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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
You can, of course, make up for this by having a strong 1v2 lane and a stud jungler (which gives you map control) but if the other team has a strong/stronger 1v1 and a stud jungler of their own, Trist still is a liability for the first part of the game. It's why a lot of games you'll see Trist rack up like 300 creep kills and still lose; she's destroying people but it's too late to make a significant difference. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
the new guy looks meh... I was kinda hoping we wouldn't have to deal with bladestorm ever again, but I guess I should've known better. His thingie that like, charges up his Defense and Magic Resist passively just sounds so horribly imbalanced and makes me wonder if he'll be the new Jax (in many ways, it sounds better than Jax's passive for accidentally making him unkillable since HP is easier to invest in than both MR and Armor). oh, and tiamat's is finally starting to make me consider it... a little over 200 more than a BF Sword and it gives me only 8 less base damage and in return gives some potentially juicy other abilities... hmmm.... it probably still sucks ass, but I can't say I'm not at least intrigued by it any more. | ||
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azndsh
United States4447 Posts
On April 11 2010 13:56 NeoIllusions wrote: Boots + 3 pots. Farm until BF Sword. Get IEdge, Last Whisper, Greaves and you're pretty much set on DPS. The best Trist I know, Atlanta, gets Frozen Mallet first though. So it's a matter of play style. at mid-level elo and higher, you might consider throwing in a catalyst so that your build looks like boots, catalyst, greaves, infinity edge, last whisper, banshee's veil I also get greaves early because I tend to max Q last frozen mallet is definitely a good item, especially if you don't have control of the lizard sigil | ||
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oberon
United States1320 Posts
So, while ELOs are invisible, you can check your winrate. It seems like "decent but not great" is around 52% and "pretty solid" is around 55%. And, of course, "top ten" is around 65%. | ||
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
On April 12 2010 19:46 oberon wrote: I was watching the solomid.net stream last night, and it was a live stream of TakashiX. His winloss record was 397-221 -- over 65%. So, while ELOs are invisible, you can check your winrate. It seems like "decent but not great" is around 52% and "pretty solid" is around 55%. And, of course, "top ten" is around 65%. Also assume that you need about 350 wins for this to mean anything :D. | ||
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
I'm going to write a TT build for chogath soon, too. Chogath is top tier, don't let anyone tell you otherwise :D. | ||
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Iplaythings
Denmark9110 Posts
On April 12 2010 23:26 ZERG_RUSSIAN wrote: http://www.mobafire.com/league-of-legends/build/summoners-rift-solo-mid-cho-1180 I'm going to write a TT build for chogath soon, too. Chogath is top tier, don't let anyone tell you otherwise :D. You got it right (; same for AP kat since they added spell vamp ![[image loading]](http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/550/wotv.jpg) and somebody said Kat couldnt carrie? ps you can enlarge the pic  + Show Spoiler + BO was Boots with pots - rylais - haunting guise - mejai's - turn boots into merc threads - abyssal scepter - vod staff / zhonya's | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
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ZERG_RUSSIAN
10417 Posts
But seriously kat is really hard to play as you get up there | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
I think Kat is probably viable at the higher levels, but it's not in a carrying capacity. | ||
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On April 13 2010 00:07 Mogwai wrote: to be fair... the ashe in that screenshot has a Nashor's Tooth... I think Kat is probably viable at the higher levels, but it's not in a carrying capacity. I played against a Kat that went 5-0 in the first 10 minutes in a practice game... yesterday, I think? And I was solo mid Zilean that was 0-0. And I was going DPS. The clash of the titans. Who won? DPS Zilean, without even using ult. Carry Katarina wut. The obvious problem with Kat is that even at our Elo she'll pretty much never get her ult off for any decent period of time. Without her ult her damage output stinks. And without her damage output she's absolutely junk, except for some irritating harass at the