Alienware Cup - Page 467

Acritter

Syria7637 Posts

July 09 2013 14:55 GMT

#9321

On July 09 2013 23:54 Acritter wrote:
I dunno why LGD aren't taking T1 top. That's a really important tower for Na'Vi, because as soon as it's gone there's basically nothing for XBOCT to farm.

Aaaaand they take it. Yeah, calling this as an easy win for LGD unless they throw harder than an Olympic shot-putter.

Koshi

Belgium38799 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9322

Vlads and Vanguard are items I don't really like. But meh, sometimes it's good.

cilinder007

Slovenia7251 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9323

On July 09 2013 23:54 Oktyabr wrote:
So does anyone know for sure if this midas + vlad pl build is actually legit compared to the normal drums into diffuse/yasha?

it gives nothing but some armor and a very very very tiny bit of dmg

PassiveAce

United States18076 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9324

lgd showing navi how push strats are done

Unleashing

Denmark14978 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9325

xboct wont be useful in fights this game when needed. LGD has too much early game pressure for this build for fuck sake.
He needs diffusal, manta and so on.

ForTehDarkseid

8139 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9326

On July 09 2013 23:42 teapoted wrote:
Joyful and insightful.

You missed the point. I was not calling names, yet you act as if I did.

Now be quiet, every post I found of yours shows you're an example of what you're complaining about.

I like you, man, but you are undeniably rude sometimes.

And either way, this isn't the place for this discussion.

I don't think there would be discussion at all.

Acritter

Syria7637 Posts

July 09 2013 14:56 GMT

#9327

On July 09 2013 23:56 PassiveAce wrote:
lgd showing navi how push strats are done

Against teams with no teamfight?

hideo

Canada1641 Posts

July 09 2013 14:57 GMT

#9328

On July 09 2013 23:53 Acritter wrote:

Show nested quote +

On July 09 2013 23:52 BurningSera wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:39 hideo wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:37 Acritter wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:29 BurningSera wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:22 Acritter wrote:
Pretty sure it's the terrible draft that lost Na'Vi this game. They went for a little early push, but not enough to really matter. Their teamfight and lategame carry were similarly lacking. Meanwhile, LGD got to draft fantastic manmode hard carry, fantastic teamfight, and fantastic splitpush, and once Na'Vi failed to take rax in the early midgame (which was inevitable given how outmatched their teamfight was and how vulnerable they were to Prophet counterpush), there was really no way for them to come back. If they'd gone for extreme push with a Jugg pickup (who also provides pick-off potential) or good rotations with something like QoP, they might have done better.

I wouldnt say terrible draft, SF with items is still a beast in mid/late game, navi was outplayed right after the #tacticalpauseforpee #cheatingpause, you can see that once chen failed to push that top navi has come to the vicious cycle of 'chen make new creeps->push->lost teamfight->repeat', they lost too many team fights right before and after the pause due to bad positioning/coordinating.

And seriously not to on kuroky again but lesh couldn't deal the expected burst damage and funnik also feel like dealing almost no damage.

The issue is that even though SF may be beast, he's nothing compared to Alch. The second he gets disabled, he goes down due to insufficient tankiness, and with the Magnus pickup on LGD, BKB couldn't be expected to alleviate that. DK is much tankier, but doesn't have enough damage to contest the Alch. The Chen part of your statement just reconfirms what I said earlier: once Na'Vi's push stalled even just a little, they were doomed.

Agreed on Lesh and WR. They would have been better if XBOCT's carry had a higher damage output, but the tankiness of DK was really not what Na'Vi needed that game (maybe don't firstpick DK if you can't properly abuse him). Without that DPS, the extra disables just weren't suitable.

Sure they abused the DK. It was obviously a fast pushing tempo lineup, and the DK pick was core to that.

Ya pretty much like what we said.

But seriously SF is one of the best late game, is just that western SF usually doesnt do the ultimate endgame build (also reminds me of mushi's SF).

'fraid to admit I'm not familiar with China Fiend. What do you consider "ultimate endgame" to be on that hero?

You go straight for late game DPS items after the BKB (+ possible shadowblade) like butterfly/satanic/daedalus. No messing around with blink.

teddyoojo

Germany22369 Posts

July 09 2013 14:57 GMT

#9329

midas vlads
"oh dear"

EnumaAvalon

Philippines3613 Posts

July 09 2013 14:57 GMT

#9330

Is Na'Vi really losing?

