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On January 30 2014 04:39 Sentenal wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2014 04:29 Chro wrote:On January 30 2014 03:43 Sentenal wrote:On January 30 2014 03:41 Chro wrote:
Its possible, luffy can still be rubber in water. He punched stuff all the time during the fishman island arc. So maybe he couldn't use it himself, but one of his allies could after it turned to 'flag'. We have also seen Seastone instantly drain Luffy's strength when he touches it. That was pre-time skip, i think people with more training can somewhat struggle before becoming powerless. Aokiji can put his hands in water and freeze it. Hell, brook can run on water so just touching it isn't an issue. He should be able to make seastone flat with his power and once hes done it would stay that way but solid. We aren't talking about water. We are talking about seastone, which is a condensed mass of the "sea". Its entirely different from sticking your hand into water or running on top of it. Oda already answered how different levels of submersion in water affects Devil Fruit users, and we have also seen Devil Fruit users instantly lose their strength when lightly touching it. Your "well that was pre-time skip" response is a Forikorder level of argumentation.
Now thats a lie, its not a 'condensed' version of the sea. Its a stone that emits the same power that the sea does. Nothing more nothing less. People with seastone cuffs can still walk. He could touch it, even for a split second and make it somewhat thinner and keep doing it after he gets his power back if he really wanted to. As for DF users having an effect on seastone i'll take this from the wiki.
However, it has been shown that though a Devil Fruit user loses his powers when in contact with the Kairoseki, said powers can still be used on the Kairoseki, as shown seen when Mr. 3's candle wax key could open Kairoseki cuffs and cell doors, though this may be because the locks themselves are not made of Kairoseki or because the wax has no Devil Fruit powers inside it as shown when he unlocked Ace's Kairoseki handcuffs. Another example is when Shiki levitated battleships in Marineford, despite the hulls being lined with Kairoseki. Trafalgar Law was also able to switch Kairoseki chains with regular ones, using his abilities.
You're not one to change your mind when facing evidence so i'll stop the fight now because its ambiguous and you'll start talking like forkrider even with facts shown in the manga.
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On January 30 2014 04:53 Chro wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2014 04:39 Sentenal wrote:On January 30 2014 04:29 Chro wrote:On January 30 2014 03:43 Sentenal wrote:On January 30 2014 03:41 Chro wrote:
Its possible, luffy can still be rubber in water. He punched stuff all the time during the fishman island arc. So maybe he couldn't use it himself, but one of his allies could after it turned to 'flag'. We have also seen Seastone instantly drain Luffy's strength when he touches it. That was pre-time skip, i think people with more training can somewhat struggle before becoming powerless. Aokiji can put his hands in water and freeze it. Hell, brook can run on water so just touching it isn't an issue. He should be able to make seastone flat with his power and once hes done it would stay that way but solid. We aren't talking about water. We are talking about seastone, which is a condensed mass of the "sea". Its entirely different from sticking your hand into water or running on top of it. Oda already answered how different levels of submersion in water affects Devil Fruit users, and we have also seen Devil Fruit users instantly lose their strength when lightly touching it. Your "well that was pre-time skip" response is a Forikorder level of argumentation. Now thats a lie, its not a 'condensed' version of the sea. Its a stone that emits the same power that the sea does. Nothing more nothing less. People with seastone cuffs can still walk. He could touch it, even for a split second and make it somewhat thinner and keep doing it after he gets his power back if he really wanted to. As for DF users having an effect on seastone i'll take this from the wiki. However, it has been shown that though a Devil Fruit user loses his powers when in contact with the Kairoseki, said powers can still be used on the Kairoseki, as shown seen when Mr. 3's candle wax key could open Kairoseki cuffs and cell doors, though this may be because the locks themselves are not made of Kairoseki or because the wax has no Devil Fruit powers inside it as shown when he unlocked Ace's Kairoseki handcuffs. Another example is when Shiki levitated battleships in Marineford, despite the hulls being lined with Kairoseki. Trafalgar Law was also able to switch Kairoseki chains with regular ones, using his abilities. You're not one to change your mind when facing evidence so i'll stop the fight now because its ambiguous and you'll start talking like forkrider even with facts shown in the manga.
