EPTLeague of Legends - Page 200
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Baikinman
United States74 Posts
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
On May 12 2010 17:40 redtooth wrote: wow elementz is making Yi look viable. zerg_russian: were you on the stream when he was claiming to be the god of nidalee? Was that right after he was like "NAME ONE THING THAT AKALI DOES BETTER THAN A CHAMP THAT DOES IT BEST"? | ||
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bargaw
Poland36 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Baikinman
United States74 Posts
blitz, kat, akali, gragas, morgana (us) vs warwick (level 18), ezreal, zilean, garen, rammus (enemy) we got destroyed Yes our Morgana died a lot with a pretty bad negative ratio but he died for our team except 1-3 times. BUT i dont see the use of Kat and Akali. (especially on the same team... ugh) Kat with 3 bloodthirster wasn't dropping things fast as some normal dps should b killing. why not have IE or Black Cleaver instead of 3 thirster? (2 will b enough to stack the dmg?) Akali can't say much because i still have no clue what she does but it seems like she doesn't have any survival skill or cc other than the smoke aoe that sucks because its obvious where she is. I'll NEVER say any hero is so useless because there are no useless hero out there b/c if your good then you should b able to do pretty decent. But i know Southlight isn't "good" with Kat compared to Janna, Udyr, Malphite (depends on team too much but he isn't bad with him). I dont know what to say about that game but it was just plain terrible. Just a reminder to all Kat + Akali same team is pretty bad. Personally i hate them both on my team. | ||
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emucxg
Finland4559 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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kyzers0ze
Singapore1073 Posts
On May 12 2010 17:32 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote: Lol I was watching you guys being streamed at work today. Grackis gas no idea how to play Akali, it took him one game to realize you need to hit with aa to proc q and another to figure the passive out. That was the game where Kyzers0ze was Karthus. rofl i was wondering if he was streaming. that was my best karth game out of like 3 at that time =/ | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On May 12 2010 19:55 Southlight wrote: Shame we had a 19-10-8 Katarina (was 15-3-X for a while) on our team. Man, I wish we replaced her with Janna. Sounds about right | ||
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
On May 12 2010 21:43 kyzers0ze wrote: rofl i was wondering if he was streaming. that was my best karth game out of like 3 at that time =/ Ya i saw you dive like 4 times and get kills on all of them haha. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
Here's how armor, magic resist, armor penetration and magic penetration work: Armor and magic armor are simple. You get more of it, your damage taken is reduced. At armor 0, you're taking 100% damage; at armor 50, you're taking 67% damage; at armor 100, it goes down to 50%, then at 200 armor it goes down to 33%. Armor and Magic penetration are interesting in that there are both fixed armor / magic resist reductions (Sunder mastery, runes, The Black Cleaver item, Sorcerer's Shoes) and percentile reductions (Archaic Knowledge mastery, Void Staff item, Last Whisper item). The math works like this: If you have 18 armor pen from Runes, 6 armor pen from Masteries, and you take the Last Whisper item, an opponent with 100 base armor would have an effective armor of (100-6-18)*.6 = 51.6, for 65.9% damage taken. So, damage-for-cost, what's worth getting? Say I'm a level 1 Jax facing a level 1 Garen. With 19 base armor, his damage taken is 84%; if I get 18 armor pen. from Mark-type runes, that goes up to 99%, for 18% increased damage to my attacks and Leap Attack ability (which goes against armor). Not bad. Say I’m a level 6 Annie trying to gank a level 5 Garen, with 35 magic resist. As Annie, I have the Archaic Knowledge mastery, which is a no-brainer, for 15% magic penetration. With that, his effective magic resist would be 29.75, for 77% damage taken. Now, if I buy the Sorcerer’s Shoes for 20 magic pen, his effective magic resist would be 12.75, for 88% damage taken, or a 15% damage boost; if I cast Summon Tibbers + level 3 Incinerate, the extra magic penetration from the shoes are equivalent to 47 Ability Power, worth 1010 gold (a Blasting Wand and then some). Considering the Sorcerer’s Shoes cost 1100 gold and also give me movement speed, they look like a pretty good buy! If Annie had Magic Penetration marks as well, Garen’s final magic resist would be (35-20-9)*.85 = 5, for 95% damage taken, or 23% more damage than in the base case. Say I’m a level 11 Ashe shooting down an enemy Rammus with the help of another physical DPS character like Master Yi. Rammus has 100 armor for 50% damage taken. If I get 5 stacks of the Black Cleaver on him, that takes his armor down to 40, for 71% damage taken from me and Yi- a 42% damage bonus to us both. If we both have Sunder (-6 armor) and Armor Pen. Marks (-18 armor) as well, Rammus will have an effective armor of 16, for 86% damage taken, or 72% more than in the base case of armor 100. If my Master Yi ally is dealing 150 damage per attack and has a Brutalizer item (-15 armor), Ashe’s armor reduction effect from the Black Cleaver is worth 60% more damage for Yi, equivalent to 90 base damage per attack, which would cost him 3300+ gold to get otherwise . Do note that static armor penetration is worth more damage the LESS armor my opponent has. | ||
