The Neon Genesis Evangelion Thread - Page 20

On September 20 2012 12:19 Sentenal wrote:

Strawman. I didn't say its an atypical reaction to "freak out". I said its atypical to freak out and (this is the important part) try to murder Asuka. This is what makes him a psychopath. Not the "freak out" part, but the "murder Asuka" part.

He didn't kill her, but he wanted to. You can tell he wanted to kill her because he was strangling her. Normally when you crawl on top of someone else, cup your hands around their throat, squeeze really hard to cut off their wind pipe (which is clearly what he was doing), you are trying to kill the person.

If he actually thought it was a hallucination, then he wouldn't have tried to murder her, since you can't kill hallucinations. He would have to be mentally retarded to think you can kill something you "know" is in your imagination by strangling it.

On September 20 2012 15:58 madcow305 wrote:
I find it funny that Sent and that other TLADT guy have expressed that they dislike the series, yet here we are a week later and they're still posting in a thread dedicated to a topic they hate.

People, stop feeding the trolls. The only reason someone would hang around in a discussion about a topic they dislike is to troll the people that like said topic.

I also find it funny that posts containing only an image are supposed to not be allowed under TL policy, but one of the haters violates this rule twice in the first 3 pages and nothing has happened.

Thread Rules: READ BEFORE POSTING
This thread is a place to celebrate, discuss, and even argue about the show, it's characters, and your interpretation of the above.
[...]
Funny picture? Got an opinion? Share it!
[...]
This show is hit or miss with a lot of people, and the fact that the final episodes, manga and movies can be "2deep4u", will result in a lot of posters expressing their confusion, hatred, or general dislike of the series. That is to be expected.

Strawman. He didn't say that freaking out excluded murdering Asuka. Given the magnitude of the fucked up things he's seen and was put through, a freak-out reaction from that will be a lot more intense and diverse than a normal everyday freakout. It is undeniable that people have killed other people for less.

Because when you're having hallucinations, you're always thinking so rationally and clearly, right?

All sarcasm aside, the final incident gave off that groggy feeling as though you just woke up from a dream, and you're still not entirely sure wtf is happening. That hallucination theory is close to the mark, but given the inward-looking and dream-like way the previous scenes played out, it made me think that this was a case of Shinji waking up, but still retaining the irrational and subconscious thought processes of his dream state, thus trying to kill Asuka.

On September 20 2012 16:23 KazeHydra wrote:

You realize that OP, who clearly is anything but a hater, has violated that rule the most in this thread, right?

So, since there is a dedicated thread on Eva, I'm interested in knowing everyone's feelings here about Mari (purple hair girl) from Evangelion 2.0. Having seen the original series/movies, she just seems sort of out of place. What possible reason would there be for adding her in and what do you think this will do to the story/drama?

On September 20 2012 05:07 Tabularasa wrote:
This might be somewhat far fetched, but I believe there are are a handful of characters who "know" more about the greater plan, the reason for the repetitions and their role in this play. Even in the original series, they are the ones who aren't suprised by anything. Funnily enough, those are the ones seemingly without a trauma: Mari, Kaworu, Kaji, Yui and maybe Fuyutsuki.

For example, Mari suddenly becomes very interesting character to me:
Before, I thought of her somewhat as a "movie gimmick": She suddenly appears to fight in an epic way and pretty much dies gladly in the process - but that seemed it.
She always unbelievable confident and doesn't seem to be psychologically damaged. She talks about "using adults as the pawns for children", can use "beast mode" and the only thing she did which truely mattered (besides pleasing otakus) was making sure than Shinjis sees Rei being swallowed by the Angel.

On September 20 2012 21:33 Sentenal wrote:

Allow me to point out a few places you didn't read in the OP.

So, now that I've helped you read the READ BEFORE POSTING part, you can see that arguing about Evangelion, expressing your dislike for Evangelion, and posting funny pictures about Evangelion are allowed in this thread. However, I'm not sure if "crying about other people not liking your favorite cartoon" is allowed by the rules...


Either you don't know what a "Strawman" argument is, or you didn't read. But allow me to help you. Here is what I said:
Also, he is insane. If your "freak out" reaction to what happened there at the end is "I MUST MURDER THIS PERSON", then that means you are a psychopath. No sane person would react that way after freaking out.
Here is what he said:
God, it's true that it's such an atypical reaction to freak out after seeing the face of humanity change completely under the eyes of a giant bleeding Rey Ayanami.
As you can see, after I say that a freak out reaction of "MURDER" is insane, he sarcastically remarks "yeah, freaking out is such an atypical reaction!!!" It is pretty straight-forward from this point of why its a strawman.

It is undeniable that people have killed other people for less, I agree. Those people who have, however, are batshit insane psychopaths. Because normal, sane people, don't react to surprising things with "I GOTTA CHOKE A BITCH".


If someone KNOWS its a hallucination, like what he said, then you KNOW its not real, since the very DEFINITION of the word says its something that isn't real. Knowingly attacking something that you already know isn't real is something that crazy or retarded people do. Which I guess supports what I've been saying.


Except that apparently a long time had passed since those previous, inward looking scenes. So if we are to believe you, he kept his batshit insane murderous thought process from the time Instrumentality Ended (where he accepted who he was), all the way up to him eventually attacking another person at the very end of the movie (which was a good bit of time). Please correct me if I'm not understanding you correctly.

No no, let me help you instead. What you did in constructing your strawman was to ignore the part of the post you quoted yourself - "after seeing the face of humanity change completely under the eyes of a giant bleeding Rey Ayanami.", and responding instead to a cut-down version of the post which completely changes its original intent. Obviously the whole point of other poster was saying that a freak-out will be a lot more extreme and possibly murderous circumstantial to the horribly fucked-up conditions of the world and the traumatic effect it had on Shinji, which you completely ignored and substituted your own interpretation of an "everyday freakout which does not include an urge to kill" to reply to.

I again disagree with your proposition that only insane people will kill others. A great deal of literature in the world deals with the issue of what normal, sane people are pushed to do when confromted by extraordinary circumstance. Are you going to dismiss pretty much every Shakespearean tragedy because since the protagonists kill people, they're obviously batshit insane?

If you are correct in saying that a long time has passed between Shinji materialising on the beach and Asuka materialising on the beach, then my idea falls flat on its face. To me it seemed like the beach scene immediately follows the one between nekkid Rei and Shinji, and the dialogue with Yui, which is where he finally accepts his desire to live. I assumed that immediately after that he allowed people to have individual form again through Eva magic he materialises on the beach. I could be totally wrong though, and it's been a while since I've watched the film.

Also, just a recommendation - posting a picture of a strawman as a response, and then beginning another retort by implicitly pointing out "Strawman." as your introductory sentence is an inelegant way to argue. It gives off the impression that you've just learnt about the various logical fallacies and couldn't resist demonstrating it to the world in every situation to which might vaguely apply. Perhaps you'll respond to this post with a picture of an ad hominem?

On September 21 2012 12:00 N3rV[Green] wrote:
You are right, the last two episodes do NOT do the show justice at all. This was due to budget constraints at the time, like they were OUT of money.

The end of evangelion movies are what they did once getting some money to give the show a proper ending.

so YES GO WATCH THEM!!!!!!

I thought they were fucking incredible.

And then go watch the first two of the new movies 1.01 and 2.22

Happy watching xD

On September 21 2012 22:57 Heh_ wrote:

The battle with the 5th angel in the first movie was so fucking cool. Mind-blowingly awesome fight there.