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On February 11 2015 02:10 Logo wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2015 00:46 ChunderBoy wrote:On February 10 2015 16:46 Quochobao wrote: May be this is not a simple question, but can anyone comments on what makes Suma1l's Storm really strong?
Something like use ball lightning to dodge projectiles is obvious, but perhaps his positional play, pick-off target, mana management (i.e. fly how many times for how far, etc.) are somehow better? mostly hype bcoz ppl overvalue final games in grand finals I'd say it has more to do with his 85% win rate on the hero in major competitions (12-2)
Comeback goldchange also made pickoffs alot more interesting, indirect buff to storm spirit imo.
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United States47024 Posts
On February 11 2015 02:13 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2015 02:10 Logo wrote:On February 11 2015 00:46 ChunderBoy wrote:On February 10 2015 16:46 Quochobao wrote: May be this is not a simple question, but can anyone comments on what makes Suma1l's Storm really strong?
Something like use ball lightning to dodge projectiles is obvious, but perhaps his positional play, pick-off target, mana management (i.e. fly how many times for how far, etc.) are somehow better? mostly hype bcoz ppl overvalue final games in grand finals I'd say it has more to do with his 85% win rate on the hero in major competitions (12-2) Comeback goldchange also made pickoffs alot more interesting, indirect buff to storm spirit imo. The question wasn't about Storm in general, but what makes Sumail's storm special.
@Logo most people don't pay that close attention to statistics more than they do anecdotal evidence from important games. Beesa's probably right.
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On February 11 2015 02:18 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On February 11 2015 02:13 govie wrote:On February 11 2015 02:10 Logo wrote:On February 11 2015 00:46 ChunderBoy wrote:On February 10 2015 16:46 Quochobao wrote: May be this is not a simple question, but can anyone comments on what makes Suma1l's Storm really strong?
Something like use ball lightning to dodge projectiles is obvious, but perhaps his positional play, pick-off target, mana management (i.e. fly how many times for how far, etc.) are somehow better? mostly hype bcoz ppl overvalue final games in grand finals I'd say it has more to do with his 85% win rate on the hero in major competitions (12-2) Comeback goldchange also made pickoffs alot more interesting, indirect buff to storm spirit imo. The question wasn't about Storm in general, but what makes Sumail's storm special. @Logo most people don't pay that close attention to statistics more than they do anecdotal evidence from important games. Beesa's probably right.
I'd think it's both? I mean his SS is really strong, you can't really argue with such a high winrate and success, but like most people/things he's also over hyped because grand finals, flashy plays, and all that.
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Does armor work against death ward? I had a discussion with a couple of friends and I said that only armor works against death ward and they said that only dmg block items like vanguard works against it.
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Tebellong44238 Posts
yes armor works vanguard and damage block in general dont its really ez to check on the wiki to prove ur friends wrong
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United States47024 Posts
They have it reversed. Armor applies, but damage block doesn't.
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Quick question:
What hard carry hero can I pick to significantly increase my team's chances of winning if I do everything correctly?
Typically I play heroes like Tinker, Clockwerk, Vengeful Spirit, Techies. The kind of hero where you can have a great game and still lose super hard because Lifestealer/Alchemist/PA/Medusa happened and your Batrider fed 13 kills without using a single lasso.
Playing at ~2.2k MMR and I feel like my ability to do basic things like get last hits, not run into traps, and watch the minimap is much better than everyone else I play with, but my team still gets steamrolled by a 5-carry enemy team anyway.
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tinkers one of the hardest carries in the game.. ur other heroes arent tho if u think ur better than everyone just keep picking tinker or other snowbally mids like storm, sf, ta, etc safe lane carry works too, void, jugg, etc
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On February 11 2015 04:17 Dead9 wrote: tinkers one of the hardest carries in the game.. ur other heroes arent tho if u think ur better than everyone just keep picking tinker or other snowbally mids like storm, sf, ta, etc safe lane carry works too, void, jugg, etc
Well, I guess the etc. is what I'm looking for 
Tinker feels like he just takes a little too long to get going, and he's easily ganked at mid in the beginning if nobody is warding, calling missings etc. I usually avoid dying because I try to play a little safer, but it means that I can't get farm as fast. Which is a problem for Tinker...
So, let me rephrase....
What hero can I play in a game where everyone is a moron and doesn't do what they're supposed to to maximize my chances of winning?
Not trying to be one of "those guys" but come on you've all played Dota with strangers...
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Tebellong44238 Posts
jugg picking probably works if u were actually good u could just storm or slark or w/e but that is more dependant on their heroes
lets be real the actual way to climb is to improve not play different heroes lol.
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Don't rely on people calling missing ever. Yes it's extremely helpful, but what's even more helpful is if you watch and play off the minimap. You can't account for your teammates calling missing or not, but you can watch the minimap and not have it matter. It's also doubly important as Tinker given that your whole mid/late game strategy is depending on TPing into the right spots on the map to push or fight without getting blown up.
(It's also really unfair to your offlaner if you are running solo offlane. Are they supposed to call missing constantly for supports that are off the map most of the time, or just use his best judgement and risk a gank without having called missing?).
For the most part it shouldn't make much of a difference in how much farm you get early on. Use other clues to help determine where heroes off the map are. For example if their safe lane is missing the enemy creep wave at :50 you know they must have pulled the wave and can play aggressively for the next 15-20 seconds at least.
On top of that make sure you are last hitting well (both auto-attack and abilities). Getting just a few more last hits early can make all the difference in item timings. Especially for someone like Tinker where getting the BoTs before the game develops (towers go down, cores pick up things like blink daggers, supports get levels) can give you a huge window to farm up and get fat.
