on Kog'Maw. As long as you are not spamming R nonstop, you should have absolutely no mana problems by this point even without blue (it just allows you to do that, but you don't need that too badly yet). If the game isn't over by now, I pick my choice of Rylai's or Zhonyas and build the next whenever I can and then by now the game should be over. I prefer getting Rylai's first because the AP gets your w to about 8 or 9% of their life per hit. Combined with bloodrazors and Rylai's slowing effect, you are an absolute monster in teamfights. Additionally, Nashor's tooth is enough to keep your w's cooldown to 9 seconds, which means you only have 3 seconds every fight at which point your w is not on. Rylai's and Zhonyas together give you so much survivability that you are nearly impossible to kill as long as you have your team somewhere nearby.

I actually got a pentakill after I was playing on my friend's account solo q because they killed our ww who was nashoring, and then garen/taric/sona decided to be silly and attack them right as they killed nashor while I finished off the blue golem. by the time I got near enough to start w'ing them, my team had died and I managed to kill two of them off with w and r (the vision from R is just sexy) and kiting, and when three of them had me surrounded in a bush, I zhonya'd, flashed into our red, r'd them, and kited them with r, w, and e. Rylai's alone gives you so much slow and survival, with Zhonya it just seems plain unfair.

I take flash/cleanse, because cleanse->flash-> e is usually enough to keep you alive early game, and cleanse + zhonya makes you very difficult to instagib. If you're confident enough to play with flash/ghost or have a team that can help you chase while keeping you alive, I would definetly go for it.

As for runes, an attackspeed page would probably still be optimal, but you can really run whatever the hell you like (which is what I love about this build as of now, because I only have arpen runes and 2 rune pages since i changed from EU D=) as the items give you so much stats. Lategame, elixer pump is mandatory: if your team is getting into big teamfights pretty early, you can start pumping green right after razors, and after you get rylai's blue is also quite valuable because quite a large amount of damage comes from your spells at this point (as if they hadn't already!).

I think that the greatest pros of this build are the survivability that the Zhonyas give you combined with the AoE slows you obtain from your rylais is just so great. I mean, most people wouldn't be justified in getting either in an AD build your DPS is still stellar, with the bloodrazors+ boosted w.

I would think a 9-0-21 would work best with this, as the spell pen and cdr on summoners helps a lot with survivability and damage output for your razors and w and whatnot.
If this is already a really common build, I apologize for your time. Otherwise, try it out!
edit: i'm a vulture :o


I agree with this. Phr0st actually told me to try this build and it works like a dream. I don't like cleanse taking the place of ghost though, but that's completely personal preference. I'm thinking instead of Rylais though to just get an NLR and assess from there. I don't seem to ever need the extra slow on my spells


Does Rylais slow proc with W? Is seems counter-intuitive since W is more like an auto attack which makes me think you would need a Frozen Mallet to proc the slow on each hit. It should still proc on the Q (active) , E, and R since those work quite similar to castable spells.
myopia
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States2928 Posts
September 28 2010 19:21 GMT
#20756
Frozen Mallet Kog is soooo annoying

then there's the Kogs that're smart enough to run mercs and banshees...
it's my first day
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
September 28 2010 19:39 GMT
#20757
Does Kog even need anything past Recurve in offense? I would assume that even without BR he will hurt a lot for quite a while.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 19:40 GMT
#20758
On September 29 2010 03:58 Mogwai wrote:
l2kogmaw

d-blade
boots
d-blade
recurve bow
mercs
banshee's
then finish bloodrazors

you don't need to hit harder, you just need to be harder to kill. tank maw is too pro.

comeon, it's like 4 posts up, why the fuck do I need to quote myself?
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
spinesheath
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany8679 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-28 19:46:23
September 28 2010 19:45 GMT
#20759
No I mean really, why not delay BR even more? Especially if you have an AD threat like Panth/Yi/whatever.
If you have a good reason to disagree with the above, please tell me. Thank you.
Mogwai
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States13274 Posts
September 28 2010 19:48 GMT
#20760
just so you kill them faster. then I get a GA for teh lawls or a phage to stop dem from being gay and runnin'.

but I guess it's game dependent... BR does increase your damage by a lot so I don't like delaying it too much, I just like having veil as a safety net.
mogwaismusings.wordpress.com
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