PassiveAce

United States18076 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9331

On July 09 2013 23:56 Acritter wrote:

Show nested quote +

Against teams with no teamfight?

Thats the best time to draft a push lineup

ReignSupreme.

Australia4123 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9332

+ Show Spoiler +

On July 09 2013 23:53 ReignSupreme. wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

On July 09 2013 23:48 ReignSupreme. wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

On July 09 2013 23:41 ReignSupreme. wrote:
[image loading]

Natus Vincere (Dire)

+ Show Spoiler [Bans] +

LGD Gaming (Radiant)

+ Show Spoiler [Bans] +

00:00 to 05:00

- LGD: Xiao8 Beastmaster going offlane, DK mid, Nyx/Gyro Bottom and Chen Jungle
- Navi: Doom (Jungle), PL/SD (top), Bat (mid), Furion (offlane).

- Sylar on the Gyro getting a very good amount of LH's right now (20/4 @3mins)
- LGD pressuring Bot T1 early and they take it just before 5mins

- Yao get's lassoed towards Dire hill, first blood for Navi
- Funnik gets impaled at a late 6min rune pick up, Dendi fireflys in to save but the both of them end up dropping, Kuro on the Doom ends up falling aswell.
- Funnik TP's in and finds a weak Nyx with his illusions
- Dendi heads top to find Beastmaster, Puppey ends up falling to the tower though Beastmaster does die
- LGD pick up Mid T1
- Navi looking to take bottom T1, Funnik dies after a net from Troll creep. Quick response from LGD
- Score sits at 5:4, Xboct leading the net worth but LGD with the tower advantage

10:00 to 15:00

- LGD take the bottom T2 tower after that small fight
- LGD now take the top T1, Furion pressuring mid T1 but LGD use Glyph and TP in, now looking to take Navi's Mid T2
- Xiao's Beastmaster has a Medallion, not yet heading towards Roshan.
- Not much to say really
- Navi heading top but a few TP's from LGD and they back off

teapoted

United Kingdom24425 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9333

On July 09 2013 23:56 ForTehDarkseid wrote:

Show nested quote +

You missed the point. I was not calling names, yet you act as if I did.

Show nested quote +

I like you, man, but you are undeniably rude sometimes.

Show nested quote +

I don't think there would be discussion at all.

I'm an asshole, but I don't tell other people not to be assholes.

If you're disappointed by the quality of LR's in Dota compared to BW then you should be the one bringing the quality up. Ultimately, it's a different community, it is a much more relaxed community as well. It's filled with a lot more people who aren't as diehard or knowledgeable about their game because it's a much more accepted activity. Just the way it is.

Acritter

Syria7637 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9334

On July 09 2013 23:57 hideo wrote:

Show nested quote +

On July 09 2013 23:53 Acritter wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:52 BurningSera wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:39 hideo wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:37 Acritter wrote:

On July 09 2013 23:29 BurningSera wrote:

Sure they abused the DK. It was obviously a fast pushing tempo lineup, and the DK pick was core to that.

Ya pretty much like what we said.

But seriously SF is one of the best late game, is just that western SF usually doesnt do the ultimate endgame build (also reminds me of mushi's SF).

'fraid to admit I'm not familiar with China Fiend. What do you consider "ultimate endgame" to be on that hero?

You go straight for late game DPS items after the BKB (+ possible shadowblade) like butterfly/satanic/daedalus. No messing around with blink.

Ah, I getcha. "I don't have a Rapier but it sure as hell looks like it" SF.

Azarkon

United States21060 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9335

I imagine Na'Vi keeps going these defensive split pushing styles because they think they need to work on them for TI 3, and not because they think it's a style that fits them... Because it doesn't. It just doesn't.

hideo

Canada1641 Posts

July 09 2013 14:58 GMT

#9336

On July 09 2013 23:54 Kiante wrote:
what gave zhou and xboct the thought that this was a good PL build.

i just don't get it

Only thing I can think of is that it's some kind FotM thing on CDEC... maybe some extremely influential PL player is dominating there with the build.

Unleashing

Denmark14978 Posts

July 09 2013 14:59 GMT

#9337

On July 09 2013 23:57 EnumaAvalon wrote:
Is Na'Vi really losing?

Not losing but if LGD pushes they probably wont be able to deal with it.
If na'vi gets later on they have a decent chance to win, but LGD has the window to end it before xboct and so on becomes a problem.