In terms of what hero to play. Either play the one you feel appeals to how you make decisions the best or the one with your best win rate. For the former some players tend towards differing decisions and thought processes. Do you play aggressively or defensively? Do you patiently wait on engaging or do you need to charge in when the mood strikes you? Are you better at quick reactions on abilities or waiting to cast spells at just the right time? All those little tendencies and small details will probably lead you to playing one or a few heroes better than others and if you want to maximize your win then just find the hero that fits those and play them.
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On February 11 2015 05:33 Logo wrote: Don't rely on people calling missing ever. Yes it's extremely helpful, but what's even more helpful is if you watch and play off the minimap. You can't account for your teammates calling missing or not, but you can watch the minimap and not have it matter. It's also doubly important as Tinker given that your whole mid/late game strategy is depending on TPing into the right spots on the map to push or fight without getting blown up.
(It's also really unfair to your offlaner if you are running solo offlane. Are they supposed to call missing constantly for supports that are off the map most of the time, or just use his best judgement and risk a gank without having called missing?).
For the most part it shouldn't make much of a difference in how much farm you get early on. Use other clues to help determine where heroes off the map are. For example if their safe lane is missing the enemy creep wave at :50 you know they must have pulled the wave and can play aggressively for the next 15-20 seconds at least.
On top of that make sure you are last hitting well (both auto-attack and abilities). Getting just a few more last hits early can make all the difference in item timings. Especially for someone like Tinker where getting the BoTs before the game develops (towers go down, cores pick up things like blink daggers, supports get levels) can give you a huge window to farm up and get fat.
In terms of what hero to play. Either play the one you feel appeals to how you make decisions the best or the one with your best win rate. For the former some players tend towards differing decisions and thought processes. Do you play aggressively or defensively? Do you patiently wait on engaging or do you need to charge in when the mood strikes you? Are you better at quick reactions on abilities or waiting to cast spells at just the right time? All those little tendencies and small details will probably lead you to playing one or a few heroes better than others and if you want to maximize your win then just find the hero that fits those and play them.
Thanks, noted.
So say I just keep playing Tinker and going mid. Is there an ideal way to play mid-carry Tinker? I know march builds were popular before the patch because of ancient stacking/farming but is lasers/rockets ganking a better way to get early BoT now?
Also with Tinker I feel like I can effectively split push but can't necessarily beast mode their team until I have a lot of really expensive items. That may be true for other heroes as well though.
Mostly an SC2 player so apologies if some of these questions are really basic.
EDIT - my mechanics are probably my biggest strength (dat SC2 apm...). So any advice on how to best use that to my advantage is helpful. It's kind of why I like Tinker so much...
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Tinker is definitely very farm dependent, which is why killing his ancient stack farming ability hurt so hard. I'm not a Tinker player so I can't tell you much authoritatively but I can tell you in the right matchups laser/rocket is really powerful, but it is definitely going to hurt your farm, so you gotta figure that out/get better advice.
If you have strong RTS skills I would suggest that while Tinker can be a very rewarding hero to master there are heroes that will get you more out of your micro, such as Meepo, Lone Druid, and Broodmother. Meepo is probably the very best pubstomper for players who can master him. Chen/Ench will also reward your skillset but honestly if you're trying to climb the ladder fuck playing supports.
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If you can splitpush, but not beast mode likely what you want to do is keep up pressure (safely) and use your position and map control to deny enemy farm while relaxing on the parts of the map that your allies are able to farm. So if you can keep the enemy jungle contested/clear and split push lanes then you'll be denying their enemy carry farm while getting farm yourself AND freeing your team up to farm. Then just focus on the mechanics of it all and good item selection and eventually you can carry.
I haven't been impressed with opening with dagon/eblade build since the patch nerfed it all (it's a little too slow and flimsy, I think the ancient clearing was part of what made the build fast enough to snowball with a game among the other nerfs hitting that strat). Maybe other people are, but I'd say look into the more classic itemization of Tinker's (Bloodstone+Sheepstick being one I know of).
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On February 11 2015 07:04 Logo wrote: If you can splitpush, but not beast mode likely what you want to do is keep up pressure (safely) and use your position and map control to deny enemy farm while relaxing on the parts of the map that your allies are able to farm. So if you can keep the enemy jungle contested/clear and split push lanes then you'll be denying their enemy carry farm while getting farm yourself AND freeing your team up to farm. Then just focus on the mechanics of it all and good item selection and eventually you can carry.
I haven't been impressed with opening with dagon/eblade build since the patch nerfed it all (it's a little too slow and flimsy, I think the ancient clearing was part of what made the build fast enough to snowball with a game among the other nerfs hitting that strat). Maybe other people are, but I'd say look into the more classic itemization of Tinker's (Bloodstone+Sheepstick being one I know of).
I usually go: null talisman + 2 iron branches > bottle (crowing) > soul ring > BoT > Blink > Sheep stick > Dagon
Game's usually over before I get anything else. Swap Dagon for Shivas against Phantom Lancer or the like.
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United States47024 Posts
Get SR after BoT usually. SR smooths out Rearm cycles but BoT timing literally makes or breaks the hero.
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On February 11 2015 08:06 TheYango wrote: Get SR after BoT usually. SR smooths out Rearm cycles but BoT timing literally makes or breaks the hero.
I'll try that. I based my build off a Dendi video I saw but he probably puts the SR to better use than me...
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United States47024 Posts
If you farm well/efficiently enough its fine.
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Play Meepo or Earth Spirit
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"farming" queen of pain is the perfect hero to solo most games with i was in your position and learning to farm an item advantage instead of wasting time trying to "get kills" let me go from 2.2?k to 2.8k in like ....seconds yay im 2.9
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