I've always wondered this, but what about waaaayyyyy back when Luffy was drowning in the sea and they stretched his neck FOR him to save his life?
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I've been wondering that too... it says if your body has been changed by the DF it can be used indirectly from an outside source. I've also read that having any part of your body submerged in water makes you unable to use the DF ability but i just checked and aokiji has his hand in the water when he froze it over to create that path for the old man. Its a small detail but theres evidence for it to go either way. No idea.
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On January 30 2014 04:53 Chro wrote:Show nested quote +On January 30 2014 04:39 Sentenal wrote:On January 30 2014 04:29 Chro wrote:On January 30 2014 03:43 Sentenal wrote:On January 30 2014 03:41 Chro wrote:
Its possible, luffy can still be rubber in water. He punched stuff all the time during the fishman island arc. So maybe he couldn't use it himself, but one of his allies could after it turned to 'flag'. We have also seen Seastone instantly drain Luffy's strength when he touches it. That was pre-time skip, i think people with more training can somewhat struggle before becoming powerless. Aokiji can put his hands in water and freeze it. Hell, brook can run on water so just touching it isn't an issue. He should be able to make seastone flat with his power and once hes done it would stay that way but solid. We aren't talking about water. We are talking about seastone, which is a condensed mass of the "sea". Its entirely different from sticking your hand into water or running on top of it. Oda already answered how different levels of submersion in water affects Devil Fruit users, and we have also seen Devil Fruit users instantly lose their strength when lightly touching it. Your "well that was pre-time skip" response is a Forikorder level of argumentation. Now thats a lie, its not a 'condensed' version of the sea. Its a stone that emits the same power that the sea does. Nothing more nothing less. People with seastone cuffs can still walk. He could touch it, even for a split second and make it somewhat thinner and keep doing it after he gets his power back if he really wanted to. As for DF users having an effect on seastone i'll take this from the wiki. However, it has been shown that though a Devil Fruit user loses his powers when in contact with the Kairoseki, said powers can still be used on the Kairoseki, as shown seen when Mr. 3's candle wax key could open Kairoseki cuffs and cell doors, though this may be because the locks themselves are not made of Kairoseki or because the wax has no Devil Fruit powers inside it as shown when he unlocked Ace's Kairoseki handcuffs. Another example is when Shiki levitated battleships in Marineford, despite the hulls being lined with Kairoseki. Trafalgar Law was also able to switch Kairoseki chains with regular ones, using his abilities. You're not one to change your mind when facing evidence so i'll stop the fight now because its ambiguous and you'll start talking like forkrider even with facts shown in the manga.
Mr. 3 produces Wax from his body. Said wax is a product of his body, not a part of his body. Thats why he is a Paramecia and not a Logia. Thats why his wax could block Magellen's poison without poisoning himself. Thats why his Wax can exist completely independent from himself (his wax house, for instance). Shiki making battleships levitate works because the entire hull isn't made of Seastone. Its a similar reason (although on a much grander scale) why Smoker can use his Seastone Jutte, or w/e. He isn't gripping/touching the Seastone part. Law's example is probably the best, but even with his ability he wasn't able to cut them, which is something he should be able to do, with what you are suggesting. The Scissors guy should have been able to cut the Seastone cages in Impel Down, with what you are suggesting. Your logic would even suggest that Senor Pink could swim in water, let alone Seastone (which is completely ridiculous). I've yet to see anything suggest that Devil Fruit Powers can be used to actually directly affect Seastone itself. If there are instances, please let me know. But for now, all I'm seeing is "Well that was pre-time skip", "Oda never said it couldn't happen", and various examples that I don't find very compelling.
