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SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and FireClick Here for the spoiler-free thread. |
On April 13 2015 23:45 SixStrings wrote:
Oh my GOD! Just watching Episode 3, Sansa is supposed to marry Ramsay? I'm getting sick...
Well ... to be fair, the Lannisters send Sansa north to get married to Ramsay in the books, so it's no completly new.
On April 14 2015 21:24 Acrofales wrote:
Talking about Ep. 1: they are clearly taking the battle for Winterfell in a very different direction than has been implied by ADwD. In general, killing Mance seemed quite unnecessary: he was a great character, and killing him seems more like a signal to the book readers that things are really going to be completely different than anything else.
Mance also gets burned and killed by a mercy arrow from the night's watch in the books.
They might be different Sansa/Mance, but it's an easy mistake.
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[QUOTE]On April 14 2015 21:24 Acrofales wrote:
[QUOTE]On April 14 2015 21:08 Spaylz wrote:
Second point: Sansa and Littlefinger leaving the Vale is silly. In fact, from the show point of view it doesn't make any sense at all. They go to the vale to escape. There they murder Lysa, and are actually pretty safe. So then they leave. Wtf. I know that Littlefinger consolidating political power was not the most riveting, and am glad they are thinking of something to do instead of that, but it has to make some kind of sense: why leave the Vale? The justification they give, that they are going somewhere that the Lannisters cannot get to them at all is utterly inane: that place is the Vale.[/QUOTE]
Littlefinger isn't satisfied just being safe and sitting around the vale, he wants to keep expanding his power and, as we have seen many times, is willing to take huge risks to do so. I won't spoil it, but in the next few episodes he reveals his current plan to keep working his way up the ladder (although with littlefinger you never know what his true intentions are).
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What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think?
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On April 14 2015 21:50 Oshuy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2015 23:45 SixStrings wrote:
Oh my GOD! Just watching Episode 3, Sansa is supposed to marry Ramsay? I'm getting sick... Well ... to be fair, the Lannisters send Sansa north to get married to Ramsay in the books, so it's no completly new. Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 21:24 Acrofales wrote:
Talking about Ep. 1: they are clearly taking the battle for Winterfell in a very different direction than has been implied by ADwD. In general, killing Mance seemed quite unnecessary: he was a great character, and killing him seems more like a signal to the book readers that things are really going to be completely different than anything else.
Mance also gets burned and killed by a mercy arrow from the night's watch in the books. They might be different Sansa/Mance, but it's an easy mistake.
Yeah, I need to reread the books. Forgot completely about the Rattleshirt glamor trick in the books.
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On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think?
As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here.
+ Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes.
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On April 14 2015 22:44 Spiller wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think? As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here. + Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes.
+ Show Spoiler +
This is stupid. Stannis would execute Littlefinger the minute he got the chance. Certainly not make him Warden of the North, Lord of Winterfell, or anything else that isn't dead.
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+ Show Spoiler +I still can't understand why Littlefinger thinks leaving Sansa in Bolton's hands is a good idea. He could avoid the gamble by leaving her in Vale until Stannis/Roose wins so I think there has to be another reason why he thought it's necessary give her away. I hope it's not because the writers needed someone to replace fake Arya/Jeyne Poole from the books.
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On April 14 2015 23:55 Vorenius wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 22:44 Spiller wrote:On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think? As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here. + Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes. + Show Spoiler +
This is stupid. Stannis would execute Littlefinger the minute he got the chance. Certainly not make him Warden of the North, Lord of Winterfell, or anything else that isn't dead.
+ Show Spoiler +Yeah, this is by far the most major plothole in GoT history. It invalidates Littlefinger's character completely. If he wanted Stannis on the throne, why not back him from the beginning when Ned wanted Stannis to take on the succession? And then, why not deliver the Tyrells on a silver platter right after Renly's murder? LF was sent by Tywin to get the Tyrells into the fold, and he got them while Stannis was on his way to their camp to reclaim Renly's army.