onset; she has an AoE anti-heal, an escape mechanism, and little else. At low Elos when everyone's spamming crap like Mundo, Trynd and Yi (ie. no disable) or people panic and run as soon as Kat shows up, you can output hefty damage. At middle Elos when you keep running into teams with like 5+ disables, you're not going to do jack. If you want a pointblank AoE spelldamage hero you're better off playing either Karthus (who's gotten crazy annoying with Zhonya) or Fiddle. Also with those two you won't have random targeting, targeting limits, nor the issue of being disabled during ult and being useless for the next minute. Not to mention Kat's damage output isn't even that high ;/ | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
Which means every healing hero has a means of knocking her out of her ult. So the question becomes, is playing 4+anti-heal vs 5 worth it, because most of the support heroes aren't just their healing power. The answer may or may not be yes. But unless you get really lucky (both in terms of team composition, and in terms of your shuriken bounce) you're pretty much playing 4v5 at our Elo, if you have a Kat. I mean just yesterday I was even talking about solo-mid Tristana being a liability in some games at our Elo, because of her lack of mobility and ganking efficiency -> forces an early teamfight that can be game-ending before she gets farmed. Tristana! Like, an actual DPS carry, and one of the best, at that! Edit: I mean, it boils down to speed. Kat needs an ungodly amount of gold advantage to wreak havoc, because she needs ridiculous damage output in 0.5-1 second in most fights. And when a team fight breaks out at like level 8-9, when all you have is like BO was Boots with pots - (half of) rylais what are you going to do? You'll hit one person for like 400 damage, and that's if I'm granting you like 2-3 seconds of your ult? Oh my GOD wow an accomplishment! /end sarcasm Or if you're solo mid you might be level 10-12 (depending on how you fared), you might hit TWO people, but we'll also have to jack your ult duration down because the solo mid never gets away freely in that early teamfight, and your farming is still suspect. The other problem is, of course, your shuriken, your main harassment skill, automatically pushes creep :p | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
Kat would be better if her attack speed wasn't the worst in the game (or close to it), but for some reason Riot seems fixated on her ult and making her balanced between AD and AP. They just need to drop the AP BS and increase her attack speed, to make her an actual damage-dealer. Or something of the sort. Meh. But at the same time they're probably comfortable with her being a low Elo pubstomper; buff her too much and she'll absolutely destroy low Elo. In terms of support, well we kinda concluded that our "all-out damage" works okay, but it needs to 1) be coordinated better or 2) switch one of our flatteners with a support hero. I actually started playing Taric (whee another hero switch) to keep up the Aegis/Tanking role whilst providing pushing/support capabilities. Edit: On April 13 2010 00:49 Brees wrote: i played kat vs a support/heal team once and went 6-4, the healing reduction does absolutely nothing though. spirit visage on all of them geegee Hahah <3 Yeah we've tried running EC on our DPS but it doesn't really help. The only time I saw a marked difference by getting heal reduc vs a healing team was when I played Twitch, and that was because I put heal reduc on their whole team while doing like 400 DPS. At this point I'm just like F it, get DPS items and spike them, and if it doesn't work we need a healer of our own. | ||
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Brees
Marshall Islands3404 Posts
Sorc boots Haunting guise Leviathan Rylai's Guardian Angel Sunfire cape?? (never got this far) | ||
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Southlight
United States11768 Posts
On April 13 2010 00:55 Brees wrote: oh and kennen to me seems like a non-tanking amumu unless you play him as an AD carry. Agreed. I was talking to a guy who was going AP with him a couple days ago, and mentioned Amumu, too. I was like if you're going to mass-stun, why not just take Amumu? At least you'll do significant damage, and be able to tank. Meh. AD/AS is the "safest" on him but then he suffers from "outclassed" and "takes too long to kill." Interesting hero, but I'm not sure about his role in relation to other "similar" heroes on both sides of the spectrum, yet at the same time I'm not sold on a hybrid build. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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