For reference, what Oda has said in regards to different levels of submersion:
http://onepiece.wikia.com/wiki/SBS_Volume_41#Chapter_398.2C_Page_206
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The pre/post timeskip has everything to do with it because of the build up on willpower. Which in mangas can lead to anything. I'm guessing a marine admiral with a DF power and a weak DF user have two different reactions at first to seastone and water. Which is what i'm getting at, its about a second of time before weakness sets in. Nothing crazy like DF users can live in water.
It's been proven that DF users can manipulate water while touching it. Seastone has the effect of water, water can be manipulated while being touched. Its not a stretch to say a strong DF user could touch seastone for half a second and do something to it.
I'm not saying oda is wrong or theres something magical about the time skip. Simply put, strong people in one piece have seen doing things weak users have not. While oda says things in the SBS, some actions in the manga say otherwise. To me, at least, there are some weird grey areas with DF users and water/seastone. Its not clear cut.
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While touching it, yes. However, the amount of touching it is consistent with what Oda has said. Sticking your hand into water is much different than being completely submerged in it, where he says you lose your strength and can't lose your power.
And I will say that based on the manga, even though the amount of strength being drained has varied (for example, Luffy post-time skip touching the Colosseum fence and losing his energy, or Luffy in Crocodile's cage doing the same thing, vs Seastone handcuffs being able to walk around), it has been show pretty universally that it at least disables active use of their powers. People with seastone handcuffs might not be weakened enough to have trouble moving, but they also haven't been shown to be able to use their powers wearing them.
Maybe you are right that a strong DF user could manipulate Seastone while directly touching it. I can't read the future, so who knows. However, I do think that is a very long stretch, and something that no one so far has ever come close to doing, and something that has never been implied to be possible.
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Bart seems immensely well suited for this competition. When the fish with the fruit jumps up and attack, he can just put a barrier to prevent it from returning to the water.
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On January 30 2014 07:37 gedatsu wrote:
Bart seems immensely well suited for this competition. When the fish with the fruit jumps up and attack, he can just put a barrier to prevent it from returning to the water.
Not to mention he can just barrier himself when they come flying out the water at him. I feel like he's going to win and give the fruit to "Lucy".
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Bartolomeo to Straw hats plx. SH really needs somebody like him
Btw its obvious that SH needs another member because BlackBeard pirates has 10 members.
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On January 30 2014 07:46 Mensol wrote:
Bartolomeo to Straw hats plx. SH really needs somebody like him
Btw its obvious that SH needs another member because BlackBeard pirates has 10 members.
Jinbe. He said he would join somewhere down the road. So...
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FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
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oh right 
Btw Lao G = Gen from Street Fighter.
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On January 30 2014 07:57 flamewheel wrote:
Jinbe prolly gon die
Oh yeah, well... Your prolly gon die!!!
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FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
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On January 30 2014 07:57 flamewheel wrote:
Jinbe prolly gon die
Why?
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If there's someone that skips Leg day in ONe Piece, it seems to be Diamante.
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On January 30 2014 08:01 AsnSensation wrote:
If there's someone that skips Leg day in ONe Piece, it seems to be Diamante.
Lol how about Burgess?
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On January 30 2014 07:46 Mensol wrote:
Bartolomeo to Straw hats plx. SH really needs somebody like him
Hurrai, I vote for Bartolomeo as next SH member! Oda sensei, make it happen!!!
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On January 30 2014 08:01 AsnSensation wrote:
If there's someone that skips Leg day in ONe Piece, it seems to be Diamante.
Not really bulky anywhere else either.
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maybe kinemon will solo pika, luffy vs DD and Zoro versus Fujitora
He is powerfull enough for DD to notice him and talk about him so maybe he will get to fight pika and tell Luffy and the rest to go ahead
what do you guys think ?
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EPT