I get that LF is supposed to be pulling moves and that he's playing every alliance he can get, but the one thing that is damn sure is that Stannis would sentence LF to death on the spot.
I do believe that LF, in the books, says something similar to what he said in the show, i.e. "If your moves don't make sense to your enemies, they will never see you coming" or something like that. But still.
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United Kingdom31255 Posts
On April 15 2015 00:40 Spaylz wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 23:55 Vorenius wrote:On April 14 2015 22:44 Spiller wrote:On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think? As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here. + Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes. + Show Spoiler +
This is stupid. Stannis would execute Littlefinger the minute he got the chance. Certainly not make him Warden of the North, Lord of Winterfell, or anything else that isn't dead.
+ Show Spoiler +Yeah, this is by far the most major plothole in GoT history. It invalidates Littlefinger's character completely. If he wanted Stannis on the throne, why not back him from the beginning when Ned wanted Stannis to take on the succession? And then, why not deliver the Tyrells on a silver platter right after Renly's murder? LF was sent by Tywin to get the Tyrells into the fold, and he got them while Stannis was on his way to their camp to reclaim Renly's army.
I get that LF is supposed to be pulling moves and that he's playing every alliance he can get, but the one thing that is damn sure is that Stannis would sentence LF to death on the spot. I do believe that LF, in the books, says something similar to what he said in the show, i.e. "If your moves don't make sense to your enemies, they will never see you coming" or something like that. But still.
+ Show Spoiler +I presume LF is hoping the winter kills Stannis after he has secured Sansa back at castle black or something. Either way there is no outcome where LF doesn't die or have Sansa killed at this point
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Maybe Littlefinger just wants more chaos. If Stannis wins the north from the Boltons and comes south, the Lannisters and Tyrells have to engage him again.
While the noble houses destroy one another, Littlefinger and his network of merchants could usurp power. Westeros could be dominated by trade and men of business like the Free Cities.
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any chance for any more leaks? =]]]
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On April 14 2015 23:55 Vorenius wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 22:44 Spiller wrote:On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think? As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here. + Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes. + Show Spoiler +
This is stupid. Stannis would execute Littlefinger the minute he got the chance. Certainly not make him Warden of the North, Lord of Winterfell, or anything else that isn't dead.
+ Show Spoiler +Well as far as I can remember they have never had any interactions in the show, so I wasn't sure what Stannis thinks or knows about Littlefinger. Littlefinger could be like hey I brought you the last known Stark (other than Jon Snow) so since I helped you, you help me out, and Stannis seems to be willing to work with whoever he think can help him reach his goal. But like I said i haven't read the books so i have less to go on than most people here. It will be interesting to see what Littlefinger's actual plan is and how it unfolds.
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On April 14 2015 21:50 Oshuy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2015 23:45 SixStrings wrote:
Oh my GOD! Just watching Episode 3, Sansa is supposed to marry Ramsay? I'm getting sick... Well ... to be fair, the Lannisters send Sansa north to get married to Ramsay in the books, so it's no completly new.
You are a bit confused.
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On April 15 2015 03:54 hariooo wrote:
any chance for any more leaks? =]]]
I hope so. Won't have much to watch the coming weeks due to a lack of self-control  .
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+ Show Spoiler +So Sansa also plays the role of fake arya? Then reverse reveal...
Reek getting Sansa wet before Ramsey takes her....that's going to be awkward haha
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On April 15 2015 03:54 hariooo wrote:
any chance for any more leaks? =]]]
No.
The leaks were promos that HBO sent out to the press. These are always the first 4 episodes.
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On April 15 2015 05:23 Spiller wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 23:55 Vorenius wrote:On April 14 2015 22:44 Spiller wrote:On April 14 2015 22:07 0x64 wrote:
What we are pointing out is that you gain 0 influence by helping Bolton.
Bolton was strong because of Tywin, he is now weak.
He is also not a good ally.