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bellweather
United States404 Posts
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scDeluX
Canada1341 Posts
. I stopped playing for sc2 tho. Too bad there is no ladder in this game. It made alot of good people lose interest. | ||
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Madkipz
Norway1643 Posts
On May 13 2010 01:30 [Z]-NhaT wrote: Great game, I've played around 700 games. Alot of them at high ELO. . I stopped playing for sc2 tho. Too bad there is no ladder in this game. It made alot of good people lose interest. I was under the impression that they would eventually make a ladder system, call me if im wrong though as I usually am. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On May 13 2010 01:18 InsideTheBox wrote: Excellent write up, although I was always under the impression that percentile reductions were applied before fixed number reductions for armor/MR. Anyone confirm/deny? (armor/MR of target - reduction) * (1 - .01 * %pen) - flat pen. Flat pen can only drop down to 0, though. | ||
NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
We missed you and your Nidalee  | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On May 13 2010 00:43 Zato-1 wrote: I wrote up an analysis of the armor pen and magic pen stats and shared it with a group of friends, lemme know if you guys find it useful / interesting: Here's how armor, magic resist, armor penetration and magic penetration work: Armor and magic armor are simple. You get more of it, your damage taken is reduced. At armor 0, you're taking 100% damage; at armor 50, you're taking 67% damage; at armor 100, it goes down to 50%, then at 200 armor it goes down to 33%. ok, good baselines, but you might as well give the formula. damage is determined by the following formula: (Damage * 100)/(Armor + 100) = Actual Damage With Magic Resist Subbed in for Armor when talking about spells of course. On May 13 2010 00:43 Zato-1 wrote: Armor and Magic penetration are interesting in that there are both fixed armor / magic resist reductions (Sunder mastery, runes, The Black Cleaver item, Sorcerer's Shoes) and percentile reductions (Archaic Knowledge mastery, Void Staff item, Last Whisper item). The math works like this: If you have 18 armor pen from Runes, 6 armor pen from Masteries, and you take the Last Whisper item, an opponent with 100 base armor would have an effective armor of (100-6-18)*.6 = 51.6, for 65.9% damage taken. Actually, you misstated stuff here. There are 3 types of penetration. You got 2 right, but The Black Cleaver is actually an incorrect example of fixed penetration. BC, Soraka's starcall, Corki's gattling gun, stark's aura, abyssal scepter's aura, Ryze's Spell Flux, Fiddle's aura and so on are all examples of a different sort of "penetration" in that they all reduce the champion's armor/magic resist instead of penetrating it. The two big differences between what the brutalizer, sorc shoes, haunting guise and penetration runes do and what these do are: 1. Armor/Magic Resist Reductions help teammates, whereas penetration only helps you. 2. They get stacked at different times. What I mean by this is that you're actually doing the stacking of penetration incorrectly. The ordering is as follows: FIRST: Armor/MR reductions apply SECOND: Percentage based penetrations apply THIRST: Flat penetrations apply For instance, this means that your Last Whisper vs. 100 armor math is wrong and you actually do (100 * .6) - 18 - 6 = 36 effective armor which is a big difference. On May 13 2010 00:43 Zato-1 wrote: So, damage-for-cost, what's worth getting? EXAMPLE STUFF Do note that static armor penetration is worth more damage the LESS armor my opponent has. Last line is correct. Armor reducing and flat penetration are worth the most when your opponent has low armor and Last Whisper, Void Staff and Archaic Knowledge are worth the most when your opponent has high armor. The long and short of analysis though is that penetration is better than it first seems to new players. Last Whisper is just ridiculous for cost efficiency on auto-attack based heroes (note that unlike EVERY other type of physical penetration/armor reduction, LW does not apply to physical based abilities, so if you're looking to boost abilities like Pantheon's Heartseeker, Ashe's Volley, or Garen's Judgement, LW with not affect them, whereas Brutalizer, Sunder, and Armor Pen Marks will). With Sorc Shoes, Magic Pen Marks, Archaic Knowledge and Void Staff, anything < 80 Magic Resist is going to be completely penetrated. Throw Haunting Guise in there and you start to see why people in this thread talk about how stacking MR is not the way to counter mages now and how investing in HP is just smarter. | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
needed sleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep. I dun get how you play with those WC (and Australia, WTF PASSIONBEAR!?) guys so much, it makes you stay up so late lol. god, I tried so hard to keep my Nidalee win streak going with my last game, but our Rammus player was level 8 and basically did nothing so we lost despite me playing my balls off. I knew when I saw a level 8 that I should've switched to my smurf, lol. Fucking smash players need to learn to play LoL well. | ||
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