I was thinking of the possibility of the show merging Manderly and Littlefinger.
The book's littlefinger's story is at the same point in the show. The also don't want to introduce new characters.
So Littlefinger talking to Davos secretly, showing his trustworthiness to Bolton by "executing" Davos, then killing some Frey's to make Sansa like him more and bring some Vale knight to replace White Harbor's soldiers inside Winterfell...
This is a bit far fetched, what do you think? As a note i haven't read the books so I don't know how the shows Littlefinger arc compares to the book exactly but I don't mind spoilers they don't take away my enjoyment for the story so thats why im discussing this here. + Show Spoiler +Didn't Littlefinger tell Sansa that he expects Stannis to take Winterfell? So he is not really helping Bolton, but Bolton is his safety net if Stannis doesn't retake Winterfell. If everything goes perfectly then Stannis defeats the Boltons, places Sansa (and Littlefinger?) in power of Winterfell again to appease the Northerners who want a Stark in power.
What Littlefinger would do from there idk. Maybe he would be satisfied being Lord of Winterfell with Sansa as his wife and allow Stannis to continue his quest for the iron throne, or maybe he would then find a way to double cross Stannis like he has almost everyone else.
But my point was that he is betting on Stannis to defeat Bolton, him pretending to help Bolton is just a failsafe in case everything goes to shit. This way he is in with the ones who control the north no matter which way the battle goes. + Show Spoiler +
This is stupid. Stannis would execute Littlefinger the minute he got the chance. Certainly not make him Warden of the North, Lord of Winterfell, or anything else that isn't dead.
+ Show Spoiler +Well as far as I can remember they have never had any interactions in the show, so I wasn't sure what Stannis thinks or knows about Littlefinger. Littlefinger could be like hey I brought you the last known Stark (other than Jon Snow) so since I helped you, you help me out, and Stannis seems to be willing to work with whoever he think can help him reach his goal. But like I said i haven't read the books so i have less to go on than most people here. It will be interesting to see what Littlefinger's actual plan is and how it unfolds.
They have had plenty interaction. Stannis knows Petyr intimately, they served at Robert's small council for years until Jon Arryn died and Stannis fled the capital.
On April 14 2015 21:50 Oshuy wrote:Show nested quote +On April 13 2015 23:45 SixStrings wrote:
Oh my GOD! Just watching Episode 3, Sansa is supposed to marry Ramsay? I'm getting sick... Well ... to be fair, the Lannisters send Sansa north to get married to Ramsay in the books, so it's no completly new.
And no, the Lannisters didn't send Sansa to Ramsay, they lost Sansa during Jeoff's wedding. They sent Jaine Poole and made her pretend to be Arya.
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On April 15 2015 06:34 jinorazi wrote:+ Show Spoiler +So Sansa also plays the role of fake arya? Then reverse reveal...
Reek getting Sansa wet before Ramsey takes her....that's going to be awkward haha
I'd like to think that I can watch/handle absolutely anything. That said, some things need more than a spoiler tag and this comment is one of them. That is one of those not safe for life visualizations.
Edit: Not sure why I spoiler tagged this originally.
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That Reek / Ramsay scene with Jaine Poole almost made me puke when reading it.
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On April 15 2015 06:55 SixStrings wrote:Show nested quote +On April 14 2015 21:50 Oshuy wrote:On April 13 2015 23:45 SixStrings wrote:
Oh my GOD! Just watching Episode 3, Sansa is supposed to marry Ramsay? I'm getting sick... Well ... to be fair, the Lannisters send Sansa north to get married to Ramsay in the books, so it's no completly new. And no, the Lannisters didn't send Sansa to Ramsay, they lost Sansa during Jeoff's wedding. They sent Jaine Poole and made her pretend to be Arya.
True, somehow Jeyne/Sansa connected and I forgot it was Arya that was supposed to marry Ramsay. I guess they would have had to revoke Sansa's wedding to Tyrion before sending Sansa and that made things more difficult.
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